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Alabama vs Notre Dame: BCS Championship

Originally posted by blizzuntz:
I want to smoke what you guys are smoking

That's where we differ. The last thing I'd want to smoke is something that makes me so absurdly delusional.









Just kidding. Puff puff pass!
Originally posted by StOnEy333:

hahaha

bonus points stoney
Originally posted by IWASATTHECATCH:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by IWASATTHECATCH:
Originally posted by StOnEy333:
Valdosta St could indeed beat Bama, because Billy Jean King beat Riggs in a tennis match. Therefore anything in this world is possible.

Speaking of Billie Jean... for record, she was NOT my lover. She's just a girl who said I was the one.



53-man NFL roster vs. 10 "draftable" college players = no contest. This conversation is pure verbal diarrhea.

Bama has at least 10 draftable players (half being 1st or 2nd rounders) on their starting offense alone (McCarron, Lacy, Yeldon, B. Jones, Warmack, Fluker, Kouandjio, Steen, Cooper and Norwood.....possibly Bell too). And on defense, there's another 12 or so just among their current rotational players (J Williams, Square, Stinson, Dial, Hubbard, Mosley, Nico Johnson, Xzavier Dickson, Milliner, Clinton-Dix, Lester and Belue).

So that's nearly every starter on Bama's team that unless something crazy happens, are easily draftable. And that's not counting any future stars or even just draftable players they may have stuck behind some of the all-americans and future high picks they have.

But thanks for the insightful comment anyway. You're probably right about your overall premise, but way off-target in terms of Bama's talent. I mean, it's cool to poke fun of people that have a different opinion than you, but at least get your basic facts/assessments straight.

You're welcome- for allowing me the privilege of attempting to inject logic into a comical scenario.

Just curious, are you an aspiring agent trying to get top NFL-dollars for "fringe" college players, and view this thread as your golden goose? Outside of that, I can see no other reason for your heels-dug-in-yet-laughable-stance.

Again... you're welcome.

No, I just find it humorous that I'm being vilified for having an opinion, when that's all you guys have too....just an opinion. You have zero proof, zero facts and zero evidence to state your claims (since the scenario of a great college team playing an awful NFL never has happened and never will) yet you make me out to be a nut-job for being in the same situation (no proof, no evidence and no facts) but merely thinking and saying out loud, " I think, given the right situation, it's possible." It's a hypothetical that I thought might be an interesting thing to discuss...

So bottom line, I just have a different OPINION than the group-think on this board, but you're stating your case as if it's a known and proven fact that can never ever possibly happen (when in fact, you don't know that) and I'm some idiot because I can see a scenario where it's possible. Your bias about this doesn't even allow you to see beyond your own opinion about it (as if there was no situation that exists that can change it), whereas I've admitted to you and to others, that you're probably right and I'm probably wrong....but again, given the right set of circumstances, etc., etc., etc.

Dude, that's really all. Wasn't meant as a dissertation or statement of faith. Was just an opinion.
[ Edited by GhostofFredDean74 on Jan 8, 2013 at 5:01 PM ]
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
No, I just find it humorous that I'm being vilified for having an opinion, when that's all you guys have too....just an opinion. You have zero proof, zero facts and zero evidence to state your claims (since the scenario of a great college team playing an awful NFL never has happened and never will) yet you make me out to be a nut-job for being in the same situation (no proof, no evidence and no facts) but merely thinking and saying out loud, " I think, given the right situation, it's possible." It's a hypothetical that I thought might be an interesting thing to discuss...

So bottom line, I just have a different OPINION than the group-think on this board, but you're stating your case as if it's a known and proven fact that can never ever possibly happen (when in fact, you don't know that) and I'm some idiot because I can see a scenario where it's possible. Your bias about this doesn't even allow you to see beyond your own opinion about it (as if there was no situation that exists that can change it), whereas I've admitted to you and to others, that you're probably right and I'm probably wrong....but again, given the right set of circumstances, etc., etc., etc.

Dude, that's really all. Wasn't meant as a dissertation or statement of faith. Was just an opinion.

It's not like those of us that strongly disagree haven't thought about what you're suggesting before blindly disagreeing. It's a numbers game in a 60-minute war of attrition.

NFL roster = 53 athletes that were the best of the best CFB studs (not from one specific year, but from a dozen years combined!)

vs.

Your CFB team of choice - A (generous) select collection of NFL players & 40+ more athletes that will never sniff playing on Sundays

=

Ass beating of considerable proportion.


May as well argue that Sugar Ray Leonard had "a chance" to beat Tyson, simply because you know he's won other matches convincingly. Pretzel logic, IMO.
Go back and check out Bama's 2010 depth chart. Looking at the starters and the the backups (then), it's loaded with early round NFL talent. The players currently on the roster are no different. Guys like Lacy and Yeldon are just as talented as the Ingrams and Richardsons, they're just not as we'll known yet. Bama is as deep as any team in the nation. They scoop up a handful of the best players in the country every year.

I understand the argument that NFL players are the best draftable players in the country and better than standard college kids; however, your average NFL team may only have about 5 first round picks on the roster. Alabama is pumping out 3-5 1st-2nd round picks every year. The talent is there.

Personally I think the huge difference is professional preparation and Bama is unique in that they are basically an NFL training school. Lets face it, an 8th grader has the smarts to get a degree in Alabama. They are the closest thing to a professional team in the NCAA. Saban has them ready every week and out smarts opponents every week. It's rare that they have a competitive game. If Alabama kept they're players (rather than sending them to the NFL), they'd have a Pro Bowl team caliber team in a few short years.

Look at an older roster as a snapshot of how many current/projected NFL players you see. It's pretty remarkable how well Saban has recruited. His team is loaded with NFL-caliber talent. Most of his starters go pro. On any pro roster there's a few guys that are just there for lack of a better player. Thankfully, we've purged the roster of our Snyders and Rachals. Plus, while the general perception is that NFL players were star college players, that's far from the truth. After the 2nd round, the vast majority of players selected were good, not great college players.
[ Edited by strickac on Jan 8, 2013 at 6:23 PM ]
Oh boy. This conversation is still going on.
Originally posted by jrg:
Oh boy. This conversation is still going on.

Slow sports day. Bottom line is... it isnt impossible. Just incredibly unlikely. I would bet my house and bank account against it.
Originally posted by strickac:
Go back and check out Bama's 2010 depth chart. Looking at the starters and the the backups (then), it's loaded with early round NFL talent. The players currently on the roster are no different. Guys like Lacy and Yeldon are just as talented as the Ingrams and Richardsons, they're just not as we'll known yet. Bama is as deep as any team in the nation. They scoop up a handful of the best players in the country every year.

I understand the argument that NFL players are the best draftable players in the country and better than standard college kids; however, your average NFL team may only have about 5 first round picks on the roster. Alabama is pumping out 3-5 1st-2nd round picks every year. The talent is there.

Personally I think the huge difference is professional preparation and Bama is unique in that they are basically an NFL training school. Lets face it, an 8th grader has the smarts to get a degree in Alabama. They are the closest thing to a professional team in the NCAA. Saban has them ready every week and out smarts opponents every week. It's rare that they have a competitive game. If Alabama kept they're players (rather than sending them to the NFL), they'd have a Pro Bowl team caliber team in a few short years.

Look at an older roster as a snapshot of how many current/projected NFL players you see. It's pretty remarkable how well Saban has recruited. His team is loaded with NFL-caliber talent. Most of his starters go pro. On any pro roster there's a few guys that are just there for lack of a better player. Thankfully, we've purged the roster of our Snyders and Rachals. Plus, while the general perception is that NFL players were star college players, that's far from the truth. After the 2nd round, the vast majority of players selected were good, not great college players.

as you put it, the the alabama players are still "in training." even though talented, most aren't ready to face an NFL team right now. like with most rookies, the talent is just potential until they can prove it.
You're basing your entire premise on the fact that superior talent (or even superior talent, speed and experience) ALWAYS AND WITH NO EXCEPTIONS EVER beats inferior talent. That's been proven incorrect on more than one occasion in just about every sport or endeavor known to man, so that's pretty flimsy (but a premise that most people use when they don't want to really examine something thoroughly). I would also argue that the Bama squad might not be so inferior to the worst NFL teams (since they're bad for a reason, and mostly because they lack REAL NFL talent) especially in terms of size, speed and overall athleticism.

And your boxing example is so irrelevant that it's almost not worth commenting on, but I'll do it anyway.

Boxing is an individual sport where it's just you and your opponent in the ring...similar weights (at least as close as possible) are critical not only for the competition, but for the pure safety factor. They purposely and for good reason set up actual weight classes, for the very obvious reason that a fighter like Leonard at 168 lbs doesn't have much of a chance against a man like Tyson who fought at 215-235. In that particular sport, and with the strength, punching power and 40-60 pound weight advantage, Leonard would be physically unable to compete against Tyson and his life would actually be in danger more so than against a normal opponent.

Not so with the Alabama, say, against the Titans defensive front (just as an example):

T - Cyrus Kouandjio, 6'6", 311 (Alabama)
DE - Kamerion Wimbley, 6'4", 255 (Tennessee)

OG - Chance Warmack, 6'3", 320 (Alabama)
DT - Jurrell Casey, 6'1", 300 (Tennessee)

C - Barrett Jones, 6'5", 305 (Alabama)

OG - DJ Fluker, 6'6", 335 (Alabama)
DT - Sen'Derrick Marks, 6'2", 294 (Tennessee)

T - Anthony Steen, 6'3", 305 (Alabama)
DE - Derrick Morgan, 6'3", 275 (Tennessee)

Let me be clear about this. I'm not saying Alabama could beat Tennessee because I don't think they could. I'm merely saying that your analogy falls flat since there is no CLEAR AND OBVIOUS PHYSICAL mismatch between the opposing fronts in this case, as there is in your example of the 168 pound Sugar Ray fighting the 215-235 pound Tyson. Tennessee has other advantages that would stop most of what Alabama would try to do, but there wouldn't be the physical mismatch that you're stating.
[ Edited by GhostofFredDean74 on Jan 8, 2013 at 6:47 PM ]
Originally posted by 49erfeeeever808:
as you put it, the the alabama players are still "in training." even though talented, most aren't ready to face an NFL team right now. like with most rookies, the talent is just potential until they can prove it.

Yet guys like Watt, Aldon and Miller step right in the league and dominate. The gap isn't as big as people make it out to be.
Originally posted by jrg:
Oh boy. This conversation is still going on.

I know....I need to know when to quit.
Originally posted by strickac:
Originally posted by 49erfeeeever808:
as you put it, the the alabama players are still "in training." even though talented, most aren't ready to face an NFL team right now. like with most rookies, the talent is just potential until they can prove it.

Yet guys like Watt, Aldon and Miller step right in the league and dominate. The gap isn't as big as people make it out to be.

They didn't play for the same college team

Now if the 1st 52 picks were from the same school , it would be believable
Originally posted by IWASATTHECATCH:
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
I want to smoke what you guys are smoking

That's where we differ. The last thing I'd want to smoke is something that makes me so absurdly delusional.









Just kidding. Puff puff pass!

Originally posted by blizzuntz:
They didn't play for the same college team

Now if the 1st 52 picks were from the same school , it would be believable

They didn't, but but NFL teams only get 2 picks in the first 2 rounds. Bama is sending more 4+ players every year in the first 2 rounds. Plus, there were plenty of rookies that had a big year in the NFL.
Originally posted by strickac:
Originally posted by blizzuntz:
They didn't play for the same college team

Now if the 1st 52 picks were from the same school , it would be believable

They didn't, but but NFL teams only get 2 picks in the first 2 rounds. Bama is sending more 4+ players every year in the first 2 rounds. Plus, there were plenty of rookies that had a big year in the NFL.

the argument isnt if NFL rookies are NFL talent.

The argument is that Alabama can beat an NFL team when only 4-5 players are NFL starter material right now (1st rounders) and only about 10 or so players are NFL ready (draft wise).

The rest of Alabama may one day be NFL ready, but at this point in time they are not ALL ready