2013 San Francisco Giants Thread

Originally posted by redrathman:

Originally posted by sfgiantdave:
I must say I don't understand why the Giants haven't DFA Barry Zito yet

Zito would elect free agency and the Giants would be on the hook for his entire 2014 option.

He would have to hit 200 innings which wouldn't happen as the Giants can decline the option and just give him the 7 million to go away

Originally posted by sfgiantdave:
I must say I don't understand why the Giants haven't DFA Barry Zito yet

Nice guy, good teammate, and they wouldnt have won the WS last year without him. That plus the fact that there is zero chance they can contend this year anyway. I would say those are the reasons.

damn we suck

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Rubberneck36:

Man, not the Bonds thing again. He f**ked up and cheated. We look like NY homers hoping AROD is cleared when we pound the desk that Bonds was different. Was he a great hitter? Yes, HOF before he cheated. Would he have hit 74 HRs in a year with cheating? No.

I don't think anyone's talking about someone being cleared of anything. Simply stating that no matter what else is said, Bonds is one of the greatest hitters in MLB history, and that makes him HOF worthy.

You are leaving out the gold gloves and stolen bases. He is the greatest baseball player I ever got to watch and I am grateful he played for a team I cheered for.

And lol @ rubs being one of those old dudes that believes in competing "clean." All beisbol players take PEDs and they will continue to do so. The drugs are always one step ahead of the testing. That won't change and there are millions of dollars at stake. But no amount of PEDs will make a below average player as good as the greatest of my lifetime.

Originally posted by 9erReign:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Rubberneck36:
Man, not the Bonds thing again. He f**ked up and cheated. We look like NY homers hoping AROD is cleared when we pound the desk that Bonds was different. Was he a great hitter? Yes, HOF before he cheated. Would he have hit 74 HRs in a year with cheating? No.

I don't think anyone's talking about someone being cleared of anything. Simply stating that no matter what else is said, Bonds is one of the greatest hitters in MLB history, and that makes him HOF worthy.

You are leaving out the gold gloves and stolen bases. He is the greatest baseball player I ever got to watch and I am grateful he played for a team I cheered for.

And lol @ rubs being one of those old dudes that believes in competing "clean." All beisbol players take PEDs and they will continue to do so. The drugs are always one step ahead of the testing. That won't change and there are millions of dollars at stake. But no amount of PEDs will make a below average player as good as the greatest of my lifetime.

Not even the greatest SF Giant of all time. Bonds was obviously great but his numbers are tainted and always will be. It is a shame because he didnt need to do roids to be a Hall of Famer

Originally posted by Ninerjohn:

Not even the greatest SF Giant of all time. Bonds was obviously great but his numbers are tainted and always will be. It is a shame because he didnt need to do roids to be a Hall of Famer

But he was the greatest of his generation and he knew it. But to prove it to everyone else he had to level the playing field.

Originally posted by 9erReign:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Rubberneck36:
Man, not the Bonds thing again. He f**ked up and cheated. We look like NY homers hoping AROD is cleared when we pound the desk that Bonds was different. Was he a great hitter? Yes, HOF before he cheated. Would he have hit 74 HRs in a year with cheating? No.

I don't think anyone's talking about someone being cleared of anything. Simply stating that no matter what else is said, Bonds is one of the greatest hitters in MLB history, and that makes him HOF worthy.

You are leaving out the gold gloves and stolen bases. He is the greatest baseball player I ever got to watch and I am grateful he played for a team I cheered for.

And lol @ rubs being one of those old dudes that believes in competing "clean." All beisbol players take PEDs and they will continue to do so. The drugs are always one step ahead of the testing. That won't change and there are millions of dollars at stake. But no amount of PEDs will make a below average player as good as the greatest of my lifetime.

Complete agree with both OTC and Reign

Originally posted by 9erReign:

Originally posted by Ninerjohn:

Not even the greatest SF Giant of all time. Bonds was obviously great but his numbers are tainted and always will be. It is a shame because he didnt need to do roids to be a Hall of Famer

But he was the greatest of his generation and he knew it. But to prove it to everyone else he had to level the playing field.

This is a great point, and something I dont think anyone really takes into account. Id bet 70% of the game was dirty during that era, and 98% were using some kind of performance enhancer like greenies.

Itd be one thing if Bonds was the only guy cheating, but it was the culture. Doesnt make it right, but it shouldnt taint the fact that he was the best player of his generation.

Also, "cheating" means you were breaking rules. Major League Baseball did not have the substances Bonds was taking on the banned list, which meant he wasnt using anything illegal. Never even tested positive. The reputation he gets is from the way the media portrays him, which is through a biased opinion.

In time, I think as the bitter media gets older and new generations come through, Bonds will be looked at as the best of his era, regardless of what he used.

Like ive said before, every era in baseball had cheaters. If you put asterisks by one guy, youd have to put them everywhere. The game of baseball itself is inherently unfair as it is. What helps a career more, steroids, or playing at Coors Field before the humidor? One is cheating, and one is not? They both provide significant advantages over others not benefitting from them.

If you were able to reveal every players' secrets and find out everything that everyone did in a career, be it stealing signs, doctoring the ball, taking PED's, corking bats, standing a couple inches in front of the slab, caffeine pills, juiced baseballs, etc, how many players would be 100% innocent? Probably almost none.

Its weird to me that people get so upset that players juiced to hit more HR's, but then say the real HR king is a guy who played most of his career in a home park nicknamed "the launching pad". How many older generation fans thought Hank Aaron passing Babe Ruth because he played in a tiny park was BS, and Ruth should still hold the real record? An advantage is an advantage, regardless of morality.

Its just sad that we all witnessed the most feared hitter in baseball history break the all time HR record, and we cant even enjoy it because were too caught up with HOW it was done. He still had to hit the ball. He got 1 pitch to hit a night, and he never missed it. Thats remarkable beyond any steroid aid. Bob Gibson has one of the greatest pitching seasons ever on a raised mound, but theres no asterisk.

was at the game last night with my wife for her bday. sec 131, row 2. awesome seats!

what's not awesome is the fckin team made it seem like we were going again Cy Young, or something

i like that Bum admitted that some players have checked out for the season. calling them out for sloppy play.

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by 9erReign:

Originally posted by Ninerjohn:

Not even the greatest SF Giant of all time. Bonds was obviously great but his numbers are tainted and always will be. It is a shame because he didnt need to do roids to be a Hall of Famer

But he was the greatest of his generation and he knew it. But to prove it to everyone else he had to level the playing field.

This is a great point, and something I dont think anyone really takes into account. Id bet 70% of the game was dirty during that era, and 98% were using some kind of performance enhancer like greenies.

Itd be one thing if Bonds was the only guy cheating, but it was the culture. Doesnt make it right, but it shouldnt taint the fact that he was the best player of his generation.

Also, "cheating" means you were breaking rules. Major League Baseball did not have the substances Bonds was taking on the banned list, which meant he wasnt using anything illegal. Never even tested positive. The reputation he gets is from the way the media portrays him, which is through a biased opinion.

In time, I think as the bitter media gets older and new generations come through, Bonds will be looked at as the best of his era, regardless of what he used.

Like ive said before, every era in baseball had cheaters. If you put asterisks by one guy, youd have to put them everywhere. The game of baseball itself is inherently unfair as it is. What helps a career more, steroids, or playing at Coors Field before the humidor? One is cheating, and one is not? They both provide significant advantages over others not benefitting from them.

If you were able to reveal every players' secrets and find out everything that everyone did in a career, be it stealing signs, doctoring the ball, taking PED's, corking bats, standing a couple inches in front of the slab, caffeine pills, juiced baseballs, etc, how many players would be 100% innocent? Probably almost none.

Its weird to me that people get so upset that players juiced to hit more HR's, but then say the real HR king is a guy who played most of his career in a home park nicknamed "the launching pad". How many older generation fans thought Hank Aaron passing Babe Ruth because he played in a tiny park was BS, and Ruth should still hold the real record? An advantage is an advantage, regardless of morality.

Its just sad that we all witnessed the most feared hitter in baseball history break the all time HR record, and we cant even enjoy it because were too caught up with HOW it was done. He still had to hit the ball. He got 1 pitch to hit a night, and he never missed it. Thats remarkable beyond any steroid aid. Bob Gibson has one of the greatest pitching seasons ever on a raised mound, but theres no asterisk.

Incredibly well-said. I 100% agree with everything just said here.

Reign and 99 nailed it. couldn't agree more.

Originally posted by boast:
Reign and 99 nailed it. couldn't agree more.

This. Steroids era or not, he's one of the best players of all time. He got walked 232 times in a season and still hit 45 HR's and his career average OPS is 1.051, just absolutely insane.

Originally posted by itlynstalyn:

Originally posted by boast:
Reign and 99 nailed it. couldn't agree more.

This. Steroids era or not, he's one of the best players of all time. He got walked 232 times in a season and still hit 45 HR's and his career average OPS is 1.051, just absolutely insane.

Yes he was incredible. I just wish he had stayed the player he was in 1993. MVP, great fielder and base runner, still with 40 homers, and doing it all naturally. While others like Mac and Sosa needed Roids to become great, Bonds didnt. Bonds and Clemens were the best and now they will never be in the HOF. I find that sad.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by 9erReign:

Originally posted by Ninerjohn:

Not even the greatest SF Giant of all time. Bonds was obviously great but his numbers are tainted and always will be. It is a shame because he didnt need to do roids to be a Hall of Famer

But he was the greatest of his generation and he knew it. But to prove it to everyone else he had to level the playing field.

This is a great point, and something I dont think anyone really takes into account. Id bet 70% of the game was dirty during that era, and 98% were using some kind of performance enhancer like greenies.

Itd be one thing if Bonds was the only guy cheating, but it was the culture. Doesnt make it right, but it shouldnt taint the fact that he was the best player of his generation.

Also, "cheating" means you were breaking rules. Major League Baseball did not have the substances Bonds was taking on the banned list, which meant he wasnt using anything illegal. Never even tested positive. The reputation he gets is from the way the media portrays him, which is through a biased opinion.

In time, I think as the bitter media gets older and new generations come through, Bonds will be looked at as the best of his era, regardless of what he used.

Like ive said before, every era in baseball had cheaters. If you put asterisks by one guy, youd have to put them everywhere. The game of baseball itself is inherently unfair as it is. What helps a career more, steroids, or playing at Coors Field before the humidor? One is cheating, and one is not? They both provide significant advantages over others not benefitting from them.

If you were able to reveal every players' secrets and find out everything that everyone did in a career, be it stealing signs, doctoring the ball, taking PED's, corking bats, standing a couple inches in front of the slab, caffeine pills, juiced baseballs, etc, how many players would be 100% innocent? Probably almost none.

Its weird to me that people get so upset that players juiced to hit more HR's, but then say the real HR king is a guy who played most of his career in a home park nicknamed "the launching pad". How many older generation fans thought Hank Aaron passing Babe Ruth because he played in a tiny park was BS, and Ruth should still hold the real record? An advantage is an advantage, regardless of morality.

Its just sad that we all witnessed the most feared hitter in baseball history break the all time HR record, and we cant even enjoy it because were too caught up with HOW it was done. He still had to hit the ball. He got 1 pitch to hit a night, and he never missed it. Thats remarkable beyond any steroid aid. Bob Gibson has one of the greatest pitching seasons ever on a raised mound, but theres no asterisk.

Incredibly well-said. I 100% agree with everything just said here.

Griffey shoulda took hgh, he woulda hit 800 hrs