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Jerry West in favor of contraction in the NBA?

Originally posted by susweel:
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by susweel:
I agree with Jerry West, the NBA is hard to watch. Many players are just garbage, many cant even make half of there free throws.

Im a die hard Laker fan but the NBA is a very boring game to watch. Most of the teams dont even play hard. Many of the arenas are half empty. There is no energy in many of the games now.

The league's FT% last year was the highest in NBA history. I think most people are remembering a time that never existed.

I agree 100%. THey remember Bird, MJ, Magic, Kareem, etc. and assume everything was perfect. Nope. There were still crappy players in the 80s, 70s, 60s. Guys still missed some free throws. If anything there's more talent because there's more people playing the game. Not to mention plenty of the teams that are horrible are big market teams. Look at the Knicks and Nets. They're not very good, and they play in that area that has millions and millions of people. According to the theory the small market teams have a hard time, the Knicks should be better than Utah or OKC. NJ(soon to be NY) should have more than 3 wins.

Guys could actually shoot the basketball back then. Players actually could make a mid range jumper. Also there wasn't all these wonna be gangsters and thugs with 50 million tattoos all over there body. NBA should look like a professional league not a game played in a ghetto some where.

League average 3 Point % by season

08-09 season - 36.7%
94-95 season - 35.9%
89-90 season - 33.1%
84-85 season - 28.2%

Could be just me, but it seems guys are getting better at "shooting a basketball".

Originally posted by TheSixthRing:
Originally posted by susweel:
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by susweel:
I agree with Jerry West, the NBA is hard to watch. Many players are just garbage, many cant even make half of there free throws.

Im a die hard Laker fan but the NBA is a very boring game to watch. Most of the teams dont even play hard. Many of the arenas are half empty. There is no energy in many of the games now.

The league's FT% last year was the highest in NBA history. I think most people are remembering a time that never existed.

I agree 100%. THey remember Bird, MJ, Magic, Kareem, etc. and assume everything was perfect. Nope. There were still crappy players in the 80s, 70s, 60s. Guys still missed some free throws. If anything there's more talent because there's more people playing the game. Not to mention plenty of the teams that are horrible are big market teams. Look at the Knicks and Nets. They're not very good, and they play in that area that has millions and millions of people. According to the theory the small market teams have a hard time, the Knicks should be better than Utah or OKC. NJ(soon to be NY) should have more than 3 wins.

Guys could actually shoot the basketball back then. Players actually could make a mid range jumper. Also there wasn't all these wonna be gangsters and thugs with 50 million tattoos all over there body. NBA should look like a professional league not a game played in a ghetto some where.

League average 3 Point % by season

08-09 season - 36.7%
94-95 season - 35.9%
89-90 season - 33.1%
84-85 season - 28.2%

Could be just me, but it seems guys are getting better at "shooting a basketball".


The three pointer is better and a lot has to do with the Euro infusion. Nowadays seven footers have to be able to bust a three. Suswell was referring to the dying mid range game. David West, Kobe and maybe Melo have the best mid range games in the league now, but players don't care about this. It isn't a low percentage shot like LA says, it shouldn't be for NBA players. A good mid range game can elevate a player to another level. Certain aspects of the game, like fundamentals and mid range play, have gotten worse.
Originally posted by sacniner:
Originally posted by TheSixthRing:
Originally posted by susweel:
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by susweel:
I agree with Jerry West, the NBA is hard to watch. Many players are just garbage, many cant even make half of there free throws.

Im a die hard Laker fan but the NBA is a very boring game to watch. Most of the teams dont even play hard. Many of the arenas are half empty. There is no energy in many of the games now.

The league's FT% last year was the highest in NBA history. I think most people are remembering a time that never existed.

I agree 100%. THey remember Bird, MJ, Magic, Kareem, etc. and assume everything was perfect. Nope. There were still crappy players in the 80s, 70s, 60s. Guys still missed some free throws. If anything there's more talent because there's more people playing the game. Not to mention plenty of the teams that are horrible are big market teams. Look at the Knicks and Nets. They're not very good, and they play in that area that has millions and millions of people. According to the theory the small market teams have a hard time, the Knicks should be better than Utah or OKC. NJ(soon to be NY) should have more than 3 wins.

Guys could actually shoot the basketball back then. Players actually could make a mid range jumper. Also there wasn't all these wonna be gangsters and thugs with 50 million tattoos all over there body. NBA should look like a professional league not a game played in a ghetto some where.

League average 3 Point % by season

08-09 season - 36.7%
94-95 season - 35.9%
89-90 season - 33.1%
84-85 season - 28.2%

Could be just me, but it seems guys are getting better at "shooting a basketball".


The three pointer is better and a lot has to do with the Euro infusion. Nowadays seven footers have to be able to bust a three. Suswell was referring to the dying mid range game. David West, Kobe and maybe Melo have the best mid range games in the league now, but players don't care about this. It isn't a low percentage shot like LA says, it shouldn't be for NBA players. A good mid range game can elevate a player to another level. Certain aspects of the game, like fundamentals and mid range play, have gotten worse.

If you view it in terms or risk vs. reward, it's the worst shot in basketball inside 30 feet. Kobe's considered to have one of the best mid-range games ever, and he still shoots about 43-44% from that area. There is no additional reward for a 15-20 footer than a closer shot, which is why it's a bad shot. Behind the three point line, there's a 50% reward.
Get rid of a team from each division.

Atlantic: Toronto Raptors
Central: Milwaukee Bucks
Southeast: Charlotte Bobcats
Northwest: Minnesota Timberwolves
Pacific: Sacramento Kings
Southwest: Memphis Grizzlies

I think we could all live without those teams.
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Get rid of a team from each division.

Atlantic: Toronto Raptors
Central: Milwaukee Bucks
Southeast: Charlotte Bobcats
Northwest: Minnesota Timberwolves
Pacific: Sacramento Kings
Southwest: Memphis Grizzlies

I think we could all live without those teams.

Texas has 3 teams. I vote one of them goes.
Originally posted by 9erReign:
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Get rid of a team from each division.

Atlantic: Toronto Raptors
Central: Milwaukee Bucks
Southeast: Charlotte Bobcats
Northwest: Minnesota Timberwolves
Pacific: Sacramento Kings
Southwest: Memphis Grizzlies

I think we could all live without those teams.

Texas has 3 teams. I vote one of them goes.

No way.

Dallas Mavericks
Houston Rockets
San Antonio Spurs

They all make too much money.
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Originally posted by 9erReign:
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Get rid of a team from each division.

Atlantic: Toronto Raptors
Central: Milwaukee Bucks
Southeast: Charlotte Bobcats
Northwest: Minnesota Timberwolves
Pacific: Sacramento Kings
Southwest: Memphis Grizzlies

I think we could all live without those teams.

Texas has 3 teams. I vote one of them goes.


True, I would get rid of the Milwakee Bucks instead.
No way.

Dallas Mavericks
Houston Rockets
San Antonio Spurs

They all make too much money.
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Originally posted by 9erReign:
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Get rid of a team from each division.

Atlantic: Toronto Raptors
Central: Milwaukee Bucks
Southeast: Charlotte Bobcats
Northwest: Minnesota Timberwolves
Pacific: Sacramento Kings
Southwest: Memphis Grizzlies

I think we could all live without those teams.

Texas has 3 teams. I vote one of them goes.

No way.

Dallas Mavericks
Houston Rockets
San Antonio Spurs

They all make too much money.

Nobody would miss Houston. And only people from texas would miss san antonio.
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Get rid of a team from each division.

Atlantic: Toronto Raptors
Central: Milwaukee Bucks
Southeast: Charlotte Bobcats
Northwest: Minnesota Timberwolves
Pacific: Sacramento Kings
Southwest: Memphis Grizzlies

I think we could all live without those teams.

no to the timberwolves
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Get rid of a team from each division.

Atlantic: Toronto Raptors
Central: Milwaukee Bucks
Southeast: Charlotte Bobcats
Northwest: Minnesota Timberwolves
Pacific: Sacramento Kings
Southwest: Memphis Grizzlies

I think we could all live without those teams.

Kings put a s**tty product on the floor for the last 5 years and still 4/5 seasons get a decent ammount of fans. You're just saying that because you hate the Kings. And the Raptors have a good fan base. They don't have a great team but they have a good fan base. The point of contraction would be GETTING RID OF TEAMS THAT DON'T HAVE GOOD FAN BASES. Then you have teams like the Bobcats and Grizzlies who don't have great fan bases, but they're up and coming teams. Your idea is stupid. Just like West's idea of contraction is f**king dumb.
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Get rid of a team from each division.

Atlantic: Toronto Raptors
Central: Milwaukee Bucks
Southeast: Charlotte Bobcats
Northwest: Minnesota Timberwolves
Pacific: Sacramento Kings
Southwest: Memphis Grizzlies

I think we could all live without those teams.

Kings put a s**tty product on the floor for the last 5 years and still 4/5 seasons get a decent ammount of fans. You're just saying that because you hate the Kings. And the Raptors have a good fan base. They don't have a great team but they have a good fan base. The point of contraction would be GETTING RID OF TEAMS THAT DON'T HAVE GOOD FAN BASES. Then you have teams like the Bobcats and Grizzlies who don't have great fan bases, but they're up and coming teams. Your idea is stupid. Just like West's idea of contraction is f**king dumb.

I don't give a s**t about the Kings, don't get so butthurt.

I really don't give a s**t about the NBA either; the season is too long, there's too many teams with low-quality players, and the playoffs are a 2-month long borefest.

And, other than the Raptors who I guess have a decent fan base, the teams I listed have a horrible fan base:

NBA Attendance

2009-2010 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 13
Milwaukee Bucks - 24
Charlotte Bobcats - 23
Minnesota Timberwolves - 25
Sacramento Kings - 29
Memphis Grizzlies - 30

2008-2009 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 10
Milwaukee Bucks - 24
Charlotte Bobcats - 26
Minnesota Timberwolves - 27
Sacramento Kings - 30
Memphis Grizzlies - 29

2007-2008 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 9
Milwaukee Bucks - 22
Charlotte Bobcats - 24
Minnesota Timberwolves - 25
Sacramento Kings - 27
Memphis Grizzlies - 29

2006-2007 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 13
Milwaukee Bucks - 23
Charlotte Bobcats - 27
Minnesota Timberwolves - 24
Sacramento Kings - 16
Memphis Grizzlies - 30

2005-2006 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 17
Milwaukee Bucks - 20
Charlotte Bobcats - 22
Minnesota Timberwolves - 25
Sacramento Kings - 14
Memphis Grizzlies - 26
Dont those happen when a women is giving birth?
Originally posted by susweel:
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by susweel:
I agree with Jerry West, the NBA is hard to watch. Many players are just garbage, many cant even make half of there free throws.

Im a die hard Laker fan but the NBA is a very boring game to watch. Most of the teams dont even play hard. Many of the arenas are half empty. There is no energy in many of the games now.

The league's FT% last year was the highest in NBA history. I think most people are remembering a time that never existed.

I agree 100%. THey remember Bird, MJ, Magic, Kareem, etc. and assume everything was perfect. Nope. There were still crappy players in the 80s, 70s, 60s. Guys still missed some free throws. If anything there's more talent because there's more people playing the game. Not to mention plenty of the teams that are horrible are big market teams. Look at the Knicks and Nets. They're not very good, and they play in that area that has millions and millions of people. According to the theory the small market teams have a hard time, the Knicks should be better than Utah or OKC. NJ(soon to be NY) should have more than 3 wins.

Guys could actually shoot the basketball back then. Players actually could make a mid range jumper. Also there wasn't all these wonna be gangsters and thugs with 50 million tattoos all over there body. NBA should look like a professional league not a game played in a ghetto some where.

your whole issue is that players have too many tattoos. an issue that has nothing to do with the topic at hand, and an issue that could not be helped by contraction.

it seems to be more of a personal preference issue than a league issue.
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Get rid of a team from each division.

Atlantic: Toronto Raptors
Central: Milwaukee Bucks
Southeast: Charlotte Bobcats
Northwest: Minnesota Timberwolves
Pacific: Sacramento Kings
Southwest: Memphis Grizzlies

I think we could all live without those teams.

Kings put a s**tty product on the floor for the last 5 years and still 4/5 seasons get a decent ammount of fans. You're just saying that because you hate the Kings. And the Raptors have a good fan base. They don't have a great team but they have a good fan base. The point of contraction would be GETTING RID OF TEAMS THAT DON'T HAVE GOOD FAN BASES. Then you have teams like the Bobcats and Grizzlies who don't have great fan bases, but they're up and coming teams. Your idea is stupid. Just like West's idea of contraction is f**king dumb.

I don't give a s**t about the Kings, don't get so butthurt.

I really don't give a s**t about the NBA either; the season is too long, there's too many teams with low-quality players, and the playoffs are a 2-month long borefest.

And, other than the Raptors who I guess have a decent fan base, the teams I listed have a horrible fan base:

NBA Attendance

2009-2010 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 13
Milwaukee Bucks - 24
Charlotte Bobcats - 23
Minnesota Timberwolves - 25
Sacramento Kings - 29
Memphis Grizzlies - 30

2008-2009 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 10
Milwaukee Bucks - 24
Charlotte Bobcats - 26
Minnesota Timberwolves - 27
Sacramento Kings - 30
Memphis Grizzlies - 29

2007-2008 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 9
Milwaukee Bucks - 22
Charlotte Bobcats - 24
Minnesota Timberwolves - 25
Sacramento Kings - 27
Memphis Grizzlies - 29

2006-2007 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 13
Milwaukee Bucks - 23
Charlotte Bobcats - 27
Minnesota Timberwolves - 24
Sacramento Kings - 16
Memphis Grizzlies - 30

2005-2006 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 17
Milwaukee Bucks - 20
Charlotte Bobcats - 22
Minnesota Timberwolves - 25
Sacramento Kings - 14
Memphis Grizzlies - 26


If you go by percentage of Seats filled:
2009-2010: Kings=25th
08-09: 29th
07-08: 18th
06-07: 5th (100 %)
05-06: 5th(100 %)

so before the team played like s**t they sold out a whole bunch of games. My points still stands that the Kings have good fans. In this economy you can't blame people for not going to see a s**tty product. But when the team was actually full they sold out both 05-06 and 06-07(a non playoff year IIRC). Ahead of big market teams like NY and LA and Chicago. 2 of those teams on par or better than the Kings in those years.

But it's easy to see why you think like you do. You're a bandwagon kobe fan like in your profile, you think the season is way too long(I love watching basketball as much as I can), you think there are too many teams with too many players(which is dumb seeing as there are more teams in the NFL, just as many in the MLB, and fewer players than either), and you think the playoffs are boring. You're not even a real basketball fan, you're a bandwagoner.
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Originally posted by YourHuckleberry:
Get rid of a team from each division.

Atlantic: Toronto Raptors
Central: Milwaukee Bucks
Southeast: Charlotte Bobcats
Northwest: Minnesota Timberwolves
Pacific: Sacramento Kings
Southwest: Memphis Grizzlies

I think we could all live without those teams.

Kings put a s**tty product on the floor for the last 5 years and still 4/5 seasons get a decent ammount of fans. You're just saying that because you hate the Kings. And the Raptors have a good fan base. They don't have a great team but they have a good fan base. The point of contraction would be GETTING RID OF TEAMS THAT DON'T HAVE GOOD FAN BASES. Then you have teams like the Bobcats and Grizzlies who don't have great fan bases, but they're up and coming teams. Your idea is stupid. Just like West's idea of contraction is f**king dumb.

I don't give a s**t about the Kings, don't get so butthurt.

I really don't give a s**t about the NBA either; the season is too long, there's too many teams with low-quality players, and the playoffs are a 2-month long borefest.

And, other than the Raptors who I guess have a decent fan base, the teams I listed have a horrible fan base:

NBA Attendance

2009-2010 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 13
Milwaukee Bucks - 24
Charlotte Bobcats - 23
Minnesota Timberwolves - 25
Sacramento Kings - 29
Memphis Grizzlies - 30

2008-2009 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 10
Milwaukee Bucks - 24
Charlotte Bobcats - 26
Minnesota Timberwolves - 27
Sacramento Kings - 30
Memphis Grizzlies - 29

2007-2008 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 9
Milwaukee Bucks - 22
Charlotte Bobcats - 24
Minnesota Timberwolves - 25
Sacramento Kings - 27
Memphis Grizzlies - 29

2006-2007 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 13
Milwaukee Bucks - 23
Charlotte Bobcats - 27
Minnesota Timberwolves - 24
Sacramento Kings - 16
Memphis Grizzlies - 30

2005-2006 attendance rankings (out of 30 teams)
Toronto Raptors - 17
Milwaukee Bucks - 20
Charlotte Bobcats - 22
Minnesota Timberwolves - 25
Sacramento Kings - 14
Memphis Grizzlies - 26


If you go by percentage of Seats filled:
2009-2010: Kings=25th
08-09: 29th
07-08: 18th
06-07: 5th (100 %)
05-06: 5th(100 %)

so before the team played like s**t they sold out a whole bunch of games. My points still stands that the Kings have good fans. In this economy you can't blame people for not going to see a s**tty product. But when the team was actually full they sold out both 05-06 and 06-07(a non playoff year IIRC). Ahead of big market teams like NY and LA and Chicago. 2 of those teams on par or better than the Kings in those years.

But it's easy to see why you think like you do. You're a bandwagon kobe fan like in your profile, you think the season is way too long(I love watching basketball as much as I can), you think there are too many teams with too many players(which is dumb seeing as there are more teams in the NFL, just as many in the MLB, and fewer players than either), and you think the playoffs are boring. You're not even a real basketball fan, you're a bandwagoner.

You're right, I'm not a basketball fan. I'm not even a bandwagoner either, I'm a nothing. I rarely even watch the NBA and I don't have a favorite team.

But from what I've seen, Jerry West is right: there are too many teams and too little talent. Very few people play fundamental basketball anymore; it's just 4 guys standing around watching 1 thug trying to cross another up...all while never playing any defense.

And I don't know what to tell you if you think that a team has a good fanbase when the fans only show up when the team is winning.

But anyways, like I said, I don't watch the NBA that much, I was just making a suggestion based on what I've seen. You're getting waaaay too defensive, all you had to do was come back with your own suggestion for teams that should be gone.