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Sacramento Kings 2009-2010 thread

Originally posted by SacRock14:
As for the other part about Martin, I disagree. There's been a pretty good debate about this. Right now, we still lack someone we can trust when we need a crucial basket. Tyreke will get there soon, but he's not there yet. Martin is that guy.

Plus, he's our best outside shooter. Our ball movement is pretty good right now and putting Martin on the perimeter is a huge asset. Another guy you can't leave. Teams are starting to double Tyreke now and we're succeeding because guys like JT and Hawes are hitting their shots. Throw Kevin in there and it just makes us stronger.

Oh, I think that Martin's a good player, but I agree with that one scout's assessment that he's the #3 guy on a good team. Evans has the ability to draw the attention of defenses in the way that Martin doesn't, as you alluded to. This what Kobe's been able to do for years now, and why guys' shooting percentages jump when they come to the Lakers, and drop when they leave. Evans has that quality in him.

Martin helps the team, no doubt, but I don't think that you guys are well-served when he is "the guy". I feel the exact same way about Michael Redd.
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by SacRock14:
As for the other part about Martin, I disagree. There's been a pretty good debate about this. Right now, we still lack someone we can trust when we need a crucial basket. Tyreke will get there soon, but he's not there yet. Martin is that guy.

Plus, he's our best outside shooter. Our ball movement is pretty good right now and putting Martin on the perimeter is a huge asset. Another guy you can't leave. Teams are starting to double Tyreke now and we're succeeding because guys like JT and Hawes are hitting their shots. Throw Kevin in there and it just makes us stronger.

Oh, I think that Martin's a good player, but I agree with that one scout's assessment that he's the #3 guy on a good team. Evans has the ability to draw the attention of defenses in the way that Martin doesn't, as you alluded to. This what Kobe's been able to do for years now, and why guys' shooting percentages jump when they come to the Lakers, and drop when they leave. Evans has that quality in him.

Martin helps the team, no doubt, but I don't think that you guys are well-served when he is "the guy". I feel the exact same way about Michael Redd.

That I agree with. He's not a #1. But I think he's a very good offensive #2. Evans could be the #1 in time. And then we'll be in good shape.

I'm not saying this is the rule, but finishing in the top 10 in scoring the past two years (and averaging 30+ before going down this year) has to make him at least a capable #2.
Originally posted by SacRock14:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by SacRock14:
As for the other part about Martin, I disagree. There's been a pretty good debate about this. Right now, we still lack someone we can trust when we need a crucial basket. Tyreke will get there soon, but he's not there yet. Martin is that guy.

Plus, he's our best outside shooter. Our ball movement is pretty good right now and putting Martin on the perimeter is a huge asset. Another guy you can't leave. Teams are starting to double Tyreke now and we're succeeding because guys like JT and Hawes are hitting their shots. Throw Kevin in there and it just makes us stronger.

Oh, I think that Martin's a good player, but I agree with that one scout's assessment that he's the #3 guy on a good team. Evans has the ability to draw the attention of defenses in the way that Martin doesn't, as you alluded to. This what Kobe's been able to do for years now, and why guys' shooting percentages jump when they come to the Lakers, and drop when they leave. Evans has that quality in him.

Martin helps the team, no doubt, but I don't think that you guys are well-served when he is "the guy". I feel the exact same way about Michael Redd.

That I agree with. He's not a #1. But I think he's a very good offensive #2. Evans could be the #1 in time. And then we'll be in good shape.

I'm not saying this is the rule, but finishing in the top 10 in scoring the past two years (and averaging 30+ before going down this year) has to make him at least a capable #2.

It would be very interesting to see if making X player the #1 option on his team would put X player in the top ten in scoring.

I honestly feel Martin is in the top 10 because he gets the shots. I don't think he gets as many shots as a number 2 which means his rythm and total points scored would drop a lot. Barkley has it right, anyone can score points if a coach allows them to.

Being able to control a game and scoring points are two different things and I have never really considered Kevin as a game changing type of player.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by SacRock14:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by SacRock14:
As for the other part about Martin, I disagree. There's been a pretty good debate about this. Right now, we still lack someone we can trust when we need a crucial basket. Tyreke will get there soon, but he's not there yet. Martin is that guy.

Plus, he's our best outside shooter. Our ball movement is pretty good right now and putting Martin on the perimeter is a huge asset. Another guy you can't leave. Teams are starting to double Tyreke now and we're succeeding because guys like JT and Hawes are hitting their shots. Throw Kevin in there and it just makes us stronger.

Oh, I think that Martin's a good player, but I agree with that one scout's assessment that he's the #3 guy on a good team. Evans has the ability to draw the attention of defenses in the way that Martin doesn't, as you alluded to. This what Kobe's been able to do for years now, and why guys' shooting percentages jump when they come to the Lakers, and drop when they leave. Evans has that quality in him.

Martin helps the team, no doubt, but I don't think that you guys are well-served when he is "the guy". I feel the exact same way about Michael Redd.

That I agree with. He's not a #1. But I think he's a very good offensive #2. Evans could be the #1 in time. And then we'll be in good shape.

I'm not saying this is the rule, but finishing in the top 10 in scoring the past two years (and averaging 30+ before going down this year) has to make him at least a capable #2.

It would be very interesting to see if making X player the #1 option on his team would put X player in the top ten in scoring.

I honestly feel Martin is in the top 10 because he gets the shots. I don't think he gets as many shots as a number 2 which means his rythm and total points scored would drop a lot. Barkley has it right, anyone can score points if a coach allows them to.

Being able to control a game and scoring points are two different things and I have never really considered Kevin as a game changing type of player.

lol, leave it to joecool to say something negative about a player that's not even playing. Not like he's ever done that before...
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by SacRock14:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by SacRock14:
As for the other part about Martin, I disagree. There's been a pretty good debate about this. Right now, we still lack someone we can trust when we need a crucial basket. Tyreke will get there soon, but he's not there yet. Martin is that guy.

Plus, he's our best outside shooter. Our ball movement is pretty good right now and putting Martin on the perimeter is a huge asset. Another guy you can't leave. Teams are starting to double Tyreke now and we're succeeding because guys like JT and Hawes are hitting their shots. Throw Kevin in there and it just makes us stronger.

Oh, I think that Martin's a good player, but I agree with that one scout's assessment that he's the #3 guy on a good team. Evans has the ability to draw the attention of defenses in the way that Martin doesn't, as you alluded to. This what Kobe's been able to do for years now, and why guys' shooting percentages jump when they come to the Lakers, and drop when they leave. Evans has that quality in him.

Martin helps the team, no doubt, but I don't think that you guys are well-served when he is "the guy". I feel the exact same way about Michael Redd.

That I agree with. He's not a #1. But I think he's a very good offensive #2. Evans could be the #1 in time. And then we'll be in good shape.

I'm not saying this is the rule, but finishing in the top 10 in scoring the past two years (and averaging 30+ before going down this year) has to make him at least a capable #2.

It would be very interesting to see if making X player the #1 option on his team would put X player in the top ten in scoring.

I honestly feel Martin is in the top 10 because he gets the shots. I don't think he gets as many shots as a number 2 which means his rythm and total points scored would drop a lot. Barkley has it right, anyone can score points if a coach allows them to.

Being able to control a game and scoring points are two different things and I have never really considered Kevin as a game changing type of player.

lol, leave it to joecool to say something negative about a player that's not even playing. Not like he's ever done that before...

He is also talking about something he knows nothing about. K-Mart is one of the most efficient players in the NBA. He isn't a high volume, high points kind of guy like Durant.
Originally posted by 9erReign:
Originally posted by WillistheWall:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by SacRock14:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by SacRock14:
As for the other part about Martin, I disagree. There's been a pretty good debate about this. Right now, we still lack someone we can trust when we need a crucial basket. Tyreke will get there soon, but he's not there yet. Martin is that guy.

Plus, he's our best outside shooter. Our ball movement is pretty good right now and putting Martin on the perimeter is a huge asset. Another guy you can't leave. Teams are starting to double Tyreke now and we're succeeding because guys like JT and Hawes are hitting their shots. Throw Kevin in there and it just makes us stronger.

Oh, I think that Martin's a good player, but I agree with that one scout's assessment that he's the #3 guy on a good team. Evans has the ability to draw the attention of defenses in the way that Martin doesn't, as you alluded to. This what Kobe's been able to do for years now, and why guys' shooting percentages jump when they come to the Lakers, and drop when they leave. Evans has that quality in him.

Martin helps the team, no doubt, but I don't think that you guys are well-served when he is "the guy". I feel the exact same way about Michael Redd.

That I agree with. He's not a #1. But I think he's a very good offensive #2. Evans could be the #1 in time. And then we'll be in good shape.

I'm not saying this is the rule, but finishing in the top 10 in scoring the past two years (and averaging 30+ before going down this year) has to make him at least a capable #2.

It would be very interesting to see if making X player the #1 option on his team would put X player in the top ten in scoring.

I honestly feel Martin is in the top 10 because he gets the shots. I don't think he gets as many shots as a number 2 which means his rythm and total points scored would drop a lot. Barkley has it right, anyone can score points if a coach allows them to.

Being able to control a game and scoring points are two different things and I have never really considered Kevin as a game changing type of player.

lol, leave it to joecool to say something negative about a player that's not even playing. Not like he's ever done that before...

He is also talking about something he knows nothing about. K-Mart is one of the most efficient players in the NBA. He isn't a high volume, high points kind of guy like Durant.

I didn't mention anything about efficiency. I was mentioning the actual impact of the points. He's a quiet stats kind of guy. You don't really see him taking over the game but he shows up on the box score. This is why I said I agree with Barkley who always says that anyone can score but not many can impact a game.
Paul Westphal has had a huge impact on Kings chemistry.

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  • crzy
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 39,280
JoeCool actually made a really valid point.

There are plenty of guys who put up statistics with absolutely no impact on the game: Troy Murphy, etc.

Now I think Kevin Martin is one of the most efficient scorers in the league, without a doubt. But he can't truly be an impact player until he improves his matador defense and becomes more of a playmaker.
Originally posted by crzy:
JoeCool actually made a really valid point.

There are plenty of guys who put up statistics with absolutely no impact on the game: Troy Murphy, etc.

Now I think Kevin Martin is one of the most efficient scorers in the league, without a doubt. But he can't truly be an impact player until he improves his matador defense and becomes more of a playmaker.

I don't know if he will ever be a superstar to take over games. But I think even as a #2 on a team he will still get his quiet stats. Kind of like Shawn Marion in his prime. He doesn't need the ball a ton to build up his stats. I think he will still be a 20+ ppg even as a #2. So I think JC's point in completely invalid. He doesn't need to be the #1 option in order to get his #'s. I'd imagine in the future Tyreke will be #1 superstar and K-Mart can play second fiddle.
Originally posted by 9erReign:
Originally posted by crzy:
JoeCool actually made a really valid point.

There are plenty of guys who put up statistics with absolutely no impact on the game: Troy Murphy, etc.

Now I think Kevin Martin is one of the most efficient scorers in the league, without a doubt. But he can't truly be an impact player until he improves his matador defense and becomes more of a playmaker.

I don't know if he will ever be a superstar to take over games. But I think even as a #2 on a team he will still get his quiet stats. Kind of like Shawn Marion in his prime. He doesn't need the ball a ton to build up his stats. I think he will still be a 20+ ppg even as a #2. So I think JC's point in completely invalid. He doesn't need to be the #1 option in order to get his #'s. I'd imagine in the future Tyreke will be #1 superstar and K-Mart can play second fiddle.

I don't think that him being a #2 is far-fetched at all, but very rarely do the #1 & #2 guys both come out of the backcourt or the PF & C positions. I think it'll be difficult for Evans and Martin to coexist. Evans' started the first game K-Mart wasn't on the court with him.
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by 9erReign:
Originally posted by crzy:
JoeCool actually made a really valid point.

There are plenty of guys who put up statistics with absolutely no impact on the game: Troy Murphy, etc.

Now I think Kevin Martin is one of the most efficient scorers in the league, without a doubt. But he can't truly be an impact player until he improves his matador defense and becomes more of a playmaker.

I don't know if he will ever be a superstar to take over games. But I think even as a #2 on a team he will still get his quiet stats. Kind of like Shawn Marion in his prime. He doesn't need the ball a ton to build up his stats. I think he will still be a 20+ ppg even as a #2. So I think JC's point in completely invalid. He doesn't need to be the #1 option in order to get his #'s. I'd imagine in the future Tyreke will be #1 superstar and K-Mart can play second fiddle.

I don't think that him being a #2 is far-fetched at all, but very rarely do the #1 & #2 guys both come out of the backcourt or the PF & C positions. I think it'll be difficult for Evans and Martin to coexist. Evans' started the first game K-Mart wasn't on the court with him.

Hasn't Evans started every game he's played in to this point?
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by silkyjohnson:
Originally posted by marshniners24:
That team had so much potential

We did get shafted in '02, but let's not dwell on the past.

Eh, Game 6 was a nice makeup for the screw job in Game 5 that no one talks about where Shaq managed to play 32 minutes, shoot 1 free throw, and foul out. Plus, the blatant foul by Bobby Jackson on the last shot by Kobe.

Anyway, my GF was at the game last night, and she loved it. Said that Arco was hopping. I like this squad. And I think it kinda illustrates how unimportant Kevin Martin is, to be honest.

Can't forget Mike Bibby's nose blatantly fouling Kobe in the elbow.
Originally posted by Super9er81:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by 9erReign:
Originally posted by crzy:
JoeCool actually made a really valid point.

There are plenty of guys who put up statistics with absolutely no impact on the game: Troy Murphy, etc.

Now I think Kevin Martin is one of the most efficient scorers in the league, without a doubt. But he can't truly be an impact player until he improves his matador defense and becomes more of a playmaker.

I don't know if he will ever be a superstar to take over games. But I think even as a #2 on a team he will still get his quiet stats. Kind of like Shawn Marion in his prime. He doesn't need the ball a ton to build up his stats. I think he will still be a 20+ ppg even as a #2. So I think JC's point in completely invalid. He doesn't need to be the #1 option in order to get his #'s. I'd imagine in the future Tyreke will be #1 superstar and K-Mart can play second fiddle.

I don't think that him being a #2 is far-fetched at all, but very rarely do the #1 & #2 guys both come out of the backcourt or the PF & C positions. I think it'll be difficult for Evans and Martin to coexist. Evans' started the first game K-Mart wasn't on the court with him.

Hasn't Evans started every game he's played in to this point?

Yes.
Originally posted by Super9er81:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by 9erReign:
Originally posted by crzy:
JoeCool actually made a really valid point.

There are plenty of guys who put up statistics with absolutely no impact on the game: Troy Murphy, etc.

Now I think Kevin Martin is one of the most efficient scorers in the league, without a doubt. But he can't truly be an impact player until he improves his matador defense and becomes more of a playmaker.

I don't know if he will ever be a superstar to take over games. But I think even as a #2 on a team he will still get his quiet stats. Kind of like Shawn Marion in his prime. He doesn't need the ball a ton to build up his stats. I think he will still be a 20+ ppg even as a #2. So I think JC's point in completely invalid. He doesn't need to be the #1 option in order to get his #'s. I'd imagine in the future Tyreke will be #1 superstar and K-Mart can play second fiddle.

I don't think that him being a #2 is far-fetched at all, but very rarely do the #1 & #2 guys both come out of the backcourt or the PF & C positions. I think it'll be difficult for Evans and Martin to coexist. Evans' started the first game K-Mart wasn't on the court with him.

Hasn't Evans started every game he's played in to this point?

I omitted a key word there. I meant to say that Evans' ASCENT started the first game that K-Mart was out. Yes, he was starting with K-Mart in there, but he didn't start kicking ass until he was gone.

My bad.

[ Edited by LA9erFan on Dec 4, 2009 at 08:39:05 ]
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by Super9er81:
Originally posted by LA9erFan:
Originally posted by 9erReign:
Originally posted by crzy:
JoeCool actually made a really valid point.

There are plenty of guys who put up statistics with absolutely no impact on the game: Troy Murphy, etc.

Now I think Kevin Martin is one of the most efficient scorers in the league, without a doubt. But he can't truly be an impact player until he improves his matador defense and becomes more of a playmaker.

I don't know if he will ever be a superstar to take over games. But I think even as a #2 on a team he will still get his quiet stats. Kind of like Shawn Marion in his prime. He doesn't need the ball a ton to build up his stats. I think he will still be a 20+ ppg even as a #2. So I think JC's point in completely invalid. He doesn't need to be the #1 option in order to get his #'s. I'd imagine in the future Tyreke will be #1 superstar and K-Mart can play second fiddle.

I don't think that him being a #2 is far-fetched at all, but very rarely do the #1 & #2 guys both come out of the backcourt or the PF & C positions. I think it'll be difficult for Evans and Martin to coexist. Evans' started the first game K-Mart wasn't on the court with him.

Hasn't Evans started every game he's played in to this point?

I omitted a key word there. I meant to say that Evans' ASCENT started the first game that K-Mart was out. Yes, he was starting with K-Mart in there, but he didn't start kicking ass until he was gone.

My bad.

I thought the first game against the Hornets was his first break out game, but he didn't really keep it up. I understand the sentiment that they don't really work together, but I think its overblown this year so far, I mean they played 5 games together, not really a solid sample to glean from.