Week 13 2015: Thoughts after rewatching the game...

I was at the game and it was pretty terrible to watch. I'll be interested to see the film breakdown thread because to me I saw Gabbert miss some better options because he was throwing the check down so quick, one I think cost us a 3rd down conversion.

We were gifted this game, Gould missed 2 fgs either of which would have won the game for the Bears.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by 49ersFan:

Gabbert has a quality that all the greats do. He makes everyone around him better. Make no mistake, the entire team is playing better because they have someone that they believe in. You could even see it after the losses at sea and vs ariz. Theres something there, he has "it"...thats right I just crowned his ass...

...ok, we might just need to slow down a tad.

The dude has played 4 games. He's got 5 TDs and 3 INTs. The dude has outperformed most peoples expectations and that's admirable, but can we refrain from talking like he's freakin' Joe Montana. We'll find out. No need to rush to judgment. I'd be thrilled if he became a perennial all-pro as a Niner, but right now He's creeping up to serviceable backup.

That's not to be scoffed at. That's a long road from where he started and lets just watch and see how far he can take it.

Truth...but I can also understand his excitement that it does appear the players are genuinely happy for him and seem to still be playing hard (maybe b/c they now feel they have a chance with him, more so, than his leadership...although he does seem to have some of that as well).

Fair points. Well taken

Originally posted by Joecool:
Kap never had to look over his shoulder. It is bad but I think he didn't work as hard as he should have. Must hope that getting benched and seeing your backup succeed in the same system along with reports of Gabbert working harder opened Kap's eyes. Sometimes, that's what it takes.

He may be socially awkward but he isn't lazy and he did not have his priorities straight. Have a feeling he will from now on if he wants to continue playing football at a high level.

Remember when he came in for Alex, he had anticipated throws. They may have been one read but he would let it rip a hair sooner than Alex did. We were frustrated that Alex was a see it throw it QB. What I think happened is that Kap turned into a see it throw it QB but started as a gunslinger. The throw he made to McDonald for that one play he came in for Gabbert was a sign that he can still anticipate. Now he needs to work on his fundamentals so that he can make the progressions quickly and have his feet set to scramble quickly also.

Oh yeah the throw where he had no pressure an absolute clean pocket, McDonald was open for 10yds with Kap staring him down and still threw it late and uncatchable. Yep looked like he's still got it! NOT!

10) Draft position: One of the worst feelings while watching your favorite team play a game. Teams makes a great play at the end and you want to be happy but simultaneously realize that one play could cost you a QB to take you into the next decade. With that win and Cleveland next on the schedule, the 49ers may have just lost any chance at Lynch or Goff. Maybe it all works out in the end. Maybe they don't need one of those guys. Maybe those guys end up sucking anyway. Maybe they fall to the Niners anyway. Who knows what's gonna happen...

...but I HATE that feeling of wanting to be happy with the result but understanding what it might mean in the grand scheme.

I can't get wrapped up in this. The drafting process is a crap shoot. If it wasn't, Justin Gilbert would be better than Jason Verrett (8 vs 25) or Kyle Fuller over Bradley Roby (14 vs 30).

I'd like to win as many games as possible and let the chips fall where they may. It's hard too unlearn being in a losing locker room and if you plan to keep a nucleus of players, winning is a culture created by....winning. Losing is a culture created by....losing and eventually, it doesn't leave that bad taste in your mouth if you do it enough. It's not ok to lose and can't be accepted.

Give me the guy who fell in the draft with a chip on his shoulder over the anointed megastar any day.

Originally posted by Joecool:
Agree with all except Kap. Think by watching Gabbert, Kap is seeing how to play QB in our offense. Seriously, we should invest in developing him properly. I do think he was taken advantage of and neglected by our previous coaches.

the guy will be 30 by next season. How much longer can you afford to wait and hope he develops at the price of his contract. This is like the historically longest qb development program in the history of the nfl

We have bigger holes to fill on this team than just a QB. I can see Baalke trading back 3-5 spots to get another draft pick in the 2nd or 3rd round. Use our first rounder for an OL and grab a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round, along with a MLB, TE and perhaps a WR.

I'm not saying BG is the long term solution but I can see him progressing even further with better pass protection and more consistent weapons around him. Besides, expectations should not be very high next year and wasting a high draft pick on an unsure thing such as a QB seems a bit counterproductive to me.

I don't have any numbers to back up my claims but I'm willing to bet that a higher percentage of top OL draft prospects turn out to be successful than top QB draft prospects I'm also a firm believer of building a roster from inside the trenches out but that's just me.

Originally posted by insanemike27:
We have bigger holes to fill on this team than just a QB. I can see Baalke trading back 3-5 spots to get another draft pick in the 2nd or 3rd round. Use our first rounder for an OL and grab a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round, along with a MLB, TE and perhaps a WR.

I'm not saying BG is the long term solution but I can see him progressing even further with better pass protection and more consistent weapons around him. Besides, expectations should not be very high next year and wasting a high draft pick on an unsure thing such as a QB seems a bit counterproductive to me.

I don't have any numbers to back up my claims but I'm willing to bet that a higher percentage of top OL draft prospects turn out to be successful than top QB draft prospects I'm also a firm believer of building a roster from inside the trenches out but that's just me.

I have been repeating this idea on various threads throughout the forum. If you want to fix this team, fix the lines first.

Originally posted by jbeale49:
10) Draft position: One of the worst feelings while watching your favorite team play a game. Teams makes a great play at the end and you want to be happy but simultaneously realize that one play could cost you a QB to take you into the next decade. With that win and Cleveland next on the schedule, the 49ers may have just lost any chance at Lynch or Goff. Maybe it all works out in the end. Maybe they don't need one of those guys. Maybe those guys end up sucking anyway. Maybe they fall to the Niners anyway. Who knows what's gonna happen...

...but I HATE that feeling of wanting to be happy with the result but understanding what it might mean in the grand scheme.

I can't get wrapped up in this. The drafting process is a crap shoot. If it wasn't, Justin Gilbert would be better than Jason Verrett (8 vs 25) or Kyle Fuller over Bradley Roby (14 vs 30).

I'd like to win as many games as possible and let the chips fall where they may. It's hard too unlearn being in a losing locker room and if you plan to keep a nucleus of players, winning is a culture created by....winning. Losing is a culture created by....losing and eventually, it doesn't leave that bad taste in your mouth if you do it enough. It's not ok to lose and can't be accepted.

Give me the guy who fell in the draft with a chip on his shoulder over the anointed megastar any day.

Point taken...

...but Draft Position affords you options beyond the player taken. You can move down, pick up more picks and still get a solid player. Its not just about "hey this guy at 8 isn't as good as this guy at 25...draft position doesn't matter".

Several years ago the San Diego Chargers had the first pick of the draft and there was a hyper athletic phenom of a QB entering the league. They had the option, but didn't take him. They moved down to 5, selected a RB and then got a QB at the top of round 2 where they still had the first pick.

Sounds crazy, right? Take a RB over that phenom QB?

Who were those players?

Phenom QB: Mike Vick.
RB taken at 5: Ladainian Tomlinson.
QB in round 2: Drew Brees.

Point being, draft position is important in EVERY round and it's most important because it gives you options. You don't end up with the other guys second choice.

Put another way, a few years before that the Chargers had the SECOND pick of the draft while Indy had the first pick. There were TWO top prospects at QB and the Chargers just figured they were set because whomever Indy didn't take they'd get.

Indy: Peyton Manning.
SD: Ryan Leaf.

Draft position matters.

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by jbeale49:
10) Draft position: One of the worst feelings while watching your favorite team play a game. Teams makes a great play at the end and you want to be happy but simultaneously realize that one play could cost you a QB to take you into the next decade. With that win and Cleveland next on the schedule, the 49ers may have just lost any chance at Lynch or Goff. Maybe it all works out in the end. Maybe they don't need one of those guys. Maybe those guys end up sucking anyway. Maybe they fall to the Niners anyway. Who knows what's gonna happen...

...but I HATE that feeling of wanting to be happy with the result but understanding what it might mean in the grand scheme.

I can't get wrapped up in this. The drafting process is a crap shoot. If it wasn't, Justin Gilbert would be better than Jason Verrett (8 vs 25) or Kyle Fuller over Bradley Roby (14 vs 30).

I'd like to win as many games as possible and let the chips fall where they may. It's hard too unlearn being in a losing locker room and if you plan to keep a nucleus of players, winning is a culture created by....winning. Losing is a culture created by....losing and eventually, it doesn't leave that bad taste in your mouth if you do it enough. It's not ok to lose and can't be accepted.

Give me the guy who fell in the draft with a chip on his shoulder over the anointed megastar any day.

Point taken...

...but Draft Position affords you options beyond the player taken. You can move down, pick up more picks and still get a solid player. Its not just about "hey this guy at 8 isn't as good as this guy at 25...draft position doesn't matter".

Several years ago the San Diego Chargers had the first pick of the draft and there was a hyper athletic phenom of a QB entering the league. They had the option, but didn't take him. They moved down to 5, selected a RB and then got a QB at the top of round 2 where they still had the first pick.

Sounds crazy, right? Take a RB over that phenom QB?

Who were those players?

Phenom QB: Mike Vick.
RB taken at 5: Ladainian Tomlinson.
QB in round 2: Drew Brees.

Point being, draft position is important in EVERY round and it's most important because it gives you options. You don't end up with the other guys second choice.

Put another way, a few years before that the Chargers had the SECOND pick of the draft while Indy had the first pick. There were TWO top prospects at QB and the Chargers just figured they were set because whomever Indy didn't take they'd get.

Indy: Peyton Manning.
SD: Ryan Leaf.

Draft position matters.

Absolutely!

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Originally posted by jbeale49:

10) Draft position: One of the worst feelings while watching your favorite team play a game. Teams makes a great play at the end and you want to be happy but simultaneously realize that one play could cost you a QB to take you into the next decade. With that win and Cleveland next on the schedule, the 49ers may have just lost any chance at Lynch or Goff. Maybe it all works out in the end. Maybe they don't need one of those guys. Maybe those guys end up sucking anyway. Maybe they fall to the Niners anyway. Who knows what's gonna happen...

...but I HATE that feeling of wanting to be happy with the result but understanding what it might mean in the grand scheme.

I can't get wrapped up in this. The drafting process is a crap shoot. If it wasn't, Justin Gilbert would be better than Jason Verrett (8 vs 25) or Kyle Fuller over Bradley Roby (14 vs 30).

I'd like to win as many games as possible and let the chips fall where they may. It's hard too unlearn being in a losing locker room and if you plan to keep a nucleus of players, winning is a culture created by....winning. Losing is a culture created by....losing and eventually, it doesn't leave that bad taste in your mouth if you do it enough. It's not ok to lose and can't be accepted.

Give me the guy who fell in the draft with a chip on his shoulder over the anointed megastar any day.

Point taken...

...but Draft Position affords you options beyond the player taken. You can move down, pick up more picks and still get a solid player. Its not just about "hey this guy at 8 isn't as good as this guy at 25...draft position doesn't matter".

Several years ago the San Diego Chargers had the first pick of the draft and there was a hyper athletic phenom of a QB entering the league. They had the option, but didn't take him. They moved down to 5, selected a RB and then got a QB at the top of round 2 where they still had the first pick.

Sounds crazy, right? Take a RB over that phenom QB?

Who were those players?

Phenom QB: Mike Vick.
RB taken at 5: Ladainian Tomlinson.
QB in round 2: Drew Brees.

Point being, draft position is important in EVERY round and it's most important because it gives you options. You don't end up with the other guys second choice.

Put another way, a few years before that the Chargers had the SECOND pick of the draft while Indy had the first pick. There were TWO top prospects at QB and the Chargers just figured they were set because whomever Indy didn't take they'd get.

Indy: Peyton Manning.
SD: Ryan Leaf.

Draft position matters.

Marvin your voice need to be heard on other threads, better yet, your words need to be read. Draft positioning absolutely matters. I'll even add that draft position matters when trying to move up. This just happen to us two years ago with Odell Beckham. Everyone said Trent wanted him, but to move up to get him was way too costly. There's a big difference moving a couple spots up compared to 10.

Originally posted by insanemike27:

We have bigger holes to fill on this team than just a QB. I can see Baalke trading back 3-5 spots to get another draft pick in the 2nd or 3rd round. Use our first rounder for an OL and grab a QB in the 2nd or 3rd round, along with a MLB, TE and perhaps a WR.

I'm not saying BG is the long term solution but I can see him progressing even further with better pass protection and more consistent weapons around him. Besides, expectations should not be very high next year and wasting a high draft pick on an unsure thing such as a QB seems a bit counterproductive to me.

I don't have any numbers to back up my claims but I'm willing to bet that a higher percentage of top OL draft prospects turn out to be successful than top QB draft prospects I'm also a firm believer of building a roster from inside the trenches out but that's just me.

Absolutely THIS!

Just quickly on gabbert. He sits in the pocket and is willing to wait for options. every game he's played is competitive not a blow out. Most games can go either way. It's a breath of fresh air compared to the first half of the season

Originally posted by Marvin49:

Point taken...

...but Draft Position affords you options beyond the player taken. You can move down, pick up more picks and still get a solid player. Its not just about "hey this guy at 8 isn't as good as this guy at 25...draft position doesn't matter".

Several years ago the San Diego Chargers had the first pick of the draft and there was a hyper athletic phenom of a QB entering the league. They had the option, but didn't take him. They moved down to 5, selected a RB and then got a QB at the top of round 2 where they still had the first pick.

Sounds crazy, right? Take a RB over that phenom QB?

Who were those players?

Phenom QB: Mike Vick.
RB taken at 5: Ladainian Tomlinson.
QB in round 2: Drew Brees.

Point being, draft position is important in EVERY round and it's most important because it gives you options. You don't end up with the other guys second choice.

Put another way, a few years before that the Chargers had the SECOND pick of the draft while Indy had the first pick. There were TWO top prospects at QB and the Chargers just figured they were set because whomever Indy didn't take they'd get.

Indy: Peyton Manning.
SD: Ryan Leaf.

Draft position matters.

If you told me right now Baalke moves back, I'd be less apt to worry about the culture "tanking" affords. I would definitely rather have a starting RT and an LB that will compete for the starting job in camp. I'm happy Gabbert is showing us a few wins and that he is capable enough to do the job. If he didn't, no way do we have 2 potential starters at RT and LB, we'd have 1 QB that gets thrusted into a tough situation.

On the topic of SD, the Rivers/Tomlinson/Brees/Merriman equation was a clinic...