Week 7 Seahawks coaches film analysis

Looking at the end zone view, he had Celek. He just need to throw the ball.

Originally posted by NCommand:
Blown coverages are a theme in this defense although are you seeing a decrease over the weeks as they become more familiar?

Agreed, Seattle came out running the ball with authority for a quick TD and then the DL settled down. Lesson learned, I hope.

Please cover the Brock TD to Lockett. It seemed like he had to cover him about 60 total yards from right to left all the way across the field and had no S help.

These are two great points about Dial and AA and ones we need to watch closely in their development over the next 9 games.

Agree with thl too...just too darn hard to evaluate Geep right now in this catch-22 offense. Brutal position to be in between CK's psyche and this OL.

Any theories on why we didn't stay with under-C snaps and swap out Tiller (the better pass protector) for Devey against a well known pass rush?

The blown coverages seem to be out of different defense's, so, not sure what the issue is.

The Brock TD, I think we got caught in a different type of cover-2 defense. I've seen it a couple times before, but it's not too common. Where your 2 outside corners act as your 2 deep safeties in a cover 2. So, it allows your safeties to play the hook/curl/seam aggressively, which was a result of how Sea was attacking us. I'll show it in a little bit.

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Here's the very next play, it's another mesh concept and, to me, was one of the biggest plays in the game. It causes a 3 and out for the offense and Seattle goes on to get a TD and take momentum.


We're going to motion TS inside and then run him on a shallow cross with Bush running a short out. Bush is the primary on this play. The idea is to cause a "rub route" on the MLB covering Bush out of the backfield - we saw NY do this to us several times.


Seattle is in man-coverage, so it's a win for us conceptually.


You see TS's shallow crossing route create traffic for Wagner to fight through.


You see how tough is is going to be to cover Bush out of the backfield.


Bush breaks open and with Williams' back turned, it should be an easy first down.


The throw is off though. Gotta hit that throw.

.

Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Looking at the end zone view, he had Celek. He just need to throw the ball.

Considering how quick(or not so quick) CK's release is and the time it takes for the ball to arrive, I think he got scared away from the throw because he saw Williams or Wright driving on the throw. Seattle has a lot of length and have picked off CK on throws like this before.

Who is actually being productive on D?

Originally posted by jonnydel:

I'm not sure where to start with this game. It was frustrating from every aspect, as I'm sure it has been for just about every niners fan. There's opinions everywhere about what's wrong with the niners this season and there's a million different, "chicken and the egg" arguments that can be made for just about every on-field failure. This game, I felt like the defense played well enough; they didn't play great, but I felt they played well enough to win. That doesn't mean they didn't have their own part in the loss, however, I feel the majority of the weight for this loss can be laid at the offense.

I'm not going to work through my normal, "the good and bad" lists as I feel like it was pretty bad all the way through.

I want to be careful about any assertions I make throughout this thread, as I know there's a lot of strong opinions about a number of things.

First off, take this as you will, but one thing I noticed throughout the game: was that Seattle seemed prepared for everything we did on offense. There was little variety in the passing and running offense and, at times, it seemed like Seattle knew what we were going to do before we did. Where the blame lies for that, is open for discussion, but, it was very apparent, on film, that Seattle was well prepared for us. Considering they were coming in with a short week of prep, that's fairly damning.

Our passing offense seemed like, "lather, rinse, repeat". This is what I saw as far as concepts used(I may have missed a couple cause I'm going off memory):

scissors(several times, every time, unsuccessful)
slide
slant/flat
smash
flood
mesh
spot

I don't remember seeing any other concepts used.

The thing about all those concepts is: they are all either pick-a-side reads or half field reads. While I don't have a problem with pick-a-side or half field reads, they have to be incorporated into a passing attack that includes more variety. The flood, slide, smash and spot(to an extent) are from a similar design and mode of attack. They're half field, vertical stretch reads.

Thl408 and I briefly discussed our frustration with how it seemed like we were watching the same passing plays over and over and over again - which isn't always a bad thing, it just puts a much bigger emphasis on the need for precise execution. We also briefly discussed the causation for this and it's hard to pinpoint from our limited perspective. We're not in the meetings with Geep Chryst, so it's hard to know, for certain, why the passing game was structured the was it was. Personally, I have to wonder if this is a result of the "paring down" of the playbook in the off-season that Tomsula talked about with Kaepernick to try and stick to, "the things he does well". It could also be a mistrust of the offensive line to provide time to block. Either way, we're seeing a much less complex offensive attack than we had seen during the Harbaugh/Roman years(I say that with great trepidation as I know where simply saying that can lead and really don't want to de-rail this thread).

The same can be said for the running game. There were times when Seattle was calling a slant right into our running play(quite a few times, actually). So, like I said, it was like they knew where the play was going before we did. Again, i think this comes down to the lack of variety in the gameplans. It wasn't that Chryst wasn't trying to mix some things up though, because our biggest run of the day came off a play where we ran opposite of where Seattle slanted, and it had more to do with Seattle making the incorrect line call, than our blocking. There were 4 players who took themselves out of the play and Hyde gained 13 yards.

There is also the possibility of ineptitude on the part of the coaching staff - any which way, I can't speak to evidence of from film - I have my own opinions, but I think some of those discussion are better served in other threads.

On defense, I saw several blown coverage's. When that happens, sometimes it's hard to figure out exactly what went wrong on our defense. There were a couple of those blown coverage's on blitzes when we were trying to play man-coverage behind it.

One thing Arik Armstead must do better is his execution on stunts. So far this season his execution on any stunts has been bad, at best. He looks like he's still trying to win a 1v1 battle while Lynch is trying to stunt around, leaving holes open for QB's to escape the pocket.

I mentioned it last week and I think Seattle saw the same thing on film, that Dial really struggles on stretch plays away from him. Sometimes, I really don't like being right. But, There were at least 6-7 run plays of 7 or more yards that came from a stretch play away from him and then the cutback to his side, right over his area. Every time, he got pushed down into the pile. It looked like a repeat of last week's film cutup of him.

All around - not a lot of positives to take-away from the game other than that our defense got 6 sacks against the worse O-line in football(that's saying a lot considering how bad ours is, LOL). Cheers!

All those concepts you mentioned, are tried and true WCO. You dead on right when you say it's about precision. Back in the day if we called a slide play, there was about a 90% chance of a positive out (completed pass, QB run), something like spot probably had like a 70% success rate and so on and so forth. For damn near 2 decades, we seemingly always found the proper balance of concepts, formations, personnel grouping to run a state of the art passing game.

We lack this precision and when you face top of the chain defenses they make you pay. Seattle is a top defense, but they also see all of these concepts in practice daily. They are just looking for any cues to unwrap our concepts.

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Blown coverages are a theme in this defense although are you seeing a decrease over the weeks as they become more familiar?

Agreed, Seattle came out running the ball with authority for a quick TD and then the DL settled down. Lesson learned, I hope.

Please cover the Brock TD to Lockett. It seemed like he had to cover him about 60 total yards from right to left all the way across the field and had no S help.

These are two great points about Dial and AA and ones we need to watch closely in their development over the next 9 games.

Agree with thl too...just too darn hard to evaluate Geep right now in this catch-22 offense. Brutal position to be in between CK's psyche and this OL.

Any theories on why we didn't stay with under-C snaps and swap out Tiller (the better pass protector) for Devey against a well known pass rush?

The blown coverages seem to be out of different defense's, so, not sure what the issue is.

The Brock TD, I think we got caught in a different type of cover-2 defense. I've seen it a couple times before, but it's not too common. Where your 2 outside corners act as your 2 deep safeties in a cover 2. So, it allows your safeties to play the hook/curl/seam aggressively, which was a result of how Sea was attacking us. I'll show it in a little bit.

Awesome...thank you.

Look at all those wide open receivers and Kap can't see any of them .

Originally posted by thl408:

Another solid playcall and it worked to get the ball out of Kap's hands. Like you said, conceptually, it worked. Good recognition to locate the mismatch - Bush versus LB. When watching it live, it looked like Bush had a drop. Bush is not a 6'3 WR. Kap needs to make that throw.

NE abused Seattle in the SB with these passes.

Throws like this is what Joe and Steve use to kill on. This is how you get Roger and Ricky catching 75 passes a year.

The ck misfire/Reggie drop looked like Reggie started turning up field too soon. Then again Kap could have lead him better. As soon as that play failed I knew it was going to be a long ass game

How's Lynch look? Any technique issues? What are his weaknesses? The guy hardly ever gets talked about but is probably our most exciting/promising defensive player.

Originally posted by Dsoto87:
The ck misfire/Reggie drop looked like Reggie started turning up field too soon. Then again Kap could have lead him better. As soon as that play failed I knew it was going to be a long ass game

Toooootally!

we suck

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Blown coverages are a theme in this defense although are you seeing a decrease over the weeks as they become more familiar?
.
.

The blown coverages seem to be out of different defense's, so, not sure what the issue is.

The Brock TD, I think we got caught in a different type of cover-2 defense. I've seen it a couple times before, but it's not too common. Where your 2 outside corners act as your 2 deep safeties in a cover 2. So, it allows your safeties to play the hook/curl/seam aggressively, which was a result of how Sea was attacking us. I'll show it in a little bit.

Someone say blown coverages? Opening SEA drive.
Cover 3 (black are the deep zones, blue is the underneath). Players to watch are Bethea, Brock and Ward. 49ers show 2 deep safeties.
SEA: Smash concept to the right, Curl/Post/Curl to the left.


RW takes the snap and looks to his left. No one open. Brock is bailing to his deep zone. Bethea is rotating downwards from a cover 2 look. This is important to note as it alters how he plays the #2 WR. Notice Ward, the curl/flat defender on the strongside. He was up at the LoS at the snap. This allows him to re-route the #2 WR on that side of the field. Bethea can't do that since he is coming downhill.


Breakdown in pass rush lanes. Never let RW escape to the right. Brooks gets too far upfield.


Bethea never gets to his location as the curl/flat defender. He stayed on the #2 WR the whole way. This leaves the #1 (Lockett) with room to have a picnic. RW escapes the pocket and finds Lockett.


+16 yards


I'll show a play later where SEA defends similar a similar route concept much better than what Bethea does here. Brock and Bethea talk about it after.

Originally posted by Niners816:

Originally posted by thl408:
Another solid playcall and it worked to get the ball out of Kap's hands. Like you said, conceptually, it worked. Good recognition to locate the mismatch - Bush versus LB. When watching it live, it looked like Bush had a drop. Bush is not a 6'3 WR. Kap needs to make that throw.

NE abused Seattle in the SB with these passes.

Throws like this is what Joe and Steve use to kill on. This is how you get Roger and Ricky catching 75 passes a year.

So this. Make a guy miss and there's another 10yds added on to the short completed pass. They pretty much used Niners WCO to move the ball on Seattle.

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by jonnydel:

Originally posted by NCommand:
Blown coverages are a theme in this defense although are you seeing a decrease over the weeks as they become more familiar?

Agreed, Seattle came out running the ball with authority for a quick TD and then the DL settled down. Lesson learned, I hope.

Please cover the Brock TD to Lockett. It seemed like he had to cover him about 60 total yards from right to left all the way across the field and had no S help.

These are two great points about Dial and AA and ones we need to watch closely in their development over the next 9 games.

Agree with thl too...just too darn hard to evaluate Geep right now in this catch-22 offense. Brutal position to be in between CK's psyche and this OL.

Any theories on why we didn't stay with under-C snaps and swap out Tiller (the better pass protector) for Devey against a well known pass rush?

The blown coverages seem to be out of different defense's, so, not sure what the issue is.

The Brock TD, I think we got caught in a different type of cover-2 defense. I've seen it a couple times before, but it's not too common. Where your 2 outside corners act as your 2 deep safeties in a cover 2. So, it allows your safeties to play the hook/curl/seam aggressively, which was a result of how Sea was attacking us. I'll show it in a little bit.

Awesome...thank you.

Here's the Lockette TD. It's hard to say for certain what our coverage was. Could've been cover 2-man, could've been a strange cover 3, could've been cover 4, I'm just going off what it looks like when putting all the pieces together.


Seattle comes out in 21 personnel and shifts Tukuafu to a TE spot. This is just after Bethea went out of the game, btw.


What makes it tough, is the hard play action sell by SEA. They get nearly our whole defense to bite.


As soon as Reid see's Lockette fly by, he goes into pursuit, but notice how Tartt is just sitting in his zone.


The underneath defenders look like zone. If it was a safety blowing coverage, you'd think that Tartt would have some urgency to drop back, but he sits there like his primary responsibility is that area. Acker also looks like he's in deep zone, as he gets confused on who to cover, the WR running on the deep post or his man on a deep curl.


Either way, there's now 2 receivers wide open and Lockette has an angle for the endzone.


It's a pretty good throw.


Brock's reaction, isn't one of anger towards Reid. Normally, you see a guy point or gesture towards who the culprit was if it was on someone else. He just kinda balls up his hands in frustration.


This is what I think the defensive call was - again, I can't be certain. I've seen this coverage before, albeit, not too often.


Here's another possibility, with the safeties not playing for over-the-top help, but for the intermediate in routes.