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49ers Offensive Line

What does the team need to do in order for our O-Line to become better in pass protection?

I think they took one step today by releasing J.Martin.
Originally posted by InsertNameHere:
What does the team need to do in order for our O-Line to become better in pass protection?

I think they took one step today by releasing J.Martin.

It starts with Chris Foerster & Eric Wolford. These two are best known for their zone blocking schemes (which we're anticipating will be installed here). So with our personnel, these fatties from the power run scheme (buh-bye Iupati) are going to have to slim down, get in shape, do some cardio, be able to move quickly from 3-4-point stance, rise quickly, block on the move in a zone, drop down and block at the next level, etc. Technique will be critical. As to personnel, I have a feeling we'll see some changes in the lineup (blocking in a ZBS includes the TE's as well):

H-Back: Derek Carrier
TE: Vernon Davis; Vance McDonald, Garrett Celek, Asante Cleveland & Xavier Grimble
FB: Bruce Miller; Trey Millard
LOT: Joe Staley; Erik Pears
ROT: Anthony Davis; Chris Martin & Fou Fonoti
LG: Brandon Thomas/Marcus Martin; & Andrew Tiller
RG: Alex Boone; Joe Looney
C: Daniel Kilgore/Marcus Martin; Dillon Farrell

WRATH is one of our resident OL experts and he's had some great thoughts on ideal personnel and why they would fit best.
Yep. Coaching. No JMart. No Iupati.

/thread
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by InsertNameHere:
What does the team need to do in order for our O-Line to become better in pass protection?

I think they took one step today by releasing J.Martin.

It starts with Chris Foerster & Eric Wolford. These two are best known for their zone blocking schemes (which we're anticipating will be installed here). So with our personnel, these fatties from the power run scheme (buh-bye Iupati) are going to have to slim down, get in shape, do some cardio, be able to move quickly from 3-4-point stance, rise quickly, block on the move in a zone, drop down and block at the next level, etc. Technique will be critical. As to personnel, I have a feeling we'll see some changes in the lineup (blocking in a ZBS includes the TE's as well):

H-Back: Derek Carrier
TE: Vernon Davis; Vance McDonald, Garrett Celek, Asante Cleveland & Xavier Grimble
FB: Bruce Miller; Trey Millard
LOT: Joe Staley; Erik Pears
ROT: Anthony Davis; Chris Martin & Fou Fonoti
LG: Brandon Thomas/Marcus Martin; & Andrew Tiller
RG: Alex Boone; Joe Looney
C: Daniel Kilgore/Marcus Martin; Dillon Farrell

WRATH is one of our resident OL experts and he's had some great thoughts on ideal personnel and why they would fit best.
What about from a personnel stand point?

Do you think we should draft some offensive lineman early, thats better suited for the zone blocking scheme, Or will the players that we have suffice?
How sure are we on the ZBS though? I'm all for it but everything I've read this off season indicates power running game. Maybe it will be a mixture. I think the talent is here they simply under performed last year and have to play better. No doubt Looney and Martin didn't help at all. Boone played like garbage, and Davis was hurt. Staley struggled as well. And There was one game after Kilgore got hurt that Marcus Martin just couldn't block anybody. I just don't foresee that type of poor play repeating itself.
Originally posted by InsertNameHere:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by InsertNameHere:
What does the team need to do in order for our O-Line to become better in pass protection?

I think they took one step today by releasing J.Martin.

It starts with Chris Foerster & Eric Wolford. These two are best known for their zone blocking schemes (which we're anticipating will be installed here). So with our personnel, these fatties from the power run scheme (buh-bye Iupati) are going to have to slim down, get in shape, do some cardio, be able to move quickly from 3-4-point stance, rise quickly, block on the move in a zone, drop down and block at the next level, etc. Technique will be critical. As to personnel, I have a feeling we'll see some changes in the lineup (blocking in a ZBS includes the TE's as well):

H-Back: Derek Carrier
TE: Vernon Davis; Vance McDonald, Garrett Celek, Asante Cleveland & Xavier Grimble
FB: Bruce Miller; Trey Millard
LOT: Joe Staley; Erik Pears
ROT: Anthony Davis; Chris Martin & Fou Fonoti
LG: Brandon Thomas/Marcus Martin; & Andrew Tiller
RG: Alex Boone; Joe Looney
C: Daniel Kilgore/Marcus Martin; Dillon Farrell

WRATH is one of our resident OL experts and he's had some great thoughts on ideal personnel and why they would fit best.
What about from a personnel stand point?

Do you think we should draft some offensive lineman early, thats better suited for the zone blocking scheme, Or will the players that we have suffice?

Well IIRC, WRATH had this lineup: Staley - Thomas - Kilgore - Martin - Davis with Boone as the swing-T. He liked Staley at LT b/d he's a very effective cut blocker on that back end where Hyde, Hunter and Bush could take advantage of. Many stretch runs would be to the right where Staley/Thomas can seal off that backside and Kilgore, Martin and Davis can help open up things to the right. M.Martin has slimmed down a lot. Kilgore is much better suited for the ZBS. Davis is a very good seal/power blocker on the move and getting to that second level. Hyde, Hunter and Bush all come from a ZBS...even CK would be better suited in a RO in a ZBS.

So if Staley, Thomas, Kilgore, Martin and Davis all slim down, hit the cardio, work on and master their technique, work as a unit well, etc. we could get back to being a dominant run blocking OL again. And ironically, this type of focus, should also help in PP as well.
Originally posted by lamontb:
How sure are we on the ZBS though? I'm all for it but everything I've read this off season indicates power running game. Maybe it will be a mixture. I think the talent is here they simply under performed last year and have to play better. No doubt Looney and Martin didn't help at all. Boone played like garbage, and Davis was hurt. Staley struggled as well. And There was one game after Kilgore got hurt that Marcus Martin just couldn't block anybody. I just don't foresee that type of poor play repeating itself.

Chris Foerster & Eric Wolford are ZBS experts. It's their forte.' That said, it still has not been made "official" although just about everyone believes we'll go this route.

I agree...scheme alone screwed the OL last year...lack of motivation...poor coaching, etc. In fact, I'm just going to pretend last year never happened. With this new coaching staff, they are starting anew first, reviewing each players strengths and weakness, then building up their philosophy and playbook. If this is a quality coaching staff, we're going to see a new scheme, ALL personnel in position battles and may the best 5 win.
No more Iupati definitely helps. He was just atrocious in pass protection.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by InsertNameHere:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by InsertNameHere:
What does the team need to do in order for our O-Line to become better in pass protection?

I think they took one step today by releasing J.Martin.

It starts with Chris Foerster & Eric Wolford. These two are best known for their zone blocking schemes (which we're anticipating will be installed here). So with our personnel, these fatties from the power run scheme (buh-bye Iupati) are going to have to slim down, get in shape, do some cardio, be able to move quickly from 3-4-point stance, rise quickly, block on the move in a zone, drop down and block at the next level, etc. Technique will be critical. As to personnel, I have a feeling we'll see some changes in the lineup (blocking in a ZBS includes the TE's as well):

H-Back: Derek Carrier
TE: Vernon Davis; Vance McDonald, Garrett Celek, Asante Cleveland & Xavier Grimble
FB: Bruce Miller; Trey Millard
LOT: Joe Staley; Erik Pears
ROT: Anthony Davis; Chris Martin & Fou Fonoti
LG: Brandon Thomas/Marcus Martin; & Andrew Tiller
RG: Alex Boone; Joe Looney
C: Daniel Kilgore/Marcus Martin; Dillon Farrell

WRATH is one of our resident OL experts and he's had some great thoughts on ideal personnel and why they would fit best.
What about from a personnel stand point?

Do you think we should draft some offensive lineman early, thats better suited for the zone blocking scheme, Or will the players that we have suffice?

Well IIRC, WRATH had this lineup: Staley - Thomas - Kilgore - Martin - Davis with Boone as the swing-T. He liked Staley at LT b/d he's a very effective cut blocker on that back end where Hyde, Hunter and Bush could take advantage of. Many stretch runs would be to the right where Staley/Thomas can seal off that backside and Kilgore, Martin and Davis can help open up things to the right. M.Martin has slimmed down a lot. Kilgore is much better suited for the ZBS. Davis is a very good seal/power blocker on the move and getting to that second level. Hyde, Hunter and Bush all come from a ZBS...even CK would be better suited in a RO in a ZBS.

So if Staley, Thomas, Kilgore, Martin and Davis all slim down, hit the cardio, work on and master their technique, work as a unit well, etc. we could get back to being a dominant run blocking OL again. And ironically, this type of focus, should also help in PP as well.

I agree that we may be better suited for a ZBS....our running backs have more experience with it and with T Smith and V Davis streaking down field our play action could be very effective. Throw in Kaeps running ability, Bush/Hunter speed, and somebody like Ellington in motion we could see an effective use of the RO.
1. A healthy Anthony Davis will help.
2. Finding and developing a consistent center is huge. ( Kilgore or M. Martin or whoever.)
3. Health.
4. Dump Jonathan Martin. This has to be the biggest move in the off-season by far.
5. Develop young talent.

There is some good depth at offensive line, but I think that drafting an offensive lineman in the first or second rounds could make the starting line better (maybe next year if they draft an offensive lineman in the second or third rounds this year). I hope those who are "high" on Looney are right, but I'm somewhat skeptical.

Whatever line they put together, I sure hope it can pull off successful screens on a regular basis.
[ Edited by 49erphan on Mar 27, 2015 at 9:18 AM ]
  • cciowa
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Originally posted by BigBug415:
1. A healthy Anthony Davis will help.
2. Finding and developing a consistent center is huge. ( Kilgore or M. Martin or whoever.)
3. Health.
4. Dump Jonathan Martin. This has to be the biggest move in the off-season by far.
5. Develop young talent.

good points, good job,, bullet point number two i think goes to kilgore,, he was good when healthy. anthony never had injury issues till last year so hope he got them used up last year.. i think the acl guy in thomas is going to be a gem for us but thats just me
Kilgore was our best lineman in the beginning of last season and played very well until he got injured. I think he comes back as the starter and will dominate his position.

Boone could easily fit in as the swing tackle and play well when doing so.

I think Thomas and Martin will be much improved.

I don't think taking an OL in the first three rounds of the draft is necessary unless a stud falls into our laps.

It will come down to coaching AND I hope JT & coaches go into the vault and study what Bill put together.

Unlike JH, who did not do that when he said he would.
Before injury Kilgore was the most consistent outta the group.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Chris Foerster & Eric Wolford are ZBS experts. It's their forte.' That said, it still has not been made "official" although just about everyone believes we'll go this route.

I agree...scheme alone screwed the OL last year...lack of motivation...poor coaching, etc. In fact, I'm just going to pretend last year never happened. With this new coaching staff, they are starting anew first, reviewing each players strengths and weakness, then building up their philosophy and playbook. If this is a quality coaching staff, we're going to see a new scheme, ALL personnel in position battles and may the best 5 win.


I can dig. Hyde and Hunter are good cut back runners.
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