If Harbs really was so loyal to Roman, why didn't he take him with him to Michigan?

Originally posted by jrouter4949:

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:

Originally posted by BuddyRyans46:

Just curious, because a lot of the speculation on this board, revolves around Harbs being fired (at least in part) for his refusal to scapegoat Roman. If that is true, then why didn't he try to get Roman to join him in Ann Arbor? I realize that Roman landed another NFL OC gig in Buffalo, but it seemed like Harbs never even attempted to get Roman to join him back in college. Why would he go to the wall for the guy, if he didn't view him as an essential part of his future coaching success? Do you think that, on some level, Harbs REALIZED that Roman wasn't hacking it as his OC, YET his arrogance/obstinance/combativeness precluded him from firing him, simply because he refused to give Baalke and York the "pleasure?" Would he have been that petty?

Maiocco reported that Roman wanted to stay in the NFL and get out of Harbaugh's shadow.

I`m begining to see that IT WAS Harbaugh`s offense that was the problem and it will show in Michigan and I waiting to see how Roman will do in Buffalo,and I`m one to bet on Roman having the better offense...time will tell.

As far as power running game, Roman is one of the best in the business. JH could have very well been trying to develop Kap into a pocket passer with more than 2 reads and thT is where our offense struggled Bc Kap is limited (potential through the roof but we saw the struggle)

JH offense with Luck at Stanford was a thing of beauty.

in my opinion, neither has anything to do with the niners anymore and sooner or later , in my opinion, any talk about x niner coaches should be moved to somewhere else in the zone just like the alex smith thread was. they are not here, they are not relevant and mean nothing to us anymore

It goes beyond Roman. There's no evidence whatsoever that Harbaugh was tied to the hip to Roman. The facts were we had the 11th ranked offense the 3 previous years so of course Harbaugh had Roman's back. That's the excuses people come up with now after the organization decided to get rid of him before the season even started.

Harbaugh has final say on the roster, his coaching staff, and who he plays and if he just shuts out the organization on that decision making you get a rift. You're talking about a guy who benched a quarterback in the middle of a possible Super Bowl run. He made bold moves, he came an inch short, the organization comes to the conclusion that someone else would have gotten that inch and from there the circus began.

Originally posted by blizzuntz:

Originally posted by jrouter4949:

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:

Originally posted by BuddyRyans46:

Just curious, because a lot of the speculation on this board, revolves around Harbs being fired (at least in part) for his refusal to scapegoat Roman. If that is true, then why didn't he try to get Roman to join him in Ann Arbor? I realize that Roman landed another NFL OC gig in Buffalo, but it seemed like Harbs never even attempted to get Roman to join him back in college. Why would he go to the wall for the guy, if he didn't view him as an essential part of his future coaching success? Do you think that, on some level, Harbs REALIZED that Roman wasn't hacking it as his OC, YET his arrogance/obstinance/combativeness precluded him from firing him, simply because he refused to give Baalke and York the "pleasure?" Would he have been that petty?

Maiocco reported that Roman wanted to stay in the NFL and get out of Harbaugh's shadow.

I`m begining to see that IT WAS Harbaugh`s offense that was the problem and it will show in Michigan and I waiting to see how Roman will do in Buffalo,and I`m one to bet on Roman having the better offense...time will tell.

As far as power running game, Roman is one of the best in the business. JH could have very well been trying to develop Kap into a pocket passer with more than 2 reads and thT is where our offense struggled Bc Kap is limited (potential through the roof but we saw the struggle)

JH offense with Luck at Stanford was a thing of beauty.

Andrew Luck is the only sure fire number one overall pick I've ever seen. I mean scouts inc. had him ranked number 1 in position group and overall in his draft class with a grade of 99. Anyone who is a real football fan new this kid was going to succeed. That man never missed a beat coming into the NFL. So was he a product of Harbaugh's passing game or was it the other way around?

Harbaugh's offense did struggle because Kaep was limited but don't stop there. Kaep was limited because Harbaugh failed to develop him. Couple that with a poor excuse for an offensive line and you have the 2014 season. Even if he couldn't develop Kaep himself, he should have gotten him some outside help during the 2014 offseason. We all witnessed Kaep's limitations during the 2013 season and in the NFCCG.

The bottom line is Harbaugh isn't the QB "whisperer' that is his reputation . Alex "ascended" well before Harbaugh had a chance to work with him. Harbaugh did not create some miracle with Smith in a lockout shortened offseason in 2011. Josh Johnson hasn't done anything with his career since coming to the NFL. Harbaugh's other protégé ( can't remember his name) isn't even in the NFL anymore.

So again I ask, is Andrew Luck a product of Harbaugh's passing game or was it the other way around?

Originally posted by insanemike27:

Andrew Luck is the only sure fire number one overall pick I've ever seen. I mean scouts inc. had him ranked number 1 in position group and overall in his draft class with a grade of 99. Anyone who is a real football fan new this kid was going to succeed. That man never missed a beat coming into the NFL. So was he a product of Harbaugh's passing game or was it the other way around?

Harbaugh's offense did struggle because Kaep was limited but don't stop there. Kaep was limited because Harbaugh failed to develop him. Couple that with a poor excuse for an offensive line and you have the 2014 season. Even if he couldn't develop Kaep himself, he should have gotten him some outside help during the 2014 offseason. We all witnessed Kaep's limitations during the 2013 season and in the NFCCG.

The bottom line is Harbaugh isn't the QB "whisperer' that is his reputation . Alex "ascended" well before Harbaugh had a chance to work with him. Harbaugh did not create some miracle with Smith in a lockout shortened offseason in 2011. Josh Johnson hasn't done anything with his career since coming to the NFL. Harbaugh's other protégé ( can't remember his name) isn't even in the NFL anymore.

So again I ask, is Andrew Luck a product of Harbaugh's passing game or was it the other way around?

Idk if you guys watched luck in Stanford but he wasn't slinging it all over the field like he does now..Stanford was run the ball, run the ball..then hit the te/wr because the run opened things up....people were quick to judge what harbaughs offense was going to be..but he is a run first guy

Originally posted by insanemike27:

Originally posted by blizzuntz:

Originally posted by jrouter4949:

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:

Originally posted by BuddyRyans46:

Just curious, because a lot of the speculation on this board, revolves around Harbs being fired (at least in part) for his refusal to scapegoat Roman. If that is true, then why didn't he try to get Roman to join him in Ann Arbor? I realize that Roman landed another NFL OC gig in Buffalo, but it seemed like Harbs never even attempted to get Roman to join him back in college. Why would he go to the wall for the guy, if he didn't view him as an essential part of his future coaching success? Do you think that, on some level, Harbs REALIZED that Roman wasn't hacking it as his OC, YET his arrogance/obstinance/combativeness precluded him from firing him, simply because he refused to give Baalke and York the "pleasure?" Would he have been that petty?

Maiocco reported that Roman wanted to stay in the NFL and get out of Harbaugh's shadow.

I`m begining to see that IT WAS Harbaugh`s offense that was the problem and it will show in Michigan and I waiting to see how Roman will do in Buffalo,and I`m one to bet on Roman having the better offense...time will tell.

As far as power running game, Roman is one of the best in the business. JH could have very well been trying to develop Kap into a pocket passer with more than 2 reads and thT is where our offense struggled Bc Kap is limited (potential through the roof but we saw the struggle)

JH offense with Luck at Stanford was a thing of beauty.

Andrew Luck is the only sure fire number one overall pick I've ever seen. I mean scouts inc. had him ranked number 1 in position group and overall in his draft class with a grade of 99. Anyone who is a real football fan new this kid was going to succeed. That man never missed a beat coming into the NFL. So was he a product of Harbaugh's passing game or was it the other way around?

Harbaugh's offense did struggle because Kaep was limited but don't stop there. Kaep was limited because Harbaugh failed to develop him. Couple that with a poor excuse for an offensive line and you have the 2014 season. Even if he couldn't develop Kaep himself, he should have gotten him some outside help during the 2014 offseason. We all witnessed Kaep's limitations during the 2013 season and in the NFCCG.

The bottom line is Harbaugh isn't the QB "whisperer' that is his reputation . Alex "ascended" well before Harbaugh had a chance to work with him. Harbaugh did not create some miracle with Smith in a lockout shortened offseason in 2011. Josh Johnson hasn't done anything with his career since coming to the NFL. Harbaugh's other protégé ( can't remember his name) isn't even in the NFL anymore.

So again I ask, is Andrew Luck a product of Harbaugh's passing game or was it the other way around?

Luck has been lights out everywhere he went. You could win over many with this argument.

But we agree Kaep hasn't developed and the o-line play this year is a critical factor.

But a QB whisperer would have developed Kaep regardless, which he did in a lot of new aspects, but overall he and the offense was inconsistent In many aspects and we can say it was a regrepssion year for the offense and
Kap

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Because it was never about Roman at all.


It's Jed and the York Family.


~ Yes Man
~ Cheap
~ Beta Male
~ Cheap
~ Limited or no experience at the top
~ Won't ever challenge them
~ Cheap
~ Won't ever stand up to them.


This is what they wanted. The Roman EXCUSE is just for the JED YES MEN on the board. And yeah we got them here too on the board. Not just in the organization as Jed demands.

I pretty sure you can take cheap of your list. I not going to say I know the exact article but I read somewhere that Harbs' wanted the bank broke on him I'm sorry but he wasn't worth that yet. Props to him for consistently beating the sAINTS & the Pats(both in their own house & sometimes late in the year when games mattered a lil more) but he still hadn't won the big game. Jed also couldn't pay him more than Carroll who was punking him lately & also won the SB. Any money short of P.Carroll he should've been fine with but I think he still thought he deserved more, no matter how historical his winning percentage was.

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by insanemike27:

Andrew Luck is the only sure fire number one overall pick I've ever seen. I mean scouts inc. had him ranked number 1 in position group and overall in his draft class with a grade of 99. Anyone who is a real football fan new this kid was going to succeed. That man never missed a beat coming into the NFL. So was he a product of Harbaugh's passing game or was it the other way around?

Harbaugh's offense did struggle because Kaep was limited but don't stop there. Kaep was limited because Harbaugh failed to develop him. Couple that with a poor excuse for an offensive line and you have the 2014 season. Even if he couldn't develop Kaep himself, he should have gotten him some outside help during the 2014 offseason. We all witnessed Kaep's limitations during the 2013 season and in the NFCCG.

The bottom line is Harbaugh isn't the QB "whisperer' that is his reputation . Alex "ascended" well before Harbaugh had a chance to work with him. Harbaugh did not create some miracle with Smith in a lockout shortened offseason in 2011. Josh Johnson hasn't done anything with his career since coming to the NFL. Harbaugh's other protégé ( can't remember his name) isn't even in the NFL anymore.

So again I ask, is Andrew Luck a product of Harbaugh's passing game or was it the other way around?

Idk if you guys watched luck in Stanford but he wasn't slinging it all over the field like he does now..Stanford was run the ball, run the ball..then hit the te/wr because the run opened things up....people were quick to judge what harbaughs offense was going to be..but he is a run first guy

Until this past season when we would have been better off running the ball, Harbs tried to put it all on Kaep's arm. Regardless of what Harbaugh's philosophy was at Stanford, Andrew Luck still made all of those clutch throws whether it was to a TE or to a WR.

Originally posted by insanemike27:

Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:

Originally posted by insanemike27:

Andrew Luck is the only sure fire number one overall pick I've ever seen. I mean scouts inc. had him ranked number 1 in position group and overall in his draft class with a grade of 99. Anyone who is a real football fan new this kid was going to succeed. That man never missed a beat coming into the NFL. So was he a product of Harbaugh's passing game or was it the other way around?

Harbaugh's offense did struggle because Kaep was limited but don't stop there. Kaep was limited because Harbaugh failed to develop him. Couple that with a poor excuse for an offensive line and you have the 2014 season. Even if he couldn't develop Kaep himself, he should have gotten him some outside help during the 2014 offseason. We all witnessed Kaep's limitations during the 2013 season and in the NFCCG.

The bottom line is Harbaugh isn't the QB "whisperer' that is his reputation . Alex "ascended" well before Harbaugh had a chance to work with him. Harbaugh did not create some miracle with Smith in a lockout shortened offseason in 2011. Josh Johnson hasn't done anything with his career since coming to the NFL. Harbaugh's other protégé ( can't remember his name) isn't even in the NFL anymore.

So again I ask, is Andrew Luck a product of Harbaugh's passing game or was it the other way around?

Idk if you guys watched luck in Stanford but he wasn't slinging it all over the field like he does now..Stanford was run the ball, run the ball..then hit the te/wr because the run opened things up....people were quick to judge what harbaughs offense was going to be..but he is a run first guy

Until this past season when we would have been better off running the ball, Harbs tried to put it all on Kaep's arm. Regardless of what Harbaugh's philosophy was at Stanford, Andrew Luck still made all of those clutch throws whether it was to to a TE or to a WR.

Harbaugh pass game is weak and it showed...I Follow Stanford as I live near by and went to games when I was younger..I'm not saying was inaccurate..just saying jh hardly threw the ball even a good ab like luck

Originally posted by cciowa:

in my opinion, neither has anything to do with the niners anymore and sooner or later , in my opinion, any talk about x niner coaches should be moved to somewhere else in the zone just like the alex smith thread was. they are not here, they are not relevant and mean nothing to us anymore

There was an Alex Smith thread here....???

Harbaugh had already 1 foot out the door with the Michigan dream job locked up so why throw his buddy under the bus? In fact he came out towards the end and called him Chip Kelly-esque promoting him.

Originally posted by AB81Rules:
Ok? How the hell did Jim sell out this year? I don't get it.

How? Once he found out that he had almost been traded to Cleveland, he learned he was gone at the end of the season unless they won the title. So, he completely overhauled the offense (his words), then didn't let Kap play more than a few series during preseason when he most needed the reps to learn the "new" offense. What was the new offense? It restricted Kap to the pocket, took away his rollouts, reverses, short patterns, etc., and required him to stay in the pocket and throw deep high-risk sideline passes.

What coach who wants to win does that? Either Harbaugh suffered a sudden attack of stupidity or he was going to get even with Jed, damage his team and QB, then leave. Harbaugh knew what he was doing and that must be the reason they fired his whole staff. They want to remove the "stink" of him from the organization and have an "all-for-one and one-for-all" attitude instead of a drama queen making it all about him. That's how.

It was Roman's decision to stay in the NFL. Reported by both Matts already. The rest of this is wildly speculative crazy talk.

Originally posted by MC9BEAT:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
Because it was never about Roman at all.


It's Jed and the York Family.


~ Yes Man
~ Cheap
~ Beta Male
~ Cheap
~ Limited or no experience at the top
~ Won't ever challenge them
~ Cheap
~ Won't ever stand up to them.


This is what they wanted. The Roman EXCUSE is just for the JED YES MEN on the board. And yeah we got them here too on the board. Not just in the organization as Jed demands.

All the BS excuses for booting Harbaugh out the door are gone now. He wanted too much money, He refused to move on from Roman. They were all BS. This is about theHead Coach being a good little soldier and following orders. Harbaugh wouldn't be that guy. There were trade rumors before the season started. There were rumors he would be replaced mid-season by Tomsula. This has nothing to do with winning, money or Roman.

The absolute proof is the way they booted Fangio out the door too. By hiring Tomsula they gauranteed Fangio would be gone. He couldn't possibly work for someone who worked under him the last 4 years. Fangio did an amazing job with the defense. Especially this past season with all the injuries and missing players. They could have promoted Fangio to HC. They could have brought in a strong offensive mind to be HC and gave Fangio a raise and an extension to run the defense. Instead they booted Fangio out the door after the amazing job he did the last 4 years.

The rumors gave all kinds of excuses for booting Harbaugh. What possible excuses could they make up for booting Fangio? This is absolute proof it wasn't Harbaugh or Fangio but the desire to have a HC who would know his place and accept it.

Because of this we not only lost the best HC we have had in decades but we also lost an amazing DC as well. All because York and Baalke want coaches who know their place. How many HC's who are not take charge kinda guys and are willing to know their place have won Superbowls? Bill Walsh was not only the HC but he was in charge of the draft and eventually the HC/GM. All great HC's are take charge kinda guys.

Let me ask yah something.

You are the boss. Top dawg, nobody higher. You are young and as such many people tend to not really give you the respect that someone 20 years your senior might get in the same position with the same performance record. One of your very best, most productive employees is even semi disrespectful to you only some of the time you speak, but he is and it's becoming more and more frequent and the disrespect a tad more noticeable. You believe your company can make just as much or only very slightly less if you replace this person who has been more and more disrespectful over the years with someone you truly get along with and respect.

You going to tell me you wouldn't fire that employee?

I can't effing stand the way this whole thing has been handled. I can't effin stand the way York comes off in front of the camera. I can't effing stand the position the team has put JT in. I can't effing stand that it was allowed to fester into something that cost us a ton of stud coaches on the defensive side of the ball. Having said that, Jed York was 100% justified in canning Harbaughs ass if he was a rude or disrespectful employee. I would have, you would have, and 99% of the webzone would do the same thing in any business we would run.

"Blah blah winning, deal with blah blah winning"

b******t. Each and every one of us would fire an employee who was both difficult to deal with and disrespectful to us the owner. Anyone who has paid even slight attention to the 49ers and Jim Harbaugh is unlikely to argue that at some point Harbaugh cocked off with something that he shouldn't have said to our 30 something year old owner. Maybe Harbaugh says or treats Jed the same way 20 years from now and it's no big deal, but Jeds the owner and he doesn't have to put up with it if he doesn't want to. I wouldn't.

I don't like Jed York right now for a litany of reasons, but imo he had every right to can Harbaugh and didn't act much differently than the majority of us would.

Greg Roman's a grown man, he can decide where he wants to work. He doesn't need Jim Harbaugh to "bring" him anywhere.