49ers Fan: The Problem is Money & Motivation

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Phil:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Phil:

Lol, ya right. If players want to get paid they play lights out to pad their stats so they can collect in FA, especially true for Crabtree. If you think Crabtree is going to purposely drop balls because he wants to get paid more I don't know what to say.

I'm confused -- did you think he was saying players are "purposely" playing bad? His point is the players are collectively off because essentially they cannot seemingly put together a game where all of them are COLLECTIVELY focused on the field. So many ugly games this year, even the wins. It's hard to ignore that the team does indeed often look "broken", unfocused, unaware, distracted, and all the synonymous terms that go along with those.

If pay is an issue, traditionally people play better so as to demand more. Davis held out because his stats were padded, because the Niners had no viable WR's fir a while in 2013. He knew, with an influx of WR's comming in he'd get less passes thrown his way and his stats would suffer so he was trying to cash in on his 2013 numbers. His "absence" this year is to be expected when you have Johnson and Lloyd comming in. Crabtree just seems to be having a s**t year which totally hurts his chances if making more money. Kap isn't playing well and he just signed that new contract! And his pay will actually suffer from poor performance. The issue here isn't money.

I think the players want to do well, and want to win, but I think this fan's thought is that players might be focused too much on the present circumstances instead of making the best of it and doing the best they can to better their situation. Like I said, it's hard to say 100% either way. In the corporate environment, this thing does happen -- and you're right that logically, the underpaid person with the talent and ability to do great things would go above and beyond to earn the raise, but I think there are some examples where it doesn't always turn out that way (person doesn't always perform to that level, and/or the raise never comes). At some point, I think there's room for the possibility that there could be a ride-it-out-until-I'm-somewhere-else sort of mentality.

Again, just to clarify, by no means is this to say that this is what's going on.. but it's an interesting thought that this individual had and I wouldn't be too surprised if it has some truth to it.

I think the only top down problems we have on this team is coaching philosophy on offense. Roman is an issue and the s**t has hit the fan. The offense just can't get into the endzone. It's pathetic. We're last in the leage. I personally blame Roman, the o line and Kap. Not ownership. If anything ownership will step in and make some serious changes soon.

Originally posted by Phil:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Phil:

Originally posted by OnTheClock:

Originally posted by Phil:

Lol, ya right. If players want to get paid they play lights out to pad their stats so they can collect in FA, especially true for Crabtree. If you think Crabtree is going to purposely drop balls because he wants to get paid more I don't know what to say.

I'm confused -- did you think he was saying players are "purposely" playing bad? His point is the players are collectively off because essentially they cannot seemingly put together a game where all of them are COLLECTIVELY focused on the field. So many ugly games this year, even the wins. It's hard to ignore that the team does indeed often look "broken", unfocused, unaware, distracted, and all the synonymous terms that go along with those.

If pay is an issue, traditionally people play better so as to demand more. Davis held out because his stats were padded, because the Niners had no viable WR's fir a while in 2013. He knew, with an influx of WR's comming in he'd get less passes thrown his way and his stats would suffer so he was trying to cash in on his 2013 numbers. His "absence" this year is to be expected when you have Johnson and Lloyd comming in. Crabtree just seems to be having a s**t year which totally hurts his chances if making more money. Kap isn't playing well and he just signed that new contract! And his pay will actually suffer from poor performance. The issue here isn't money.

I think the players want to do well, and want to win, but I think this fan's thought is that players might be focused too much on the present circumstances instead of making the best of it and doing the best they can to better their situation. Like I said, it's hard to say 100% either way. In the corporate environment, this thing does happen -- and you're right that logically, the underpaid person with the talent and ability to do great things would go above and beyond to earn the raise, but I think there are some examples where it doesn't always turn out that way (person doesn't always perform to that level, and/or the raise never comes). At some point, I think there's room for the possibility that there could be a ride-it-out-until-I'm-somewhere-else sort of mentality.

Again, just to clarify, by no means is this to say that this is what's going on.. but it's an interesting thought that this individual had and I wouldn't be too surprised if it has some truth to it.

I think the only top down problems we have on this team is coaching philosophy on offense. Roman is an issue and the s**t has hit the fan. The offense just can't get into the endzone. It's pathetic. We're last in the leage. I personally blame Roman, the o line and Kap. Not ownership. If anything ownership will step in and make some serious changes soon.

I personally feel we need to pull a John Harbaugh and fire the OC. The problems are not on defense. Fangio is doing his job in REMARKABLE fashion with backups upon backups. Greg Roman is failing epically with all-star talent across the board on offense. A combination of Pro Bowl/All-Pro OL, star RB with very talented #2, three 1000 yard receivers, Pro Bowl tight end, Pro Bowl caliber FB.. and we're LAST? LAST IN THE RED ZONE?

If we lose to New Orleans because we can't put up offense, I'm sorry, Roman needs to be let go. No more chances. Jim needs to consult John and listen.. if the OC is a large part of what's about to cost you the season, it's time for a change.

Like most, I fear harbaugh and roman are a packaged deal. If management steps in and fires roman it undermines harbaugh. I really hope im wrong but I fear we will be looking for a new head coach after this season.

Best case scenario some dumb team, maybe the Browns? ask to interview Roman and throw a ton of money his way to be the head coach... Roman leaves takes the money and Harbaugh's ego doesn't take a hit and he stays as SF head coach..

Originally posted by 9erTilDeath:

Best case scenario some dumb team, maybe the Browns? ask to interview Roman and throw a ton of money his way to be the head coach... Roman leaves takes the money and Harbaugh's ego doesn't take a hit and he stays as SF head coach..

Raiders, Browns, Jets, Atlanta...any other teams with coaches on the hot seat?

One of the better posts of the year and probably true. Harbaugh is underpaid and so are many of the players. If Jed loses Harbaugh the blowback from the fanbase is gonna be horrendous. May destroy him as team CEO.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
I happened to stumble upon this comment while reading about our disastrous, last-ranked red zone efficiency this year. I have to admit, I don't think it's too far fetched to think this individual may have a point. Yes, these guys are professionals paid to do a job and while they SHOULDN'T let things like this affect them, can you really say for sure it doesn't? It's hard to pin the team's seemingly colossal failure to meet expectations up to this point on one specific thing, but I wonder how many others have thought that the comment I'm quoting below may be at least one part of it all.

It makes me laugh how 49er fans are all searching for the reason why the 49ers suck this year. First it's Harbaugh, then it's Roman, then it's the players, now the red zone is a concern. The reality is the players and coaches don't just forget how to do their jobs. Players and coaches who worked together at a very high level for the past three years don't just become incompetent overnight. Crabtree doesn't just forget how to catch a football overnight. This leads to a question of motivation on both the players and coaches behalves.

At first, the NFL Network (that does the bidding of the owners) floated the story that Harbaugh had lost the locker room. But that story didn't wash. It didn't wash for two reasons: The players all came out in support of Harbaugh after the Deion Sanders story, AND the second reason is there were enough players on this team when the team was forever sub .500 under Nolan and Singletary. These players are glad still to have a coach who gives them a legit shot at winning Super Bowl rings. A very telling stat is that Harbaugh has more wins in 3 years than Jed York had in the 8 or so York owned the team prior to Harbaugh. Bowman, Kaepernick, Crabtree, Boone, Martin, Bethea and several others came out and publically supported Harbaugh after the NFL Network story.

What happens after a team wins the Super Bowl? Players get paid. The Seahawks? Tate got paid in Detroit, Bennett got a huge payday, Russell Wilson will soon get paid.
The 49ers didn't win the Super Bowl, but now their players, some of whom are coming into their second and third contracts (the big contracts) now want to get paid regardless if they've won a Super Bowl or not.

When Vernon Davis ended his ill-advised holdout, he said, "At least I tried," and made reference to other 49ers players on the team who weren't happy with their current contracts. Alex Boone held out. Brooks is underpaid and there's rumors the 49ers were shopping him prior to the trade deadline. Even the coach, Harbaugh, is in a contract dispute, with both sides agreeing to stop negotiations until next year (or never again).

This team isn't performing because collectively (especially the players in their second and sometimes third contracts) aren't being paid. Guys like Frank Gore, Anquan Boldin and Justin Smith don't care about money because they're done. This is their swan song, and they're the real victims. But if you get enough guys in their prime, wanting to be paid more, with a coach in the same boat, also wanting to be paid more, eventually you're gonna have motivation problems and head scratching seasons. It's nobody's fault but Jed York. Offensive lines don't just miraculously go from one of the best in football to somehow forgetting how to pass block. Guys like Crabtree and Vernon don't just forget how to catch a football. Ahmad Brooks and his sack numbers don't just plummet because he's forgotten how to rush the qb. It's a motivation thing. The NFL fired its bullet at Harbaugh - claiming the lack of motivation was Harbaugh's fault. But the lack of motivation is monetary, and Harbaugh politicks for his guys constantly.

Here's Harbaugh's politicking for his guys: Terrell Brown's agent's bonehead move to let Brown practice in Texas instead of Santa Clara costs Brown 2 million dollars. Harbaugh comes out publically and says, "We'll make it right." But the 49ers' front office doesn't make it right. After the NFC Championship game with Seattle, Harbaugh says he wants to compete again next year with "This exact same team regardless what the front office wants" but Harbaugh isn't given the chance. Gone are Whitner, Goodwin, Brown, Rogers (3/5th of the 49ers' secondary that hasn't been replaced adequately in my eyes). During the Cleveland Browns drama when Harbaugh was on the trade block, Harbaugh politicked for his DC - getting Vic Fangio a raise. The issue isn't a rift between Harbaugh and his players. The issue is a rift between the players and the front office. The NFL Network and Jed York tried to pin the rift between players and the front office on Harbaugh. Why the hell would Harbaugh want to coach here next season?

Harbaugh's one of the best coaches to come into the NFL in the last 25 years. And for Jed York to not see that and not try everything in his power to not only protect his head coach but value him and support him speaks to Jed York's lack of football acumen. And to me, that means the 49ers are gonna suck for the next decade, maybe longer, after Harbaugh leaves. Harbaugh will be York's Curse of the Bambino. You don't let Harbaugh walk, like you don't trade Babe Ruth. You do it right. You pay your players and your coaches fair market. You do things the right way. If you don't... resentment will set in and the players and coaches won't perform for you. But Jed York doesn't understand any of this...

Originally posted by AZ9erfan520:

Originally posted by 9erTilDeath:

Best case scenario some dumb team, maybe the Browns? ask to interview Roman and throw a ton of money his way to be the head coach... Roman leaves takes the money and Harbaugh's ego doesn't take a hit and he stays as SF head coach..

Raiders, Browns, Jets, Atlanta...any other teams with coaches on the hot seat?

If Roman hasn't landed a head coaching gig by now, I am not sure he ever will. The fact that he's been passed over a multitude of times for HC jobs says something.

The best scenario I've read this season. Not doing the right thing with Brown sent shockwaves through the team. Boone and Iupati feel shortchanged, add in a few injuries and the loss of Goodwin, which shows. An assessment of a QB that can't win when it counts the most makes the big bucks signing questionable. Let's stop all the talk and knock off the Saints Sunday.

I don't buy it. Football is the ultimate team sport. You're telling me that these players don't respect themselves and their teammates to give it their all on the field? Especially for those players like Gore, and Smith who are trying to win the big one before they retire? Nah, not buying it.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
I personally feel we need to pull a John Harbaugh and fire the OC. The problems are not on defense. Fangio is doing his job in REMARKABLE fashion with backups upon backups. Greg Roman is failing epically with all-star talent across the board on offense. A combination of Pro Bowl/All-Pro OL, star RB with very talented #2, three 1000 yard receivers, Pro Bowl tight end, Pro Bowl caliber FB.. and we're LAST? LAST IN THE RED ZONE?

If we lose to New Orleans because we can't put up offense, I'm sorry, Roman needs to be let go. No more chances. Jim needs to consult John and listen.. if the OC is a large part of what's about to cost you the season, it's time for a change.

I'm pretty iffy on the whole money/motivation thing, although I have my doubts that V Davis' issues are all physical. But fire the OC? Uh, yeah, do it yesterday. And I know he's not even 100% of the blame, but a new voice, a new perspective MIGHT be a shot in the arm to this pathetically underachieving offense that SHOULD easily be putting up 375+ yds and 27-28 pts per game, not looking like some remedial f***ing joke offense.

Originally posted by OnTheClock:
I personally feel we need to pull a John Harbaugh and fire the OC. The problems are not on defense. Fangio is doing his job in REMARKABLE fashion with backups upon backups. Greg Roman is failing epically with all-star talent across the board on offense. A combination of Pro Bowl/All-Pro OL, star RB with very talented #2, three 1000 yard receivers, Pro Bowl tight end, Pro Bowl caliber FB.. and we're LAST? LAST IN THE RED ZONE?

If we lose to New Orleans because we can't put up offense, I'm sorry, Roman needs to be let go. No more chances. Jim needs to consult John and listen.. if the OC is a large part of what's about to cost you the season, it's time for a change.

You are wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong dead wrong.

Short of a total revelation (like dropping 50 on the Saints in New Orleans), Roman should have been fired long ago.
P.S. If we put up 50 against the Saints I will personally write Roman a letter of apology.

Our players have sat back, watched 3 other teams win Superbowls, and guys on those teams getting paid. Welcome to the NFL, can't sell everybody over forever.

Ah. I loved them about Gore, Boldin and Justin Smith don't care about moneys. They are good guys. If david, Crabtree and Boone wanted more moneys because they are hell as devil. ... Gore, Boldin and Justin Smith are alway wanted a wins. I liked it them so much..


I don't watch the rams vs 49ers last sunday. I just read on thl408 for post of pictures and explains it.

I am thinking about lot. I wonder why sack on kap for 8 times? Wtf.. I think, there is something wrong with Kap but... Maybe Offense Lines are probably hate on kap? Maybe. Then blame on Boone allow to sack on kap. I think, Boone was not happy about issues the moneys..


I am very sick about issues the moneys!!!

I think everyone needs to sit and think about this for a second...


Let's all go back to 3 years ago, When Alex Smith was still our QB, our team was making a name for themselves, our defense was lights out. We finally became the 49ers we've been waiting for, for 10 years. We make the playoffs, we surprise the saints, but then fell short against the giants.

The following year, Smith gets benched for Kap, all of a sudden we opened a whole book with the same defense, our confidence was up, we tore it up against anyone. We make the play offs, make a splash, we surprise the falcons on the road and make the superbowl. But fall short of 5 yards to win.

Now you got to realize how much more damage can our team take with fall short twice in a row.

It's 2013, we're tearing it up, our defense seems better than ever, offense was better. We make the play offs again, do what we do. take out greenbay and Carolina, But then fall short against not only another team but Seattle! and considering we should have won, we didn't.


I just feel like the last 3 years our team has been great, but they're tired and beat up, they don't have the confidence they had because they might feel like they're not good enough to make it again.

A lot of that is the players still believing in harbaugh or not, if they don't have faith in there own coach, then all is lost...


Might be time to start fresh again

For those of you who don't want to believe a portion of this take, you need to take a step back. I said this at the beginning of the year when the team looked "off" and Harbs said they were "off" in the preseason...the team is distracted. A portion of that is distraction from contracts - Harbs, Crabs, VD, Boone, and a host of others. The other distraction is off the field issues - Smith, Brown, Cully, McDonald, and others.

If you dont think distractions play out on the field you are fooling yourself. Players & coaches are distracted and they pay less attention in the film room, in meetings, schemes, etc. Its shows up on the field.