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Williams, Bowman and now, Sherman Rule

Originally posted by BrianGO:
I am arguing because I believe the NFL is just shifting responsibility to the officials.

Letting s**t roll downhill is not how you resolve problems, in fact, that is how you create more problems. The NFL, instead, needs to reexamine the rules for pass interference and how they are called and penalized.

Perhaps they should allow judgement calls to be challenged? Perhaps they should make pass interference a spot foul only up to 15 yards, just like in college. Because if you make the penalty less severe, the officials will be able to make a call on it more easily.

Just look at how soccer works. It is the perfect example of how screwed up you can make a game, when the penalties are too severe.
When a player is fouled in the box, it is a penalty shot. That penalty is so severe, it is like awarding 2 touchdowns. Because it is so severe, the official will be less inclined to make a PROPER ruling.

If they instead, did it like the NHL, or the NBA, where the penalty is not as severe, the officials will be much more inclined to try and call the game as accurately as possible. When the penalty is TOO severe, they are afraid to make the call.

This is an EXCELLENT point!
Originally posted by BleedsRedNGold:
Originally posted by BrianGO:
I am arguing because I believe the NFL is just shifting responsibility to the officials.

Letting s**t roll downhill is not how you resolve problems, in fact, that is how you create more problems. The NFL, instead, needs to reexamine the rules for pass interference and how they are called and penalized.

Perhaps they should allow judgement calls to be challenged? Perhaps they should make pass interference a spot foul only up to 15 yards, just like in college. Because if you make the penalty less severe, the officials will be able to make a call on it more easily.

Just look at how soccer works. It is the perfect example of how screwed up you can make a game, when the penalties are too severe.
When a player is fouled in the box, it is a penalty shot. That penalty is so severe, it is like awarding 2 touchdowns. Because it is so severe, the official will be less inclined to make a PROPER ruling.

If they instead, did it like the NHL, or the NBA, where the penalty is not as severe, the officials will be much more inclined to try and call the game as accurately as possible. When the penalty is TOO severe, they are afraid to make the call.

This is an EXCELLENT point!

It is true but like Harbaugh said after the Superbowl, the game/situation shouldn't matter...a foul is a foul (in ANY context). Don't commit the foul and there are no negative (severe or not) consequences. Period.
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by SofaKing:
Originally posted by ninerjok:
How much will the supposed new emphasis on the actual rules regarding DB play really affect the Seacawks; very little, somewhat, or significantly.

Assuming the NFL actually follows through with it, I'll say at least somewhat. It won't be dramatic because the Seattle D has legit talent and they will adjust.

But anyone who watches the games (especially the coache's film) can see that they get away with contact beyond 5 yards A LOT. It's not just trivial, incidental contact. It's clearly impeding the WRs ability to run the route.

The NFL has to eliminate the grey area this season. Either you allow WRs and DBs to mug each other on each route, or enforce the f**king rules. Contact beyond 5 yards is a penalty, period, no questions asked. It should be very easy to determine incidental vs penalty. It's only difficult today because the refs see the illegal contact, but only call it when they feel like it. It creates inconsistency and confusion. That has to stop.

Agreed on the bolded. What bothers me is that the only times the ref might call the penalty is when the WR that got contacted illegally was targeted with a throw. A lot of times, the whole reason the QB doesn't throw it to the WR is because the WR wasn't open, because there was illegal contact committed. There's no flag thrown because the WR wasn't targeted with a pass.

This is a fantastic point and can really hurt a young QB just trying to get to his second reads and it esp. affects timing offenses (like the Broncos). I wonder if we pay extra close attention to this the first few games and see how things are called. If they aren't being called, I hate to say it, but we may have to counter by having CK throw the ball immediately to the WR who is being mugged to force the issue and have the WR flail his arms around in disgust. I also wonder if this will effect how we'll play more press this year as well.
Over in NFL Talk, Hawk's thread, one Hawk feels the rule changes aren't a big deal and that Sherman/Maxwell will just have to adjust "some." It got me thinking about this:

This is actually a good point. The "rules" are in part why we drafted a smaller but excellent cover slot/FS in Ward in the first round. We essentially play in the nickle 60% of the time b/c of the pass happy league and it's rules. We've been forced to come up with more exotic OFF-coverage schemes as a result (rarely play press and when when we do, it's not a "disruptive" press...we have to play with one less DL or LB on the field as a result and add more DB's. I agree with zaghawk that most rules are only enforced during TC and early into the season and then they will back off and let 'em play come playoff time. That said, if Mike P. is right, the last time this rule was enforced back in 2004, the calls went from roughly 80 to 200; that IS very signifcant and could very much have a prfound effect on not only their CB tactics but also the types of defense they play (they may have to play MUCH more nickle, off coverage, add extra DB's, take a LB or DL off the field, etc.).

Read more at http://www.49erswebzone.com/forum/nfl/178781-will-seattle-be-dethroned/page107/#d40LbV0I0whBq7Li.99
I dare the refs to enforce the rules in Seattle. That's a big part of the problem. The Seahawka bet they'll be able to get away with it at home....and that virtually guarantees them a spotless home record.

Beyond that...they need to scrape 3-4 wins on the road and they are set for the playoffs.
will someone please explain to me what this has to do with Williams and Bowman?
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Originally posted by ChazBoner:
will someone please explain to me what this has to do with Williams and Bowman?

They were injured by seadderall players?
Originally posted by ChazBoner:
will someone please explain to me what this has to do with Williams and Bowman?

LOL...we're just listing the new rule changes that could directly affect the Niners-Hawks rivalry. The Williams rule is very significant...no longer can a sleazy Sleazy dive at the knees/ankle area in pursuit behind a chasing DL which could have pround effects on Seattle's zone blocking scheme and their "tactics." The Bowman rule, well that's obvious...had that rule been in place in the NFCCG it could not only have given us the ball right away but saved a good couple minutes on theclock which means we may have been less inclined to take a risky, low % shot in the corner of the EZ with time winding down. And the Dick rule? That's self-explanatory.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by ChazBoner:
will someone please explain to me what this has to do with Williams and Bowman?

LOL...we're just listing the new rule changes that could directly affect the Niners-Hawks rivalry. The Williams rule is very significant...no longer can a sleazy Sleazy dive at the knees/ankle area in pursuit behind a chasing DL which could have pround effects on Seattle's zone blocking scheme and their "tactics." The Bowman rule, well that's obvious...had that rule been in place in the NFCCG it could not only have given us the ball right away but saved a good couple minutes on theclock which means we may have been less inclined to take a risky, low % shot in the corner of the EZ with time winding down. And the Dick rule? That's self-explanatory.
got it, thanks.
Originally posted by ChazBoner:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by ChazBoner:
will someone please explain to me what this has to do with Williams and Bowman?

LOL...we're just listing the new rule changes that could directly affect the Niners-Hawks rivalry. The Williams rule is very significant...no longer can a sleazy Sleazy dive at the knees/ankle area in pursuit behind a chasing DL which could have pround effects on Seattle's zone blocking scheme and their "tactics." The Bowman rule, well that's obvious...had that rule been in place in the NFCCG it could not only have given us the ball right away but saved a good couple minutes on theclock which means we may have been less inclined to take a risky, low % shot in the corner of the EZ with time winding down. And the Dick rule? That's self-explanatory.
got it, thanks.

You bet!
P.S. In all honesty, if we had gotten the ball on the 1/2 yard line, where Bowman recovered it, I think we go 3 and out immediately after. The Karma gods helped us out on the very next play.
Originally posted by ChazBoner:
P.S. In all honesty, if we had gotten the ball on the 1/2 yard line, where Bowman recovered it, I think we go 3 and out immediately after. The Karma gods helped us out on the very next play.

That's possible...1/2 yard or the 10, it wasn't going to be an easy drive for sure. Thank you Based God.
[ Edited by NCommand on Jul 21, 2014 at 8:53 AM ]
Even Pete Carroll is happy the WIlliams rule is in effect. He stated repeatedly last year that he would be fully compliant if such a proposal was enacted. I don't think anyone liked the technique although smaller lines use it, including seattle.

The bowman rule is smart and good. But it would have wound up hurting us if we had been rightfully awarded possession at the 1 foot line against Seattle d as opposed to what unfolded. Sorry, but that's the truth. Instead, I am convinced that the call was so egregious that seattle deliberately gave us the ball the next play in a near touch back position. Otherwise the entire game itself would have gone down as the most rigged in super bowl history. As it is, the call is a strong candidate for worst, most impactful call in SB history. The officiating crew appeared simply inept.

I'm not sure how the "Sherman points " differ from what is currently in effect.
Originally posted by ChazBoner:
P.S. In all honesty, if we had gotten the ball on the 1/2 yard line, where Bowman recovered it, I think we go 3 and out immediately after. The Karma gods helped us out on the very next play.

No, safety for them. We went three and out from the 15, didn't we?
Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:
Originally posted by ChazBoner:
P.S. In all honesty, if we had gotten the ball on the 1/2 yard line, where Bowman recovered it, I think we go 3 and out immediately after. The Karma gods helped us out on the very next play.

No, safety for them. We went three and out from the 15, didn't we?

INT


3-10-SF 10 (8:54) (Shotgun) 3-R.Wilson pass short middle to 15-J.Kearse to SF 1 for 9 yards (53-N.Bowman). FUMBLES (53-N.Bowman), recovered by SEA-24-M.Lynch at SF 1. 24-M.Lynch to SF 1 for no gain (35-E.Reid). SF-53-N.Bowman was injured during the play.

4-1-SF 1 (8:29) 3-R.Wilson FUMBLES (Aborted) at SF 4, touched at SF 12, recovered by SEA-26-M.Robinson at SF 15. 26-M.Robinson to SF 15 for no gain (26-T.Brock). San Francisco 49ers at 08:18

1-10-SF 15 (8:18) (Shotgun) 32-K.Hunter right tackle to SF 26 for 11 yards (31-K.Chancellor).

1-10-SF 26 (7:44) 7-C.Kaepernick pass short left intended for 81-A.Boldin INTERCEPTED by 31-K.Chancellor at SF 40. 31-K.Chancellor to SF 40 for no gain (81-A.Boldin).