Only a FS Jimmie Ward-Houston Texans

Originally posted by NinerSickness:

Originally posted by natrone06:

So acording to you don't give up on Marcus Martin and Lemonier because they are young but Ward is a waste after year one..... Sound logic . If this off season has proven anything Depth is hugely important. At a moments notice a position of strength can be depleated and you need backups to step up.

Martin & Lemonier weren't first-round picks. If they were, then that would've been a waste of extremely-high draft value. You don't spend a first-round pick on a backup safety.

Do me a favor
Go back and look at that roster the year we drafted Ward
Look at our depth, contracts, and average age per position
Then re-visit what happened during that draft day and tell me what a better option would have been.

I'll save you the trouble, there wasn't a better option

Originally posted by znk916:
dumb idea to try to convert him to slot last yr, dude is a natural FS and sounds like that's where he's playing most so far this camp

THIS. Who bright idea was that?

Originally posted by pdizo916:

Originally posted by znk916:
dumb idea to try to convert him to slot last yr, dude is a natural FS and sounds like that's where he's playing most so far this camp

THIS. Who bright idea was that?

He wasn't being converted to slot. We had so many CB injuries they put him in there to patch up the D and let him learn a new skillset.

Originally posted by Buchy:

Originally posted by pdizo916:

Originally posted by znk916:

dumb idea to try to convert him to slot last yr, dude is a natural FS and sounds like that's where he's playing most so far this camp

THIS. Who bright idea was that?

He wasn't being converted to slot. We had so many CB injuries they put him in there to patch up the D and let him learn a new skillset.

Who was injuried in camp at CB? He was learning slot position all through camp...I agree his a better FS.

Originally posted by Luckycharms:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Luckycharms:
With Tartt taking over most of all the big nickel work I'm really curious to see how Ward fits in. He's not working at the slot position any more, and I agree that he is a better fit at FS, but I'm not sure I see him playing more than 10 snaps a game. I think Tartt is a better fit as that hybrid safety due to his size and speed being able to cover TE's while still playing the run. I think Ward is capable of that as well, I just think Tartt is a better fit.

I'm not sure how many times we will get 4 safety's on the field. I'm confident we will use the 3 safety look a lot in nickle and dime packages, I'm just not sure about getting Reid, Bethea, Tartt, and Ward at the same time. I would like to say I am a Ward fan, I'm just mainly curious how mangini will work him in since the coaching staff seems to only be practicing him at S, and I've yet to hear any of the beat writers mention having a 4 safety look in any of the training camp practices.

You sir, seem to get it. In some cases, it sounds like Ward could come in as the SAM or even WILL OLB as a hybrid and drop back in coverage at the snap...another wrinkle. The podcast was talking about how Mathieu was playing the SAM role on several DIME packages. So in essence, we could take TWO LB's off the field for better coverage and not lose on run support.

I agree NC, and I hope Mangini uses Ward cus I think he can be a stud safety. I'm just curious if Mangini will do that or will he just interchange Tartt and Ward as the hybrid safety in the big nickle 3 safety look based off who we are playing.

For example let's say it's 3rd and 4 and the offense puts out 3 WR's so we come out in our big nickle package with Tartt at the LB/SS role because at 3rd and 4 the offense can still choose a run play to pick up the 4 yards for the 1st down but Tartt is a better choice against the run than Ward.
But let's say it's 3rd and 8 and we like Wards coverage a little better than Tartt and we want to send Bowman on a blitz so Ward is responsible for covering a quick RB out of the flat, or a smaller TE down the seam.

I think those examples will be how Ward gets on the field. I think him and Tartt will be interchangeable and even Baalke mentioned this when Tartt was drafted. I would like for us to use a 4 safety look every now and then, I just haven't heard any of the beat writers mention seeing that being practiced.

Excellent point. It just gives Mangini the "flexibility" he's always talking about...going with a 4-Safety look or 3 or usual 2 with interchangeable personnel for specific matchups. This is going to be exciting to watch b/c I already see Bethea and Reid as playmakers...I have little doubt Tartt and Ward can be as well. Lots of parts Mangini can use here for sure.

thl408 is going to have a field day breaking down all our pre and post snap alignments and disguise "looks" in coverage.

Originally posted by NinerSickness:
Martin & Lemonier weren't first-round picks. If they were, then that would've been a waste of extremely-high draft value. You don't spend a first-round pick on a backup safety.

Amazing how many fans post but never read or take the two minutes to educate themselves.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Buchy:

Originally posted by pdizo916:

Originally posted by znk916:
dumb idea to try to convert him to slot last yr, dude is a natural FS and sounds like that's where he's playing most so far this camp

THIS. Who bright idea was that?

He wasn't being converted to slot. We had so many CB injuries they put him in there to patch up the D and let him learn a new skillset.

Who was injuried in camp at CB? He was learning slot position all through camp...I agree his a better FS.

Yeah, in this case, Fangio did note he was considered a starter b/c he'd be playing, essentially, that slot CB spot up to 60% of the year.

However, despite the perception, he did have a pretty solid year for a rookie.

BUT, I didn't like how he was used...turn and run with the WR in the slot with his back to the QB before passing off the to the S's. His best attributes are reading and breaking on balls when everything is in front of him. That's why I'm loving these hybrid ILB/S roles for he and Tartt. I think that plays to their strengths much better. We can use a more pure CB in the slot now with our depth and talent (slide Brock inside or use Reaser or Acker or Johnson).

Originally posted by Quest4six:
Do me a favor
Go back and look at that roster the year we drafted Ward
Look at our depth, contracts, and average age per position
Then re-visit what happened during that draft day and tell me what a better option would have been.

I'll save you the trouble, there wasn't a better option

That's ridiculous. There wasn't a better option? The better option was picked 1 pick after Ward: Bradley Roby! Jordan Matthews was also on the board, and he would've been a better pick. And I was saying all of this BEFORE AND DURING the draft.

There wasn't a better option than a tweener FS / CB who isn't all that good???

Originally posted by NinerSickness:

That's ridiculous. There wasn't a better option? The better option was picked 1 pick after Ward: Bradley Roby! Jordan Matthews was also on the board, and he would've been a better pick. And I was saying all of this BEFORE AND DURING the draft.

There wasn't a better option than a tweener FS / CB who isn't all that good???

Considering the rather large regression from junior to senior tape, easy to see why some of the teams needing DB's ahead of us and Denver passed on Roby. And FWIW Denver has discussed using Roby as a base safety and sub package nickel corner this year.

Matthews might not have even played last year given how Harbs and Roman did not afford much opportunity to young receivers. Could easily have spent our offseason debating whether he is a bust (after 1 season ) or whether he just needed developed/opportunity.

You are saying Ward is not very good after only 8 pro games played. It's far too early to tell exactly what we have in Ward. Over the last couple of years posters here have really begun jumping the gun on young players, calling them busts way early in their careers. Every player develops at a different rate, some come on strong early and some take a little longer.

The all 22 breakdown thread showed Ward fared better than most realize or have given credit for.

Originally posted by KRS-1:
Considering the rather large regression from junior to senior tape, easy to see why some of the teams needing DB's ahead of us and Denver passed on Roby. And FWIW Denver has discussed using Roby as a base safety and sub package nickel corner this year.

Matthews might not have even played last year given how Harbs and Roman did not afford much opportunity to young receivers. Could easily have spent our offseason debating whether he is a bust (after 1 season ) or whether he just needed developed/opportunity.

You are saying Ward is not very good after only 8 pro games played. It's far too early to tell exactly what we have in Ward. Over the last couple of years posters here have really begun jumping the gun on young players, calling them busts way early in their careers. Every player develops at a different rate, some come on strong early and some take a little longer.

The all 22 breakdown thread showed Ward fared better than most realize or have given credit for.

Nailed it.

Originally posted by NYniner85:

Originally posted by Buchy:

Originally posted by pdizo916:

Originally posted by znk916:
dumb idea to try to convert him to slot last yr, dude is a natural FS and sounds like that's where he's playing most so far this camp

THIS. Who bright idea was that?

He wasn't being converted to slot. We had so many CB injuries they put him in there to patch up the D and let him learn a new skillset.

Who was injuried in camp at CB? He was learning slot position all through camp...I agree his a better FS.

If I remember rightly, Chris Cook was injured and Cox had a niggling injury early as well. I don't think it was a good idea to put him in the slot vs Marshall but I don't think it's a bad thing that he can play 2 positions.

Originally posted by KRS-1:
Considering the rather large regression from junior to senior tape, easy to see why some of the teams needing DB's ahead of us and Denver passed on Roby. And FWIW Denver has discussed using Roby as a base safety and sub package nickel corner this year.

Matthews might not have even played last year given how Harbs and Roman did not afford much opportunity to young receivers. Could easily have spent our offseason debating whether he is a bust (after 1 season ) or whether he just needed developed/opportunity.

You are saying Ward is not very good after only 8 pro games played. It's far too early to tell exactly what we have in Ward. Over the last couple of years posters here have really begun jumping the gun on young players, calling them busts way early in their careers. Every player develops at a different rate, some come on strong early and some take a little longer.

The all 22 breakdown thread showed Ward fared better than most realize or have given credit for.

Matthews would have been yet another possession receiver on a roster filled with possession receivers. I think Ward will more than prove his worth in the seasons to come, holding an injury-plagued rookie season against him is just asinine.

I'm just concerned this jones fracture will be a recurring issue.

whats this dudes deal

Originally posted by Garcia:

whats this dudes deal

I think his footy still hurts..