Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by Adusoron:
Jonnydel, what did you think of Colin's progress in the pocket progressing through his reads in this playoff game? I listed to Greg Cosell's analysis with Tom Tolbert (interview yesterday evening on KNBR).
Cosell admitted he's perplexed by QBs like Newton and CK7 and not sure how to judge them as quarterbacks because they are clearly gifted runners who are unfinished passers. He believes (and I agree) and there has to be a balance in when you have your QB abandoning the pocket on a scramble and when you have the QB hang in there, shift/reset his feet, and make additional reads. He wasn't saying Colin or JH are wrong in how they approached the Green Bay game, but he implied that CK7 is still jumping to running/leaving the pocket too soon and not developing his read progression skills a la Brady/Brees/Manning pocket QB style.
Cosell also theorized that at some point, you face a defense competent at taking away the scrambling and read option lanes. (Carolina and Seattle are clearly two of those types of defenses and are likely the next two teams we play, assuming a win in CAR). He said he is concerned that when those defenses set up against a Newton or CK7's scrambling/RO tendency, without having developed read progression skills, the passing offense is in trouble.
We all saw what happened @SEA, IND, CAR, and @NO. In those four games, Colin was criticized soundly for playing poorly in the pocket, missing reads, abandoning the pocket too early, etc. And in all those games, we lost. (I realize there are many mitigating factors like Crabtree and Davis being injured, and the rest of the receiving corps being subpar or Roman having occasional brainfarts in his playcall and play design but my focus is on Colin.)
Based on what you've seen in the GB tape, and judging Cosells' comments above, are you concerned about CAR or SEA forcing Colin into being a strict pocket passer and have you seen enough progression in Colin's game that he can avoid repeating the four losses?
I started watching film after the Seattle game; since then, I've gone back and watched just about every game this year and every game since and a couple games from last season in the playoffs. Here's what I can say to this regard:
Last year in the playoffs, Colin wanted to see his receiver open against zone coverage before he threw it. He was very successful against zone coverages because the underneath defenders were usually pulled up by his running ability and he has a strong arm to drive the ball down the field. Against man coverage he was able to take off and run. Where he struggled was against a rush that collapsed the pocket and against exotic coverages.
What I've seen this year is an increasing ability to anticipate when a receiver will be open against zone coverages. He's also done a much better job of recognizing pre-snap, when a defense is going to be in either man or zone coverage(a lot like what I showed earlier). There has been times when there has been a receiver open when he's run, but there's also an element of what it does to a defense when he starts to run(I'll show later). I've seen him have the ability to get to his 3rd, 4th and 5th reads. When he struggles to go through his progression isn't that much different than other Qb's, it's when he's under pressure from the DL. His biggest strength is also his weakness, not his ability to run, but his absolute trust in his receivers. This has given some big plays, but also kept him from moving on from some of his progressions.
I think he views his running not as much as a "bailout" but as a read in itself. When he's reading the coverage I think there are times when he see's his lane as a runner as a better option than the receiver who's open. Sometimes he's trying to avoid the rush, other times I think it's truly the better option.
I have seen a lot of growth from him in his ability to read the defense and he now has a couple guys who he can look to who really can beat a 1-1 coverage.
If you're trying to evaluate them the same as a guy like Drew Brees, he's not there. Brees using the run as a bailout and a way to make something out of nothing. I think Kaep uses his running as another read in the passing game sometimes. If you try and evaluate them the same, you'll be perplexed because it seems like he's bailing out too soon, you always want the QB to find the open receiver as the best option. If you evaluate it as taking the best option out of the read of the defense, I think he's doing a pretty good job.
Not sure how clear that is or how much that helps. But that's my two cents.
Really interesting topic, the bolded, in both your posts. There might be a tendency to penalize these dual threat QBs for looking to run instead of sticking it out in the pocket. But when you get results like a 42 and a 24 yard scramble, it makes the judging easy. Each scramble would have to be looked at to see if that was the better option over a possible open target downfield. I think
it was Brent Jones on KNBR radio that said it's harder for these dual threat QBs to know what to do because they have more than just one thing to do - throw or run. That seems like a very valid point. These QBs were scrambling QBs in high school and college and now they are told to unlearn an instinct.
Here are some WildKap plays that the 49ers used in the game. These were the two designed runs that I saw. The others were scrambles. 7 carries for 98 yards.
This is the third 49er offensively play of the game. Kap will take the snap and sweep right. The blocks to watch are Vance and ADavis.
Below: The LB has given Vance a hard enough shove to alter Vance's path to his assigned blocking assignment, #50.
Below: The DE lined up over ADavis has pushed him back about 2 yards. This alters Kap's path to the edge.
The play: The combination of Vance and ADavis prevent this play from getting off the ground as #50 forces Kap back to the inside. 1 yard gain.
The other designed Kap run. There was a bunch of motioning and arm waving between Kap and the WRs and talking with Gore before the play. I want to think that Kap saw the numbers favorable and audibled to this play. The WRs all go downfield looking for blocks.
The play: 16 yard gain and now defenses have another thing to gameplan for.
[ Edited by thl408 on Jan 7, 2014 at 11:29 PM ]