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Analysis from the Green Bay Packers coaches film

Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Wait, Brooks had 2 sacks, 5 QB hits, 3rd in tackles and a forced fumble and he had a bad game b/c of containment? LOL.

On a serious note, you are right, containment is usually his best asset and s/b an anomaly. Great breakdown though.

Looking forward to your "how to beat Carolina" break down!

Green Bay ran the ball more frequently than anticipated. Rogers threw 26 passes; Lacey 21 carries.

My guess is that sometimes Brooks got caught going inside on plays that ended up being running plays, and not pass plays.

That is my guess.

well, sort of, contain isn't just restricted to the run game. Think of how AZ absolutely dominated Seattle's passing offense, they kept great contain on Russel Wilson. A speed rush up the field is great, but not if you allow the QB a big lane to step up and out of the pocket. Against a guy like AR you have to understand that if there's a lane to move in the pocket Rodgers is going to get it. The biggest difference between Aldon's pass rush and Brooks is that Aldon's more disciplined. He'll take a speed rush to the outside shoulder of the T and look to flatten out at the top to collapse the lane. Brooks tried to speed rush right around the T, he got some hurries this way but they weren't really hurries cause Rodgers only had to take a half step forward to be completely out of the way. If Rodgers doesn't step forward he still probably wouldn't have been touched by Brooks - again, not all the time, but sometimes that's what happened. Brooks didn't play a terrible game, I just thought it was the poorest of the starters in general.
Aldon was in beast mode from the jump. GB did a good job with that formation they ran from the 2nd quarter on. In the shotgun with a single back. That forces one of the linebackers off the field and that's when teams seem to have some success running the ball right up the gut.
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Wait, Brooks had 2 sacks, 5 QB hits, 3rd in tackles and a forced fumble and he had a bad game b/c of containment? LOL.

On a serious note, you are right, containment is usually his best asset and s/b an anomaly. Great breakdown though.

Looking forward to your "how to beat Carolina" break down!

Green Bay ran the ball more frequently than anticipated. Rogers threw 26 passes; Lacey 21 carries.

My guess is that sometimes Brooks got caught going inside on plays that ended up being running plays, and not pass plays.

That is my guess.

well, sort of, contain isn't just restricted to the run game. Think of how AZ absolutely dominated Seattle's passing offense, they kept great contain on Russel Wilson. A speed rush up the field is great, but not if you allow the QB a big lane to step up and out of the pocket. Against a guy like AR you have to understand that if there's a lane to move in the pocket Rodgers is going to get it. The biggest difference between Aldon's pass rush and Brooks is that Aldon's more disciplined. He'll take a speed rush to the outside shoulder of the T and look to flatten out at the top to collapse the lane. Brooks tried to speed rush right around the T, he got some hurries this way but they weren't really hurries cause Rodgers only had to take a half step forward to be completely out of the way. If Rodgers doesn't step forward he still probably wouldn't have been touched by Brooks - again, not all the time, but sometimes that's what happened. Brooks didn't play a terrible game, I just thought it was the poorest of the starters in general.


The 49ers did the same vs Seattle in their second meeting. The D-Line and OLB stayed in their lanes and constantly compressed the pocket while not allowing an escape route.
Originally posted by Byisgod:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Wait, Brooks had 2 sacks, 5 QB hits, 3rd in tackles and a forced fumble and he had a bad game b/c of containment? LOL.

On a serious note, you are right, containment is usually his best asset and s/b an anomaly. Great breakdown though.

Looking forward to your "how to beat Carolina" break down!

The stats don't tell the whole story. GB was able to run the ball in the game because of Brooks. His sacks also had more to do with Aldon than they did himself. He was the one who let Rodgers out for the TD pass and also let Rodgers out on a few other key first downs. His stats say he played a much better game than he did. It's also not always about how many good plays you make in a game it's about how few negative plays. He had more than anyone on the team.

I noticed this throughout the entire game. Glad someone else caught it, too! He failed to set the edge on several plays, frequently getting sucked inside.

That, and on a few plays he didn't collapse the lane, he's usually really good at this, but, several times he got widened out like Aldon did and wasn't able to collapse the lane down.
Originally posted by lamontb:
Aldon was in beast mode from the jump. GB did a good job with that formation they ran from the 2nd quarter on. In the shotgun with a single back. That forces one of the linebackers off the field and that's when teams seem to have some success running the ball right up the gut.


One thing I noticed...its seems that they didn't substitute Willis out of the game nearly as much as they had vs GB in the past.
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Wait, Brooks had 2 sacks, 5 QB hits, 3rd in tackles and a forced fumble and he had a bad game b/c of containment? LOL.

On a serious note, you are right, containment is usually his best asset and s/b an anomaly. Great breakdown though.

Looking forward to your "how to beat Carolina" break down!

The stats don't tell the whole story. GB was able to run the ball in the game because of Brooks. His sacks also had more to do with Aldon than they did himself. He was the one who let Rodgers out for the TD pass and also let Rodgers out on a few other key first downs. His stats say he played a much better game than he did. It's also not always about how many good plays you make in a game it's about how few negative plays. He had more than anyone on the team.

I know brother...I was just messing with you. Being more ironical b/c most focus on him and his sacks (even though he plays the SAM) and ignore all the REAL OLB stuff he does top notch. This was a perfect example!
Originally posted by ace52:
Thanks for the review.
It's great to hear about the development in Aldon. He is progressing well from a pass-rush specialist to an excellent all-around OLB.
I find it a bit puzzling that Kap's footwork was better under center than in the shotgun. Didn't he spend most of his time in college playing in shot gun formation?
Also, some analyst on the pre-game show (It might have been Howie Long) made the remark that Kap is a streaky thrower, meaning that he would have streaks where he would throw the ball really well, and then ones where he was much less effective. Do you agree with this assessment? (To me, it seemed like Kap started the game "hot", then cooled down significantly in the middle part of the game, before getting back on track in the 4th quarter). If he is indeed "streaky", is that just how he is, or is it due to the defense making some adjustments against him, and him needing some time to adjust to their adjustments?

I think the biggest reason his under center footwork is better is because of "time on task". Since coming out of college he's probably worked on his under center footwork more than anything because he needed to so much.

also, I do somewhat agree about him being a streaky thrower. I think it more has to do with his rhythm in reading the coverage. I think defenses have done a lot of in-game adjusting, so he'll get in rhythm, they switch it up, he slows down, then speeds up, they switch it up. Kind of a thing. What helps him the most is when the run game is going and he's able to get in rhythm with the play action. Where he starts to sputter is when the play action passes get snuffed out more.
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Aldon was in beast mode from the jump. GB did a good job with that formation they ran from the 2nd quarter on. In the shotgun with a single back. That forces one of the linebackers off the field and that's when teams seem to have some success running the ball right up the gut.


One thing I noticed...its seems that they didn't substitute Willis out of the game nearly as much as they had vs GB in the past.

This is an excellent point. What's that alignment we usually do...5-2?
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Aldon was in beast mode from the jump. GB did a good job with that formation they ran from the 2nd quarter on. In the shotgun with a single back. That forces one of the linebackers off the field and that's when teams seem to have some success running the ball right up the gut.


One thing I noticed...its seems that they didn't substitute Willis out of the game nearly as much as they had vs GB in the past.

This is an excellent point. What's that alignment we usually do...5-2?


I wasn't counting plays in specific alignments or anything, but it seemed that both ILBs were on the field most of the time. I spent alot of time on Seahawks forums in the offseason and I got alot of comments about how the 49ers were "routinely taking Willis out of the game". I think that was way overblown. It looks like they tended to do that against Green Bay specifically in the first meeting because GB didn't have a runner who could scare them and played Dime and Nickel almost the entire game.

In the playoffs, it seemed they used that alignment alot less.

In the season opener THIS year, it seemed they almost never played the NT. Ian Williams and Glenn Dorsey played sparingly if at all in week 1.

This time around, Dorsey played. Call that the Lacy effect.
[ Edited by Marvin49 on Jan 7, 2014 at 1:08 PM ]
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Here it is, I just finished going through the GB game. That was one heck of a game between two very talented teams that know each other well.
.
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Go Niners!

P.S. as usual, breakdowns to follow:


Pretty much like a division game playing four times in 2 years. Good take on Brooks. I did not notice his subpar play at all. Interesting that the 49ers this year played SEA (x2), WAS, IND, HOU and GB (x2). All are predominantly zone blocking run teams. There are only a handful of teams in the league that use zone blocking and the 49ers played five of them. When I noticed that I looked up the YPC for those games and the 49ers were not faring well. Rushing totals were fine, but YPC was a bit high. I'm glad Lacy was kept in check for the most part.

Crazy stat is Rodgers did not complete one pass in the entire 1st quarter. On many of those plays I thought they were coverage sacks as he did not even pull the trigger. I haven't watched the entire game on All22 yet, only the 49er offensive plays.

I agree the Packers were set out on shutting down VD and were going to live with Crabs 1 on 1. We know the stat line for Crabs. Very encouraging that teams can focus on shutting one guy down, then another will shine. As Kap establishes his arm as a weapon, teams will have to pick and choose whether to sit in zone coverage to keep their eyes on Kap, or man up and risk getting gashed for 15-30 yard scrambles.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Originally posted by lamontb:
Aldon was in beast mode from the jump. GB did a good job with that formation they ran from the 2nd quarter on. In the shotgun with a single back. That forces one of the linebackers off the field and that's when teams seem to have some success running the ball right up the gut.


One thing I noticed...its seems that they didn't substitute Willis out of the game nearly as much as they had vs GB in the past.

This is an excellent point. What's that alignment we usually do...5-2?

Our base defense is a 3-4 even alignment. We do use a lot of "over" and "under" as well, but we're mainly a true 3-4 even. That's where we have a NT, 2 DE, 2 OLB and 2 ILB.

When we go Nickel we use a 2-4 Nickel alignment. 2 DT's 4 LB's(2 OLB and 2 ILB) The biggest advantage with this alignment is that you have your two stud ILB's on the field against the run and because you're using OLB's as rushers, they also have to option of dropping into coverage. It makes things a lot harder on the O-line and QB to be sure who's rushing and who's not and what coverage will be run(again along with Fangio's preference to disguise).

When Willis comes out is in our Dime package whch is a 4-1-6 alignment. We'll move Smith and Brooks to DE with McD and Smith to DT's. I think they use Bowman in that coverage unit because rarely will a team only block with 5 guys, this will allow Bowman to serve as a "lurk" defender over the middle. Bowman is smoother in the hips than Willis which allows him to change direction faster. Willis is a faster one direction guy, but, in a lurk role you have to be able to change your direction quickly.

We'll also go with a quarter alignment sometimes, which is a 3-2-6 alignment. Meaning, 1 DT, 2 DE, 2 ILB and 6 DB's. When we do that we usually only rush 3. We used that a couple times in the GB game.
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Here it is, I just finished going through the GB game. That was one heck of a game between two very talented teams that know each other well.
.
.
Go Niners!

P.S. as usual, breakdowns to follow:


Pretty much like a division game playing four times in 2 years. Good take on Brooks. I did not notice his subpar play at all. Interesting that the 49ers this year played SEA (x2), WAS, IND, HOU and GB (x2). All are predominantly zone blocking run teams. There are only a handful of teams in the league that use zone blocking and the 49ers played five of them. When I noticed that I looked up the YPC for those games and the 49ers were not faring well. Rushing totals were fine, but YPC was a bit high. I'm glad Lacy was kept in check for the most part.

Crazy stat is Rodgers did not complete one pass in the entire 1st quarter. On many of those plays I thought they were coverage sacks as he did not even pull the trigger. I haven't watched the entire game on All22 yet, only the 49er offensive plays.

I agree the Packers were set out on shutting down VD and were going to live with Crabs 1 on 1. We know the stat line for Crabs. Very encouraging that teams can focus on shutting one guy down, then another will shine. As Kap establishes his arm as a weapon, teams will have to pick and choose whether to sit in zone coverage to keep their eyes on Kap, or man up and risk getting gashed for 15-30 yard scrambles.

And THAT is what fans of other teams have been missing all year when we complain about not having Crab. I remember having those arguments and peeps would be like "oh yeah, one guy is going to fix your entire passing game LOL".

Well, as a matter of fact...

It's not just Crab catching the ball. Its the THREAT of Crab that forces you to play honest. With no Crab and Vernon hurt, teams could just sit on the already speed challenged Boldin and Niners were toast.

With Crab, they have to play more honest. More importantly, when plays break down Kap and Crab already have a chemistry to find an open spot and make a "sandlot" play. Kap doesn't have that same chemistry with any other player on the team. Not even Vernon or Boldin. Thats also why Crab needs to be resigned. Soon.
[ Edited by Marvin49 on Jan 7, 2014 at 1:30 PM ]
Originally posted by thl408:

Pretty much like a division game playing four times in 2 years. Good take on Brooks. I did not notice his subpar play at all. Interesting that the 49ers this year played SEA (x2), WAS, IND, HOU and GB (x2). All are predominantly zone blocking run teams. There are only a handful of teams in the league that use zone blocking and the 49ers played five of them. When I noticed that I looked up the YPC for those games and the 49ers were not faring well. Rushing totals were fine, but YPC was a bit high. I'm glad Lacy was kept in check for the most part.

Agreed, perhaps the game plan was to get to Rodgers as much as possible and crack that collar bone b/c both OLB's were rushing hard this game and not hesitating in their first step. I noted before the game that we tend to struggle with power backs (it seems this way anyhow) and predicted Lacy would be in the 4-5 yard YPC range but the overall average won't tell the whole story...these big backs can break us a bit on a few drives here and there and wear us down. Then they can also be stuffed a bit and stretched out for no gains/TFL. Lacy was a handful and they had a nice balance of run/pass. It seemed like Rodgers took advantage of the pass rush and off coverage and starting dinking and dunking us a couple times for scores.
[ Edited by NCommand on Jan 7, 2014 at 1:30 PM ]
Originally posted by jonnydel:
well, sort of, contain isn't just restricted to the run game. Think of how AZ absolutely dominated Seattle's passing offense, they kept great contain on Russel Wilson. A speed rush up the field is great, but not if you allow the QB a big lane to step up and out of the pocket. Against a guy like AR you have to understand that if there's a lane to move in the pocket Rodgers is going to get it. The biggest difference between Aldon's pass rush and Brooks is that Aldon's more disciplined. He'll take a speed rush to the outside shoulder of the T and look to flatten out at the top to collapse the lane. Brooks tried to speed rush right around the T, he got some hurries this way but they weren't really hurries cause Rodgers only had to take a half step forward to be completely out of the way. If Rodgers doesn't step forward he still probably wouldn't have been touched by Brooks - again, not all the time, but sometimes that's what happened. Brooks didn't play a terrible game, I just thought it was the poorest of the starters in general.

we here our guys say this every week "keep him in the cage"

qb's who can move around that's the focus. keep him in the box and make them make those plays. i see this emphasis continuing this upcoming week.
and with aldon being back in form it's a game changer. honestly brooks should feast more now than ever because aldon is now truly one of the best olb in the game.
he was all pass rush but now at this point im more impressed with his edge setting and run stopping. every game he has 2 or 3 wow plays. you pointed out the 1st series where he knocks the t back into the running back, im sitting at home going WOW is anybody else seeing?

he just has that fire in his eyes again. they all do. i was impressed with cox coming in and playing as well as he did in a big game. he had some key pass breakups where usually db's just let the catch happen.

this was the best offense we are going to face on the nfc side of things. they have an elite qb, stud running back, and beast wr core and they tried to take shots on us all game but couldn't

the defense is going to give up a drive or two but that's it. and that's amazing.

on offense we are deadly at this point. the panthers should burn the tape from the 1st game because they can't play that way.
cannot shade coverage towards 1 person.
cannot just play zone otherwise we run free
cannot play man without a spy cause kap will run
cannot play man with a spy because as of late our backs are leaking out and they're going to get free releases.

my only concern is interior line, mainly goodwin. if he can play a great game keeping the middle clean in the passing game so that when the outside rushes kap can step up? then i like what we can do to them offensively. especially keeping our new fb in the game to match up with their linebackers.

at this point with our offense, no matter who we play.. you just can't cover everybody.

when they played us vd went down, crab wasn't there. and don't forget reid went out with the concussion.

but they literally had to shade coverage to boldin and stack the box against gore. that's it..
you do that this time and you're going to get punished.
Originally posted by Marvin49:
And THAT is what fans of other teams have been missing all year when we complain about not having Crab. I remember having those arguments and peeps would be like "oh yeah, one guy is going to fix your entire passing game LOL".

Well, as a matter of fact...

God who would argue that? Do they NOT watch our offense? Crabtree is critical to OUR offense in particular. Sure, other teams runs different systems and can plug-n-play anyone but Crabtree is essential to our success in our system (i.e. making the most out of 5-8 catches a game + RAC, 3rd down conversions, TD's, ad lib plays, run blocking, he wants the ball, experience, etc.).