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Originally posted by BrianGO:
The "right" price?

Kap had the second highest QBR in the postseason last year. This year, once again, he has the second highest. Only Lucks super performance was better. Kap's play is about as consistent as it gets.

He was a top ten quarterback with only one WR, with Crabs back he is top five. What is the "right" price for those 3rd down scrambles at the end of the Green Bay game? We would not have won with some blah quarterback in Green Bay. We would not have won the NFC championship last year with some blah quarterback.

We can and will afford Kap. Flacco is a joke compared to Kap. So is Romo and Cutler.
Kap will be paid at least as much as those guys. I think we can keep Kap, Aldon and either Crabs or Boldin. Then we can use our draft picks to fill in what we have lost. That is the only way to go about it. When you have a top five quarterback you have to pay him market value. There is no way around it.

We will lose Iupati, Brown, Rogers, Whitner, Goodwin, and probably a few others. And we will be FINE. We have a crap load of draft picks and we can fill in the gaps.

At what point after week 1 this season was Kaep a top 10 QB? He was horrible through the mid season. Particularly in our 4 losses. The Green Bay defense is atrocious and always blow their assignments. Hell, he throws the game away had that CB held on to the pick in the final minutes. Dodged a huge bullet there.

I can agree Flacco, Romo & Cutler are all jokes. But I feel they would win with our Defense holding up their end.

I don't think his play has earned 120M. And if we pay him on potential be prepared to miss the playoffs in seasons to come.

Originally posted by AUniner:

Originally posted by BrianGO:
The "right" price?

Kap had the second highest QBR in the postseason last year. This year, once again, he has the second highest. Only Lucks super performance was better. Kap's play is about as consistent as it gets.

He was a top ten quarterback with only one WR, with Crabs back he is top five. What is the "right" price for those 3rd down scrambles at the end of the Green Bay game? We would not have won with some blah quarterback in Green Bay. We would not have won the NFC championship last year with some blah quarterback.

We can and will afford Kap. Flacco is a joke compared to Kap. So is Romo and Cutler.
Kap will be paid at least as much as those guys. I think we can keep Kap, Aldon and either Crabs or Boldin. Then we can use our draft picks to fill in what we have lost. That is the only way to go about it. When you have a top five quarterback you have to pay him market value. There is no way around it.

We will lose Iupati, Brown, Rogers, Whitner, Goodwin, and probably a few others. And we will be FINE. We have a crap load of draft picks and we can fill in the gaps.

At what point after week 1 this season was Kaep a top 10 QB? He was horrible through the mid season. Particularly in our 4 losses. The Green Bay defense is atrocious and always blow their assignments. Hell, he throws the game away had that CB held on to the pick in the final minutes. Dodged a huge bullet there.

I can agree Flacco, Romo & Cutler are all jokes. But I feel they would win with our Defense holding up their end.

I don't think his play has earned 120M. And if we pay him on potential be prepared to miss the playoffs in seasons to come.

and if you try to under pay him be prepared for his agent to laugh and eventually test the market and miss the playoffs in season to come. its a double edged sword. it took like 10 years to get to the point of seriously debating paying our qb top money. we shouldnt forget that.

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
We need AB81 to break it down for us lol. I have to find that thread he had some months back with a breakdown of a possible cap outlook for 2014 and 2015. I do not believe Baalke will have three guys taking up almost 50% of the cap space. I don't know how he'll get it done, but he will, and I think we have a relatively unselfish group of guys who have not sought to break the bank with their deals.

Kap 20
Aldon 15
Crabs 10

That's 45 million. Wasn't the cap going up to 126 million? That's definitely not half the salary. And we can afford it once we let Iupati, Goodwin, Rogers, Hitner, Brown and Boldin walk. And we can keep Boldin and maybe someone else for another year if we wait to pay Aldon and/or Crabs next year. Although, IMO, that just makes their price go up even higher.

Originally posted by crabman82:

Originally posted by AUniner:

Originally posted by BrianGO:
The "right" price?

Kap had the second highest QBR in the postseason last year. This year, once again, he has the second highest. Only Lucks super performance was better. Kap's play is about as consistent as it gets.

He was a top ten quarterback with only one WR, with Crabs back he is top five. What is the "right" price for those 3rd down scrambles at the end of the Green Bay game? We would not have won with some blah quarterback in Green Bay. We would not have won the NFC championship last year with some blah quarterback.

We can and will afford Kap. Flacco is a joke compared to Kap. So is Romo and Cutler.
Kap will be paid at least as much as those guys. I think we can keep Kap, Aldon and either Crabs or Boldin. Then we can use our draft picks to fill in what we have lost. That is the only way to go about it. When you have a top five quarterback you have to pay him market value. There is no way around it.

We will lose Iupati, Brown, Rogers, Whitner, Goodwin, and probably a few others. And we will be FINE. We have a crap load of draft picks and we can fill in the gaps.

At what point after week 1 this season was Kaep a top 10 QB? He was horrible through the mid season. Particularly in our 4 losses. The Green Bay defense is atrocious and always blow their assignments. Hell, he throws the game away had that CB held on to the pick in the final minutes. Dodged a huge bullet there.

I can agree Flacco, Romo & Cutler are all jokes. But I feel they would win with our Defense holding up their end.

I don't think his play has earned 120M. And if we pay him on potential be prepared to miss the playoffs in seasons to come.

and if you try to under pay him be prepared for his agent to laugh and eventually test the market and miss the playoffs in season to come. its a double edged sword. it took like 10 years to get to the point of seriously debating paying our qb top money. we shouldnt forget that.

Of course, that's a fair point.

What would be nice is if the NFL would hurry up and commit to a reasonable Cap increase. It has to come soon with everyone loading up on 100M QBs.

Next year will be HELL for a lot of teams. Luck, RG3, Wilson & Tannehill are all going to want the monies. Foles as well.

Another thing to consider, ridiculous as it sounds, might be how (un)lucky we were to flop on the 2012 Draft. At least we don't need to cough up the cash for those guys.

Originally posted by AUniner:

Originally posted by crabman82:

Originally posted by AUniner:

Originally posted by BrianGO:
The "right" price?

Kap had the second highest QBR in the postseason last year. This year, once again, he has the second highest. Only Lucks super performance was better. Kap's play is about as consistent as it gets.

He was a top ten quarterback with only one WR, with Crabs back he is top five. What is the "right" price for those 3rd down scrambles at the end of the Green Bay game? We would not have won with some blah quarterback in Green Bay. We would not have won the NFC championship last year with some blah quarterback.

We can and will afford Kap. Flacco is a joke compared to Kap. So is Romo and Cutler.
Kap will be paid at least as much as those guys. I think we can keep Kap, Aldon and either Crabs or Boldin. Then we can use our draft picks to fill in what we have lost. That is the only way to go about it. When you have a top five quarterback you have to pay him market value. There is no way around it.

We will lose Iupati, Brown, Rogers, Whitner, Goodwin, and probably a few others. And we will be FINE. We have a crap load of draft picks and we can fill in the gaps.

At what point after week 1 this season was Kaep a top 10 QB? He was horrible through the mid season. Particularly in our 4 losses. The Green Bay defense is atrocious and always blow their assignments. Hell, he throws the game away had that CB held on to the pick in the final minutes. Dodged a huge bullet there.

I can agree Flacco, Romo & Cutler are all jokes. But I feel they would win with our Defense holding up their end.

I don't think his play has earned 120M. And if we pay him on potential be prepared to miss the playoffs in seasons to come.

and if you try to under pay him be prepared for his agent to laugh and eventually test the market and miss the playoffs in season to come. its a double edged sword. it took like 10 years to get to the point of seriously debating paying our qb top money. we shouldnt forget that.

Of course, that's a fair point.

What would be nice is if the NFL would hurry up and commit to a reasonable Cap increase. It has to come soon with everyone loading up on 100M QBs.

Next year will be HELL for a lot of teams. Luck, RG3, Wilson & Tannehill are all going to want the monies. Foles as well.

Another thing to consider, ridiculous as it sounds, might be how (un)lucky we were to flop on the 2012 Draft. At least we don't need to cough up the cash for those guys.

it did jump the shark a while back. i remember not too long ago rodgers got like 6 for 60, then it became 100-120 mil as a starting point. inflated more than any other position thats for sure. its like all the money they took from 1st round rookies went to the qbs.

Originally posted by BrianGO:
Kap 20
Aldon 15
Crabs 10

That's 45 million. Wasn't the cap going up to 126 million? That's definitely not half the salary. And we can afford it once we let Iupati, Goodwin, Rogers, Hitner, Brown and Boldin walk. And we can keep Boldin and maybe someone else for another year if we wait to pay Aldon and/or Crabs next year. Although, IMO, that just makes their price go up even higher.

Crabs will want more. 12-15 p.a.

Originally posted by crabman82:
it did jump the shark a while back. i remember not too long ago rodgers got like 6 for 60, then it became 100-120 mil as a starting point. inflated more than any other position thats for sure. its like all the money they took from 1st round rookies went to the qbs.

Just like Manning, Brady & Brees wanted.

Originally posted by AUniner:
Of course, that's a fair point.

What would be nice is if the NFL would hurry up and commit to a reasonable Cap increase. It has to come soon with everyone loading up on 100M QBs.

Next year will be HELL for a lot of teams. Luck, RG3, Wilson & Tannehill are all going to want the monies. Foles as well.

Another thing to consider, ridiculous as it sounds, might be how (un)lucky we were to flop on the 2012 Draft. At least we don't need to cough up the cash for those guys.

There is nothing worse for a team's salary cap, then missing on draft picks. Draft picks are relatively DIRT CHEAP compared to veteran players.

For example, Aldon, Kap, Crabs, Iupati and Reid are not making market value because they are on their rookie deals. They are saving us huge money because rookie deals are big cost savers.

No matter how good a young player plays, they can't just resign or refuse to play, without creating all kinds of problems for themselves.

Originally posted by AUniner:

Originally posted by BrianGO:
Kap 20
Aldon 15
Crabs 10

That's 45 million. Wasn't the cap going up to 126 million? That's definitely not half the salary. And we can afford it once we let Iupati, Goodwin, Rogers, Hitner, Brown and Boldin walk. And we can keep Boldin and maybe someone else for another year if we wait to pay Aldon and/or Crabs next year. Although, IMO, that just makes their price go up even higher.

Crabs will want more. 12-15 p.a.

All of them will want more.

Originally posted by BrianGO:
There is nothing worse for a team's salary cap, then missing on draft picks. Draft picks are relatively DIRT CHEAP compared to veteran players.

For example, Aldon, Kap, Crabs, Iupati and Reid are not making market value because they are on their rookie deals. They are saving us huge money because rookie deals are big cost savers.

No matter how good a young player plays, they can't just resign or refuse to play, without creating all kinds of problems for themselves.

Looks like I've given you a boner.

I get what you mean about missing in the draft but when you hit it out of the park like 2011 then it's not such a burden. Missing in 2012 should allow us to pour cash into the Kaep, Aldon & Crabs contracts though. So we'll be in good shape to extend Reid and hopefully Tank, McD, Lattimore.

Originally posted by AUniner:

Originally posted by tatdwolf49:
U cant pay everyone bigg money pplz some playerz have to go..

Kap will get a nice rise but hopefully he wont break our bank 6yrz $100mill h*ll give him $60mill guarantee..

I think crabtree will be our biggest problem to resign hez already makin good money so who knowz if he'll be happy with a little dump up in cash....

Aldon Smith i think we need to lock him 5-6 yrz i think he wont break our bank after we stood by him N payed him ..

Boldin bye bye i know hate me if u want but again we cant pay everyone ...To replace Boldin we draft 2 WRz N we have Patton to step up ...

Dawson again bye bye replace with a rookie yea hate me but i hate tha idea of payin a kicker 2+ mill draft a rookie put him in ...

Miller lock him up luv tha dude ....

Culliver think we'll get him cheap hopefully he comez back strong..

Iupati this is where im just not sure again we cant pay everyone hez great but is he worth 6-8+ mill a yr im not sure can we draft someone sure we have enough pickz..

Brown bye bye i think he'll want to much money after missin out on $2mill again draft a rookie itz what tha pickz are for ...

You wanna give Kaep 100M over 6 with 60 guaranteed? You're crazy. He hasn't shown his worth IMO and without Harbaugh I think he flops.

LOL, Harbaugh hand picked Kaep. Kaep has done more than ANY young QB so far in the NFL. If not him, then who?

Originally posted by kronik:
LOL, Harbaugh hand picked Kaep. Kaep has done more than ANY young QB so far in the NFL. If not him, then who?

It's not about keeping Kaep. I think we all want that. It's about keeping him at the right price.

IMO we need the other pieces for him to be successful. We need Crabs there. Possibly Boldin too... imagine this season without that guy here. Aldon can not leave.

We're a team pressed hard up against the cap with cheap guys that are in need of extensions. We need Kaep. We need Aldon. We need Crabs. How can we fit them all in. Those 3 are going to eat 50M cap room straight up.

If you think our coaches are going to throw rookies in there to replace every other FA, and there is a lot of them, I think you're mistaken. They don't operate like that. Eric Reid and Bruce Miller are the only rookies that have come in and started day 1 in this 3 year regime.

Good organizations re up contracts one year before player hit FA. That being said, the thread should be which players do you re up in 2014, AND which players are you willing to test FA and which player are you willing to franchise. Also which player are you willing to let go??

CK7 signed through 2014-
offer him 5 years 80 million, if he balks, let him play in 2014 for his contract, then franchise him in 2015 and 2016. This would be 3 years 30 million.

Crabtree- Offer to pay him as a top 3 WR, He is signed through 2014 because I do not believe he hit his outs.

Aldon Smith- Keep him on his rookie contract as his legal troubles need to play out.

Iupati- Let him play out his contract in 2014, in 2015 franchise him for a 1st round pick, if someone makes an offer, let him sign and take the first.

Boldin- Must sign him to 2 year 12 million dollar contract.

Frank Gore- falls into bucket of let him play out his contract for one more season, or gulp, let him go due to depth and his cap number. He will be like losing Montana, you know it is the right call, but it seems wrong.

Originally posted by 9erred:
Good organizations re up contracts one year before player hit FA. That being said, the thread should be which players do you re up in 2014, AND which players are you willing to test FA and which player are you willing to franchise. Also which player are you willing to let go??

CK7 signed through 2014-
offer him 5 years 80 million, if he balks, let him play in 2014 for his contract, then franchise him in 2015 and 2016. This would be 3 years 30 million.

Crabtree- Offer to pay him as a top 3 WR, He is signed through 2014 because I do not believe he hit his outs.

Aldon Smith- Keep him on his rookie contract as his legal troubles need to play out.

Iupati- Let him play out his contract in 2014, in 2015 franchise him for a 1st round pick, if someone makes an offer, let him sign and take the first.

Boldin- Must sign him to 2 year 12 million dollar contract.

Frank Gore- falls into bucket of let him play out his contract for one more season, or gulp, let him go due to depth and his cap number. He will be like losing Montana, you know it is the right call, but it seems wrong.

I'd RFA Crabs. See if someone is willing to dump a first rounder AND pay Crabs the money he wants. That way the niners can have the option to pick up the contract or take a draft pick, let someone else negotiate. Is restricted free agency still a thing? Been a while since I've seen it in action.

Originally posted by BrianGO:

Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
We need AB81 to break it down for us lol. I have to find that thread he had some months back with a breakdown of a possible cap outlook for 2014 and 2015. I do not believe Baalke will have three guys taking up almost 50% of the cap space. I don't know how he'll get it done, but he will, and I think we have a relatively unselfish group of guys who have not sought to break the bank with their deals.

Kap 20
Aldon 15
Crabs 10

That's 45 million. Wasn't the cap going up to 126 million? That's definitely not half the salary. And we can afford it once we let Iupati, Goodwin, Rogers, Hitner, Brown and Boldin walk. And we can keep Boldin and maybe someone else for another year if we wait to pay Aldon and/or Crabs next year. Although, IMO, that just makes their price go up even higher.

Crabtree at 10 is a bargain. I think that's probably the price Baalke wants him at. But I will admit that it is not half the cap. It still is a huge financial commitment and other guys are likely to take notice. I'm thinking Kaep will be a little more of a team player and we can get him at 15-18 million. It might sound unrealistic, but we all saw and I'm sure CK is well aware of what it was like this season without Crabtree. Kaep is a winning QB but he isn't at the level where he can make a receiver. Given that, I think he probably won't try to go for 20 million a year so that the team will be able to sign decent targets for him to throw to. If he sets that precedent, maybe the other 2011 guys and Michael Crabtree will follow suit.