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Greatest Niners by position

A nasty receiving core would be WR-Rice, WR-Owens, Slot-Taylor and TE-Vernon Davis.
  • cciowa
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Originally posted by 60sFan:
A nasty receiving core would be WR-Rice, WR-Owens, Slot-Taylor and TE-Vernon Davis.
rice gene washington, freddie soloman and kwalik would do just as well. it just frustrates me that alot of posters think the niners came into the league in 1980 you talk about linebackers.... dave wilcox, skip vanderwilt and the fudgehammer would do just as good as the current day guys esp behind the front four of hardman, hart, elam and webb. do you guys not know that 76 team still has the all time record(for a 14 game season ) of sacks in a single season at 61 0r 63, no issue with rathman at fb but ken willard is his back up in my opinion,,, that is back in the days of a single bar face mask and none of this p***y cage s**t today
  • cciowa
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Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
My team:

Young
Rice
TO
Rathman
Vernon
Waters
'94 oline

Justin Smith
Bryant Young
Dana Stubblefield
Aldon Smith
Julian Peterson
Patrick Willis
Ken Norton Jr.
Navarro Bowman
Deoin Sanders
Eric Davis
Merton Hanks
Tim McDonald

Brian Jennings
Andy Lee
Jeff Wilkins
no mention of jimmy johnson hall of famer, shut down corner even before the word was invented,, disgracefull
Could we list it as a depth chart?

ie:

QB - Montana, Young, Brodie
HB - Gore, Craig, McIlhenny, Hearst
FB - Rathman, Floyd
WR - Rice, TO, JT, Washington
TE - Davis, Jones
etc etc
Originally posted by cciowa:
rice gene washington, freddie soloman and kwalik would do just as well. it just frustrates me that alot of posters think the niners came into the league in 1980 you talk about linebackers.... dave wilcox, skip vanderwilt and the fudgehammer would do just as good as the current day guys esp behind the front four of hardman, hart, elam and webb. do you guys not know that 76 team still has the all time record(for a 14 game season ) of sacks in a single season at 61 0r 63, no issue with rathman at fb but ken willard is his back up in my opinion,,, that is back in the days of a single bar face mask and none of this p***y cage s**t today

I'm not dissing the old guys, but some of the older players aren't as athletic or physical specimens as today's players. Now I'm not saying athleticism is everything, but combine it with the same football IQ and instincts as the older players, then some of today's player are more dominant.
'
Originally posted by cciowa:
wow,, you have to have a better understanding of the team to do this in my opinion. the team lived before 1980 and you need to include great players and hall of fame guys like jimmy johnson, dave wilcox, forest blue as the best center ever. how can you exclude gene washington,, how can you exclude perhaps the best pass rusher in our history in cedrick hardman? to have deion sanders on that list with no mention to jimmy johnson is a insult in my opinion. sure justin smith is good but come on,, hardman, fred dean, charley kruger. sheesh. john brodie must be in that list and so does ted kwalik

Thanks, Jimmy Johnson was so good NFL teams stopped throwing to his side for years. He played on some bad teams and there was no ESPN or internet so except in SF his name was not mentioned too much. Another 49er great who could play today was Bob St.Clair, offensive tackle, 6'9" around 270. In 10-20 years the next generation of fans will ask, "Who was Joe Montana?"
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Originally posted by kray28:
I like Gore, but Hearst in his prime was the better runner, a guy who could take it to the house from anywhere in the field (96 yard run?). Watters was a better receiver, and Craig was all-around great too. Gore has longevity on his side...but we have had more explosive and more skilled players at the position than him.

It is a tough argument to make. Hearst was phenomenal. He probably had the best burst of speed through the line of anyone on the list. That 96 yarder was monumental. Each of the four guys mentioned was great at something, but also had a weakness. Hearst lost too many years to injury, Watters wasn't much of a ball carrier, and Craig's numbers suffered a bit because of the style of offense his teams played. Gore has had some minor injury issues, but he really doesn't have a weakness. The only knock you can put on him is that he doesn't have the finishing speed on long runs anymore, but he definitely did early in his career.
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Originally posted by RishikeshA:
Originally posted by cciowa:
wow,, you have to have a better understanding of the team to do this in my opinion. the team lived before 1980 and you need to include great players and hall of fame guys like jimmy johnson, dave wilcox, forest blue as the best center ever. how can you exclude gene washington,, how can you exclude perhaps the best pass rusher in our history in cedrick hardman? to have deion sanders on that list with no mention to jimmy johnson is a insult in my opinion. sure justin smith is good but come on,, hardman, fred dean, charley kruger. sheesh. john brodie must be in that list and so does ted kwalik

Thanks, Jimmy Johnson was so good NFL teams stopped throwing to his side for years. He played on some bad teams and there was no ESPN or internet so except in SF his name was not mentioned too much. Another 49er great who could play today was Bob St.Clair, offensive tackle, 6'9" around 270. In 10-20 years the next generation of fans will ask, "Who was Joe Montana?"

I tried to preface the arguments I was making by saying I only had knowledge of the team from the 80s on. I have watched my fair share of NFL Films, but I still didn't have enough to put some of the older guys in their proper place so I am really glad you guys have chimed in. St. Clair, Johnson, Kwalik, etc., all belong on this list.

As for the next generation forgetting Montana, I disagree. Sure, they won't have the first hand knowledge of him, but he is still a National benchmark for the most important position in sports. The great skill guys will fade slower. RIce, Montana, Young, they all stick in our memories for the plays that STILL get air time on ESPN. It's the Offensive and Defensive linemen that are marginalized the quickest, and it's the great players for horrible teams that never get their due.
  • cciowa
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Originally posted by FunkNinerFlex:
Originally posted by cciowa:
rice gene washington, freddie soloman and kwalik would do just as well. it just frustrates me that alot of posters think the niners came into the league in 1980 you talk about linebackers.... dave wilcox, skip vanderwilt and the fudgehammer would do just as good as the current day guys esp behind the front four of hardman, hart, elam and webb. do you guys not know that 76 team still has the all time record(for a 14 game season ) of sacks in a single season at 61 0r 63, no issue with rathman at fb but ken willard is his back up in my opinion,,, that is back in the days of a single bar face mask and none of this p***y cage s**t today

I'm not dissing the old guys, but some of the older players aren't as athletic or physical specimens as today's players. Now I'm not saying athleticism is everything, but combine it with the same football IQ and instincts as the older players, then some of today's player are more dominant.
'
you do not know that. in my opinion gene washington would be a great player today, sure back then the d linemen got away with head slaps but cedrick would still be a dominate force. great players are great players despite the era they played in, in my opinion. d sanders would not have made it back then , he was not physical and you had to be physical back then. he would have been run out of the nfl if he played in 1974.
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
My team:

Young
Rice
TO
Rathman
Vernon
Waters
'94 oline

Justin Smith
Bryant Young
Dana Stubblefield
Aldon Smith
Julian Peterson
Patrick Willis
Ken Norton Jr.
Navarro Bowman
Deoin Sanders
Eric Davis
Merton Hanks
Tim McDonald

Brian Jennings
Andy Lee
Jeff Wilkins
no mention of jimmy johnson hall of famer, shut down corner even before the word was invented,, disgracefull
As I said -- MY team. The players I watched play.

Never saw Jimmy Johnson play, foo.
  • cciowa
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Originally posted by RishikeshA:
Thanks, Jimmy Johnson was so good NFL teams stopped throwing to his side for years. He played on some bad teams and there was no ESPN or internet so except in SF his name was not mentioned too much. Another 49er great who could play today was Bob St.Clair, offensive tackle, 6'9" around 270. In 10-20 years the next generation of fans will ask, "Who was Joe Montana?"
he had great years in san fran BEFORE the gold rush which of course helped out the niner secondary back then. bruce taylor was drafted to succeed him but poor bruce was just ok and back then when you were compared to jimmy johnson "ok" was just not good enough
  • cciowa
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Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
Originally posted by cciowa:
Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
My team:

Young
Rice
TO
Rathman
Vernon
Waters
'94 oline

Justin Smith
Bryant Young
Dana Stubblefield
Aldon Smith
Julian Peterson
Patrick Willis
Ken Norton Jr.
Navarro Bowman
Deoin Sanders
Eric Davis
Merton Hanks
Tim McDonald

Brian Jennings
Andy Lee
Jeff Wilkins
no mention of jimmy johnson hall of famer, shut down corner even before the word was invented,, disgracefull
As I said -- MY team. The players I watched play.

Never saw Jimmy Johnson play, foo.

my comments to your team were based upon the original title of this thread. the title made no mention of a certain era
Offense:

QB - Montana
WR1 - Rice
WR2 - Solomon
RB1 - Perry
RB2 - Craig
FB - Rathman
TE - Davis
T - St. Clair
T - Barton
C - Cross
G - Sapolu
G - McIntyre

Defense

DL - B. Young
DL - C. Hardman
DL - F. Dean
DL - T. Hart

LB - Wilcox
LB - Willis
LB - Haley
LB - A. Smith (yes, he's that good)

CB1 - J. Johnson
CB2 - E. Wright
S - R. Lott
S - M. Hanks
I am seeing a lot of people's "all time" RB lists and none have included Perry. Crazy. When the guy retired he was second on the all time rushing list to Jim Brown. In an era when teams predominantly ran the ball. That's like Chicago Bears fans voting Matt Forte the best RB of all time when Walter Payton is sitting there. I realize he played a long time ago, but the fact that Perry's team records stood for several decades despite all of the talented RBs we have had through the years shows how dominant he was at his position.
  • cciowa
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Originally posted by midrdan:
Offense:

QB - Montana
WR1 - Rice
WR2 - Solomon
RB1 - Perry
RB2 - Craig
FB - Rathman
TE - Davis
T - St. Clair
T - Barton
C - Cross
G - Sapolu
G - McIntyre

Defense

DL - B. Young
DL - C. Hardman
DL - F. Dean
DL - T. Hart

LB - Wilcox
LB - Willis
LB - Haley
LB - A. Smith (yes, he's that good)

CB1 - J. Johnson
CB2 - E. Wright
S - R. Lott
S - M. Hanks
now that is a good list in my opinion. i would quibble a titch about putting forest blue in at center but that it also a little upset that there is no love for jason webster but thats life