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Analysis from the Tampa Bay coaches film

Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by AmpLee:
Originally posted by thl408:


The reason this play was really interesting is because it opens the question that if Kap is calling plays based on his pre-snap read, then couldn't a defense force the 49ers into a play call based on what they reveal pre-snap? Using this play as an example, was TB baiting the 49ers into thinking that a blitz was coming? Looking at the pre-snap GIF. The SS bites so much on the hard count it's a bit too obvious (you can see Kap's hard count by his head bobble). As if he wants Kap to change the play. Fake a blitz (which suggests man coverage), allow the offense to audible to a man coverage busting concept, then change the coverage to zone.

I'm glad you brought this up. A lot of teams have had success changing their defense after an audible. During the game, they did their arm flap two or three times, signaling they were audibling as well, or calling out our play change. We need to be able to do a fake audible at times to throw off this type of thing. For example, we call a play, Kap hard counts, the defense shows something, Kap yells out a fake audible, the defense audibles, and we run the play we were going to run the entire time.

There's a lot of gamesmanship going on back and forth there. You can see Kaep changed the play to a man coverage beater, but tampa countered by going with a 2 zone coverage that helped them stop the play short. I had looked at that play when I was breaking down the film as well, Tampa did stuff like that a couple times. You have to give it to the D-capt. there to make the right call on the fly. Sometimes the guys on the other side of the ball know their P's and Q's well too.

Agreed. In an offense that allows the QB so much flexibility at the line of scrimmage, it can work against the 49ers as well. TB decided to do this on a 3rd down, the money down. Maybe Kap can notice how blatantly obvious the fake blitz was? Just a tough play for any QB. He thinks he's doing the right thing, but he's actually doing exactly what the defense wanted him to do.
Hey jonnydel can you show the missed chance to Crabtree where Kaep went to Boldin instead and Crabs was wide open in the middle with his hand up. I think this play got under Crabtrees skin and he showed it later on the missed long pass.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Nice. I was totally fine with this play...although I probably would have used BOLDIN as the blocker and not the RB here and I probably wouldn't have done it inside the 10...but what the heck, it's the Bucs! I still think #54 cleans this up or the S just to his left. Did the S go with Crabtree? Either way, it should have been a positive gain but unfortunately, one chain broke here

I thought the play was dumb. Looking at this, its not as dumb but i still don't like it. Yeah it was good in theory, but you are asking a backup guard (one of the worst in the league) to pull and take out a quick DE. To top it off, we hand it to a 36 year old man.

If the play blew up, which it did, maybe if we had a more shifty player like LMJ or Crabs take the handoff he could of made the DE miss.
Originally posted by Young2Rice:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Nice. I was totally fine with this play...although I probably would have used BOLDIN as the blocker and not the RB here and I probably wouldn't have done it inside the 10...but what the heck, it's the Bucs! I still think #54 cleans this up or the S just to his left. Did the S go with Crabtree? Either way, it should have been a positive gain but unfortunately, one chain broke here

I thought the play was dumb. Looking at this, its not as dumb but i still don't like it. Yeah it was good in theory, but you are asking a backup guard (one of the worst in the league) to pull and take out a quick DE. To top it off, we hand it to a 36 year old man.

If the play blew up, which it did, maybe if we had a more shifty player like LMJ or Crabs take the handoff he could of made the DE miss.
I think the D-end blew the play up so bad, nobody was going to get away from him. You can't really blame Roman too much, he put his players in a great situation to succeed, he can't plan for his players to fail, if he does, there's a major coaching problem going on.
I hope Kaep turns the corner soon, there's guys wide open that he misses way too often, it doesn't matter when we play the bucs, but we need those plays in the playoffs. I'm not gonna blame roman because it's clear he's scheming guys open, we need to hit those plays
Originally posted by ninerhippy:
I hope Kaep turns the corner soon, there's guys wide open that he misses way too often, it doesn't matter when we play the bucs, but we need those plays in the playoffs. I'm not gonna blame roman because it's clear he's scheming guys open, we need to hit those plays

it's not clear. it's clear that sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't
just like sometimes kaps misses people just like every other qb in the nfl.

what i do know is that this was the preseason basically.

these 3 games against tough opponents for crabtree.

now watch what he and the offense does now that it's playing together for some time... remember no training camp no preseason missed 12 games..

this is just the beginning
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by Young2Rice:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Nice. I was totally fine with this play...although I probably would have used BOLDIN as the blocker and not the RB here and I probably wouldn't have done it inside the 10...but what the heck, it's the Bucs! I still think #54 cleans this up or the S just to his left. Did the S go with Crabtree? Either way, it should have been a positive gain but unfortunately, one chain broke here

I thought the play was dumb. Looking at this, its not as dumb but i still don't like it. Yeah it was good in theory, but you are asking a backup guard (one of the worst in the league) to pull and take out a quick DE. To top it off, we hand it to a 36 year old man.

If the play blew up, which it did, maybe if we had a more shifty player like LMJ or Crabs take the handoff he could of made the DE miss.
I think the D-end blew the play up so bad, nobody was going to get away from him. You can't really blame Roman too much, he put his players in a great situation to succeed, he can't plan for his players to fail, if he does, there's a major coaching problem going on.

I just think in scoring range it was a weird call. I don't ever want to see Boldin with a handoff ever again.
Originally posted by Young2Rice:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by Young2Rice:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Nice. I was totally fine with this play...although I probably would have used BOLDIN as the blocker and not the RB here and I probably wouldn't have done it inside the 10...but what the heck, it's the Bucs! I still think #54 cleans this up or the S just to his left. Did the S go with Crabtree? Either way, it should have been a positive gain but unfortunately, one chain broke here

I thought the play was dumb. Looking at this, its not as dumb but i still don't like it. Yeah it was good in theory, but you are asking a backup guard (one of the worst in the league) to pull and take out a quick DE. To top it off, we hand it to a 36 year old man.

If the play blew up, which it did, maybe if we had a more shifty player like LMJ or Crabs take the handoff he could of made the DE miss.
I think the D-end blew the play up so bad, nobody was going to get away from him. You can't really blame Roman too much, he put his players in a great situation to succeed, he can't plan for his players to fail, if he does, there's a major coaching problem going on.

I just think in scoring range it was a weird call. I don't ever want to see Boldin with a handoff ever again.

Iupati wouldve crushed on that play. walk in touchdown it might look a lil different, either way im glad they did it. its on tape and in the playoffs that sweep to LMJ might get open.
4th Quarter 3rd & 12

This is a play only Kap can make as Kap's legs and arm are on full display. Anyone that has an arm this strong isn't this elusive. Anyone this elusive, doesn't have an arm this strong.

49ers: Triangle concept (oblique stretch)
TB: Cover 1 blitz (? under)

Below: Pre-snap. TB is coming with a 6 man blitz, overloading the left side of the Oline. The 49ers have one of the best blitz picker up RB in the league. Protection should be okay.

Below: A moment after the snap. Gore will pick up the blitzing SS. The blitzing LB will come untouched as Snyder has chosen to help double team #92.


The play: Kap has to bolt immediately after securing the snap.


Let's see why Crabs was open for the catch.

Below: It's a money down and the 49ers will utilize a triangle concept using their top dogs Crabs, VD, and Boldin. This route combination will create a horizontal and vertical stretch of the defense as a zone beating concept (see the SEA film thread for horizontal/vertical stretch examples) as well as a man coverage beating concept with the bunch formation. Bill Walsh spoke about the importance of triangles in his offense and is considered an originator of it.


Below: The red lines show the triangle formed. The blue lines show the stress (stretch) the defenders are under to cover two players in their area. When a defender tries to cover two players, they cover none. Revis is the Buc that is seen pointing. He wants to cover VD on the deep corner route and wants #29 to cover Crabs.


Below: This is a still of Kap releasing the ball. The ball is about to come off his fingertips. #24 is stepping towards VD on the corner route, #29 is stepping towards Boldin on the curl. No one is coming towards Crabs. Look at the distance on that throw.


The play: Pretend that there was no craziness going on behind the line of scrimmage with Kap running for his life. There is separation created for Crabs, on his initial cut of his out route, due to this route combination. I'm not clear who was supposed to defend Crabs here, but it worked out for the good guys.


After the play, there is a lot of conversation between Revis (24) and Johnson (29). I feel Revis is the one that messed up. He should not cover a route that deep when the QB is that pressured. Kap has a wicked arm, but VD on the corner is humanly impossible.
[ Edited by thl408 on Dec 19, 2013 at 1:10 AM ]
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Thanks Thl for picking up the slack while I was gone. You added a lot of great stuff! Thanks. I do think, however, that we incorporate progression reads in our coverage reads.

From what I could see on film, and the way Kaep was checking plays, it seemed like they would have a certain zone buster(like a cover 3 buster for example) and with a phrase he could check to a cover 2 bust. Or sometimes a zone buster to a man buster. There were several times(particularly when Tampa stopped us) that Tampa showed somethine pre-snap, Kaep changed the routes, Tampa changed their D and got themselves into a favorable defense.

I'll show in a few minutes how Kaep also did a great job in his scouting recognition to get us into some favorable run plays.

Hope all is okay with pops jonnydel. I link a progression read directly to footwork. Also, it is pre-determined by the playcall which target the QB looks to first. After the QB snaps the ball, during mid-dropback, he is reading the coverage technique used by the CB on that WR (his #1 read). If the WR is running a route that wins against that leverage and technique (coverage), throw it on the completion of the dropback. If during mid dropback, the #1 WR is covered, the QB looks to his #2 and uses the same analysis of leverage and technique. Coverage reads are where the QB can look first to whichever route he feels is right based off his pre-snap read. Good footwork never hurts, but does not need to be precise. I'd like to take a guess at what you meant in the bolded, and hope you expand on it. I'm guessing what you mean is that when the 49ers call a generic pass play, designed to beat both man on one side and zone on the other, Kap is timing his footwork with his #1 and #2 read on that certain route concept. If that concept is defeated, his footwork takes him to the other concept being run on the other side of the field.

During the live telecast, they rarely show the defensive backfield, where less players are and it's easier to see what's going on. Instead, they focus on the front 7 and OL, where there is so much going on and it's impossible to really see it all. Thanks for the breakdowns near the line of scrimmage. Looking forward to more.

Thanks for the concern Thl, my dad is doing much better today. Not to air everything out there, but, he was diagnosed with an inoperable, terminal brain tumor recently. His first doctor said they were going to stop treatment because they thought the chemo was breaking down his body so fast that it was going to kill him before the cancer did. Which is why I took a leave from work and have been caring for him the past week or so with not much more than my laptop(without a mouse btw!!!!) to keep me company. This is why I've had so much time to break down film as my dad has trying to recover his strength and sleeps for long periods of the day. Thankfully, we got a better prognosis from a 2nd opinion today who has seen improvement in his health and wants to continue treatment. So, that's encouraging.

From the football side, I mean, the QB has to determine pre-snap what possible coverage he's going to see based off of alignment and safety look to determine his 1st and 2nd reads(which is why I think we have Kaep hard count so much to try and get a coverage look), from there, post-snap, see if the coverage has held to what it showed or has shifted, knowing also from his pre-snap read of leverage where, if the coverage did change, what are now his 3rd and 4th reads to the check down read.

I guess that's what I'm meaning. That, he has to understand his coverage read, to make his progression read. If that makes sense.

Congrats about your father man! Best wishiz for much better progress and even better news going forward bro.
And the football side makes perfect sence :)
Don't know if this has been posted but it's another breakdown of the Tampa game from Inside the film room-http://insidethefilmroom.com/?p=3221
Originally posted by Ronnie49Lott:
Don't know if this has been posted but it's another breakdown of the Tampa game from Inside the film room-http://insidethefilmroom.com/?p=3221

lol crap. I should have just linked this article.
Originally posted by jonnydel:
I almost forgot to break down the Boldin run!



Here we start out with an empty backfield with James lined up out right. We motion Boldin into the backfield, making it look like we're isolating Crabtree 1-1 on the outside.



As you see, this sets up a big inside run advantage as there's only one LB in the middle of the field. We motion James fast giving the appearance of a sweep(highly likely since we brought one defender out of the outside area)



All of the James run action brings a lot of attention from the D. You see 4 players bite on the play. This sets up a numbers advantage for us on the backside.



From the endzone I've highlighted the blocking scheme. This is a DE trap play. They combo down on the DT while the pulling Guard is responsible to kick out the DE with Davis leading up the hole onto the LB.



You see how the James run action holds the LB from being aggressive and stepping up into the hole. Snyder has a good angle on the DE, he doesn't even need to blow the guy up, he just needs to wall off the defender from the play.



Instead, Snyder totally whiffs on his block.....



You see how Snyder has whiffed and how good of blocking angles both VD and AD have on the LB's



I've highlighted the goal line with the purple line at the bottom of the screen. If Snyder makes that block, Boldin walks in for a TD as the safety on that side would've had to be a superhero to make a tackle on Boldin from his angle.


The game got deleted off of my DVR. But didn't they run a very similar play/look 3 different times? A sweep to LMJ, PA pass, and this one?

In 3 weeks could you imagine this with gore, crabs, boldin, Davis, and James. Not to mention the threat of Kap running the ball.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by 49erCanuck:
And right after I posted that questions, I see it answered up above. Tis always the way.

From the Roman thread:

My theory: Just a reminder of what an (Annointed Revceiver - AR1 or AR2) passing game means. Essentially, it's a pre-determined passing play designed to get ONE receiver the ball from the plays called in to the huddle by HaRoMan. It is typically designed to get this one receiver the ball under 3 seconds for obvious reasons. IF that AR is covered, CK is instructed to be off and running. Once the AR is covered (or CK doesn't pull the trigger), it instantly becomes an ad lib play. In both types of passing plays HaRoMan determines the play calls, not CK. While he may be able to audible out of one pass play to another, both typically have the AR pre-determined. CK's job (and esp. that of the AR and the non-AR's) is merely to "execute" the play. It's a team-receiving concept (like college). Like in the run game, if one chain breaks, the whole play blows up. It leans heavily on skill players winning their 1on1 battles; we've seen the results when Boldin & VD were doubled this year. In 2012, the AR's were Crabtree and VD. In 2013, it's been Boldin and VD. Now we're starting to see more Crabtree but clearly, like Dilfer referenced, his # isn't being called enough to make him happy.

AR1 (most common) - This is a play designed to get the AR the ball via non-physical support from the others (e.g. decoy routes). For instance, we run 3 straight go-routes occupying 4 DB's to hit the AR underneth in a 1on1 matchup. Think Randy Moss running deep sideline and post routes to open up VD and Crabtree underneath all year long. It includes cutting off routes to draw defenders (or making them hesitate just for a second) to free up the AR who cuts the other direction. It includes designed flows as well...getting the defense to flow one way to pass back to the other side; misdirections, crossing patterns, etc. The non-AR's are NOT viable receiving options in the play UNTIL it becomes an ad lib play. They must execute their part to help the AR get the ball. This is common in a college offense vs. pro-style.
AR2 (rare) - This is a play designed to get the AR the ball with physical help from the others (literallly, blocking up field while the ball is in the air to the AR underneath). This is a play where Boldin received a P.I. call inside the RZ recently.
Ad lib (common) - This is a play where CK doesn't pull the trigger on the AR (hesitates) or the AR is effectively covered and the play instantly becomes a broken ad lib play. CK is instructed to buy time with his legs and look to ad lib pass or pick up yards with his legs. We've scored 3 of our last 4 TD's on this one.
Pro-Style (PS) (rare) - This is a passing play called where all receivers (usually 4) plus the backs are ALL viable passing options. It's on CK to find the most open and pull the trigger.

See post #1972 to see a breakdown of the 1st half of the Bucs game from this theory: http://www.49erswebzone.com/forum/niners/168162-greg-roman-really-good/page132/

Here is how you simply break it down:
Step 1. Ignore: the personnel groupings, who lines up where, their routes, defensive alignments, etc. Focus ONLY on who caught the ball.
Step 2. Rewind and watch CK's head angle and body positioning (is he looking at this AR all the way)? Is he looking off defenders to assist the AR1/2?
Step 3. Rewind again. Now watch the non-AR's to see what part they played in getting that receiver open.
Step 4. Fill in the details and results


I agree with your theory but I also agree with Jonnydel - the two are not mutually exclusive.

What I think has been happening is that with Crabs, Manningham and Patton out, Moss and Walker gone and Vernon being injured for a few games, we ran the AR style offensive plays far more often in the first part of the season. I think there were almost no PS pass plays called until Manningham returned and we started bleeding them all in. We were focusing purely on getting Boldin the ball in AR style plays because he's a playmaker and we didn't trust Baldwin or Williams due to suspect hands so we didn't put in AR plays for them.

Now that Crabs is back as well, I think our offense is migrating to include more which is why we are seeing the blend that Jonnydel has picked out in the Seattle and Tampa games.

However, my real criticism of Roman and Harbaugh is that they did not try and develop Baldwin and McDonald as receiving options by continuing to call plays for them when we had that run of 5 wins.

I think Mcdonald is going to see far more plays now with Miller out, but he will need to improve his blocking and that is the issue. He didn't block much at college so I think the coaches trust him as a receiver but he's never going to be the go to TE option with Vernon on the field until thbey are confident he can really block and then slip out short into the middle of the field to give Kap an option.