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Jon Baldwin - Another Guy Getting The Blame

Originally posted by lamontb:
Originally posted by NinerG94:
No NC I'm making that jump after three seasons and two teams with the same results. I don't need to see Baldwin get more opportunities to figure out that he's just not very good. He's definitely not the size speed guy we're missing. I don't care how many passes he gets thrown to him. Why is a guy that size getting beat so badly at the line of scrimmage? Like the rest of the WR's on this roster he has no speed. DB's can afford to take the risk and jam our WR's at will because they know if they get beat they can easily recover. Also, this guy has a vertical that's off the charts yet every time the ball is in the air he looks lost. What good is his athletic attributes if he constantly gets beat at the line and can't play the ball in the air to save his life?

Kaepernick is bad. The WR's are bad. The offensive line can't pass block and the play calling hasn't helped. All of these issues are tied together. All these areas need to be fixed or be replaced all together. As one area fails they all fail.

Cosign

Really guys? 2 years at KC and 6 throws here?

Give the guy a chance under a real OC and we might see some different results than the 3 he is getting a game now with probably the lowest % probabillity throws in the NFL. I'm not ready to right anyone off until we see a real pro offense/coaching and at least ONE receiver that is developed here in SF since T.O.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by thl408:
I still don't understand why the Baldwin catch in the endzone was reviewed and ruled incomplete. He caught the ball, made a football move, and dragged his toes to get both feet in bounds. At this point, it is a TD catch. Then when he hit the ground, the ball came out.

I don't either...and he never once lost possession of the ball...it moved once he hit the ground but he never lost it. They consider it incomplete b/c he didn't complete the catch through the plays entirety. Apparently, he is supposed to velcro the ball to his chest, get up, do 40 jumping jacks, do a sprint up the stadium stairs and come back all w/o the ball ever moving.

The funny thing is, if that TD would have been allowed, he's be the only WR not named VD or Boldin to catch one this season. LOL

As I understand it, the new rule on a catch is that if it's a going out of bound play, the player has to demonstrate and follow through on the play as he falls out of bound. He can catch it, have both feet in bound but as he falls out of bound, if he loses grip or possession of the ball it would be considered a no catch. He has to have possession when he hits the ground also.

Pretty sure the rule came from the Calvin Johnson play out of bound from 2011(?)
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by thl408:
I still don't understand why the Baldwin catch in the endzone was reviewed and ruled incomplete. He caught the ball, made a football move, and dragged his toes to get both feet in bounds. At this point, it is a TD catch. Then when he hit the ground, the ball came out.

I don't either...and he never once lost possession of the ball...it moved once he hit the ground but he never lost it. They consider it incomplete b/c he didn't complete the catch through the plays entirety. Apparently, he is supposed to velcro the ball to his chest, get up, do 40 jumping jacks, do a sprint up the stadium stairs and come back all w/o the ball ever moving.

The funny thing is, if that TD would have been allowed, he's be the only WR not named VD or Boldin to catch one this season. LOL

As I understand it, the new rule on a catch is that if it's a going out of bound play, the player has to demonstrate and follow through on the play as he falls out of bound. He can catch it, have both feet in bound but as he falls out of bound, if he loses grip or possession of the ball it would be considered a no catch. He has to have possession when he hits the ground also.

Pretty sure the rule came from the Calvin Johnson play out of bound from 2011(?)

Thanks, qnnhan7. It's odd because once the WR hits the white (out of bounds) with any part of his body/uniform/hair, isn't the play considered 'dead'? He's now out of bounds. But now, we have to watch the play further to see what happens once he's already out of bounds? Whether he has control once he is already off the field of play. I don't like that logic (rule).
Don't like the rule either, especially in the end-zone when a guy can lose possession as long as it crosses the line. A little too much discrepancy between those rules to me.

Still, it was a nice "catch" by Baldwin, and I think he is good enough that he should get more targets.
he was clearly held on that first big throw to him.
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by qnnhan7:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by thl408:
I still don't understand why the Baldwin catch in the endzone was reviewed and ruled incomplete. He caught the ball, made a football move, and dragged his toes to get both feet in bounds. At this point, it is a TD catch. Then when he hit the ground, the ball came out.

I don't either...and he never once lost possession of the ball...it moved once he hit the ground but he never lost it. They consider it incomplete b/c he didn't complete the catch through the plays entirety. Apparently, he is supposed to velcro the ball to his chest, get up, do 40 jumping jacks, do a sprint up the stadium stairs and come back all w/o the ball ever moving.

The funny thing is, if that TD would have been allowed, he's be the only WR not named VD or Boldin to catch one this season. LOL

As I understand it, the new rule on a catch is that if it's a going out of bound play, the player has to demonstrate and follow through on the play as he falls out of bound. He can catch it, have both feet in bound but as he falls out of bound, if he loses grip or possession of the ball it would be considered a no catch. He has to have possession when he hits the ground also.

Pretty sure the rule came from the Calvin Johnson play out of bound from 2011(?)

Thanks, qnnhan7. It's odd because once the WR hits the white (out of bounds) with any part of his body/uniform/hair, isn't the play considered 'dead'? He's now out of bounds. But now, we have to watch the play further to see what happens once he's already out of bounds? Whether he has control once he is already off the field of play. I don't like that logic (rule).

This is correct. Thanks guys.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Really guys? 2 years at KC and 6 throws here?

Give the guy a chance under a real OC and we might see some different results than the 3 he is getting a game now with probably the lowest % probabillity throws in the NFL. I'm not ready to right anyone off until we see a real pro offense/coaching and at least ONE receiver that is developed here in SF since T.O.

Understandable NC and I like your optimism. However I believe he's had every opportunity to succeed. Andy Reid is a very good offensive mind and he also had a good long look at this guy and still got behind the trade for A. J. Jenkins. Not saying he can't develop and still get better. Heck most WR's take two to three seasons to develop. The problem I have with that is that he should have shown more than he has at this point being a first round pick and all and the fact that a potential first round bust who nobody knows anything about or has accomplished anything at this stage in the season is probably our second best receiver is just criminal. I'm not counting Manningham until he shows hes 100%. So far he's shown next to nothing since returning.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Really guys? 2 years at KC and 6 throws here?

Give the guy a chance under a real OC and we might see some different results than the 3 he is getting a game now with probably the lowest % probabillity throws in the NFL. I'm not ready to right anyone off until we see a real pro offense/coaching and at least ONE receiver that is developed here in SF since T.O.

Understandable NC and I like your optimism. However I believe he's had every opportunity to succeed. Andy Reid is a very good offensive mind and he also had a good long look at this guy and still got behind the trade for A. J. Jenkins. Not saying he can't develop and still get better. Heck most WR's take two to three seasons to develop. The problem I have with that is that he should have shown more than he has at this point being a first round pick and all and the fact that a potential first round bust who nobody knows anything about or has accomplished anything at this stage in the season is probably our second best receiver is just criminal. I'm not counting Manningham until he shows hes 100%. So far he's shown next to nothing since returning.
Sorry for the double post guys. An error made me do it.
Originally posted by NinerG94:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Really guys? 2 years at KC and 6 throws here?

Give the guy a chance under a real OC and we might see some different results than the 3 he is getting a game now with probably the lowest % probabillity throws in the NFL. I'm not ready to right anyone off until we see a real pro offense/coaching and at least ONE receiver that is developed here in SF since T.O.

Understandable NC and I like your optimism. However I believe he's had every opportunity to succeed. Andy Reid is a very good offensive mind and he also had a good long look at this guy and still got behind the trade for A. J. Jenkins. Not saying he can't develop and still get better. Heck most WR's take two to three seasons to develop. The problem I have with that is that he should have shown more than he has at this point being a first round pick and all and the fact that a potential first round bust who nobody knows anything about or has accomplished anything at this stage in the season is probably our second best receiver is just criminal. I'm not counting Manningham until he shows hes 100%. So far he's shown next to nothing since returning.

I hear ya...just hard for me to make any determination with the other issues that may be effecting his development. That said, you "know" I will point his issues out once he is given a fair shake. LOL
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by thl408:
I still don't understand why the Baldwin catch in the endzone was reviewed and ruled incomplete. He caught the ball, made a football move, and dragged his toes to get both feet in bounds. At this point, it is a TD catch. Then when he hit the ground, the ball came out.

I don't either...and he never once lost possession of the ball...it moved once he hit the ground but he never lost it. They consider it incomplete b/c he didn't complete the catch through the plays entirety. Apparently, he is supposed to velcro the ball to his chest, get up, do 40 jumping jacks, do a sprint up the stadium stairs and come back all w/o the ball ever moving.

The funny thing is, if that TD would have been allowed, he's be the only WR not named VD or Boldin to catch one this season. LOL

Me my dad and brother in law were wondering the same thing. It really made no sense, seen plenty of receivers catch the ball make a football move take two steps and spike it shouldnt that be an incomplete pass also, cause like you said he caught it made a move two steps and only lost grip of the ball after he tripped but by then it should have been a td.
Idiot signaled harbaugh to challenge the incomplete pass after he clearly bobbled it after falling out of bounds.
Originally posted by LoneWolf:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by thl408:
I still don't understand why the Baldwin catch in the endzone was reviewed and ruled incomplete. He caught the ball, made a football move, and dragged his toes to get both feet in bounds. At this point, it is a TD catch. Then when he hit the ground, the ball came out.

I don't either...and he never once lost possession of the ball...it moved once he hit the ground but he never lost it. They consider it incomplete b/c he didn't complete the catch through the plays entirety. Apparently, he is supposed to velcro the ball to his chest, get up, do 40 jumping jacks, do a sprint up the stadium stairs and come back all w/o the ball ever moving.

The funny thing is, if that TD would have been allowed, he's be the only WR not named VD or Boldin to catch one this season. LOL

Me my dad and brother in law were wondering the same thing. It really made no sense, seen plenty of receivers catch the ball make a football move take two steps and spike it shouldnt that be an incomplete pass also, cause like you said he caught it made a move two steps and only lost grip of the ball after he tripped but by then it should have been a td.

The rule is different when the receiver goes to the ground. It's the "Calvin Johnson" rule - receiver has to maintain catch all the way to the ground and through the contact with the ground.

I hate it and man others hate it for the reason you state - it looks like a catch. But it is a rule, albeit a dumb one.
Originally posted by five1oh:
Idiot signaled harbaugh to challenge the incomplete pass after he clearly bobbled it after falling out of bounds.

Yeah, that was definitely not smart. It's one thing to bobbled the ball. Another thing to act like you caught it or not know the rules.
Originally posted by olapac:
Originally posted by LoneWolf:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by thl408:
I still don't understand why the Baldwin catch in the endzone was reviewed and ruled incomplete. He caught the ball, made a football move, and dragged his toes to get both feet in bounds. At this point, it is a TD catch. Then when he hit the ground, the ball came out.

I don't either...and he never once lost possession of the ball...it moved once he hit the ground but he never lost it. They consider it incomplete b/c he didn't complete the catch through the plays entirety. Apparently, he is supposed to velcro the ball to his chest, get up, do 40 jumping jacks, do a sprint up the stadium stairs and come back all w/o the ball ever moving.

The funny thing is, if that TD would have been allowed, he's be the only WR not named VD or Boldin to catch one this season. LOL

Me my dad and brother in law were wondering the same thing. It really made no sense, seen plenty of receivers catch the ball make a football move take two steps and spike it shouldnt that be an incomplete pass also, cause like you said he caught it made a move two steps and only lost grip of the ball after he tripped but by then it should have been a td.

The rule is different when the receiver goes to the ground. It's the "Calvin Johnson" rule - receiver has to maintain catch all the way to the ground and through the contact with the ground.

I hate it and man others hate it for the reason you state - it looks like a catch. But it is a rule, albeit a dumb one.

The NFL is full of dumb rules. i would really love.to see a play like i called though get called incomplete.