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Jon Baldwin - Another Guy Getting The Blame

Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
The offense is just s**t right now. There is no one player to blame. Outside of Frank Gore no one has elevated their game to a championship level. From the coaching down to the players it has been s**t.

Im not sure there is a fix right now other than to just open it up and let everything go, and if we improve fine, if not, it cant get any worse.

Gore should get 20+ carries every game. And really he should be getting closer to 25. Anything less than 20 is unacceptable. He should also be seeing at least 5 targets in the passing game each week. Anything less is unacceptable.

My perspective, on a part of the big problem is that we are having interior offensive line issues, our tackles have been playing pretty decent with the pass rusher ever great now and then beating them off of the edge. I think the team has taken many steps in correcting the overall issue with the interior of their offensive line in trades and through the draft that will improve the offense immensely. If the interior offensive line can stop the incoming inside pass rushing, adding one more second to be able to get the ball off is priceless. Just a little thinking outside of the box, a WR on average runs a 4.5/4.6 40, 1 second would equal to say 8 yards of clearance and for them to beat the coverage, that should statistically improve this offense very well, just from an analytic scenario my way kind of thinking, lol. I think if the interior of the offensive line can get a lot better, coupled with better WRs this year, I think this offense can really open up and be a huge strength on the team. I keep hoping.....If they are thinking of releasing Baldwin, they may want to see how he performs with the new team mates in place, it might opens things up for him a little. While he is not someone with blazing speed, he might provide a nice option. Would be nice if things can turn around for him like that.
[ Edited by niteshade80 on May 23, 2014 at 5:38 AM ]
He's a bust. He was over drafted based on his measurables. We have depth at the position now and soon we'll cut Baldwin and won't have to talk about him anymore. He's a non-issue on this team.

He won't beat out Crabs, Boldin, Johnson, or Patton. We aren't cutting Ellington. Best case for him is that he somehow steals the last spot away from Lloyd. I don't see that happening. He'll be another teams "project".... for the 3rd time in his career.
Edit
[ Edited by strickac on May 23, 2014 at 6:01 AM ]
Originally posted by ChazBoner:
not like the fkn niners would even realize if the dude was any good. They never use their weapons! it's so fkn frustrating. But hey, lets send Bruce Miller, Vance McDonald and Adam Snyder out wide. FKN BRILLIANT!

I understand your frustration, and feel your pain. However when Bruce Miller, Vance McDonald or Snyder are going wide, they usually are gooing to run, and they hybrid position is used to run back towards the line of scrimmage and "wham" a DT or DE in pursuit.

That being said, it is not the coach, it is the qb. Brett Favre used to tell his WR's, I do not look at you as a number or person, I throw to the open WR. If Kaep took that stance he would have taken the wide open wr quinton patton over throwing into double coverage.
Originally posted by 9erred:
Originally posted by ChazBoner:
not like the fkn niners would even realize if the dude was any good. They never use their weapons! it's so fkn frustrating. But hey, lets send Bruce Miller, Vance McDonald and Adam Snyder out wide. FKN BRILLIANT!

I understand your frustration, and feel your pain. However when Bruce Miller, Vance McDonald or Snyder are going wide, they usually are gooing to run, and they hybrid position is used to run back towards the line of scrimmage and "wham" a DT or DE in pursuit.

That being said, it is not the coach, it is the qb. Brett Favre used to tell his WR's, I do not look at you as a number or person, I throw to the open WR. If Kaep took that stance he would have taken the wide open wr quinton patton over throwing into double coverage.

I would love to see what Kaep can do with a good seven or more seconds left on the playclock after the formation set. I say this because this is the exact situation that allowed him to take over as the Starter.

Just saying.

I don't care how many arguments are thrown out there, I lay the blame of the QB issues square on Roman's lap. It's his fault, they brought in a consultant to get his head on straight, and he ignores all the feedback. Roman is the problem. He needs to go back to college where he'll be blessed with his 40 seconds to make a decision.
Originally posted by 9erred:
Originally posted by ChazBoner:
not like the fkn niners would even realize if the dude was any good. They never use their weapons! it's so fkn frustrating. But hey, lets send Bruce Miller, Vance McDonald and Adam Snyder out wide. FKN BRILLIANT!

I understand your frustration, and feel your pain. However when Bruce Miller, Vance McDonald or Snyder are going wide, they usually are gooing to run, and they hybrid position is used to run back towards the line of scrimmage and "wham" a DT or DE in pursuit.

That being said, it is not the coach, it is the qb. Brett Favre used to tell his WR's, I do not look at you as a number or person, I throw to the open WR. If Kaep took that stance he would have taken the wide open wr quinton patton over throwing into double coverage.

I would love to see what Kaep can do with a good seven or more seconds left on the playclock after the formation set. I say this because this is the exact situation that allowed him to take over as the Starter.

Just saying.

I don't care how many arguments are thrown out there, I lay the blame of the QB issues square on Roman's lap. It's his fault, they brought in a consultant to get his head on straight, and he ignores all the feedback. Roman is the problem. He needs to go back to college where he'll be blessed with his 40 seconds to make a decision.
  • KID9R
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Completely agree. That above all,drives insane about this team.
  • Giedi
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Originally posted by strickac:
He's a bust. He was over drafted based on his measurables. We have depth at the position now and soon we'll cut Baldwin and won't have to talk about him anymore. He's a non-issue on this team.

He won't beat out Crabs, Boldin, Johnson, or Patton. We aren't cutting Ellington. Best case for him is that he somehow steals the last spot away from Lloyd. I don't see that happening. He'll be another teams "project".... for the 3rd time in his career.

So far very bust. Just like AJ Jenkins. I'm hoping he does better in a power run offense than the KC West Coast Offense. (Or whatever they ran there) But I haven't seen any flashes of productivity that he had at KC. Reminds me a bit of JJ Stokes in how he plays. I'm pulling for all our players, and he has a ton of Physical talent that hasn't translated to the NFL yet. If it does this year, another poster put it very well -- we will have a poor man's Mike Evans.
Originally posted by Giedi:
So far very bust. Just like AJ Jenkins. I'm hoping he does better in a power run offense than the KC West Coast Offense. (Or whatever they ran there) But I haven't seen any flashes of productivity that he had at KC. Reminds me a bit of JJ Stokes in how he plays. I'm pulling for all our players, and he has a ton of Physical talent that hasn't translated to the NFL yet. If it does this year, another poster put it very well -- we will have a poor man's Mike Evans.

I'm not expecting anything from. He may look like Evans on paper, but he plays nothing like him.
Originally posted by maxsmart:
I think they will try to keep and develop Baldwin. If he can pull his head out and work very hard he has starter upside. He took a big pay cut, and they usually try to work with those guys. He is almost as big as Kelvin Benjamin but is much faster and much better vertical and broad jumps. Also more bench reps 20 vs. 13. If he has his head on straight should be great on special teams, with great WR upside. I'm the perennial optimist
Baldwin's Combine Results:
6 ft 4 in
228 lb
Arms: 34" !!!
Hands: 10 1/8"
40: 4.5
Vert: 42"
Broad: 10'8"
BP: 20 reps

He's got the "license" to earn a spot no doubt. Having got his feet wet last year (minor PT and playbook exposure) is a good thing. Having a full offseason is a great thing. He's the only big body we have outside Boldin/Crabtree for the X & Z position. It will be on him though. He seemed to have a positive attitude and was motivated and when thl408 broke down the film on play with us, he looked good. He's an excellent blocker out on the edges and open field which is something we lacked big time in Jenkins, Manningham, Williams, etc. I wouldn't even put Patton out there too much either.


A guy like Boldin/Crabtree can really help this guy reach his potential. If he makes it, it will be a steal. If not, no biggie.
[ Edited by NCommand on May 23, 2014 at 7:31 AM ]
There are guys on the squad you could make and argument that they are under used. Baldwin isnt one of them, he has shown nothing his entire career and to claim Kap is under using this amazing offensive weapon is just flat out axe grinding. It has been shown hundreds of times now that the offense is a one/two or three read and go system. Kap has a preset clock and a predetermined number of targets he is told to look at before he books from the pocket and up till now he has followed this plan strictly. Which is a failing of our OC. Where Kap needs to get better is ignoring this regimented system at times and taking what is given to him. In short once the play doesnt work as designed, which happens often due to wrong routes being run/ lack of speed/ lazy route running etc...he needs to go into buisness for himself. Slide around the pocket and find the open man. Sure I still want him to take off when the DB's have their backs turned, but it cant stay the only trick in the bag and maybe if he starts hitting guys outside the design of the play you wont see as many guys taking their decoy routes for granted and half assing it out there.
Originally posted by Geeked:
I would love to see what Kaep can do with a good seven or more seconds left on the playclock after the formation set. I say this because this is the exact situation that allowed him to take over as the Starter.

Just saying.

I don't care how many arguments are thrown out there, I lay the blame of the QB issues square on Roman's lap. It's his fault, they brought in a consultant to get his head on straight, and he ignores all the feedback. Roman is the problem. He needs to go back to college where he'll be blessed with his 40 seconds to make a decision.

Greg Roman Empire

  • Giedi
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Originally posted by strickac:
I'm not expecting anything from. He may look like Evans on paper, but he plays nothing like him.

Personally, I've always viewed the *ball control* receivers in this offense being the TE, not the WR's. Anquan and Crabs are ball control receivers, but I get the feeling that had they been 240 and had the same speed, they'd be more effective in this offense from the TE position. Baldwin is a big guy, almost tight end sized. This offense needs more speed from the WR's - and less big ball control recievers. The TE's in this offense (I'm looking at Vance) needs more production to create better 3rd down conversion ratios. Ball control recievers and big fast TE's look a little reversed. It should be *fast* WR's and big TE's. At least that's how a Coryell designed offense *should* look like. Just like Freddie freed up Dwight with his speed, so should the WR's free up the TE's. But *none* of our front line Wr's have top end Freddie Solomon speed. I'm hoping Bruce can inject some much needed speed in this position to make this offense function more consistently.
Well it would help if they would feature Jonathan Baldwin more instead of just having him run 2 or 3 routes a game and not throw it his way. How is he supposed to get better in civilian clothes on the bench? Its time to feature him more especially this upcoming preseason and THROW HIM THE DM BALL! Then if he stinks it up in preseason then cut ties. But you gotta atleast give JB a fair shot!

We know Crabs Quan and Patton and Stevie are safe but let JB have a fair shake vs Brandon Lloyd.
Originally posted by Giedi:
Personally, I've always viewed the *ball control* receivers in this offense being the TE, not the WR's. Anquan and Crabs are ball control receivers, but I get the feeling that had they been 240 and had the same speed, they'd be more effective in this offense from the TE position. Baldwin is a big guy, almost tight end sized. This offense needs more speed from the WR's - and less big ball control recievers. The TE's in this offense (I'm looking at Vance) needs more production to create better 3rd down conversion ratios. Ball control recievers and big fast TE's look a little reversed. It should be *fast* WR's and big TE's. At least that's how a Coryell designed offense *should* look like. Just like Freddie freed up Dwight with his speed, so should the WR's free up the TE's. But *none* of our front line Wr's have top end Freddie Solomon speed. I'm hoping Bruce can inject some much needed speed in this position to make this offense function more consistently.

Agree.