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Originally posted by TheRatMan13:
Originally posted by BSofSF:
It was a mistake to trade Alex Smith. Even if you gave Kaepernick the starting job, Smith was an affordable insurance policy given that Kaepernick earns squat. The trade compensation for Smith was nice, but without a capable backup the coaches are putting Kaepernick in a role that he's not suited for. He sucks at traditional quarterbacking. He's pretty good when he's playing balls out and running a lot. If the team wants to seize on this window of opportunity with their Super Bowl caliber roster, they've got to let Kaepernick play like a wild man down the back stretch and just accept the real risk of injury. If they try to preserve him, like he's some kind of priceless franchise QB (in my opinion he's not), then we're just going to watch the frustrating growing pains of developing a traditional pro-style passer from an unconventional background, similar to what we endured with Alex Smith. He might get hurt, or he might win us a Super Bowl. But given our current position in the standings and our inability to beat good teams, I think the team needs to let go of the reigns and let Kaepernick do his thing. He's best when he's engaged, and running, and in the mix. They also should probably try to use a high draft pick next year for another QB, because an unrestrained Kaepernick will eventually get hurt and a restrained Kaepernick just isn't that good. That's my two cents.

No offense but it really doesn't look like you read any of the article.

First, the loss of Alex Smith is highly overstated. For what he might have added to Kap's knowledge base, he also could've helped divide the locker room by being held against his will, so to speak. He also cost way too much to ride the pine. It just wouldn't be smart.

Just as a side note for the people that refer to Alex Smirh being 9-0: the chiefs have yet to play a team over .500, and five of their wins have come against back up QBs.

Back to my original point.

I really don't think Kaepernick would be struggling if the offense were built in a way that would help him overcome some of the lack of experience. This passing attack is childish, and if you look at that screenshot of a play against Carolina, there is nothing that any amount of experience would help in that situation.

I've seen plays called like this on multiple occasions. Receivers running down the field in routes over ten yards, none of them turning around while Kap (or Alex Smith before him) has a defender all over him.

The coaching staff could fix a lot of these problems with more plays to counter a heavy rush. They just simply don't do it. Harbaugh had nothing to say when he was asked about it but he did acknowledge that it's a "point taken"

Bottom line is that Kap has not played great, but he needs to be put in a better position to succeed. The most innovative that this OC has been was stealing the read option after watching RG3 run it.

Honestly i didnt read it. Cuz i mean i got enough of finger pointing in here lol. I highlighted the main point because I do remember one thing, and please correct me if im wrong. Didnt at one point when Smith was behind center, we were dealing with the same things. Supposedly bonehead plays being called, WR's dropping passes, not running the routes, teams and us as fans knowing the plays going to be run, etc.

All along i've been saying lets not jump on Kaep too much, he deserves his fairshare in all this failure. But honestly i dont even understand how our offense is called. I mean, just using for example with the chiefs. They hired Chris Ault, the spread guru, then brad childress. And he actually explained what he did. looks for offensive patters, plays and formations that the league is doing now, and gives his imput to Reid.

As someone mentioned are we all definitely sure that this year, it's just Roman calling the plays 100%. Has anyone asked that?

Remember when we all agreed that Harbs and Co. scaled back the playbook for Kaep. So no one feels that shorter playbook, means less innovative plays being called. And what if whatever plays that are off the hook and creative, Kaep may not be ready for, or too complex for him now.

I'm just saying whats wrong with blaming Kaep, Roman, Harbs, and the entire O. Why does there HAVE to be one main factoring holding it all back, when i dont think any of us TRULY know what goes into the gameplan. But when a coach and offensive OC, both come out and say, "it's not the playcalling, it's the execution, I dont know whats hard to read between the lines." After this game, execution, players said it over and over, so they are just spitballing.

Kaep has skills, and tore it up last year, we all expected this year to be a continuation, but it hasnt been.... so far. This game in NO is really gonna show us what we are made of, and honestly, I think we may wound up not only winning, but maybe even blowing out the Saints, and oh boy, I cant wait to see the zone page freeze like it used to last year, when we had a real big game.
Good read. Agreed with most of it.
Jim Harbaugh decides who to feature in a game plan. Once Harbaugh decides, than Roman schemes. Harbaugh is a very, very conservative coach. In a league where the majority of teams pass 60% and run 40%, we pass 45% and run 55%. He also wants to minimize rookie mistakes. That is why McDonald is used primarily as a blocker, even though he was featured as the second leading receiver at Rice, lining up all over the place. The Bleacher Report also points out that the other Rice TE, Laffe (?), drafted 3 rounds later, has had many more balls thrown his way with Seattle in his rookie season. Not capitalizing on McDonald's talent, especially with a decimated WR corp, is Harbaugh's responsibility.

Before the Panther game, Harbaugh said that LaMichael James was too good to not play, then promoted him as a return man on special teams. While I applaud that decision, you don't draft a second round RB without putting him into the offense, especially in his second year.

Just about everybody gets the LaMichael James = Darren Sproles comparison, yet Roman hasn't schemed anything that highlights James in space. The few times James has played, he lines up where Gore lines up and he runs the same play that Gore runs. Or, James and Hunter run the ball wide, which usually doesn't work because Ds key against sweeps when either runner replaces Gore who is primarily an inside runner. This would be Roman's fault.

But we don't run many screens? Is that Roman? Or is it Harbaugh? Did Stanford run many screens under Harbaugh and Roman?

Lastly, consider Ted Ginn as a receiver. In the first half of this season, with the same QB, Alex Smith, Ginn has twice the receiving yards than he did playing for us for two years. That would make Ginn 8x more effective than when he played in Roman's game plans where his primary purpose was as a deep decoy. While being a deep decoy helps the power running game, this is a passing league. While Roman's scheme strength is power running, our last ranked passing offense indicates that scheming a pass attack is not Roman's strength. When your primary receivers are injured, it is inexcusable to not scheme McDonald, James, and Hunter into your passing attack.

Harbaugh, with his "avoid costly mistakes from rookies" conservative decision making gets his share of the blame for signing off on Roman's game plans. Lots of teams have receivers that are out with injuries, but only the 49ers have the least effective passing attack in the NFL this season.
[ Edited by mebemused on Nov 13, 2013 at 8:29 PM ]
Originally posted by Jersey9er:
Honestly i didnt read it. Cuz i mean i got enough of finger pointing in here lol. I highlighted the main point because I do remember one thing, and please correct me if im wrong. Didnt at one point when Smith was behind center, we were dealing with the same things. Supposedly bonehead plays being called, WR's dropping passes, not running the routes, teams and us as fans knowing the plays going to be run, etc.

All along i've been saying lets not jump on Kaep too much, he deserves his fairshare in all this failure. But honestly i dont even understand how our offense is called. I mean, just using for example with the chiefs. They hired Chris Ault, the spread guru, then brad childress. And he actually explained what he did. looks for offensive patters, plays and formations that the league is doing now, and gives his imput to Reid.

As someone mentioned are we all definitely sure that this year, it's just Roman calling the plays 100%. Has anyone asked that?

Remember when we all agreed that Harbs and Co. scaled back the playbook for Kaep. So no one feels that shorter playbook, means less innovative plays being called. And what if whatever plays that are off the hook and creative, Kaep may not be ready for, or too complex for him now.

I'm just saying whats wrong with blaming Kaep, Roman, Harbs, and the entire O. Why does there HAVE to be one main factoring holding it all back, when i dont think any of us TRULY know what goes into the gameplan. But when a coach and offensive OC, both come out and say, "it's not the playcalling, it's the execution, I dont know whats hard to read between the lines." After this game, execution, players said it over and over, so they are just spitballing.

Kaep has skills, and tore it up last year, we all expected this year to be a continuation, but it hasnt been.... so far. This game in NO is really gonna show us what we are made of, and honestly, I think we may wound up not only winning, but maybe even blowing out the Saints, and oh boy, I cant wait to see the zone page freeze like it used to last year, when we had a real big game.

Lol I hear you. There definitely is enough blame to go around. I just think it starts at the top. Baalke has provided pieces. Fangio seems to did a way to get his young guys in the lineup, but on offense none of the offensive draft picks have been featured since Harbaugh took over.

I don't think there was ever much with AJ Jenkins, but really, we traded for Baldwin and he's done about the same as Jenkins did here. Sure he actually has catches but he's had zero impact to any game.

I know that there are featured players in iur offense. Gore, Davis, Boldin, and Kap. If any one of them goes down, this offense would be like we saw against Carolina, or worse. At some point the coaches NEED to develop other players on offense and get them involved. As long as they rely on only the big name players, good defenses will shut them down.

To me, that falls on Roman, but ultimately Harbaugh for letting it happen.
  • Buchy
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 686
Originally posted by SofaKing:
Good article. Most of what was said should be obvious to 49er fans. It's funny when a poster brings up these same points, it's an excuse for Kap. If it's written by an outside source, it's golden information. Maybe now all this crap about Twitter, tattoos, and commercials being the root of Kap's problems can stop. Posts like that are worthless and not worth responding to. There are too many real football issues that are effecting the offense.


Yup, it's more or less what a number of us have been saying regarding use of personnel and play calling. I think the only thing in that article I didn't mention in my war and peace post was using LMJ more, which I do agree with entirely.

To do so we need to move away from the current offensive philosophy and actually vary our game plan, improve play calling massively and work other people into the game than Vernon and Boldin.
There's no way Kap could run a complicated offense like that. Dude's having a hard time adjusting to Roman's.
LOL. Down by 1 point at the half, Vernon out, Frank only gets two carries for the rest of the game. Classic Roman.
At some point Harbaugh has to step in and say; "Bro, WTF are you doing?!"
Originally posted by OldMort49:
Is Mangini still with the team? What is his role in this mess??

he will be replacing roman as oc next year.
Originally posted by Pinchi:
There's no way Kap could run a complicated offense like that. Dude's having a hard time adjusting to Roman's.

Again, you're missing the point. These things have been the exact same problems since Harbaugh and Roman got to SF. Both QBs have gone through the same exact thing.

When there are patterns, you look for the common denominator. In this case, it is coaching.
Originally posted by TheRatMan13:
Again, you're missing the point. These things have been the exact same problems since Harbaugh and Roman got to SF. Both QBs have gone through the same exact thing.

When there are patterns, you look for the common denominator. In this case, it is coaching.

I think the major dysfunction is not the original game plan. Roman's initial game plan is right more often that it's wrong. But when it's wrong, the only adjustment he makes is to abandon the run. It is maddening.
We'll see this Sunday if the coaches can improve.
Never liked Roman. Now even less. Excellent article.
Yep...NFL is all about adjustments. Belichick and a few other head coaches are masters at it. You put Sean Payton in charge of our offense and watch it go crazy.
  • cciowa
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 23,040
Originally posted by 24plus25er:
At some point Harbaugh has to step in and say; "Bro, WTF are you doing?!"

he f**king should have done that in the super bowl after the second down call. but no, he lets it go on, roman has a free reign to play and JH is a f**king enabler of every dips**t move made by roman. we keep saying"at some point". based upon sunday we will be setting here after the regular season wondering why we are not in the playoffs all saying,,,,"well sooner or later JH has to step in" jesus f**king christ
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