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I knew our passing game wasn't the greatest but I didnt know we were DEAD LAST in the

Originally posted by LVJay:
Originally posted by jonesadrian:
that's it. it's that simple. stop trying to have 75 motions before the snap. we're good enough to beat them off of talent and effort we don't need to drop a smoke bomb before every snap and hope for the best.

line it up, run with power... run to the edge with hunter.. run routes with more than 1 receiving option. use all of the talent we have which includes letting james get a taste let hunter get more of a workload to spell gore to have both of them fresh, now use boldin and manningham and have that free up vd and for the love of god use the 6"4' 267lb tight end in the red zone



Roman outsmarting himself (at times)... it's not that he's not creative or that he isn't smart, but sometimes it seems like he doesn't have the timing of knowing when. Having said that, I still think he's one of the best OC in today's league.

All that motion isn't just window dressing. There is valuable information being gained by Kap when he sees how the defense responds (or doesn't respond) to the motion. Then there are plays where there is a bunch of shifting used to set up the matchup they want. I've seen it go from a situation where a DB is covering VD, then a bunch of motion/shifting is run and suddenly a LB is covering VD. You also cannot just run this type of motion on pass plays because then it will be a tell for the defense. So you have to execute all that motion and shifting on run plays as well. When the motion is used on run plays, it shifts the strong side around and forces the defense to communicate or risk being out manned at the point of attack.

I guarantee you guys that the opposing defense spends hours talking about how to adjust and what to communicate to each other when they are about to play the 49ers regarding how to respond to all that shifting. I agree that there is always a risk of getting a delay of game penalty, but it appears the coaching staff is willing to risk it, hoping it gets better through time. For the most part, it has gotten better. I see situations where the play is 'won' pre-snap using all this fancy shifting. Getting the matchup they want while adding confusion to the defense can give the offense a huge advantage once the ball is snapped. Why line up and play straight on when you can gain the upper hand before the ball is even snapped?
Originally posted by USArmyParatrooper:
Originally posted by valrod33:
Thats what happens when your QB is too busy doing photoshoots and endorsing products instead of studying his playbook. The Seahwaks games ive watched ive noticed Wilson on the sidelines looking at film, anytime Kaep is shown all he is doing is walking around with a stupid ass grin on his face

Actually it's what happens when your QB has games like against the Jags where he BLEW THEM THE FAWK OUT BY

- Throwing for 63%
- Throwing for 10.3 yards per Pass Attempt
- Scoring 4 touchdowns the first 4 drives

And since the game was in the bag (after throwing 15 passes in the first half) the 49ers thew ONCE in the 2nd half, a 17 yard completion.

Because of Kaepernick's PURE AWESOMENESS he was only allowed to throw 16 total passes, which is why TOTAL YARDS was low.

/THREAD


That's a good point. The only reason you need a quarterback in the first place, is because you need points. The reason you need a running back, is to get first downs and run the clock.

We threw one pass in the second half because Kap was so darn perfect in the first half. Kap is too perfect for the game of football. His play is almost confusing people about what football is all about.
Originally posted by LVJay:
Originally posted by LoneWolf:
Originally posted by LVJay:
Originally posted by LoneWolf:
Originally posted by Jakemall:
Originally posted by jonesadrian:
some people don't even really deserve the privilege of being 49er fans that's just being honest without calling out anyone specific.

Sorry but I find this post amusing on several levels

Its only amusing because you know you've thought the same thing before.

I'm quite amused by all of this

Yeah but your easily amused your own hands so that doesnt say much about this thread

I'm too sore to even try to disagree

fyp
Originally posted by thl408:
All that motion isn't just window dressing. There is valuable information being gained by Kap when he sees how the defense responds (or doesn't respond) to the motion. Then there are plays where there is a bunch of shifting used to set up the matchup they want. I've seen it go from a situation where a DB is covering VD, then a bunch of motion/shifting is run and suddenly a LB is covering VD. You also cannot just run this type of motion on pass plays because then it will be a tell for the defense. So you have to execute all that motion and shifting on run plays as well. When the motion is used on run plays, it shifts the strong side around and forces the defense to communicate or risk being out manned at the point of attack.

I guarantee you guys that the opposing defense spends hours talking about how to adjust and what to communicate to each other when they are about to play the 49ers regarding how to respond to all that shifting. I agree that there is always a risk of getting a delay of game penalty, but it appears the coaching staff is willing to risk it, hoping it gets better through time. For the most part, it has gotten better. I see situations where the play is 'won' pre-snap using all this fancy shifting. Getting the matchup they want while adding confusion to the defense can give the offense a huge advantage once the ball is snapped. Why line up and play straight on when you can gain the upper hand before the ball is even snapped?

i am not saying motions don't have their place i understand there are looks they are trying to get into. but more times than not if they do too many motions and then have to do too many audibles then they call a timeout and everyone here is screaming about clock management. motions and shifts are a necessity.

i am talking about the times where there literally would be about 4 motions before a snap and 4 different players move from one side to the other then back to their original position and then the play is a curl route...

so it's not motions period i understand the need and don't need them to go away.

keep the ones from week 4 on.

get rid of the ones from week 2 where in a hostile environment kap is doing the gator chomp and 4 people start moving and then it ends with a 2 yard out route
Originally posted by BrianGO:
That's a good point. The only reason you need a quarterback in the first place, is because you need points. The reason you need a running back, is to get first downs and run the clock.

We threw one pass in the second half because Kap was so darn perfect in the first half. Kap is too perfect for the game of football. His play is almost confusing people about what football is all about.

if you don't throw for 300 yards you haven't been quarterbacking according to the media

totally ignoring the #1 requirement for qb'ing that they have been telling me since i was born... LEADERSHIP

nothing is wasted... hit on the big plays run on regular plays score touchdowns..

they throw the word "efficient" out there because he isn't throwing 22-41 for 260 yards... you're right that ain't efficient and it ain't good either.

i think the term they're looking for is "assassin"
Originally posted by BrianGO:
That's a good point. The only reason you need a quarterback in the first place, is because you need points. The reason you need a running back, is to get first downs and run the clock.

We threw one pass in the second half because Kap was so darn perfect in the first half. Kap is too perfect for the game of football. His play is almost confusing people about what football is all about.

lol Well, too perfect for the game of football is quite a stretch, but people do make waaaaaay too much over Total Yards as a statistic.

Total Yards is far too dependent on how often you throw the ball. There are plenty of viable reasons that are NOT bad for why QB's might throw less than others. They may play on a balanced on offense with a good running game, or they may be blowing teams out early. In the case of the 49ers, it's a combination of both.

That's why I first look at Yards Per Attempt. It factors Completion Percentage and Yards Per Completion.
  • LVJay
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 7,054
Originally posted by Jakemall:
Originally posted by LVJay:
Originally posted by LoneWolf:
Originally posted by LVJay:
Originally posted by LoneWolf:
Originally posted by Jakemall:
Originally posted by jonesadrian:
some people don't even really deserve the privilege of being 49er fans that's just being honest without calling out anyone specific.

Sorry but I find this post amusing on several levels

Its only amusing because you know you've thought the same thing before.

I'm quite amused by all of this

Yeah but your easily amused your own hands so that doesnt say much about this thread

I'm too sore to even try to disagree

fyp
"sore" okay, lil taste of my own medicine, huh

alrighty, i'll get u back
  • LVJay
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 7,054
Originally posted by thl408:
Originally posted by LVJay:
Originally posted by jonesadrian:
that's it. it's that simple. stop trying to have 75 motions before the snap. we're good enough to beat them off of talent and effort we don't need to drop a smoke bomb before every snap and hope for the best.

line it up, run with power... run to the edge with hunter.. run routes with more than 1 receiving option. use all of the talent we have which includes letting james get a taste let hunter get more of a workload to spell gore to have both of them fresh, now use boldin and manningham and have that free up vd and for the love of god use the 6"4' 267lb tight end in the red zone



Roman outsmarting himself (at times)... it's not that he's not creative or that he isn't smart, but sometimes it seems like he doesn't have the timing of knowing when. Having said that, I still think he's one of the best OC in today's league.

All that motion isn't just window dressing. There is valuable information being gained by Kap when he sees how the defense responds (or doesn't respond) to the motion. Then there are plays where there is a bunch of shifting used to set up the matchup they want. I've seen it go from a situation where a DB is covering VD, then a bunch of motion/shifting is run and suddenly a LB is covering VD. You also cannot just run this type of motion on pass plays because then it will be a tell for the defense. So you have to execute all that motion and shifting on run plays as well. When the motion is used on run plays, it shifts the strong side around and forces the defense to communicate or risk being out manned at the point of attack.

I guarantee you guys that the opposing defense spends hours talking about how to adjust and what to communicate to each other when they are about to play the 49ers regarding how to respond to all that shifting. I agree that there is always a risk of getting a delay of game penalty, but it appears the coaching staff is willing to risk it, hoping it gets better through time. For the most part, it has gotten better. I see situations where the play is 'won' pre-snap using all this fancy shifting. Getting the matchup they want while adding confusion to the defense can give the offense a huge advantage once the ball is snapped. Why line up and play straight on when you can gain the upper hand before the ball is even snapped?

Sweet! I like your analysis. I do agree (it's getting better). You have to admit, however, it was frustrating as hell, at times, to see it unfold into a false start, delay of game, incompletion and what not (especially in the two losses). Although, it looks brilliant when it befuddles defenses and turns into a good play. I can imagine that more experience/gelling will only make that strategy more potent and not impotent
Originally posted by USArmyParatrooper:
lol Well, too perfect for the game of football is quite a stretch, but people do make waaaaaay too much over Total Yards as a statistic.

Total Yards is far too dependent on how often you throw the ball. There are plenty of viable reasons that are NOT bad for why QB's might throw less than others. They may play on a balanced on offense with a good running game, or they may be blowing teams out early. In the case of the 49ers, it's a combination of both.

That's why I first look at Yards Per Attempt. It factors Completion Percentage and Yards Per Completion.


It's interesting that his yards-per-attempt has been steadily increasing since hitting rock bottom in Seattle.
Originally posted by LVJay:
Sweet! I like your analysis. I do agree (it's getting better). You have to admit, however, it was frustrating as hell, at times, to see it unfold into a false start, delay of game, incompletion and what not (especially in the two losses). Although, it looks brilliant when it befuddles defenses and turns into a good play. I can imagine that more experience/gelling will only make that strategy more potent and not impotent


We've toned it down a great deal, and that has helped us tremendously.

We used to shift four guys on every play, now, it's just one or two, and we don't do it on every single play. This has helped our delay of game problem a lot over our winning streak.
  • LVJay
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 7,054
Originally posted by BrianGO:
Originally posted by LVJay:
Sweet! I like your analysis. I do agree (it's getting better). You have to admit, however, it was frustrating as hell, at times, to see it unfold into a false start, delay of game, incompletion and what not (especially in the two losses). Although, it looks brilliant when it befuddles defenses and turns into a good play. I can imagine that more experience/gelling will only make that strategy more potent and not impotent


We've toned it down a great deal, and that has helped us tremendously.

We used to shift four guys on every play, now, it's just one or two, and we don't do it on every single play. This has helped our delay of game problem a lot over our winning streak.

True... man, I hope Roman doesn't go back to being too cute. I like the idea of the shifting to confuse defense, but on almost every play is ridiculous
Member Milestone: This is post number 800 for thl408.
Originally posted by jonesadrian:
Originally posted by thl408:
All that motion isn't just window dressing. There is valuable information being gained by Kap when he sees how the defense responds (or doesn't respond) to the motion. Then there are plays where there is a bunch of shifting used to set up the matchup they want. I've seen it go from a situation where a DB is covering VD, then a bunch of motion/shifting is run and suddenly a LB is covering VD. You also cannot just run this type of motion on pass plays because then it will be a tell for the defense. So you have to execute all that motion and shifting on run plays as well. When the motion is used on run plays, it shifts the strong side around and forces the defense to communicate or risk being out manned at the point of attack.

I guarantee you guys that the opposing defense spends hours talking about how to adjust and what to communicate to each other when they are about to play the 49ers regarding how to respond to all that shifting. I agree that there is always a risk of getting a delay of game penalty, but it appears the coaching staff is willing to risk it, hoping it gets better through time. For the most part, it has gotten better. I see situations where the play is 'won' pre-snap using all this fancy shifting. Getting the matchup they want while adding confusion to the defense can give the offense a huge advantage once the ball is snapped. Why line up and play straight on when you can gain the upper hand before the ball is even snapped?

i am not saying motions don't have their place i understand there are looks they are trying to get into. but more times than not if they do too many motions and then have to do too many audibles then they call a timeout and everyone here is screaming about clock management. motions and shifts are a necessity.

i am talking about the times where there literally would be about 4 motions before a snap and 4 different players move from one side to the other then back to their original position and then the play is a curl route...

so it's not motions period i understand the need and don't need them to go away.

keep the ones from week 4 on.

get rid of the ones from week 2 where in a hostile environment kap is doing the gator chomp and 4 people start moving and then it ends with a 2 yard out route

What's wrong with a curl route ? Can't audible in SEA so yeah that arm waving is funny to see. Regarding clock management, my take is that when a timeout is wasted, it's on Kap. In the end he has to get the team out of the huddle and know whether he can or cannot change the play given the time left on the playclock. The next time it happens, check out how much time was left on the playclock as they break the huddle. That can hint whether it's on Kap or the coaches. All that shifting and motioning is like getting a head start on running the play. It's just making the most out of the play clock. When Kap is just standing there yelling and waiting for just 1 second left before snapping, maybe it's to give their OL as much rest as possible. Run blocking requires much more stamina on drives.
Originally posted by BrianGO:
Originally posted by LVJay:
Sweet! I like your analysis. I do agree (it's getting better). You have to admit, however, it was frustrating as hell, at times, to see it unfold into a false start, delay of game, incompletion and what not (especially in the two losses). Although, it looks brilliant when it befuddles defenses and turns into a good play. I can imagine that more experience/gelling will only make that strategy more potent and not impotent


We've toned it down a great deal, and that has helped us tremendously.

We used to shift four guys on every play, now, it's just one or two, and we don't do it on every single play. This has helped our delay of game problem a lot over our winning streak.

Its also helped us a fair amount in drawing defenses offsides as well.
Originally posted by thl408:
What's wrong with a curl route ? Can't audible in SEA so yeah that arm waving is funny to see. Regarding clock management, my take is that when a timeout is wasted, it's on Kap. In the end he has to get the team out of the huddle and know whether he can or cannot change the play given the time left on the playclock. The next time it happens, check out how much time was left on the playclock as they break the huddle. That can hint whether it's on Kap or the coaches. All that shifting and motioning is like getting a head start on running the play. It's just making the most out of the play clock. When Kap is just standing there yelling and waiting for just 1 second left before snapping, maybe it's to give their OL as much rest as possible. Run blocking requires much more stamina on drives.

i think its on the coaches. they seem like they have 8 options per situation and try to narrow it down then get it in. when they get the calls in in a timely manner we usually have no problem making adjustments. its when they don't get the personnel in on time and then give him the call with about 15 seconds on the clock that there is trouble
i have a feeling its gonna make a huge jump towards the top of the list by the end of the season. Boldin, Crabs, Rio, VD all at once instead of Boldin and nobody else to help keep him clean. I doubt he ever sees another double cover with crabs and VD out there with him. this offense should be really potent when Crabs hits the field