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The next 49er to get a big $$ deal (other than Kap)

Originally posted by BrianGO:
The main point is that you need A car. The value of ANY car is almost equal when in a desperate situation.

Like if you are starving, a loaf of stale bread is just as valuable as a $100 plate of fancy food, because the alternative is death.

Originally posted by BrianGO:
The main point is that you need A car. The value of ANY car is almost equal when in a desperate situation.

Like if you are starving, a loaf of stale bread is just as valuable as a $100 plate of fancy food, because the alternative is death.

I get your point but if were starving we can always go to the draft.

Eventually the league is going to have to decide not to tear apart their team for mediocre QBs.
Teams that spend too much on a qb end up hurting on defense and generally speaking, don't win championships. I sincerely hope Kap doesn't turn out to be like Da$hon and care more about cash than being on a good team.
Originally posted by Memphis9er:
Teams that spend too much on a qb end up hurting on defense and generally speaking, don't win championships. I sincerely hope Kap doesn't turn out to be like Da$hon and care more about cash than being on a good team.

To be perfectly frank if he does get greedy Id let him walk. Unless he turns the corners amd starts tearing apart secindaries on his own.
  • dwett
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 627
Originally posted by AB81Rules:
Originally posted by dwett:
Originally posted by dwett:
Originally posted by BrianGO:
Originally posted by dwett:
Sorry I won't let this go but Alex is a prime example of what I am talking about. His salary cap figure does not hurt the team which is why they paid so much in draft picks to get him.

If he wants 18 mil a year to continue on the Chiefs will have to look elsewhere since I am sure they want to pay those great players on D. The thing is if you can have a decent QB for under 10 mil it opens up so much for the rest of your team. If you pay them 18-20 mil is closes that. Can you be successful having a great overall team and a QB that you pay under 10 mil for. YES. Most of the Superbowl winners were on the front ends of the QBs contracts. So would you be better served to construct a great team and only be looking for one piece even though it is important???


I think you answered your own question.

No maybe you misunderstood. They were winning them before they got paid. Brees Rodgers even Brady won their super bowls and then got paid the big dollars. None of them have won one since because they are eating up so much salary cap space the team around them is not near the level they once were.
Also I said this earlier. Is Kaep in the same category as Rodgers, Brees, Brady, and Manning. I hope he is if we are going to pay that percentage of our cap for him.

Nicely said dwett. I haven't seen a QB who got a huge deal win a SB after a mega deal signed, usually it's after they win the SB they get paid. But I agree with you dwett.


Originally posted by Memphis9er:
Teams that spend too much on a qb end up hurting on defense and generally speaking, don't win championships. I sincerely hope Kap doesn't turn out to be like Da$hon and care more about cash than being on a good team.
I do as well. If we can keep him for 10-12 like AB3 says then I am in, but if he wants the 18-20 then let him walk build the overall team and work on the next Kaep via the draft. I think we are discounting Harbaugh and his ability to groom QBs At one point Smith was done and now he is worth two second rounders. Harbaugh may be are greatest weapon going forward and his salary does not effect the cap.
Originally posted by dwett:
I do as well. If we can keep him for 10-12 like AB3 says then I am in, bu
t if he wants the 18-20 then let him walk build the overall team and work on the next Kaep via the draft. I think we are discounting Harbaugh and his ability to groom QBs At one point Smith was done and now he is worth two second rounders. Harbaugh may be are greatest weapon going forward and his salary does not effect the cap.

I'm sorry.

I know everyone like's Kaep.

That's our quarterback!

:pauses. looks down and to the left:

:lip quivers:

18-20 million would tear this team apart.

With that being said I think we need to get Aldons head in the right place and resign our all world pass rusher because he is money for at least 10 sacks a year for the next 10 years.
  • dwett
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 627
Originally posted by eonblue:
Originally posted by dwett:
I do as well. If we can keep him for 10-12 like AB3 says then I am in, bu
t if he wants the 18-20 then let him walk build the overall team and work on the next Kaep via the draft. I think we are discounting Harbaugh and his ability to groom QBs At one point Smith was done and now he is worth two second rounders. Harbaugh may be are greatest weapon going forward and his salary does not effect the cap.

I'm sorry.

I know everyone like's Kaep.

That's our quarterback!

:pauses. looks down and to the left:

:lip quivers:

18-20 million would tear this team apart.

With that being said I think we need to get Aldons head in the right place and resign our all world pass rusher because he is money for at least 10 sacks a year for the next 10 years.
Kaep or Aldon It may come down to that.
  • dwett
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 627
Originally posted by AB81Rules:
Originally posted by dwett:
Sorry I won't let this go but Alex is a prime example of what I am talking about. His salary cap figure does not hurt the team which is why they paid so much in draft picks to get him.

If he wants 18 mil a year to continue on the Chiefs will have to look elsewhere since I am sure they want to pay those great players on D. The thing is if you can have a decent QB for under 10 mil it opens up so much for the rest of your team. If you pay them 18-20 mil is closes that. Can you be successful having a great overall team and a QB that you pay under 10 mil for. YES. Most of the Superbowl winners were on the front ends of the QBs contracts. So would you be better served to construct a great team and only be looking for one piece even though it is important???

This ^^^. Alex makes like $8M a yr for 2013 and 2014 each.

BrianGO, I understand we have nothing else at QB, but it's a cap killer, we cant afford a $20M a yr QB, and keep a good D, or good OL, or good weapons on board. Until the cap rises more than 5-10M a yr, right now its lucky it is 1M rise. we are screwed. I am understanding Kap is basically viewed as the franchise QB, but it makes no sense to mortgage the future for 1 player, QB or Not. And the FO wont be bullied to give in to a high dollar demand like Romo or Flacco got.

All the deals done have been fair deals. Kap is worth a fair $12-$15M a yr, not $20M. We would have no money to retain Crabs, Iupati, Aldon, others like VD, McDonald, Willis in the future, all of which will/should be extended, since they can play at high levels. Think long term, with others. We need money to build around Kap. We cant give it all to Kap, and expect him to make average WRs look amazing, cause guess what, it hasn't wotked this year. Williams, Moore are average at best. Baldwin has been a bust since entering the NFL, but looks good. Only Boldin and VD are getting open, because of their abilities.

Kap isn't making them get open, or look better, both were at top before Kap entered the league. Only ones that get open besides those two is Vance McDonald, and Jon Baldwin
AB8 I am curious. When was the last QB to have a 15 mil plus salary and win the super bowl????? To be honest you can go 10mil a year
[ Edited by dwett on Oct 15, 2013 at 7:42 PM ]
Originally posted by dwett:
Kaep or Aldon It may come down to that.

Oh no I think we at least get those 2 signed. That should be the goal of the FO over the next two year, and it they don't accomplish that then they didn't do their job. Unless the Kaep and Aldon demand to be within the top 3 contract at their position. Thy need to get real if that's the case.

Crabtree should be #3.
  • dwett
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 627
Originally posted by eonblue:
Originally posted by dwett:
Kaep or Aldon It may come down to that.

Oh no I think we at least get those 2 signed. That should be the goal of the FO over the next two year, and it they don't accomplish that then they didn't do their job. Unless the Kaep and Aldon demand to be within the top 3 contract at their position. Thy need to get real if that's the case.

Crabtree should be #3.

Man you say both but I don't think so: Here is an article talking about placing all your hopes in a QB and hope I mean salary cap:


http://overthecap.com/super-bowl-rings-and-the-overpricing-of-the-quarterback/
[ Edited by dwett on Oct 15, 2013 at 7:50 PM ]
Originally posted by dwett:
Originally posted by BrianGO:
Originally posted by dwett:
Sorry I won't let this go but Alex is a prime example of what I am talking about. His salary cap figure does not hurt the team which is why they paid so much in draft picks to get him.

If he wants 18 mil a year to continue on the Chiefs will have to look elsewhere since I am sure they want to pay those great players on D. The thing is if you can have a decent QB for under 10 mil it opens up so much for the rest of your team. If you pay them 18-20 mil is closes that. Can you be successful having a great overall team and a QB that you pay under 10 mil for. YES. Most of the Superbowl winners were on the front ends of the QBs contracts. So would you be better served to construct a great team and only be looking for one piece even though it is important???


I think you answered your own question.

No maybe you misunderstood. They were winning them before they got paid. Brees Rodgers even Brady won their super bowls and then got paid the big dollars. None of them have won one since because they are eating up so much salary cap space the team around them is not near the level they once were.


You make a good point.
I think Eli was already in his second contract when he won his Super Bowls. I think Big Ben was on his second when he won his second Super Bowl. Peyton Manning was almost certainly on an epic contract when he won his Super Bowl. Brady might have won one on his second contract, but I'm not sure.

It's a tough call. Hopefully it works out for us in the end.
Originally posted by dwett:
AB8 I am curious. When was the last QB to have a 15 mil plus salary and win the super bowl????? To be honest you can go 10mil a year


My guess is both the Manning brother's were over 15 when they won their's.
Originally posted by dwett:
Originally posted by AB81Rules:
Originally posted by dwett:
Sorry I won't let this go but Alex is a prime example of what I am talking about. His salary cap figure does not hurt the team which is why they paid so much in draft picks to get him.

If he wants 18 mil a year to continue on the Chiefs will have to look elsewhere since I am sure they want to pay those great players on D. The thing is if you can have a decent QB for under 10 mil it opens up so much for the rest of your team. If you pay them 18-20 mil is closes that. Can you be successful having a great overall team and a QB that you pay under 10 mil for. YES. Most of the Superbowl winners were on the front ends of the QBs contracts. So would you be better served to construct a great team and only be looking for one piece even though it is important???

This ^^^. Alex makes like $8M a yr for 2013 and 2014 each.

BrianGO, I understand we have nothing else at QB, but it's a cap killer, we cant afford a $20M a yr QB, and keep a good D, or good OL, or good weapons on board. Until the cap rises more than 5-10M a yr, right now its lucky it is 1M rise. we are screwed. I am understanding Kap is basically viewed as the franchise QB, but it makes no sense to mortgage the future for 1 player, QB or Not. And the FO wont be bullied to give in to a high dollar demand like Romo or Flacco got.

All the deals done have been fair deals. Kap is worth a fair $12-$15M a yr, not $20M. We would have no money to retain Crabs, Iupati, Aldon, others like VD, McDonald, Willis in the future, all of which will/should be extended, since they can play at high levels. Think long term, with others. We need money to build around Kap. We cant give it all to Kap, and expect him to make average WRs look amazing, cause guess what, it hasn't wotked this year. Williams, Moore are average at best. Baldwin has been a bust since entering the NFL, but looks good. Only Boldin and VD are getting open, because of their abilities.

Kap isn't making them get open, or look better, both were at top before Kap entered the league. Only ones that get open besides those two is Vance McDonald, and Jon Baldwin
AB8 I am curious. When was the last QB to have a 15 mil plus salary and win the super bowl????? To be honest you can go 10mil a year

I guess the last QB to have a high salary and win a SB was Eli 2 yrs ago, but wasnt $20M, he made $14.1M in cap, only $9M in cash.

Rodgers, Brady, Big Ben, Peyton all had smaller salaries in there years as SB Champs as starting QBs.

So yeah, I think the last one to have a $15M is a while back. I dont even know if there has been one, maybe it was Peyton when he won his title. All QBs got their deals after their 1st SB win.

Here we go.

Super Bowl Winning QBs, Since 2000

2000- Rams - Warner - $2,004,300
2001- Ravens - Dilfer - $1,000,300
2002- Pats- Brady - $314,993
2003- Buccaneers - Brad Johnson - $6,803,150
2004- Pats- Brady - $3,323,450
2005- Pats- Brady - $5,062,950
2006- Steelers- Big Ben - $4,225,090
2007- Colts- Peyton - $10,571,068
2008- Giants- Eli - $10,046,666
2009- Steelers - Big Ben - $7,971,920
2010- Saints- Brees - $10,660,400
2011- Packers - Rodgers - $6,500,000
2012- Giants- Eli - $14,100,000
2013- Ravens - Flacco - $8,000,000
In terms of 'the next guy' to get $$, I'd go with Boldin. I can't imagine we'd allow him to test free agency and he's an insurance policy for our the Crabtree situation. Boldin will probably command a 3yr deal, but he's been invaluable.
For Kaep, I think it all depends on how this season ends.

If we can't even make the playoffs, all debates are for naught.

If we win the BIG one, we will have to go $15mill+ per year for an early extension or let Kaep play out his rookie contract and hope for a seventh on the cheap. This I think will be the best scenario. We will have our sixth may be a seventh all on the cheap. And we hold the cards whether to extend early or not.

If we get to the playoffs but not win the SB, I expect Kaep will either accept a $10mill per year but short term deal or play out his rookie contract and see if he can hit the jackpot after the 2014 season ala Joe Flacco. This can get really expensive though if Kaep does well in 2014.
[ Edited by ayetee on Oct 15, 2013 at 8:42 PM ]
I think Kaep plays ball with the FO and does a workable contract with the Niners. Just my gut.