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are we underutilizing our players? the state of the franchise...

If they let LMJ walk next year, he will most certainly get scooped up by SEA.. Unless, the FO trades him, I don't think they will let him walk. LMJ has talent, if we can't get it out of him, SOMETEAM will... It's going to haunt us in the end.. plus that means the whole 2012 draft was a mulligan...... the WHOLE draft, lmao.. WTF...
  • mayo49
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LMJ should be the KR/PR. Cut Williams sorry ass.
Originally posted by kazak13:
So you would rather have McDonald. Bruce Miller and even our OL Killgore ahead of Moore? Moore played real good during the pre-season on first team.. they gotta give them a chance.. I seen what Kyle Williams can do and thats about nothing.. Cant wait for Patton to step up. they dont even give them a chance.. how do you give a receiver a chance to go in rhythm when you got TE. FB and OL ahead of them on the depth chart.. and how many times do they open things up with 3 WR's..

LMJ = His inability to pass protect quickly adds to predictable play calling.

Moore = Looks like they worked him in with a reverse today.

Patton = Isn't he injured?


2/3 TE's is our version of 3 WR. VD is our best mismatch on offense, which is why he can line up outside or on the line. If opposing teams see 2/3 TE's in our huddle, their personnel will likely consist of more LB's and less CB's. This allows VD to be covered by a LB or Safety rather than CB's in zone. Also allows Miller to do his dirty work. We lose Miller in 3 WR.
[ Edited by cypherninja on Oct 14, 2013 at 7:51 AM ]
  • fropwns
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Originally posted by x--OoO--x:
If they let LMJ walk next year, he will most certainly get scooped up by SEA.. Unless, the FO trades him, I don't think they will let him walk. LMJ has talent, if we can't get it out of him, SOMETEAM will... It's going to haunt us in the end.. plus that means the whole 2012 draft was a mulligan...... the WHOLE draft, lmao.. WTF...

Your name looks just like an X-Wing fighter.
Originally posted by Liono:
Who cannot see that LMJ is the most explosive player we have on our offense athletically? No one has his burst of speed. He may not be an every down back, but get the man some touches. They aren't even using him in the return game.

I suspect he has ball control issues. Can't play an explosive player if he can't hang onto the ball.
Originally posted by boast:
stopped reading at "Osgood...huh?"

dude is an important cog in our dominant Special Teams

This, for sure.
Why is LMJ not in the slot at least?????????
Originally posted by DrGonzo00:
We probably blew a pick on LMJ. Didn't need him when we had drafted Kendall a year earlier in the same type of role. The main difference between LMJ and Kendall...LMJ can't pick up blitzes in pass protection. That's why we love Gore, that's why we love Kendall and he saw steady action as a rookie.

I also think our coaches and management envisioned LMJ as our pistol/option RB since Gore and Hunter were more traditonal RBs. Now the cutesy BS is over and we're going back to traditional, pro style formations where Gore and Hunter thrive. And LMJ isn't exactly killing it as a PR/KR. So that's that.

This is the larger picture. They were looking to use the pistol with a lot of read/option and the rules changes(can blast QB on those plays) and the effective defensive strategies against it take us right back to the power run game with play action. I feel they have made that decision. The team is really built to do this, especially with our O-Line. Look what happened in the last quarter yesterday. The ground and pound took it's toll on the AZ defensive over time. This is really what runs deepest in Harbaugh's veins. It's what he grew up with, played with and coached at Stanford. It is also what wins games over the long haul especially in the playoffs. Maybe they are among the first to see the gimmick offenses are a passing fad, and let's get back to what is the staple and become really innovative with that.
Originally posted by kazak13:
some things dont make sense to me... we have a lot of talent that is sitting on the sideline.. what do you guys think?

why do we have a offensive lineman (killgore), McDonald and Bruce Miller lining up at WR when we have LMJ, Moore, and wide receivers sitting on the bench

why dont we have more screen passes to gore or even LMJ..

is our coaching staff afraid to experiment with and be more dynamic and aggressive? it just seems that the play calling is so conservative, and yet when they do open it up Colin and VD and Boldin can tear it up...

nnamdi asomugha was playing pretty bad and it took the injury to allow Brock to step up..

we dumped an explosive player in Lavelle Hawkins and kept Osgood... huh...

I love the fact that Seattle has so much depth and that they keep playmakers on their team.. and I wish we were a little bit more aggressive...

i guess we will find out how it all comes together after manningham and crabtree come back.. its not how you start the season its how you finish it!

I will agree about LMJ. We put a second round pick into this guy and we still don't really know what we have. With that said, I understand the coach's thought process. We have Gore and Hunter playing at a high level. You have Miller who has simply become one of the best at his position. Then you have Dixon. Dixon may not be that explosive runner that LMJ could be, but he has been exceling at coverage on special teams. He is the back up lead blocker behind Miller and has shown an ability to convert goal line and short yardage situations this season when called upon. He simply brings more versatility at the moment for the current offense this team employs. With our dline situation as is, your not going to have 5 active running backs on gameday.

Now as far as Moore and opening things up with more receivers. I think we saw how that worked out the first few games outside of Green Bay, who were too focused on shutting Kaep and the running game down. Other than Vernon and Boldin, we simply just don't have anybody that can get consistent separation. The packages that you speak of with guys like Kilgore lined up at receiver are simply used for confusion and decoys.

I think we as fans tend to criticize but in the end, we have to remember who is out there on these practice fields and analyzing these gamefilms to a T. Our coaching staff has done nothing but win in the NFL, I think they have proven to know how to best utilize their talent. I understand that you wonder when guys like Brock step up and completely outplay the guy that was starting in front of them, but that happens everywhere every year. Brian Hoyer has been bounced around a bit the last couple of years then comes to Cleveland this year and looks like he should have been starting somewhere years ago. Victor Cruz, who the heck was that guy when he exploded on the scene, how did that kind of talent go overlooked? The list goes on and on and so forth. Some people are just natural gamers and that doesn't transpire on the practice field and some are the other way around.

Before I started high school in what seems like an eternity ago now, lol. There was this kid, I believe his name was Matt Burke. He was an absolute stud and went to VA Tech on a scholarship. Once there he got very few chances to shine in games. When people and locals started questioning, it came out that this dude was a stud in practice and by far the best one on the practice field at his position but he simply could not carry that talent over to the gameday field.

Believe me when I tell you that this coaching staff knows what its doing.
Originally posted by Magzarillious:
Why is LMJ not in the slot at least?????????

He's too small. And before you bring up Sproles, not just anyone can be a Sproles. Those are rare. James is not on that level. Ellington (of the Cardinals) might possibly be, though.
Member Milestone: This is post number 800 for ElephantHaley.
Yeah I gotta admit, I'm disappointed in the 49ers passing game. This team is way too explosive to be sputtering around. KW should not be on the roster. Baldwin can play. Get him more involved. Throw to him deep I don't care if its incomplete, atleast the defense will have to think about the deep ball instead of squatting on Quan,and VD and very predictable.
On a serious note, it boggles my mind re: how much talent this team has on offense and defense and 1) either doesn't use them at all or sparingly or 2) how we don't utilize them enough or properly. When you watch other teams, these two issues can often times come more into light...teams making the most of the little talent they have compared to us. So yes, it's a serious issue IMHO. Aside from one bad draft and a few head-scratching moves, Baalke has assembled one of the most talented teams on the planet with a ton of depth. It's up to the skill coaches and coordinators to get these players on the field and in position to make plays. Just a small example of this is ow we have the best and deepest 4 LBers in the game but use them in coverage more than rushing the passer or scheming more pressure. On offense, if your name is not VD or Boldin, you will be LUCKY to get two catches (yesterdays game, only one catch). This is a serious sign of underutilization IMHO so to the OP, this is a topic we should openly discuss. It's been the elephant in the room for 3 years now for many of us, not dismissing the moves first made (Brooks elevated, Sopoaga back to NT, Miller conversion, etc).
I don't think players are being underutilized so much as we really don't have the talent. Kap is not a traditional pocket passer like a Phillip Rivers, Rodgers, Manning, etc. I think he's getting better and will get better going thru his reads, but right now he's looking at VD and Boldin or looking to run. There's no one else to really look at when going thru progressions. VD can be our deep threat, Boldin can be a slot/possession threat with the ability to go deep or Kap can bootleg it. Do we need more? Sure, but has this been effective with our running game? Absolutely.

I love that we're going back to the traditional power running game. Our OL is one of the best in the league and we're going back to our bread and butter. And now that our run offense is established, we can catch teams off guard with a pass or play action or bootleg.
Originally posted by boast:
stopped reading at "Osgood...huh?"

dude is an important cog in our dominant Special Teams

Co-sign this. Some people sound like novices when they keep questioning why Osgood is still here "taking up a roster spot". Do some research. He's been a top notch ST player for years and maybe one of the main reasons teams aren't going 90 on us when we kick them the ball.
Your arguement about Hawkins is nothing. He isn't a quality NFL WR. He had one good return and a run after catch in preseason and he got crowned by some fans. Osgood is a special team stud and a lot of fans undervalue special teams and in particular kick coverage.

Marlon Moore had his chances and has disappointed.

Regarding LMJ, he showed some good flashes last year after Hunter went down. But, I think there is something more here behind the scenes we don't know about. Obviously, the coaches don't use him that much and it may be more than a "lack of talent" or fit in the scheme. Maybe he doesn't fit the FO and Harb's vision. Its obvious he will be gone soon.

Its easy to second guess front offices. I think overall we do a really good job. And, the reason Kilgore split wide was for deception. He came in the game as an extra blocker to show that power run look. AZ was expecting run, or possibly a play action bootleg. When he split wide and Kap audibled, AZ was probably confused as hell.