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Can someone explain this to me??

Originally posted by brodiebluebanaszak:
As I mentioned there's more urgent issues for the organization to deal with right now.

Amen!
Originally posted by redrathman:
1. He's bigger.
2. He has starting experience.
3. He's got a better arm.
4. He's just 25 years old.
5. He's a winner.

Skelton was able to produce winning records in his starts during his first two seasons behind the worst line in football. It's clear Harbaugh didn't like Daniels enough to keep him as his third.

We don't know enough about Daniels' work ethic and ability to pick up the system. Clearly, he wasn't worth a spot on the 53. Every other team in football had the opportunity to claim Daniels and Carroll was the only one who did.

I trust Harbaugh has more knowledge about NFL Quarterbacks in one finger then the collective knowledge of this forum.

This. If they want a pocket QB, Skelton has far more potential. Even with Wilson, if you can keep him in the pocket, he struggles immensely, look at his numbers last week in the first half or against the 49ers for pretty much the entire game. If you can keep him from getting to the outside, he's a lot less effective. The same goes for Daniels. Skelton is a guy who sit in the pocket, maintain his composure against the pass rush and gun the ball out of there, if necessary he has the athleticism to scramble, get away from the pass rush and run the ball himself.


He's 6'6" and 250, you can't teach that kind of size. Considering he's still pretty young, I'd love to see what Harbaugh can do to mold him into a better overall QB, even just as a quality backup player.
  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 8,504
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by NickSh49:
Rascal doesn't even know I exist anymore. I AM THE SADS!

I think the saddest thing lost in all of this is that JIM HARBAUGH WAS AN NFL QUARTERBACK FOR 14 YEARS! I think he knows a lot when it comes to the guy that throws the ball, should probably trust his judgement.

This can never be overstated enough!

That said, Baalke is the GM and makes the personnel decisions. He's the one who decides to keep coach-favorites such as Ventrone for Seely, Owen M. for Harbaugh, etc. But he's also the one to cut guys like Owen M. also. I have NO doubt there is regular communication between all of the coaches and GM over personnel. But it doesn't mean Baalke isn't going to make some unpopular moves among the coaching staff either (Cam Johnson was a favorite of Fangio). Another thing to consider in all of this is that Kaepernick has, so far, regressed quite a bit this season. Over in the CK thread, posters have identified a number of issues inlcuding poor mechanics, relying on arm strength, his feet, timing, etc. So if the argument is that Harbaugh is a QB-whisperer and knows who's got talent and doesn't, there are a number of factors that play into the decision to retain or rid the roster of one. And really, for all we know, Harbaugh himself may have wanted to retain Daniels and contiue to help develop him over starting from scratch with a new veteran who will have to unlearn a number of poor habits before starting with a clean slate and developing.

PS: Collie just signed with the Pats.

Baalke is responsible for all roster decisions, but we have very little information on how he works with the coaching staff on making those decisions.

Harbaugh may have told Baalke that Daniels should be cut. Harbaugh may have suggested that the team sign Skelton.

We do not know the specifics, but at the end of the day the team cuts x player and signs y player.

It would be interesting to hear Harbaugh break down the play of Kaepernick, but I know and you know that we will not hear him do that.

There really is so much that we do not know, but as long as we stay in the world of may, might, and could we will be safe.
[ Edited by buck on Oct 3, 2013 at 2:50 PM ]
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by NickSh49:
Rascal doesn't even know I exist anymore. I AM THE SADS!

I think the saddest thing lost in all of this is that JIM HARBAUGH WAS AN NFL QUARTERBACK FOR 14 YEARS! I think he knows a lot when it comes to the guy that throws the ball, should probably trust his judgement.

This can never be overstated enough!

That said, Baalke is the GM and makes the personnel decisions. He's the one who decides to keep coach-favorites such as Ventrone for Seely, Owen M. for Harbaugh, etc. But he's also the one to cut guys like Owen M. also. I have NO doubt there is regular communication between all of the coaches and GM over personnel. But it doesn't mean Baalke isn't going to make some unpopular moves among the coaching staff either (Cam Johnson was a favorite of Fangio). Another thing to consider in all of this is that Kaepernick has, so far, regressed quite a bit this season. Over in the CK thread, posters have identified a number of issues inlcuding poor mechanics, relying on arm strength, his feet, timing, etc. So if the argument is that Harbaugh is a QB-whisperer and knows who's got talent and doesn't, there are a number of factors that play into the decision to retain or rid the roster of one. And really, for all we know, Harbaugh himself may have wanted to retain Daniels and contiue to help develop him over starting from scratch with a new veteran who will have to unlearn a number of poor habits before starting with a clean slate and developing.

PS: Collie just signed with the Pats.

Baalke is responsible for all roster decisions, but we have very little information on how he works with the coaching staff on making those decisions.

Harbaugh may have told Baalke that Daniels should be cut. Harbaugh may have suggested that the team sign Skelton.

We do not know the specifics, but at the end of the day the team cuts x player and signs y player.

It would be interesting to hear Harbaugh break down the play of Kaepernick, but I know and you know that we will not hear him to that.

There really is so much that we do not know, but as long as we stay in the world of may, might, and will be safe.

Haha. This is so true! It's sometimes easier to be removed from all the variables (like fans) that could affect the player-coach-FO relationship. This is why it's so important to have a great GM who can make those tough objetive decisions. Just look at the WZ...screaming for WCO plays, getting back to our identity, etc. And BAM, 4 games later after getting called out in the media, we do just that and do it with large success (Daniels is cut/Skelton is in).

I always thought Bill Walsh would be a tremendous GM b/c he helped make some of the most difficult decisions in football history and he typically did them a year or two before the player fully declined with an eye on the future. That is a rare and unique skill. The flip side is that b/c we are fans, we are never close enough to what really goes on behind closed doors...we don'thave the access. Still, it doesn't mean the fans are always wrong either, even with limited viewing/exposure.

Someday we'll have to get a concensus on what the WZ feels strongly about vs. what the coaches or FO do and see how it all plays out for fun. I would guestimate the WZ isn't as bad as some would perceive (once you get away from the initial emotional bomb dropped). Ha
Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by redrathman:
1. He's bigger.
2. He has starting experience.
3. He's got a better arm.
4. He's just 25 years old.
5. He's a winner.

Skelton was able to produce winning records in his starts during his first two seasons behind the worst line in football. It's clear Harbaugh didn't like Daniels enough to keep him as his third.

We don't know enough about Daniels' work ethic and ability to pick up the system. Clearly, he wasn't worth a spot on the 53. Every other team in football had the opportunity to claim Daniels and Carroll was the only one who did.

I trust Harbaugh has more knowledge about NFL Quarterbacks in one finger then the collective knowledge of this forum.

This. If they want a pocket QB, Skelton has far more potential. Even with Wilson, if you can keep him in the pocket, he struggles immensely, look at his numbers last week in the first half or against the 49ers for pretty much the entire game. If you can keep him from getting to the outside, he's a lot less effective. The same goes for Daniels. Skelton is a guy who sit in the pocket, maintain his composure against the pass rush and gun the ball out of there, if necessary he has the athleticism to scramble, get away from the pass rush and run the ball himself.


He's 6'6" and 250, you can't teach that kind of size. Considering he's still pretty young, I'd love to see what Harbaugh can do to mold him into a better overall QB, even just as a quality backup player.

It seems this coaching staff is enamored with freakish builds. As in, just get us players with abnormal body types, we'll coach them up from there. Okoye, Kap, guys with long arms, and now Skelton. It appears Skelton has the arm to make all the NFL throws and now Harbaugh will get to work.
  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 8,504
Originally posted by NCommand:

Still, it doesn't mean the fans are always wrong either, even with limited viewing/exposure.

This is true, and if the GM is a Matt Millen clone, the fans might be right more often than the GM.
[ Edited by buck on Oct 3, 2013 at 2:24 PM ]
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by NCommand:

Still, it doesn't mean the fans are always wrong either, even with limited viewing/exposure.

This is true, and if the GM is a Matt Millen clone, the fans might be right more often than the GM.

This cracked me up! Some day with reality TV, a team will be run by the fans ala American Idol. Call in to vote...
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by NCommand:

Still, it doesn't mean the fans are always wrong either, even with limited viewing/exposure.

This is true, and if the GM is a Matt Millen clone, the fans might be right more often than the GM.

This cracked me up! Some day with reality TV, a team will be run by the fans ala American Idol. Call in to vote...
TEXT 3 TO 494949 TO FIRE YOUR COACH
Originally posted by ChipDouglas510:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by NCommand:

Still, it doesn't mean the fans are always wrong either, even with limited viewing/exposure.

This is true, and if the GM is a Matt Millen clone, the fans might be right more often than the GM.

This cracked me up! Some day with reality TV, a team will be run by the fans ala American Idol. Call in to vote...
TEXT 3 TO 494949 TO FIRE YOUR COACH

LMAO!!!! My bad..."text." And standard text rates apply.
When we have a QB like Kaepernick... why are people so upset over roster shuffles for the 3rd QB?

He looked good in preseason? Who cares!! it is preseason and he was mostly facing scrubs and guys who didn't even make a 53-roster.

I guess it is just greed, and hoping that Daniels could eventually turn into something and the 49ers can get draft picks 3 or 4 years from now. Foolish.
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by ChipDouglas510:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by NCommand:

Still, it doesn't mean the fans are always wrong either, even with limited viewing/exposure.

This is true, and if the GM is a Matt Millen clone, the fans might be right more often than the GM.

This cracked me up! Some day with reality TV, a team will be run by the fans ala American Idol. Call in to vote...
TEXT 3 TO 494949 TO FIRE YOUR COACH

LMAO!!!! My bad..."text." And standard text rates apply.

Originally posted by NCommand:
Gray, Cooper, Haralson, risked Morris, now lost Daniels...it's a fair question no matter how much you "trust the FO." And those moves are fine if we have epic players in front of them that force our hand. But Ventrone, Harper and Owen M. and others? I think it's a fair question esp. after the 2012 draft.


The part I don't get is, "Why draft them?" If we are just going to release them for "meh" free agents, what is the point of drafting them in the first place?

Gray, Cooper, Daniels. WHY draft them at all? If we're not interested in keeping young projects, I don't understand the logic of wasting draft picks on them. If we think that the bargain bin free agents are better, what is the point of drafting them, protecting them on the 53 etc.

"But we don't have confidence in Colt McCoy". Ok, so cut HIM. Don't cut the young guy playing for peanuts on a rookie contract.
And if you don't think that highly of him, then WHY draft him in the first place? WHY put him on the 53? We could have used some OT depth instead of wasting it on players who we're going to cut anyway.

Late round draft picks are valuable because they're CHEAP as dirt. You have them for four years. The economics of releasing them by the bushel doesn't make sense. None of it makes sense.
[ Edited by BrianGO on Oct 3, 2013 at 3:26 PM ]
Originally posted by threelittlebirds:
When we have a QB like Kaepernick... why are people so upset over roster shuffles for the 3rd QB?

He looked good in preseason? Who cares!! it is preseason and he was mostly facing scrubs and guys who didn't even make a 53-roster.

I guess it is just greed, and hoping that Daniels could eventually turn into something and the 49ers can get draft picks 3 or 4 years from now. Foolish.


Why DRAFT him? Why keep him on the 53 man ROSTER? This is cheap labor for years that we are just throwing away. Trade the picks for something. These are draft picks we are throwing away.
[ Edited by BrianGO on Oct 3, 2013 at 3:26 PM ]
Originally posted by BrianGO:
The part I don't get is, "Why draft them?" If we are just going to release them for "meh" free agents, what is the point of drafting them in the first place?

Gray, Cooper, Daniels. WHY draft them at all? If we're not interested in keeping young projects, I don't understand the logic of wasting draft picks on them. If we think that the bargain bin free agents are better, what is the point on drafting them, protecting them on the 53 etc.

"But we don't have confidence in Colt McCoy". Ok, so cut HIM. Don't cut the young guy playing for peanuts on a rookie contract.
And if you don't think that highly of him, then WHY draft him in the first place? WHY put him on the 53? We could have used some OT depth instead of wasting it on players who we're going to cut anyway.

Late round draft picks are valuable because they're CHEAP as dirt. You have them for four years. The economics of releasing them by the bushel doesn't make sense. None of it makes sense.

I hear ya. One thing to factor is that we are a pretty talented team. It's harder for late-round draft picks to crack the roster. They really have to be exceptional to stick around.

I honestly didn't see anything from Gray or Cooper to warrant a spot on our 53. Other teams with needs at their positions picked them up.

Daniels definitely flashed exciting potential. I wish we brought in Skelton sooner, so he would have had time to beat out McCoy for #2, and keep Daniels as the 3rd developmental QB. I have a hunch that was the plan in this case. We took a risk and hoped Daniels would clear waivers, he didn't.
Originally posted by TheG0RE49er:
A big problem I had was getting rid of BJ. he played good in preaseason for a rookie and made some nice throws. i don't understand how skelton can possibly have more upside than this kid.


I think it's obvious that we picked up Skelton for his ability to play NOW, rather than his upside. He has experience. We don't have confidence in Colt McCoy, so we bring in Skelton who might be an upgrade at #2.
The only problem is, this type of short term thinking is hurting our longer term welfare. Draft picks are gold in the modern NFL. Short term necessity is important, but the worst teams in the league think only about their short term necessities. Out of some sense of desperation (not happy with McCoy) we are putting short term ahead of long term. This is generally a bad idea.
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