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Can someone explain this to me??

Originally posted by Rascal:
Is more than a fair question. I would like to add to your list Cam Johnson, Lavelle Hawkins, Colt McCoy and of course now John Skelton.

The only recent move that I liked was when Baalke owned up to his mistakes and traded AJ Jenkins away for Jon Baldwin, but that's it.

When you add that to the 2012 draft choices plus our desperate need for legit WRs when nothing is done about it, it is just too much.

I am sorry, as much as I love my 49ers, I can't just sit here and recite the company line time after time like a parrot "in Baalke and Harbaugh we trust" anymore. Just can't do it with good conscience or even common sense.

Losing BJ and of anyone to the Seahawks was my last straw.

This is simply unacceptable !!

It looks like we have a new challenger for SanDiego's crown... we may need to hold a #1 contender match with Brodieblue
Originally posted by buck:
Let's look at some of the recent roster cuts that have been criticized

1. Lavelle Hawkins

Chargers signed WR Lavelle Hawkins after Malcolm Floyd was hurt. He has not played a game yet.

2. BJ Daniels

Daniels was released by 49ers. He was picked up off waivers by Seattle. He has not played a game yet.

3. Parys Haralson

Has played in 4 games and started 2. He has 2 solo tackles, 3 assists and 1 sack.

4. Cam Johnson

Johnson has played in four games for the Colts. He has 1 solo tackle.

5. Marcus Cooper

Has played in four games and he has started 1. He has 1 pass defended and 4 tackles. He has played well on special teams.

6. Brandon Jacobs

Jacobs has played in three games. He has rushed 11 times for 11 yards. Has one reception for 5 yards.


I am sure I missed somebody.

So, far it looks like Baalke made a mistake by not keeping Marcus Cooper.

Hawkins and Daniels have not played in a game yet this year.

The trades for Johnson and Haralson do not seem to be mistakes.

Jacobs has done next to nothing in New York.

Cooper (cb) appears to be the biggest loss. He filled in for Flowers over at KC...and did a solid job. Dems some shoes.
Originally posted by xcfan:
the fact that baalke likes skelton over bj tells me baalke isn't as sharp as all the hero-worshipers think. as an overall football player (locker room & field), skelton is a loser and close to garbage. bj has solid potential and has shown early flashes which instills trust in his future development as a #2 (maybe even a #1 down the road). skelton as a #2 is a complete misread; if he had to start 5 games, he might win one--that's garbage.

wow, BJ Daniels was a 7th rounder for a reason. He wasnt gonna see the field ever. Skelton is better right now then Daniels is. How can anyone judge this move as making baalke as a bad GM. Daniels is a project. We wanted him for read option, but we dont even run it anymore, teams figured it out. Better off with QBs who can throw 1st.
Love the hobbyist rage over Daniels.

It's like watching a mid 50's housewife rage over a plot twist in her soap opera.
Originally posted by Rascal:
Is more than a fair question. I would like to add to your list Cam Johnson, Lavelle Hawkins, Colt McCoy and of course now John Skelton.

The only recent move that I liked was when Baalke owned up to his mistakes and traded AJ Jenkins away for Jon Baldwin, but that's it.

When you add that to the 2012 draft choices plus our desperate need for legit WRs when nothing is done about it, it is just too much.

I am sorry, as much as I love my 49ers, I can't just sit here and recite the company line time after time like a parrot "in Baalke and Harbaugh we trust" anymore. Just can't do it with good conscience or even common sense.

Losing BJ and of anyone to the Seahawks was my last straw.

This is simply unacceptable !!

Are you being sarcastic? Serious question.
Originally posted by sspiker:
So.... are you giving up being a fan? I don't understand what you think your recourse is here.


It is not about recourse, there is nothing we can do about it as fans. But, as a fan, I have to voice out my massive disappointment with the moves and not just because we lost a third string QB to the Seahawks as some have claimed. I am referring to the string of moves we have made since this offseason.

Am I giving up ? Close to, until I see some properly well-thought out moves by the organization.

In any case, as far as this season is concerned, I am not expecting much anyway based on how things have transpired. So far, in short it has been marred by injuries that we failed to plan for, inept coaching and bad front office moves. Whether we like it or not, the Seahawks have done a far better job, their team is finally coming together and well on their way in moving into their prime and on the edge of peaking. BJ is a great pick-up from their part, so job well done there. We will definitely lose the NFC West to the Seahawks without a question. I also believe we will lose to the Seahawks at home in December, should it happen it will confirm my opinion since last December's blowout they have surpassed us.

Once again, I have to say I hope I am wrong and I welcome the idea of me being dead wrong given my support for the 9ers. It is almost painful to be right sometimes, that is how frustrating it is. Give you a quick example, yesterday, I said we better be prepared cos the Seahawks will probably claim BJ. Needless to say, I was told I was wrong and no way would that happen as most teams' rosters will be pretty much settled. So, here we are, BJ bound for Seattle. Frankly, it is common sense, Pete Carroll already made it known they wanted BJ, but was preempted by the 9ers in the draft. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to work it out they will try to claim him.
Originally posted by trellblaze:
Are you being sarcastic? Serious question.


Absolutely not.
Originally posted by Rascal:
Originally posted by sspiker:
So.... are you giving up being a fan? I don't understand what you think your recourse is here.


It is not about recourse, there is nothing we can do about it as fans. But, as a fan, I have to voice out my massive disappointment with the moves and not just because we lost a third string QB to the Seahawks as some have claimed. I am referring to the string of moves we have made since this offseason.

Am I giving up ? Close to, until I see some properly well-thought out moves by the organization.

In any case, as far as this season is concerned, I am not expecting much anyway based on how things have transpired. So far, in short it has been marred by injuries that we failed to plan for, inept coaching and bad front office moves. Whether we like it or not, the Seahawks have done a far better job, their team is finally coming together and well on their way in moving into their prime and on the edge of peaking. BJ is a great pick-up from their part, so job well done there. We will definitely lose the NFC West to the Seahawks without a question. I also believe we will lose to the Seahawks at home in December, should it happen it will confirm my opinion since last December's blowout they have surpassed us.

Once again, I have to say I hope I am wrong and I welcome the idea of me being dead wrong given my support for the 9ers. It is almost painful to be right sometimes, that is how frustrating it is. Give you a quick example, yesterday, I said we better be prepared cos the Seahawks will probably claim BJ. Needless to say, I was told I was wrong and no way would that happen as most teams' rosters will be pretty much settled. So, here we are, BJ bound for Seattle. Frankly, it is common sense, Pete Carroll already made it known they wanted BJ, but was preempted by the 9ers in the draft. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to work it out they will try to claim him.

The Seahawks represented the NFC in the superbowl? I could of sworn it was another team, of yeah, the NINERS.

Dude its a 3rd string QB who could very well get cut a couple more times before the season is over, I normally dont recommend drugs but you seem like you need to smoke a bowl.
Two years from now Skelton will be the long term backup to Kap, and BJ Daniels will be employed somewhere besides an NFL roster.

As far as options for a long term backup behind Kap, skelton>daniels.

Mccoy will be gone ASAP. They havent been happy with him since the begining of the signing.
Originally posted by Rascal:
Absolutely not.

I ask because your reaction to these moves would seem more appropriate if it were 2009 - you know....when we had put together a string of...hell I don't even know what to call what we were back then because "bad" just doesn't cut it. Even then, a fan is a fan no matter what but at least what you're saying would make some sense in that era.

Look man, just take a breath and think this through.

Cam Johnson had ONE...not several - ONE monster game. It occurred in the preseason. You could argue that he had a big upside and that we wasted a pick on him or what not but the truth is you don't expect every single draft pick to make the team. No one does. Looking at our current LB position, even with Smith and Willis out we do not need Cam Johnson. He would still be on the bench. As far as young defenders that will be developed, we have Cory Lemonier and Tank Carradine (I know Tank is a DL and not a LB). At the LB position we currently have Patrick Willis, Navarro Bowman, Ahmad Brooks, Cory Lemonier, Dan Skuta, Mike Wilhoite, and Nate Stupar. Almost all of these guys have outperformed Cam Johnson thus far (4 games played and 1 tackle).

Lavelle Hawkins has played 6 years and his biggest game came in - yes...a 49ers preseason game. Although we're quite weak at the WR position as it stands, Hawkins did not help his case with multiple penalties. He had some big plays, yes, but again, you have to know that preseason is not a direct translation to regular season. That said, I'll concede this much to you: Hawkins didn't look any worse than some of the guys we kept. However, you could argue that Jon Baldwin was expected from the start to get a bigger role eventually. He was 1 month behind in the playbook so there's no way it was going to happen early. Still, if the 49ers knew that they would eventually work him into the lineup, cutting Hawkins makes a little more sense. The team - for whatever reason...maybe experience - is sold on Kyle Williams so he wasn't going anywhere. Marlon Moore was initially brought in for special teams. Currently, this group suck a$$ but that will change drastically with the return of Manningham and Crabtree. It's worth noting that Hawkins was unemployed until a Chargers player got injured. I hope you weren't expecting a guy who could barely land a job on the other 31 teams to contribute as a legitimate #2 or 3.

BJ Daniels. If Daniels were to see the field for the 49ers, that would mean that our season is a total wash. Both Kaepernick and McCoy would have to be injured or totally ineffective. The SAME GOES FOR SEATTLE. If Daniels is playing for Seattle, they're in a sh!tload of trouble. The 49ers hoped to keep him and develop him. They had to take a risk. Was Skelton worth the risk? I have to say I'm not sold that he is. I'm not seeing the improvement with that one. Either way, losing Daniels to the Seahawks is not an impact transaction. It will not directly add to the Seahawks win total and it's not like we were robbed of QB who was going to lead us to any victories.

No matter how you package it or how many ways you spin it. The bottom line is that we have not lost any players (with the transactions discussed) that will keep us from the playoffs. It's very unlikely that any of them would've touched the field this season or next.

Remember, Rascal - this is still a great team we're talking about here. This is not the Jaguars.

And stop crowning Seattle already. Unlike most other 49er fans, I don't think about them much and they don't get under my skin at all. People around the WZ seem to think they're untouchable. Yea they're damn good, but they're beatable.

Seriously dude. Your reactions suggest that we traded Patrick Willis for Hakeem Nicks or something (heh...there was a guy who suggested this for real).
Too much whining in this thread! For a second there, I thought we got rid of Kap or Justin with the way people are crying over a 3rd string QB that probably won't see the field for the next 3 or 4 years, or maybe not at all. Its Nate Davis days all over again.
Originally posted by trellblaze:
Originally posted by Rascal:
Absolutely not.

I ask because your reaction to these moves would seem more appropriate if it were 2009 - you know....when we had put together a string of...hell I don't even know what to call what we were back then because "bad" just doesn't cut it. Even then, a fan is a fan no matter what but at least what you're saying would make some sense in that era.

Look man, just take a breath and think this through.

Cam Johnson had ONE...not several - ONE monster game. It occurred in the preseason. You could argue that he had a big upside and that we wasted a pick on him or what not but the truth is you don't expect every single draft pick to make the team. No one does. Looking at our current LB position, even with Smith and Willis out we do not need Cam Johnson. He would still be on the bench. As far as young defenders that will be developed, we have Cory Lemonier and Tank Carradine (I know Tank is a DL and not a LB). At the LB position we currently have Patrick Willis, Navarro Bowman, Ahmad Brooks, Cory Lemonier, Dan Skuta, Mike Wilhoite, and Nate Stupar. Almost all of these guys have outperformed Cam Johnson thus far (4 games played and 1 tackle).

Lavelle Hawkins has played 6 years and his biggest game came in - yes...a 49ers preseason game. Although we're quite weak at the WR position as it stands, Hawkins did not help his case with multiple penalties. He had some big plays, yes, but again, you have to know that preseason is not a direct translation to regular season. That said, I'll concede this much to you: Hawkins didn't look any worse than some of the guys we kept. However, you could argue that Jon Baldwin was expected from the start to get a bigger role eventually. He was 1 month behind in the playbook so there's no way it was going to happen early. Still, if the 49ers knew that they would eventually work him into the lineup, cutting Hawkins makes a little more sense. The team - for whatever reason...maybe experience - is sold on Kyle Williams so he wasn't going anywhere. Marlon Moore was initially brought in for special teams. Currently, this group suck a$$ but that will change drastically with the return of Manningham and Crabtree. It's worth noting that Hawkins was unemployed until a Chargers player got injured. I hope you weren't expecting a guy who could barely land a job on the other 31 teams to contribute as a legitimate #2 or 3.

BJ Daniels. If Daniels were to see the field for the 49ers, that would mean that our season is a total wash. Both Kaepernick and McCoy would have to be injured or totally ineffective. The SAME GOES FOR SEATTLE. If Daniels is playing for Seattle, they're in a sh!tload of trouble. The 49ers hoped to keep him and develop him. They had to take a risk. Was Skelton worth the risk? I have to say I'm not sold that he is. I'm not seeing the improvement with that one. Either way, losing Daniels to the Seahawks is not an impact transaction. It will not directly add to the Seahawks win total and it's not like we were robbed of QB who was going to lead us to any victories.

No matter how you package it or how many ways you spin it. The bottom line is that we have not lost any players (with the transactions discussed) that will keep us from the playoffs. It's very unlikely that any of them would've touched the field this season or next.

Remember, Rascal - this is still a great team we're talking about here. This is not the Jaguars.

And stop crowning Seattle already. Unlike most other 49er fans, I don't think about them much and they don't get under my skin at all. People around the WZ seem to think they're untouchable. Yea they're damn good, but they're beatable.

Seriously dude. Your reactions suggest that we traded Patrick Willis for Hakeem Nicks or something (heh...there was a guy who suggested this for real).


OK, I disagree.

In my opinion, as much as I hate to admit, the Seahawks will go to the Super Bowl. The 9ers is not a bad team per se, but is just not good enough to compete for the top spot. If I am not wrong, the Seahawks have not lost a single regular season game ever since they beat the Bears on the road last year, that is 12 games in a row. That means something. And if you are talking about head-to-head match-up, that's even worse, they didn't just beat us, they beat us down, not just once but twice, there is just no other way to say it. I feel Kap is intimidated when he plays them. If we lose the December game at home, there will be no more excuse from us, but to crown the Seahawks as the new King Of NFC West.

Once again, I would be esctatic if I am wrong, but if I have to be totally honest with you and be truthful of how I look at the current situation, that is just how I feel.
Originally posted by Rascal:
Originally posted by sspiker:
So.... are you giving up being a fan? I don't understand what you think your recourse is here.


It is not about recourse, there is nothing we can do about it as fans. But, as a fan, I have to voice out my massive disappointment with the moves and not just because we lost a third string QB to the Seahawks as some have claimed. I am referring to the string of moves we have made since this offseason.

Am I giving up ? Close to, until I see some properly well-thought out moves by the organization.

In any case, as far as this season is concerned, I am not expecting much anyway based on how things have transpired. So far, in short it has been marred by injuries that we failed to plan for, inept coaching and bad front office moves. Whether we like it or not, the Seahawks have done a far better job, their team is finally coming together and well on their way in moving into their prime and on the edge of peaking. BJ is a great pick-up from their part, so job well done there. We will definitely lose the NFC West to the Seahawks without a question. I also believe we will lose to the Seahawks at home in December, should it happen it will confirm my opinion since last December's blowout they have surpassed us.

Once again, I have to say I hope I am wrong and I welcome the idea of me being dead wrong given my support for the 9ers. It is almost painful to be right sometimes, that is how frustrating it is. Give you a quick example, yesterday, I said we better be prepared cos the Seahawks will probably claim BJ. Needless to say, I was told I was wrong and no way would that happen as most teams' rosters will be pretty much settled. So, here we are, BJ bound for Seattle. Frankly, it is common sense, Pete Carroll already made it known they wanted BJ, but was preempted by the 9ers in the draft. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to work it out they will try to claim him.

Are you f**king kidding me? The team is 2-2 and coming off of back-to-back deep-playoff years, and you're GIVING UP? Were you alive during the Erickson/Nolan/Singletary eras or did you just hop on the bandwagon?*

Rascal... I'm apologize, but you're coming off as a sorry excuse for a fan. I'm kind of embarrassed for you. Gain some perspective man. You treat every front office move like its life or death. You need to stop being so dramatic (like the rest of the butthurt crew in here) and realize that Nate Davis 2.0 isn't worth this much whining.

Why don't you get mad at Baalke for the receiver mess some more? That at least holds some water... not a lot, but some.




That's a rhetorical question by the way... I know you're not 7 years old.
Originally posted by trellblaze:
Originally posted by Rascal:
Absolutely not.

I ask because your reaction to these moves would seem more appropriate if it were 2009 - you know....when we had put together a string of...hell I don't even know what to call what we were back then because "bad" just doesn't cut it. Even then, a fan is a fan no matter what but at least what you're saying would make some sense in that era.

Look man, just take a breath and think this through.

Cam Johnson had ONE...not several - ONE monster game. It occurred in the preseason. You could argue that he had a big upside and that we wasted a pick on him or what not but the truth is you don't expect every single draft pick to make the team. No one does. Looking at our current LB position, even with Smith and Willis out we do not need Cam Johnson. He would still be on the bench. As far as young defenders that will be developed, we have Cory Lemonier and Tank Carradine (I know Tank is a DL and not a LB). At the LB position we currently have Patrick Willis, Navarro Bowman, Ahmad Brooks, Cory Lemonier, Dan Skuta, Mike Wilhoite, and Nate Stupar. Almost all of these guys have outperformed Cam Johnson thus far (4 games played and 1 tackle).

Lavelle Hawkins has played 6 years and his biggest game came in - yes...a 49ers preseason game. Although we're quite weak at the WR position as it stands, Hawkins did not help his case with multiple penalties. He had some big plays, yes, but again, you have to know that preseason is not a direct translation to regular season. That said, I'll concede this much to you: Hawkins didn't look any worse than some of the guys we kept. However, you could argue that Jon Baldwin was expected from the start to get a bigger role eventually. He was 1 month behind in the playbook so there's no way it was going to happen early. Still, if the 49ers knew that they would eventually work him into the lineup, cutting Hawkins makes a little more sense. The team - for whatever reason...maybe experience - is sold on Kyle Williams so he wasn't going anywhere. Marlon Moore was initially brought in for special teams. Currently, this group suck a$$ but that will change drastically with the return of Manningham and Crabtree. It's worth noting that Hawkins was unemployed until a Chargers player got injured. I hope you weren't expecting a guy who could barely land a job on the other 31 teams to contribute as a legitimate #2 or 3.

BJ Daniels. If Daniels were to see the field for the 49ers, that would mean that our season is a total wash. Both Kaepernick and McCoy would have to be injured or totally ineffective. The SAME GOES FOR SEATTLE. If Daniels is playing for Seattle, they're in a sh!tload of trouble. The 49ers hoped to keep him and develop him. They had to take a risk. Was Skelton worth the risk? I have to say I'm not sold that he is. I'm not seeing the improvement with that one. Either way, losing Daniels to the Seahawks is not an impact transaction. It will not directly add to the Seahawks win total and it's not like we were robbed of QB who was going to lead us to any victories.

No matter how you package it or how many ways you spin it. The bottom line is that we have not lost any players (with the transactions discussed) that will keep us from the playoffs. It's very unlikely that any of them would've touched the field this season or next.

Remember, Rascal - this is still a great team we're talking about here. This is not the Jaguars.

And stop crowning Seattle already. Unlike most other 49er fans, I don't think about them much and they don't get under my skin at all. People around the WZ seem to think they're untouchable. Yea they're damn good, but they're beatable.

Seriously dude. Your reactions suggest that we traded Patrick Willis for Hakeem Nicks or something (heh...there was a guy who suggested this for real).

Look at this pile of logic.

And seriously Rascal, stop crowning the Seahawks. They could easily be 2-2. Don't worry about January in October. Anything could happen... Beast Mode or Russell Wilson could get injured. They could hit a slump. Another team could knock them out of the playoffs anyway.

It's a long damn season. Have a beer and be happy the ship is pointed in the right direction, instead of wherever it was pointed under Erickson/Nolan/Singletary.