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Receivers

  • Buchy
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 1,044
Baldwin needs to learn the playbook, I think that's the only reason we haven't seen him yet.
  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 12,899
Originally posted by Forkenick:
I don't understand why the FO let go of Hawkins who was making plays for us, and kept the inept Kyle Williams. PR move?

If PR move stands for public relations move, I do not understand the idea.

How does cutting Hawkins and keeping Williams help public relations?
Originally posted by buck:
If you were talking about only Baldwin, the claim that we never utilize our players makes no sense whatsoever. You should choose your words with more care.

Your complaint is that Harbaugh did not use Baldwin in the first three games, correct.

I am willing to bet that Baldwin is active for the next game. I am hoping that he plays well and becomes an integral part of our passing game.

I am not sure Baldwin should have been active for the first three games. He has not been here very long.

We do not know if he had learned the play book. We do not know what he has looked like in practice.

Remember, that there is a red flag that comes with Baldwin, and it seems to be associated with his head.

Andy Reid, who is no dummy, was perfectly willing to trade Baldwin for AJ Jenkins. Reid lost patience with him very quickly.
That does not speak very highly of Baldwin.

If Baldwin is a problematic player, and there are plenty of indications that he is, activating him immediately might have been a mistake.

An immediate activation could have enabled him to think that he has no problems that need fixing.

Making him earn his place on the active roster on the other hand sends a good message. Here is the message that may have been intended.

We do not really care what happened in KC or in college. We were willing to trade for you. We care about what you do here in SF.

If you show us that you have the drive and skills, you will play here, but you have to earn it with us.

Now, the fact of the matter is we do not know much about what has transpired between the coaching staff and Baldwin.

If you, and others, want to make the assumption that Harbaugh made a mistake in his dealing with Baldwin, go for it.

It just seems more than a bit premature to me.


No, is not just Baldwin, it was Brandon Jacobs as well as AJ Jenkins as some have pointed out (although not me personally as I felt I had already seen enough).

But, let's focus on Baldwin here for the purpose of this discussion, first off, the playbook argument is weak or even simply invalid.

Why ? Does one need to know the entire 785 pages of the playbook before one can play ? No.

Can a player be utilized on certain packages for certain specific situations say by learning 10 plays to begin with ? Yes.

And by the way, this is not something that I invented cos many teams do it. If not, how the hell can Trenton Richardson be traded and played in an away game within a matter of days ? Do you mean to tell me he had already learnt the entire playbook within 3 days ? Does he have a photographic memory ?? Surely not, right ?

And to add, Jon Baldwin is from the 2011 draft class while Richardson is from the 2012 draft class, in other words he has even more real game experience than Richardson. So, are you saying he can't even handle memorizing only a handful of plays not to mention he already possesses a healthy base knowledge from the West Coast Offense carry-over from the Chiefs ?

As for "earning your spot", well do you think Richardson had already "earned" his starting spot before the game when he was immediately named a starter by Chuck Pagano at the trade press conference ? He has been to what ? May be a couple of Colts practices ? Oh and they already had Ahmad Bradshaw, a guy who gashed us twice when he was with the Giants and is still gashing us now as evident on last Sunday's game. But, yes they still decided to play Richardson right away cos they believed he could contribute.

Baldwin has already been with the 9ers for at least 5 weeks ? Has any of his so-called "red flags" resurfaced thus far ? I haven't heard anything, have you ?

Then you look at how the current receiving corps has been playing, KW's performance has been very so so or even subpar in the eyes of some. What do you do then ? You rotate and try out others. Actually, Badlwin is the ONLY receiver we have left on the 53 who is yet to play a game. It is not like we have a truckload of options to go to.

I am not the only person on earth who is asking to try out Baldwin. There are many posters here who are asking the same. Heck, even the media is asking the same question.

Just try him out, at least see what he can bring. If he plays well let him continue, if not take him out and give him a bit more time in practice that's all. What's wrong with that ? Nothing.
  • Ether
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 1,503
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by Forkenick:
I don't understand why the FO let go of Hawkins who was making plays for us, and kept the inept Kyle Williams. PR move?

If PR move stands for public relations move, I do not understand the idea.

How does cutting Hawkins and keeping Williams help public relations?

Oh you know, the whole "We stick by our players through thick and thin."

As we trade our 20-5-1 QB.
Originally posted by wailers15:
I love how people here are excited about Baldwin. He hasn't shown us enough. Let's be patient... my gut says bust.


Is not about being excited about Baldwin, he is the last WR we have on the 53 who hasn't played a single game. We have to see what he's got cos our current receiving corps especially KW are not exactly smoking our opponents.

If you don't play him you will never know whether he is any good or a bust as you have suggested.
Originally posted by mayo49:
If our receivers can't get separation at least try one that can a least out jump the corner.


Exactly buddy !!

He doesn't need to know the entire playbook to play, we can try him out with certain packages in certain specific situations such as red zone plays for some jump balls as you have suggested.
Originally posted by sfout:
I'd trade a second for him. We're going to get KC's 2nd rounder at this rate so why not.

As we all know the 2012 draft picks was a disaster... LMJ has been crying out for playing time, why not trade him and a 5th Rounder to the Browns for Gordon? They do need a RB.
Originally posted by Ether:
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by Forkenick:
I don't understand why the FO let go of Hawkins who was making plays for us, and kept the inept Kyle Williams. PR move?

If PR move stands for public relations move, I do not understand the idea.

How does cutting Hawkins and keeping Williams help public relations?

Oh you know, the whole "We stick by our players through thick and thin."

As we trade our 20-5-1 QB.

Alex could have stayed but he didn't want a paycut to be a backup and he wanted to start. No one blames him so the team accomodated him by working out a deal beneficial to both parties
Originally posted by Ether:
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by Forkenick:
I don't understand why the FO let go of Hawkins who was making plays for us, and kept the inept Kyle Williams. PR move?

If PR move stands for public relations move, I do not understand the idea.

How does cutting Hawkins and keeping Williams help public relations?

Oh you know, the whole "We stick by our players through thick and thin."

As we trade our 20-5-1 QB.


I doubt it was about PR. I think Harbaugh probably blackmarked him after the 2 penalties in that preseason game. The guy already apologized and it still wasn't good enough. Remember, Harbaugh only likes "yes man" types. You can't even talk to him about playing time cos he will put that against you. Frank is the man as he has nothing much to lose so he spoke out about the playcalling debacle, that was why he gave Harbaugh a few "choice words".
Originally posted by 49ersOnMINE:
Originally posted by sfout:
I'd trade a second for him. We're going to get KC's 2nd rounder at this rate so why not.

As we all know the 2012 draft picks was a disaster... LMJ has been crying out for playing time, why not trade him and a 5th Rounder to the Browns for Gordon? They do need a RB.


Not a bad idea, I have always wanted to unload LMJ. He was just a bad RB pick, plus we could really use a speed WR who can play the deep ball to get our O going again.
Activate Baldwin and LMJ.....this team right now needs a spark from somewhere! If the coaching staff intends to keep doing what we're doing, we will be doomed. Can't afford to wait for players to come back from IR when they may not make an impact right away anyway.
Originally posted by Baldie:
Activate Baldwin and LMJ.....this team right now needs a spark from somewhere! If the coaching staff intends to keep doing what we're doing, we will be doomed. Can't afford to wait for players to come back from IR when they may not make an impact right away anyway.

LMJ should be activated just for KR duties as lord knows we need a spark there.
Would be very surprised if Baldwin isn't activated on Thursday - in fact, was surprised he wasn't activated last Sunday with Vernon not playing. But they activated Owen Marecic instead who didn't play a down and wasn't even in on special teams. Ughh.
Originally posted by olapac:
Originally posted by Baldie:
Activate Baldwin and LMJ.....this team right now needs a spark from somewhere! If the coaching staff intends to keep doing what we're doing, we will be doomed. Can't afford to wait for players to come back from IR when they may not make an impact right away anyway.

LMJ should be activated just for KR duties as lord knows we need a spark there.
Would be very surprised if Baldwin isn't activated on Thursday - in fact, was surprised he wasn't activated last Sunday with Vernon not playing. But they activated Owen Marecic instead who didn't play a down and wasn't even in on special teams. Ughh.


If you think LMJ can provide a spark at KR, then good luck. He doesn't have it. We will have a better chance if we sign back Hawkins.

But, playing Baldwin is a must. He might not be a burner, but he can play the intermediate routes together with Anquan and has the size and strength to bang the DBs and linebackers. Patton and KW were getting killed in the middle in previous games. Once they can't cover both Baldwin and Anquan at the same time, you send a couple of speed guys like Moore or Patton downfield to stretch the D with a couple of deep balls from Kap. That way we might have a chance to restart our O cos right now the opposing D are playing a condensed field. Teams are stuffing the box to stop the run and they know our receivers can't get off the line to go deep, so they take their chances of shutting out all the slot passes. Once we can get our passing game going, it will be far easier to run the ball or unless their D-line can't stop our run we will just pound it to open up the passing game. One other thing, Baldwin will be key for red zone plays. If we can stack Anquan, Vance and Jon in the end zone and get Kap to throw up a few high fades for some jump balls, we should be pretty hard to stop.
Originally posted by Rascal:
Originally posted by olapac:
Originally posted by Baldie:
Activate Baldwin and LMJ.....this team right now needs a spark from somewhere! If the coaching staff intends to keep doing what we're doing, we will be doomed. Can't afford to wait for players to come back from IR when they may not make an impact right away anyway.

LMJ should be activated just for KR duties as lord knows we need a spark there.
Would be very surprised if Baldwin isn't activated on Thursday - in fact, was surprised he wasn't activated last Sunday with Vernon not playing. But they activated Owen Marecic instead who didn't play a down and wasn't even in on special teams. Ughh.


If you think LMJ can provide a spark at KR, then good luck. He doesn't have it. We will have a better chance if we sign back Hawkins.

But, playing Baldwin is a must. He might not be a burner, but he can play the intermediate routes together with Anquan and has the size and strength to bang the DBs and linebackers. Patton and KW were getting killed in the middle in previous games. Once they can't cover both Baldwin and Anquan at the same time, you send a couple of speed guys like Moore or Patton downfield to stretch the D with a couple of deep balls from Kap. That way we might have a chance to restart our O cos right now the opposing D are playing a condensed field. Teams are stuffing the box to stop the run and they know our receivers can't get off the line to go deep, so they take their chances of shutting out all the slot passes. Once we can get our passing game going, it will be far easier to run the ball or unless their D-line can't stop our run we will just pound it to open up the passing game. One other thing, Baldwin will be key for red zone plays. If we can stack Anquan, Vance and Jon in the end zone and get Kap to throw up a few high fades for some jump balls, we should be pretty hard to stop.

Why is everyone hating on his return skills? He avg. almost 30 yrds per return last year. And he had a big one in the New England game when momentum was on their side and they tied it up. His return put us into Patriot territory and Crabtree scored the next play. We have to get the ball in our playmakers hands and he's one of the few we have.

Baldwin has to play, but my concern is this: If he's open, will Kap throw him the ball? I'm getting the impression that Kap won't throw it unless he's comfortable with the WR and the 4th game of the season (when you're 1-2 and scored 10 points over 2 games) isn't the time to be building camaraderie and getting in sync.
[ Edited by olapac on Sep 24, 2013 at 7:36 AM ]
Originally posted by olapac:
Why is everyone hating on his return skills? He avg. almost 30 yrds per return last year. And he had a big one in the New England game when momentum was on their side and they tied it up. His return put us into Patriot territory and Crabtree scored the next play. We have to get the ball in our playmakers hands and he's one of the few we have.

Baldwin has to play, but my concern is this: If he's open, will Kap throw him the ball? I'm getting the impression that Kap won't throw it unless he's comfortable with the WR and the 4th game of the season (when you're 1-2 and scored 10 points over 2 games) isn't the time to be building camaraderie and getting in sync.


Not hating and is also not just on his return skills neither. To me, he is just too small, not particularly fast, lacks power, explosiveness and easy to bring down. If it were up to me, I wouldn't have drafted him, but that's just me.

As to whether Kap would throw to Baldwin, well guess what ? I think at this point Kap would jump at the chance to throw to anyone who can compete for the ball. Baldwin has the size even if he is covered especially for jump balls. Kap just can't key in on Anquan cos teams know better to double-team him now. That's why I said he can help to dilute the coverage on both Anquan and himself. If we can accomplish that, Moore and Patton can help us stretch the field.