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good post
Originally posted by SaksV:
Originally posted by jcashen87:
What gets me with the coaching is the lack of willingness to let a young player/rookie/newly signed player, play his way into being good in games. Like Patton and Moore, we barely played them at all so far. Same with kendall hunter. I mean if we are going to act like we will just rely on talents like VD and Gore and Boldin to make it happen for us, we will get found out real quick. Im kind of tired of the red shirt thing honestly. Lets see what we got with some of these guys, especially WR's.

I re-watched the game and Patton/Moore actually played some significant snaps. They just didn't produce. It APPEARS as if we didn't "use" them but in reality, we couldn't get them the ball because of pressure, missed blocking assignments, Kaep mis-reading coverages or them not being able to break Man coverage. There was a series in the 3rd quarter which Patton played almost every snap...I was waiting to see if he'd provide some kind of spark but those DBs manhandled all of our receivers.

Someone posted the snap counts and i think moore had 14 and patton like 10 or 11 or something. I dont just mean the SEA game either, or just these players. But sometimes promising guys can really learn through trial by fire. I feel like we move new guys along sometimes too slow. It seems to work with all this talent we have now, but as the cap stays flat and we lose some key pieces i would love to see more guys brought along like eric reid. Our Receiving core certainly needs a shot of life somehow.
Originally posted by jcashen87:
Originally posted by SaksV:
Originally posted by jcashen87:
What gets me with the coaching is the lack of willingness to let a young player/rookie/newly signed player, play his way into being good in games. Like Patton and Moore, we barely played them at all so far. Same with kendall hunter. I mean if we are going to act like we will just rely on talents like VD and Gore and Boldin to make it happen for us, we will get found out real quick. Im kind of tired of the red shirt thing honestly. Lets see what we got with some of these guys, especially WR's.

I re-watched the game and Patton/Moore actually played some significant snaps. They just didn't produce. It APPEARS as if we didn't "use" them but in reality, we couldn't get them the ball because of pressure, missed blocking assignments, Kaep mis-reading coverages or them not being able to break Man coverage. There was a series in the 3rd quarter which Patton played almost every snap...I was waiting to see if he'd provide some kind of spark but those DBs manhandled all of our receivers.

Someone posted the snap counts and i think moore had 14 and patton like 10 or 11 or something. I dont just mean the SEA game either, or just these players. But sometimes promising guys can really learn through trial by fire. I feel like we move new guys along sometimes too slow. It seems to work with all this talent we have now, but as the cap stays flat and we lose some key pieces i would love to see more guys brought along like eric reid. Our Receiving core certainly needs a shot of life somehow.

I saw Patton and Moore a couple of times and I agree, they really couldn't get anything going. I don't think much could've been expected considering they were going against the best secondary in the league. Now the Kendall Hunter thing is mystifying unless they feared him getting injured. In that case, I actually understand lol.
Originally posted by 9erempire:
I have to agree. We need to immediately ditch the Pistol and get back to the WCO. Run plays under center. It's not working anymore. People have to remember last year we brought out the Pistol in the playoffs. It's not going to work anymore. The NFL is a very progressive league.

We were much better under center.
Ya know, with the Pistol allowing Kaep to show off and be"Jordan"-like is definitely a reason people could overlook our standard WCO and think Kaep can put the team on his back and run away from our problems. I agree with you 100% now that I'm thinking about it cause we're successful when we run fundamental offense and defense, not when we have a one-man show.

It was so hard to realize during the SEA game that Kaep was being depended upon FAR too much, I was over here thinking mental breakdown and just "one of those games" (which it was), but I don't see us losing if we stuck with the run game.

If you guys noticed, last year, and even the couple years prior to then, we'd establish the run first and we'd get occasional 3 and outs, and this was something I personally didn't like (the idea of running TOO much) when we've got a marksman behind center. Then I start to realize how detrimental things can be if we get too fancy and have Kaep start running around like he's in a circus, let alone, against this SEA team that we know doesn't mess around. So this loss certainly was a wake up call, and though like many of you I don't like losing period, and that disgust grows more with the Hawks, I'll take a learning experience seeing as though it's only week 2 and we get a rematch closer to the end of regular season, which is where everything (as far as playcalling) is settled and we're winning the way we should. And we're at Home.

Ground and pound, it's our recipe for winning games and won't throw us into a frenzy if a team stops it.
Most of Kaep's brilliant games come through PA plays anyways soooo....
Week 2 fellas, week 2.
[ Edited by rEspEctdA49ers on Sep 17, 2013 at 2:50 PM ]
Originally posted by NickSh49:
It had nothing to do with any of this "personal" BS.

The team can't hear the playcalls, audibles, & adjustments at the line in Seattle. It isn't complicated.

this
basics*
Originally posted by xtm059:
Originally posted by NickSh49:
It had nothing to do with any of this "personal" BS.

The team can't hear the playcalls, audibles, & adjustments at the line in Seattle. It isn't complicated.

this
That is it, but it isn't all of it. We've beaten them before. We've beaten them in Seattle. Even in the Harbaugh era.
Look guys, maybe, just maybe...

Seattle will be one of those teams that will have our number for the next 10 years.. It happens in football.. back in the 80's, we couldn't beat Elway and Denver...

The Rams couldn't beat us in their own stadium at ANAHEIM..

In the 90s, we couldn't beat neither the Majik man, or Brett Favre and that Holmgrem Packers..

the Saints for instance, could never get above us w/ the great defense that hey had.. remember, the DOME PATROL was being run by Fangio back in the 80s..

Maybe, just maybe, Harbaugh is just trying to beat Petey SOOOOOOOOO MUCHHHHHH that it takes away his knowledge in coaching each time we play Seattle..

Maybe, just maybe, their QB (Russell Wilson) who to me has some of that "Joe Coolness" in him that he'll just find a way to beat us 80% of the time..

Lets just hope that no matter how Seattle has our number, that we can win more Super Bowl here...

As for Kap, he needs to stop changing plays... it was his audible (from running Gore between the tackles, TO calling Crabb's number) that cost us the win against Baltimore when we had 4 chances to score..

Sometimes, being Alex Smith is better for the team..
This is retarded, Seattle will always have the advantage at home. They are beatable anywhere else, the win was not that impressive we gave them the game on a platter with all the penalties... 3rd and 28, seriously?

Sunday cant get here soon enough so these chicken littles will finally STFU.
Here is evidence that Kaepernick and our current personnel can ABSOLUTELY run the WCO. Remember Kaep's first start last year against the Bears? We ran the exact offense we had been running with Smith. Kaep just looked like a faster, stronger-armed version of Smith. It was beautiful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTTQiLI9n-o - First half
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHsl2UFMP7E - Second half

Kaep is under center, at the line making pre-snap reads, adjusting to the defense. We were running counters, traps, pulling sweeps, and a crazy number of different formations. The pass plays were 3 step drops - slants, curls, screens to RB's and quick hits to the TE's. The play action pass was there ALL NIGHT. Sure, there were some 3 and outs, and that happens with a smash-mouth style team. But we have the defense to make stops. Control the clock, win the field position battle, play conservative offense, and pick your spots for a big play here or there. It isn't flashy, but it WINS FOOTBALL GAMES.

As soon as Harbaugh quits being an arrogant douche, and gets back to what made this team great, we'll be great again.
We are going to have to figure out a running game or this team won't win much this year.
The coaches will go and try to figure out what they need to figure out.

As for the players, I think they need to hold a closed door players only meeting to make sure the negativity doesn't carry into the Colts game and beyond.

The effect of this huge loss is not a joke. I can see the hangover linger on for an extended period of time if it is not dealt with now.
  • mayo49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 21,082
The team is still trying to get in sync. This is only their third game of playing a full game together. We'll show improvement as the weeks progress, we should be fine.
Originally posted by 9erempire:
Originally posted by jdt84_2:
why won't the pistol work anymore?

We can't run out of it the last two games. It's not fooling anyone. We need to much more of a traditional team WCO.

Just so you know, the WCO offense doesn't make use of I-formation, or shotgun, it is primarily a split back look. I think thought, you are on to a kernel of truth, we need to shorten up some of these pass patterns, and utilize more "21" personnel looks. A core concept of WCO (I prefer to say Bill Walsh) is to spread the field horizontally rather than vertically, utilizing the backs as pass catchers. Another concept is beating blitzs with hot reads rather than protection, like Seattle did when we blitzed Dial in the 4th quarter. I like the pistol, and it gives the offense a new look, and put pressure on defenses, but balance is the key word.

I wonder if Mangini, is behind the changes, it is his job to scout tendencies, and we have been predictable, but unstoppable. Now we are less predictable, but we seem to be more stoppable! I attribute this loss to growing pains, we are an offense in flux, moving from a steady plodding, safe Alex Smith lead team to a more dynamic risk taking CK lead team. The coaching staff doesn't look entirely sure of the new look and feel of the team.
[ Edited by GolittaCamper on Sep 18, 2013 at 6:50 AM ]
Originally posted by Furlow:
Here is evidence that Kaepernick and our current personnel can ABSOLUTELY run the WCO. Remember Kaep's first start last year against the Bears? We ran the exact offense we had been running with Smith. Kaep just looked like a faster, stronger-armed version of Smith. It was beautiful.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pTTQiLI9n-o - First half
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UHsl2UFMP7E - Second half

Kaep is under center, at the line making pre-snap reads, adjusting to the defense. We were running counters, traps, pulling sweeps, and a crazy number of different formations. The pass plays were 3 step drops - slants, curls, screens to RB's and quick hits to the TE's. The play action pass was there ALL NIGHT. Sure, there were some 3 and outs, and that happens with a smash-mouth style team. But we have the defense to make stops. Control the clock, win the field position battle, play conservative offense, and pick your spots for a big play here or there. It isn't flashy, but it WINS FOOTBALL GAMES.

As soon as Harbaugh quits being an arrogant douche, and gets back to what made this team great, we'll be great again.

Because of the crowd noise the coaching staff abandoned a big chunk of the play book, and shorted the pre-snap adjustments. We tried to gameplan for noise, and we failed. We will not look like that again all season. That was a one off poor performance, by the coaching staff. I feel it was a bad gameplan, poorly executed in a very hostile environment. It was also growing pains, as the coaches try to optimize Kaeps potential, it will be fine, this is a great team, and it will show it's self next week, I almost feel sorry for the Colts....almost.