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The "We can't think of a good name for the Jon Baldwin thread" thread

Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
Who is Jon Baldwin?

He is a guy that enjoyed a fair amount of success playing with a pair of BAD quarterbacks on another team yet cannot even see the field here, even when the team was desperate for wide receivers.

How John Morton keeps his job as wide receivers coach on this staff is puzzling to me. Other good passing teams bring up rookies that were undrafted or late round picks and make good use of them but this team can't seem to get any play at all out of a number of receivers that have been here since Morton arrived. I cannot put that all on Baldwin's "personality" or that others are just that bad. Harbaugh couldn't find a place on the roster for Doug Baldwin but he went on to Seattle and contributed to to 49er losses. Something is wrong here.

41/579/2. In two years.

saying we can't develop WR's is fair but give me a break. Baldwin did nothing in KC and that's why they gave him away. He's their Jenkins: a dude who just didn't pan out.
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
Who is Jon Baldwin?

He is a guy that enjoyed a fair amount of success playing with a pair of BAD quarterbacks on another team yet cannot even see the field here, even when the team was desperate for wide receivers.

How John Morton keeps his job as wide receivers coach on this staff is puzzling to me. Other good passing teams bring up rookies that were undrafted or late round picks and make good use of them but this team can't seem to get any play at all out of a number of receivers that have been here since Morton arrived. I cannot put that all on Baldwin's "personality" or that others are just that bad. Harbaugh couldn't find a place on the roster for Doug Baldwin but he went on to Seattle and contributed to two 49er losses. Something is wrong here.

Good point. This is one area in the coaching staff that needs a huge upgrade IMO.

That being said, I would hardly say Baldwin had a fair amount of success in KC, dude was still a bonafide bust there; KC fans said his attitude and work ethic was poor and that he was lazy. They were pretty happy to get rid of him.
[ Edited by NeonNiner on Jan 3, 2014 at 9:10 AM ]
  • dj43
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Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
Who is Jon Baldwin?

He is a guy that enjoyed a fair amount of success playing with a pair of BAD quarterbacks on another team yet cannot even see the field here, even when the team was desperate for wide receivers.

How John Morton keeps his job as wide receivers coach on this staff is puzzling to me. Other good passing teams bring up rookies that were undrafted or late round picks and make good use of them but this team can't seem to get any play at all out of a number of receivers that have been here since Morton arrived. I cannot put that all on Baldwin's "personality" or that others are just that bad. Harbaugh couldn't find a place on the roster for Doug Baldwin but he went on to Seattle and contributed to to 49er losses. Something is wrong here.

41/579/2. In two years.

saying we can't develop WR's is fair but give me a break. Baldwin did nothing in KC and that's why they gave him away. He's their Jenkins: a dude who just didn't pan out.
I don't know what the problem is with Baldwin but he did more than "nothing" in KC. Bowe was their main guy and Baldwin did manage to make some plays. He was a disappointment as a high pick but if you look at him as a 3rd round pick you would not see him as a bust.

In any case, my main point is that the 49ers have not done a good job developing wide outs here. Look at the results: Crabtree, though admittedly losing time while injured, took 3 years to become more than just another guy. Boldin doesn't count as he is a rent-a-player at this point - very good but the staff can take no credit for "developing" him. From there the list of WRs that have been in camp or on the roster but never doing anything in games is long. As I look around the league, teams like the Seahawks, Indy and others have lost key receivers but brought up other guys who have done well.

I recognize that Kaepernick is not yet an accomplished passing QB but even when Alex Smith was here the team did not seem to be able to get more than 2 or 3 receivers into the game. Smith, OTOH, has gone on to KC where he commonly throws the ball to 7-8 different receivers every game.

My point is that the staff is partially responsible for lack of production of WRs.
Originally posted by dj43:
I don't know what the problem is with Baldwin but he did more than "nothing" in KC. Bowe was their main guy and Baldwin did manage to make some plays. He was a disappointment as a high pick but if you look at him as a 3rd round pick you would not see him as a bust.

In any case, my main point is that the 49ers have not done a good job developing wide outs here. Look at the results: Crabtree, though admittedly losing time while injured, took 3 years to become more than just another guy. Boldin doesn't count as he is a rent-a-player at this point - very good but the staff can take no credit for "developing" him. From there the list of WRs that have been in camp or on the roster but never doing anything in games is long. As I look around the league, teams like the Seahawks, Indy and others have lost key receivers but brought up other guys who have done well.

I recognize that Kaepernick is not yet an accomplished passing QB but even when Alex Smith was here the team did not seem to be able to get more than 2 or 3 receivers into the game. Smith, OTOH, has gone on to KC where he commonly throws the ball to 7-8 different receivers every game.

My point is that the staff is partially responsible for lack of production of WRs.

i agree we have done nothing to develop any young WR's. Baldwin isn't an example of that, though.
  • pd24
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Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
Who is Jon Baldwin?

He is a guy that enjoyed a fair amount of success playing with a pair of BAD quarterbacks on another team yet cannot even see the field here, even when the team was desperate for wide receivers.

How John Morton keeps his job as wide receivers coach on this staff is puzzling to me. Other good passing teams bring up rookies that were undrafted or late round picks and make good use of them but this team can't seem to get any play at all out of a number of receivers that have been here since Morton arrived. I cannot put that all on Baldwin's "personality" or that others are just that bad. Harbaugh couldn't find a place on the roster for Doug Baldwin but he went on to Seattle and contributed to to 49er losses. Something is wrong here.

41/579/2. In two years.

saying we can't develop WR's is fair but give me a break. Baldwin did nothing in KC and that's why they gave him away. He's their Jenkins: a dude who just didn't pan out.
I don't know what the problem is with Baldwin but he did more than "nothing" in KC. Bowe was their main guy and Baldwin did manage to make some plays. He was a disappointment as a high pick but if you look at him as a 3rd round pick you would not see him as a bust.

In any case, my main point is that the 49ers have not done a good job developing wide outs here. Look at the results: Crabtree, though admittedly losing time while injured, took 3 years to become more than just another guy. Boldin doesn't count as he is a rent-a-player at this point - very good but the staff can take no credit for "developing" him. From there the list of WRs that have been in camp or on the roster but never doing anything in games is long. As I look around the league, teams like the Seahawks, Indy and others have lost key receivers but brought up other guys who have done well.

I recognize that Kaepernick is not yet an accomplished passing QB but even when Alex Smith was here the team did not seem to be able to get more than 2 or 3 receivers into the game. Smith, OTOH, has gone on to KC where he commonly throws the ball to 7-8 different receivers every game.

My point is that the staff is partially responsible for lack of production of WRs.
Smith throws to RB's and TE's. Bowe had his worst season as a pro because of his new QB. Smith has the same problem he had when he was here, he won't throw it to WR's and give them a chance and dumps it the the RB and TE instead.
  • dj43
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Originally posted by pd24:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
Who is Jon Baldwin?

He is a guy that enjoyed a fair amount of success playing with a pair of BAD quarterbacks on another team yet cannot even see the field here, even when the team was desperate for wide receivers.

How John Morton keeps his job as wide receivers coach on this staff is puzzling to me. Other good passing teams bring up rookies that were undrafted or late round picks and make good use of them but this team can't seem to get any play at all out of a number of receivers that have been here since Morton arrived. I cannot put that all on Baldwin's "personality" or that others are just that bad. Harbaugh couldn't find a place on the roster for Doug Baldwin but he went on to Seattle and contributed to to 49er losses. Something is wrong here.

41/579/2. In two years.

saying we can't develop WR's is fair but give me a break. Baldwin did nothing in KC and that's why they gave him away. He's their Jenkins: a dude who just didn't pan out.
I don't know what the problem is with Baldwin but he did more than "nothing" in KC. Bowe was their main guy and Baldwin did manage to make some plays. He was a disappointment as a high pick but if you look at him as a 3rd round pick you would not see him as a bust.

In any case, my main point is that the 49ers have not done a good job developing wide outs here. Look at the results: Crabtree, though admittedly losing time while injured, took 3 years to become more than just another guy. Boldin doesn't count as he is a rent-a-player at this point - very good but the staff can take no credit for "developing" him. From there the list of WRs that have been in camp or on the roster but never doing anything in games is long. As I look around the league, teams like the Seahawks, Indy and others have lost key receivers but brought up other guys who have done well.

I recognize that Kaepernick is not yet an accomplished passing QB but even when Alex Smith was here the team did not seem to be able to get more than 2 or 3 receivers into the game. Smith, OTOH, has gone on to KC where he commonly throws the ball to 7-8 different receivers every game.

My point is that the staff is partially responsible for lack of production of WRs.
Smith throws to RB's and TE's. Bowe had his worst season as a pro because of his new QB. Smith has the same problem he had when he was here, he won't throw it to WR's and give them a chance and dumps it the the RB and TE instead.

I won't go into an Alex Smith thread here but Smith never had a RB like Jamaal Charles here. Charles is the best all-purpose back in the NFL. I just read an All Pro team that puts him as the best in the league over Shady McCoy. Bowe, though decent, has had some injuries this year that have limited his effectiveness. Also, even when healthy, he is not the weapon that Charles is. Smith also had good production from McCluster and Avery during the season. As to TEs, KC went through 3 of them in an effort to find a healthy one. Smith never had a reliable TE this season. Also, if you have been following KC this year, Reid began opening up the offense in the past 5 games and Smith pushed it down the field well. To say he WON'T throw it down the field is not supported by actual performance.

It is interesting, and supports my main point, that KC got far more production from #2, #3 and even #4 wide receivers with the "horrible" Alex Smith throwing the ball than did the 49ers with "all world" Colin Kaepernick. That is a staff problem, IMO.
  • pd24
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Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by pd24:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
Who is Jon Baldwin?

He is a guy that enjoyed a fair amount of success playing with a pair of BAD quarterbacks on another team yet cannot even see the field here, even when the team was desperate for wide receivers.

How John Morton keeps his job as wide receivers coach on this staff is puzzling to me. Other good passing teams bring up rookies that were undrafted or late round picks and make good use of them but this team can't seem to get any play at all out of a number of receivers that have been here since Morton arrived. I cannot put that all on Baldwin's "personality" or that others are just that bad. Harbaugh couldn't find a place on the roster for Doug Baldwin but he went on to Seattle and contributed to to 49er losses. Something is wrong here.

41/579/2. In two years.

saying we can't develop WR's is fair but give me a break. Baldwin did nothing in KC and that's why they gave him away. He's their Jenkins: a dude who just didn't pan out.
I don't know what the problem is with Baldwin but he did more than "nothing" in KC. Bowe was their main guy and Baldwin did manage to make some plays. He was a disappointment as a high pick but if you look at him as a 3rd round pick you would not see him as a bust.

In any case, my main point is that the 49ers have not done a good job developing wide outs here. Look at the results: Crabtree, though admittedly losing time while injured, took 3 years to become more than just another guy. Boldin doesn't count as he is a rent-a-player at this point - very good but the staff can take no credit for "developing" him. From there the list of WRs that have been in camp or on the roster but never doing anything in games is long. As I look around the league, teams like the Seahawks, Indy and others have lost key receivers but brought up other guys who have done well.

I recognize that Kaepernick is not yet an accomplished passing QB but even when Alex Smith was here the team did not seem to be able to get more than 2 or 3 receivers into the game. Smith, OTOH, has gone on to KC where he commonly throws the ball to 7-8 different receivers every game.

My point is that the staff is partially responsible for lack of production of WRs.
Smith throws to RB's and TE's. Bowe had his worst season as a pro because of his new QB. Smith has the same problem he had when he was here, he won't throw it to WR's and give them a chance and dumps it the the RB and TE instead.

I won't go into an Alex Smith thread here but Smith never had a RB like Jamaal Charles here. Charles is the best all-purpose back in the NFL. I just read an All Pro team that puts him as the best in the league over Shady McCoy. Bowe, though decent, has had some injuries this year that have limited his effectiveness. Also, even when healthy, he is not the weapon that Charles is. Smith also had good production from McCluster and Avery during the season. As to TEs, KC went through 3 of them in an effort to find a healthy one. Smith never had a reliable TE this season. Also, if you have been following KC this year, Reid began opening up the offense in the past 5 games and Smith pushed it down the field well. To say he WON'T throw it down the field is not supported by actual performance.

It is interesting, and supports my main point, that KC got far more production from #2, #3 and even #4 wide receivers with the "horrible" Alex Smith throwing the ball than did the 49ers with "all world" Colin Kaepernick. That is a staff problem, IMO.

Still throwing it to RB's. McCluster may be listed as a WR but he is was a RB and is used a lot for the backfield. The reason the CHiefs fell off and couldn't beat the Colts at home was due to Smith not passing to WR's. Colin still had a better season even without a #2 WR most of the year.
  • dj43
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Originally posted by pd24:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by pd24:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
Who is Jon Baldwin?

He is a guy that enjoyed a fair amount of success playing with a pair of BAD quarterbacks on another team yet cannot even see the field here, even when the team was desperate for wide receivers.

How John Morton keeps his job as wide receivers coach on this staff is puzzling to me. Other good passing teams bring up rookies that were undrafted or late round picks and make good use of them but this team can't seem to get any play at all out of a number of receivers that have been here since Morton arrived. I cannot put that all on Baldwin's "personality" or that others are just that bad. Harbaugh couldn't find a place on the roster for Doug Baldwin but he went on to Seattle and contributed to to 49er losses. Something is wrong here.

41/579/2. In two years.

saying we can't develop WR's is fair but give me a break. Baldwin did nothing in KC and that's why they gave him away. He's their Jenkins: a dude who just didn't pan out.
I don't know what the problem is with Baldwin but he did more than "nothing" in KC. Bowe was their main guy and Baldwin did manage to make some plays. He was a disappointment as a high pick but if you look at him as a 3rd round pick you would not see him as a bust.

In any case, my main point is that the 49ers have not done a good job developing wide outs here. Look at the results: Crabtree, though admittedly losing time while injured, took 3 years to become more than just another guy. Boldin doesn't count as he is a rent-a-player at this point - very good but the staff can take no credit for "developing" him. From there the list of WRs that have been in camp or on the roster but never doing anything in games is long. As I look around the league, teams like the Seahawks, Indy and others have lost key receivers but brought up other guys who have done well.

I recognize that Kaepernick is not yet an accomplished passing QB but even when Alex Smith was here the team did not seem to be able to get more than 2 or 3 receivers into the game. Smith, OTOH, has gone on to KC where he commonly throws the ball to 7-8 different receivers every game.

My point is that the staff is partially responsible for lack of production of WRs.
Smith throws to RB's and TE's. Bowe had his worst season as a pro because of his new QB. Smith has the same problem he had when he was here, he won't throw it to WR's and give them a chance and dumps it the the RB and TE instead.

I won't go into an Alex Smith thread here but Smith never had a RB like Jamaal Charles here. Charles is the best all-purpose back in the NFL. I just read an All Pro team that puts him as the best in the league over Shady McCoy. Bowe, though decent, has had some injuries this year that have limited his effectiveness. Also, even when healthy, he is not the weapon that Charles is. Smith also had good production from McCluster and Avery during the season. As to TEs, KC went through 3 of them in an effort to find a healthy one. Smith never had a reliable TE this season. Also, if you have been following KC this year, Reid began opening up the offense in the past 5 games and Smith pushed it down the field well. To say he WON'T throw it down the field is not supported by actual performance.

It is interesting, and supports my main point, that KC got far more production from #2, #3 and even #4 wide receivers with the "horrible" Alex Smith throwing the ball than did the 49ers with "all world" Colin Kaepernick. That is a staff problem, IMO.

Still throwing it to RB's. McCluster may be listed as a WR but he is was a RB and is used a lot for the backfield. The reason the CHiefs fell off and couldn't beat the Colts at home was due to Smith not passing to WR's. Colin still had a better season even without a #2 WR most of the year.

Having a good RB to throw to is a STENGTH not a weakness. Pierre Thomas led the league this season in receptions by a RB. Does that mean Brees isn't playing well?

RBs catching the ball out of the backfield is a hallmark of Andy Reid's offense. Brian Westbrook was a perennial Pro Bowler, in large part from playing just the way Charles is now with Smith.

In the opinion of many around here, the fact the 49ers don't have a solid back to throw to out of the backfield is a weakness of this team. When Gore lines up in the I, teams know he will either run it or block. He is NEVER a threat to come out and catch a pass. That makes this team easier to defend.
  • pd24
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Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by pd24:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by pd24:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
Who is Jon Baldwin?

He is a guy that enjoyed a fair amount of success playing with a pair of BAD quarterbacks on another team yet cannot even see the field here, even when the team was desperate for wide receivers.

How John Morton keeps his job as wide receivers coach on this staff is puzzling to me. Other good passing teams bring up rookies that were undrafted or late round picks and make good use of them but this team can't seem to get any play at all out of a number of receivers that have been here since Morton arrived. I cannot put that all on Baldwin's "personality" or that others are just that bad. Harbaugh couldn't find a place on the roster for Doug Baldwin but he went on to Seattle and contributed to to 49er losses. Something is wrong here.

41/579/2. In two years.

saying we can't develop WR's is fair but give me a break. Baldwin did nothing in KC and that's why they gave him away. He's their Jenkins: a dude who just didn't pan out.
I don't know what the problem is with Baldwin but he did more than "nothing" in KC. Bowe was their main guy and Baldwin did manage to make some plays. He was a disappointment as a high pick but if you look at him as a 3rd round pick you would not see him as a bust.

In any case, my main point is that the 49ers have not done a good job developing wide outs here. Look at the results: Crabtree, though admittedly losing time while injured, took 3 years to become more than just another guy. Boldin doesn't count as he is a rent-a-player at this point - very good but the staff can take no credit for "developing" him. From there the list of WRs that have been in camp or on the roster but never doing anything in games is long. As I look around the league, teams like the Seahawks, Indy and others have lost key receivers but brought up other guys who have done well.

I recognize that Kaepernick is not yet an accomplished passing QB but even when Alex Smith was here the team did not seem to be able to get more than 2 or 3 receivers into the game. Smith, OTOH, has gone on to KC where he commonly throws the ball to 7-8 different receivers every game.

My point is that the staff is partially responsible for lack of production of WRs.
Smith throws to RB's and TE's. Bowe had his worst season as a pro because of his new QB. Smith has the same problem he had when he was here, he won't throw it to WR's and give them a chance and dumps it the the RB and TE instead.

I won't go into an Alex Smith thread here but Smith never had a RB like Jamaal Charles here. Charles is the best all-purpose back in the NFL. I just read an All Pro team that puts him as the best in the league over Shady McCoy. Bowe, though decent, has had some injuries this year that have limited his effectiveness. Also, even when healthy, he is not the weapon that Charles is. Smith also had good production from McCluster and Avery during the season. As to TEs, KC went through 3 of them in an effort to find a healthy one. Smith never had a reliable TE this season. Also, if you have been following KC this year, Reid began opening up the offense in the past 5 games and Smith pushed it down the field well. To say he WON'T throw it down the field is not supported by actual performance.

It is interesting, and supports my main point, that KC got far more production from #2, #3 and even #4 wide receivers with the "horrible" Alex Smith throwing the ball than did the 49ers with "all world" Colin Kaepernick. That is a staff problem, IMO.

Still throwing it to RB's. McCluster may be listed as a WR but he is was a RB and is used a lot for the backfield. The reason the CHiefs fell off and couldn't beat the Colts at home was due to Smith not passing to WR's. Colin still had a better season even without a #2 WR most of the year.

Having a good RB to throw to is a STENGTH not a weakness. Pierre Thomas led the league this season in receptions by a RB. Does that mean Brees isn't playing well?

RBs catching the ball out of the backfield is a hallmark of Andy Reid's offense. Brian Westbrook was a perennial Pro Bowler, in large part from playing just the way Charles is now with Smith.

In the opinion of many around here, the fact the 49ers don't have a solid back to throw to out of the backfield is a weakness of this team. When Gore lines up in the I, teams know he will either run it or block. He is NEVER a threat to come out and catch a pass. That makes this team easier to defend.
Thomas wasn't the leading reciever on the team though, it was an all pro TE and Colston was up there with Thomas. Charles was far and away the leading reciever for KC. Smith used to throw to Gore a ton in their early days. Brees uses everyone from WR to TE to RB and there isn't a huge difference in the numbers like in KC.
  • dj43
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Originally posted by pd24:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by pd24:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by pd24:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by fortyninerglory:
Who is Jon Baldwin?

He is a guy that enjoyed a fair amount of success playing with a pair of BAD quarterbacks on another team yet cannot even see the field here, even when the team was desperate for wide receivers.

How John Morton keeps his job as wide receivers coach on this staff is puzzling to me. Other good passing teams bring up rookies that were undrafted or late round picks and make good use of them but this team can't seem to get any play at all out of a number of receivers that have been here since Morton arrived. I cannot put that all on Baldwin's "personality" or that others are just that bad. Harbaugh couldn't find a place on the roster for Doug Baldwin but he went on to Seattle and contributed to to 49er losses. Something is wrong here.

41/579/2. In two years.

saying we can't develop WR's is fair but give me a break. Baldwin did nothing in KC and that's why they gave him away. He's their Jenkins: a dude who just didn't pan out.
I don't know what the problem is with Baldwin but he did more than "nothing" in KC. Bowe was their main guy and Baldwin did manage to make some plays. He was a disappointment as a high pick but if you look at him as a 3rd round pick you would not see him as a bust.

In any case, my main point is that the 49ers have not done a good job developing wide outs here. Look at the results: Crabtree, though admittedly losing time while injured, took 3 years to become more than just another guy. Boldin doesn't count as he is a rent-a-player at this point - very good but the staff can take no credit for "developing" him. From there the list of WRs that have been in camp or on the roster but never doing anything in games is long. As I look around the league, teams like the Seahawks, Indy and others have lost key receivers but brought up other guys who have done well.

I recognize that Kaepernick is not yet an accomplished passing QB but even when Alex Smith was here the team did not seem to be able to get more than 2 or 3 receivers into the game. Smith, OTOH, has gone on to KC where he commonly throws the ball to 7-8 different receivers every game.

My point is that the staff is partially responsible for lack of production of WRs.
Smith throws to RB's and TE's. Bowe had his worst season as a pro because of his new QB. Smith has the same problem he had when he was here, he won't throw it to WR's and give them a chance and dumps it the the RB and TE instead.

I won't go into an Alex Smith thread here but Smith never had a RB like Jamaal Charles here. Charles is the best all-purpose back in the NFL. I just read an All Pro team that puts him as the best in the league over Shady McCoy. Bowe, though decent, has had some injuries this year that have limited his effectiveness. Also, even when healthy, he is not the weapon that Charles is. Smith also had good production from McCluster and Avery during the season. As to TEs, KC went through 3 of them in an effort to find a healthy one. Smith never had a reliable TE this season. Also, if you have been following KC this year, Reid began opening up the offense in the past 5 games and Smith pushed it down the field well. To say he WON'T throw it down the field is not supported by actual performance.

It is interesting, and supports my main point, that KC got far more production from #2, #3 and even #4 wide receivers with the "horrible" Alex Smith throwing the ball than did the 49ers with "all world" Colin Kaepernick. That is a staff problem, IMO.

Still throwing it to RB's. McCluster may be listed as a WR but he is was a RB and is used a lot for the backfield. The reason the CHiefs fell off and couldn't beat the Colts at home was due to Smith not passing to WR's. Colin still had a better season even without a #2 WR most of the year.

Having a good RB to throw to is a STENGTH not a weakness. Pierre Thomas led the league this season in receptions by a RB. Does that mean Brees isn't playing well?

RBs catching the ball out of the backfield is a hallmark of Andy Reid's offense. Brian Westbrook was a perennial Pro Bowler, in large part from playing just the way Charles is now with Smith.

In the opinion of many around here, the fact the 49ers don't have a solid back to throw to out of the backfield is a weakness of this team. When Gore lines up in the I, teams know he will either run it or block. He is NEVER a threat to come out and catch a pass. That makes this team easier to defend.
Thomas wasn't the leading reciever on the team though, it was an all pro TE and Colston was up there with Thomas. Charles was far and away the leading reciever for KC. Smith used to throw to Gore a ton in their early days. Brees uses everyone from WR to TE to RB and there isn't a huge difference in the numbers like in KC.

Well, you just made the case about why Charles is the leading receiver in KC. Thomas caught 77 passes out of the backfield to Charles 70. If KC had a fully healthy Bowe, or someone near the stature of Graham or Colston, you have to believe Smith would throw it to them. Even when healthy, Bowe is not Marques Colston.

Bowe caught two less passes this season (57) but 2 more for TDs. His production overall was roughly the same this year as last. When he was healthy, he made some plays but he was battling injuries a good part of the season. Part of the problem with KC this last season was much the same thing the 49ers had in the NFCCG with NY - only one WR and he was getting double teamed all the time with no competent #2. Hard to throw to a guy in a double team. In KC's case, Charles is the very good alternative to Bowe.

The big difference is that the Andy Reid offense with his own hand-picked QB, takes advantage of the most talented receivers on the team. In this case, that is Jamaal Charles. Smith takes advantage of the talent available, and right now, that is the best all purpose RB in the league.
  • dj43
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Originally posted by pd24:
Thomas wasn't the leading reciever on the team though, it was an all pro TE and Colston was up there with Thomas. Charles was far and away the leading reciever for KC. Smith used to throw to Gore a ton in their early days. Brees uses everyone from WR to TE to RB and there isn't a huge difference in the numbers like in KC.

Why do you think that is?

Perhaps it is scheme. HaRo's offense has never thrown a lot to the backs. Turner did. McCarthy did. Personally I believe the 49er offense would be more potent if the did throw to the backs more. LMJ would be a much more valuable player rather than just another running back. Gore would be more of a threat. They use Miller a little but when they did, it was not with a great deal of deception.
  • pd24
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Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by pd24:
Thomas wasn't the leading reciever on the team though, it was an all pro TE and Colston was up there with Thomas. Charles was far and away the leading reciever for KC. Smith used to throw to Gore a ton in their early days. Brees uses everyone from WR to TE to RB and there isn't a huge difference in the numbers like in KC.

Why do you think that is?

Perhaps it is scheme. HaRo's offense has never thrown a lot to the backs. Turner did. McCarthy did. Personally I believe the 49er offense would be more potent if the did throw to the backs more. LMJ would be a much more valuable player rather than just another running back. Gore would be more of a threat. They use Miller a little but when they did, it was not with a great deal of deception.

He is who he is, he didn't get better this year. SMith is the same guy he was during the NFCCCG VS the Giants. He is still gun shy and it has cost them and it probably will cost them Sunday.
  • dj43
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Originally posted by pd24:
Originally posted by dj43:
Originally posted by pd24:
Thomas wasn't the leading reciever on the team though, it was an all pro TE and Colston was up there with Thomas. Charles was far and away the leading reciever for KC. Smith used to throw to Gore a ton in their early days. Brees uses everyone from WR to TE to RB and there isn't a huge difference in the numbers like in KC.

Why do you think that is?

Perhaps it is scheme. HaRo's offense has never thrown a lot to the backs. Turner did. McCarthy did. Personally I believe the 49er offense would be more potent if the did throw to the backs more. LMJ would be a much more valuable player rather than just another running back. Gore would be more of a threat. They use Miller a little but when they did, it was not with a great deal of deception.

He is who he is, he didn't get better this year. SMith is the same guy he was during the NFCCCG VS the Giants. He is still gun shy and it has cost them and it probably will cost them Sunday.

You continue to ignore the impact of having only a single WR of any consequence and how that impacts an offense that has a very good RB that can catch it and YAC.

So all of this is a long way from Jon Baldwin and now just another Alex Smith discussion. No offense but that bores me. We've had all of that. I still think Baldwin is more useful than what we have seen but likely not with this staff which appears to struggle developing WRs.

I'm out for a while…Golf time.
its funny to use the KC offense as an example of how to better use WR's....when they were the ones who gave up on Jon Baldwin. Lol.
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by dj43:
I don't know what the problem is with Baldwin but he did more than "nothing" in KC. Bowe was their main guy and Baldwin did manage to make some plays. He was a disappointment as a high pick but if you look at him as a 3rd round pick you would not see him as a bust.

In any case, my main point is that the 49ers have not done a good job developing wide outs here. Look at the results: Crabtree, though admittedly losing time while injured, took 3 years to become more than just another guy. Boldin doesn't count as he is a rent-a-player at this point - very good but the staff can take no credit for "developing" him. From there the list of WRs that have been in camp or on the roster but never doing anything in games is long. As I look around the league, teams like the Seahawks, Indy and others have lost key receivers but brought up other guys who have done well.

I recognize that Kaepernick is not yet an accomplished passing QB but even when Alex Smith was here the team did not seem to be able to get more than 2 or 3 receivers into the game. Smith, OTOH, has gone on to KC where he commonly throws the ball to 7-8 different receivers every game.

My point is that the staff is partially responsible for lack of production of WRs.

i agree we have done nothing to develop any young WR's. Baldwin isn't an example of that, though.

Agreed on all fronts.