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(your) Thoughts on the Chiefs games.

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[ Edited by BrianGO on Aug 19, 2013 at 1:20 AM ]
Originally posted by hofer36:
bykowski played at iowa state, which is division 1


OK. For some reason I thought he came from division II. I remember his draft highlights looking like they were from a scouts video camera.
I disagree on the comments on the Smith interception of the pass to Jenkins, Jenkins did not have him beat. He was running right with him stride for stride until Smith broke stride in order to slow down for the under thrown ball. Where as Jenkins did not. McCoy claims that that's what he expected Jenkins to do. Slow and cut underneath Smith for position. What viewers need to consider is the coverage before the ball is released and the defenders reacting to the ball rather than the receiver to judge if there was actual separation. It's sometimes difficult to time the release by the Quarter back with the positions of the receivers at the time of that release or their reaction to any thrown ball. I know in the super bowl and other games where fans have claimed a receiver was open and upon replay it turns out the were actually covered and the separation happened after the ball was released and the defenders reaction to the play not the receiver.
Originally posted by BrianGO:
Originally posted by hofer36:
bykowski played at iowa state, which is division 1


OK. For some reason I thought he came from division II. I remember his draft highlights looking like they were from a scouts video camera.


mcloughan and balke haven't drafted too many non division 1 players..i think they prefer the big time conferences
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Originally posted by hofer36:
Originally posted by BrianGO:
Despite the backup quarterback performances, I watched the O-line and noticed some things:

Snyder played very well at LT, even against the starters.
Looney played very well at LG, even against the starters. The refs gave him a bogus holding call.
Kilgore played pretty good at C. He lacks power, but uses good leverage and can move well. The refs gave him a legit holding call on the Jenkins play.
They put Looney at C later in the game, and he wasn't too great at that position.
Bykowski has talent, but is very inconsistent. He is big, athletic and has good instincts, but he played at a division II school, so he has a long way to go to adjust to the NFL game.

Everybody else is camp fodder.


bykowski played at iowa state, which is division 1

Barely
A few things on your guys comments. Wilhoite was undrafted not a 7th rounder but makes it an even better pickup. When I watched him last year in the pre-season I thought this guy has a chance next year. Looked really good. Did well on ST's last year in limited games and has really picked up his play at LB. Guy should be a lock for #3 IMO. Also, watching Moody guy is in the form of Willis and Bowman. When he blitzed that one play looked like them guys flying. He use to be a safety so he's a little bit smaller and not as strong as those guys but he is very fast. I think we are set with those 2 guys. Very well could have gotten much much younger and could have upgraded at backup ILB. As for Stupar first game didn't look that great but this game really really stepped it up. I think his main thing is can he keep up in coverage? At worst he's a PS guy. As for Bykowski guy has nice height and size but needs to get a lot stronger. I like Marquardt better, bigger and much stronger but he's hurt. Looney I think has good strength but needs to just tighten up a bit. Get in better shape, get stronger and quicker. He's a little bit soft yet.

As for our 2nd string defense I think some of those guys could start on other teams. They did really well against the Chiefs starters. Just wish the 2nd string offense would pick it up. Side note if I am a team with a bad punter I am giving a really good look at Colin Schmidt. Guy can boom it, he can kick off and kick it out of the end zone so makes him even more valuable. Plus he may very well have stopped 2 punt return TD's in 2 games. Guy is very fast for a punter. As for getting Jenkins involved we have had him run on that reverse like 5 times in 2 games and EVERY single one went to the rb up the middle for a yard or two. Also, by getting involved I mean quick throws, slants to get him the ball. We have been playing him on the outside a bunch and don't think we should be he isnt physical and big enough to get separation on press. He is more of a slot guy. Also, I think we should be getting him some catches on short stuff before sending him deep. Get his confidence up because these 2 mid to deep balls lead to 2 ints although both were bad throws by the QB.
[ Edited by Gore_21 on Aug 19, 2013 at 3:03 AM ]
I hope they are are able to stash Bykowski and Marquadt on the PS.
Originally posted by eonblue:
I'm glad we won this one. It was exciting to see the side line in joy over the last minute TD/win. The Chiefs 1st string defense was legit and the last minute TD was a great reward for a prolific defensive display.

The Niners 2nd/3rd string defense dominated the Chiefs starting O. Smith got absolutely no time in the pocket. When he was able to make a throw Nnamdi or Cox usually had pretty good coverage.

Cox gave away two receptions. He was playing zone both times and was slow to react. He was excellent when rushing though. He disguised the blitz very well and was fast to the ball. Two sacks pretty much says it all. He also shed his blockers well and made a couple of tackles on RB Davis. I think he could possibly be a long term option at corner if he progresses at the same rate he has been. He should've gave up three receptions but Baldwin juggled a 3rd down conversion in the 2nd qtr. It may have been because he knew Reid was a couple of yards away. With the angle/space/time Reid had on Baldwin he would've wrecked him. Reid pulled out of the tackle split second when he realized Baldwin dropped the pass. Most guys would have taken the chance to knock the opponents head off. That was kind of all I needed to see on Reid. I think Baalke has picked a future team leader. Reid also had a blitz up the middle that resulted in an incomplete pass on 3rd down in the RZ at the end of the 2nd. Nnamdi is gaining the edge for the #3 spot. He was targeted thrice. Both targets were poor throws but it would've taken perfection to find the receiver. I really couldn't find any flaws in his play. Maybe his coverage on an over thrown ball to Baldwin, but he was tight on Baldwin and he had Spillman over the top. He had one blitz opportunity that resulted in a incomplete pass.

The key to the game on friday was the interior defense. Tukuafu-Dorsey-Dobbs/Jerod-Eddie kept Whilhote-Stupar so clean against the Chiefs starting Oline it was embarrassing. The 2nd strings first snap pretty much sums it up. The Dline controlled the LOS and Stupar went in between some tackles to thump Davis for a 1 yard loss. I'll probably get laughed at for saying this but Stupar looked like he was the 2nd backup ILB. He was kept clean the whole time the 2nd string was out but he was crashing gaps for tackles. He tracked plays and flowed very well behind the Oline. He had a sack off a blitz where the RB picked him up. He brushed him aside and made the play. He also got a PD towards the end of the 3rd.

It really was quite amazing how well the 2nd string Dline/ILB performed. Tukuafu, Dobbs, Jerod Eddie, and Stupar were all undrafted. Whilhote was a 7th round pick. They dominated KCs starting Oline which has 2 1st rounders, 1 3rd, and a couple of 7's. I think a lot of credit should go to Tomsula and Fangio. We really are lucky to have such a strong coaching staff. Dorsey dominated the A gaps. He was getting 2-3 yard of push. There was a play in the 1st where he just swipes the Center away then benched the FB to get a hand on the RB Davis. He didn't get the tackle but that kind of play altering ability is massive. I love his ability to shed blocks. With that being said I think Williams has sealed up the starting spot. He had 9 snaps which is two less than the rest of starting dline. I'm assuming you can lump him in with that group. One snap in particular he was double teamed by the Guard/Center and with each arm he kept both of them off his body to hold is point. He's a pretty strong dude. I still think his pass rushing repertoire is limited though. He has the strength to bull rush but as far as pass rushing moves his technique doesn't seem very refined. This is why I like Dorsey. His outside swat is so smooth and he can bull rush just as well as Williams. I think he's going to have to put up 2 very strong displays to earn the starting job. He probably wont be able to earn the spot until the season starts either.

A couple of short, negative musings.

I don't think Skuta should get the spot over Cam Johnson. He is slow rushing the edge. Fasano blocked him out multiple times. He is able to capitalize on the strong Dline play with a couple of sacks but he really just doesn't impress me from a technique standpoint. I don't think he has much to offer the team because I haven't seen him contribute at all on ST. Maybe I'm overlooking something though.

LMJ is a backups backup. He has excellent north/south speed. My qualm is his leg strength. On two separate plays his feet were clipped by Hali/Poe and he couldn't keep his balance to continue the run. His style of running is a shifty back but he either needs to shake off these would-be missed tackles or just make the dude miss. He's not agile/strong enough to do either. I hope Hunter comes back full strength because I'm starting to feel LMJ is a guy you only put in when a defense is tired. Maybe it was just KCs defense but still he needs to continue progressing which I'm sure he will.

I've remained neutral on Jenkins. I think that cutting a first rounder in his 2nd year is a mark on the FO, and for that reason I would like to see him stay. I've heard some people say we need to feed him more. In the 2nd half there was a 3 down sequence where he was involved in every play. The 1st down the QB was under center he had RB play action with Jenkins on a sweep(I don't know the correct terminology it may be called a triple option). The ball was handed to the RB for a small gain. The 2nd down he was pressed at the line by Sean Smith before he broke outside for about 5 strides and hooked back. He lost his balance and dropped the pass. The 3rd down he was pressed again by Sean Smith but this time broke inside running a corner route. I don't know if he was supposed to hook back again but the QB through the ball right into Smiths hands who was trailing Jenkins. There was a safety over the top so the ball would have had to be thrown perfectly to hit Jenkins but he had a step on Smith. I don't think Jenkins was supposed to hook back. Some people will say that Smith is a very physical corner but the fact is Chad Hall did a better job against him and I believe he's much smaller than Jenkins. It's quite ironic that Jenkins only reception was called back on a Oline holding penalty. I hope the guy keeps going at it though. He shows glimpses of promise but he has to convert. Plain and simple.

eonblue! Love your posts...I did a full evaluation of the non-locks from game 2 as well and many of your comments align with mine (see: post #52).

http://www.49erswebzone.com/forum/niners/174184-winners-losers-preseason-game/page4/
Originally posted by ninergold:
I hope they are are able to stash Bykowski and Marquadt on the PS.

They don't have to stash Marquadt he is already on either on PUP or IR I can't remember which. He will not be activated this season.
Originally posted by willtalk:
Originally posted by ninergold:
I hope they are are able to stash Bykowski and Marquadt on the PS.

They don't have to stash Marquadt he is already on either on PUP or IR I can't remember which. He will not be activated this season.

he was playing this past friday ..i thought i saw his name on jersey ?
[ Edited by 49AllTheTime on Aug 19, 2013 at 12:30 PM ]
Originally posted by Gore_21:
A few things on your guys comments. Wilhoite was undrafted not a 7th rounder but makes it an even better pickup. When I watched him last year in the pre-season I thought this guy has a chance next year. Looked really good. Did well on ST's last year in limited games and has really picked up his play at LB. Guy should be a lock for #3 IMO. Also, watching Moody guy is in the form of Willis and Bowman. When he blitzed that one play looked like them guys flying. He use to be a safety so he's a little bit smaller and not as strong as those guys but he is very fast. I think we are set with those 2 guys. Very well could have gotten much much younger and could have upgraded at backup ILB. As for Stupar first game didn't look that great but this game really really stepped it up. I think his main thing is can he keep up in coverage? At worst he's a PS guy. As for Bykowski guy has nice height and size but needs to get a lot stronger. I like Marquardt better, bigger and much stronger but he's hurt. Looney I think has good strength but needs to just tighten up a bit. Get in better shape, get stronger and quicker. He's a little bit soft yet.

As for our 2nd string defense I think some of those guys could start on other teams. They did really well against the Chiefs starters. Just wish the 2nd string offense would pick it up. Side note if I am a team with a bad punter I am giving a really good look at Colin Schmidt. Guy can boom it, he can kick off and kick it out of the end zone so makes him even more valuable. Plus he may very well have stopped 2 punt return TD's in 2 games. Guy is very fast for a punter. As for getting Jenkins involved we have had him run on that reverse like 5 times in 2 games and EVERY single one went to the rb up the middle for a yard or two. Also, by getting involved I mean quick throws, slants to get him the ball. We have been playing him on the outside a bunch and don't think we should be he isnt physical and big enough to get separation on press. He is more of a slot guy. Also, I think we should be getting him some catches on short stuff before sending him deep. Get his confidence up because these 2 mid to deep balls lead to 2 ints although both were bad throws by the QB.
I really like Moody too. That blitz was a work of art. I was thinking as Moody slid over to cover the second WR that him and Cox weren't going to cover the bunch.

Originally posted by willtalk:
I disagree on the comments on the Smith interception of the pass to Jenkins, Jenkins did not have him beat. He was running right with him stride for stride until Smith broke stride in order to slow down for the under thrown ball. Where as Jenkins did not. McCoy claims that that's what he expected Jenkins to do. Slow and cut underneath Smith for position. What viewers need to consider is the coverage before the ball is released and the defenders reacting to the ball rather than the receiver to judge if there was actual separation. It's sometimes difficult to time the release by the Quarter back with the positions of the receivers at the time of that release or their reaction to any thrown ball. I know in the super bowl and other games where fans have claimed a receiver was open and upon replay it turns out the were actually covered and the separation happened after the ball was released and the defenders reaction to the play not the receiver.

Ill have to pay closer attention to the defenders motion after the throw. I usually account for the defenders reaction when judging his coverage. It looks like Jenkins was open to me but I would have to watch it again to know for sure.
how did baldwin look during the pre season game against us?
Originally posted by pdizo916:
how did baldwin look during the pre season game against us?

He was targeted 3 times on 27 snaps. 2 of the targets were poor throws and one was a drop. Ncommand rewatched the game and noted his ability to block out WR. He was sealing Nnamdi off with ease. I can't really comment on his route running technique. Ncommand commented that on his one drop he tried to adjust to soon and lost coordination on the ball. Reid was a couple of yard behind him and was in great position to make a tackle.
[ Edited by eonblue on Aug 19, 2013 at 8:06 PM ]
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Originally posted by willtalk:
Originally posted by ninergold:
I hope they are are able to stash Bykowski and Marquadt on the PS.

They don't have to stash Marquadt he is already on either on PUP or IR I can't remember which. He will not be activated this season.

he was playing this past friday ..i thought i saw his name on jersey ?

No he is still PUP and probably will be IR for the year
Originally posted by eonblue:
Originally posted by pdizo916:
how did baldwin look during the pre season game against us?

He was targeted 3 times on 27 snaps. 2 of the targets were poor throws and one was a drop. Ncommand rewatched the game and noted his ability to block out WR. He was sealing Nnamdi off with ease. I can't really comment on his route running technique. Ncommand commented that on his one drop he tried to adjust to soon and lost coordination on the ball. Reid was a couple of yard behind him and was in great position to make a tackle.

Thanks eon...yeah, his drop looked like a post pattern...he beat Brock by 5 yards and the ball may have been slightly tipped by Moody throwing off the timing and Reid was about to light him up in the middle of the field as well. It looked like between the tip and adjusting his route to Reid, he dropped it. He'd be the 1st to tell you there wasn't any excuse. He struggled in press some with Nnamdi (excellent game) and needs to refine his technique and use his physicality more (swim move, etc.). His play-IQ needs to be better as well. When you are in single, press coverage, you HAVE to beat your man and get to the spot. That ball is coming to you! Not only does he block out well, he actually MOVES the CB completely out of the way leaving clean running lanes for the RB's off tackle. That skill set alone will be huge for Gore, esp. Hunter and James; on reverses. He played all three WR spots and came in on various packages. His best route was when he'd break off routes and come underneath across the middle of the field. He was WIDE open. Therefore, he sets CB's up nicely. He is going to learn a ton more from Boldin in this area.