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Bad at Scouting/Evaluating WR's?

I'd say there is a definite hole here in the scouting and selection process. I think Jenkins will come around at some point. He will probably just blow up in one game and go from there. Its a whole confidence thing right now. He obviously has talent because he produced for more than one year at a major college. At some point I think it will just click. Rice struggled his rookie year and had catching issues. Crabtree was the same. Get him the reps and eventually he'll pop.
Right now their sample size is 2, 3 with Patton... cant really determine how good they are just yet. Patton will step it up when he gets healthy, he will be the type of player that forces his way into the rotation.
All them other wr's listed have done what??? not much in my opinion i'm still giving Jenkins a bit more time and well this preseason to show some ability but I didnt think he was 1st rd material when we drafted him think he does have skills to be a decent player at some point though
Originally posted by dj43:
It seems Baalke either over-rated the receivers the team had, or under-estimated the importance of WRs to this offense. In either case, we are starting yet another season with WR being the weakest position on the team. Even if Crabtree were healthy, this would still not be a bunch that would keep DCs awake at night.


Both !! For one, we had noone left after Crab and Mario went down. Last year, when Kyle and Mario went down, we had the same problem and this year we are still talking about the same thing. Injuries happen, is just part of the game, the thing is you have to plan for it. When you don't draft enough and the little number of WRs you draft have problems such as Jenkins, that is how you end up in trouble. Missing the mark in the draft is one thing, it happens ,I get it, but if you don't have enough to begin with and considering the hit rate on WR can be somewhat lower, you just have to draft more than one a year until you have the situation under control.

So, to answer your question, they definitely over-rated Jenkins to say the least. At the same time when we only had Jenkins, Lockette, Hall and Patton (excluding Boldin as a starter) left at the time of Crab's injury just goes to show they underestimated the importance of having qualty back-ups.
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
Originally posted by Rascal:
Originally posted by 49AllTheTime:
then we suck at evaluating WRs


Quite possible. If Patton or the next WR draft pick busts then is pretty much confirmed.

well looking at the past WRs drafted the last 10 yrs...pretty much confirms it


Yes, but if we are trying to guage Baalke now, we can only look at the past 3 years I suppose.
  • buck
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Baalke has been in charge of four drafts. The first was in 2010 when Baalke was the interim general manager.

In 2010, we drafted Kyle Williams in the sixth round. He has been moderately productive.

In 2011, we drafted Ronald Johnson in the sixth round. He could not make the team. Bad pick.

In 2012, we drafted AJ Jenkins in the first round. He had no production in his first year

In 2013, we drafted Quinton Patton in the fourth round. He has not played one down of football in the NFL.

If the question is premature, answering the question is not smart.
[ Edited by buck on Aug 15, 2013 at 8:52 PM ]
  • buck
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Originally posted by Niners99:
They got too cute drafting Jenkins. Moving up for a player that wasnt even graded as a 1st or 2nd rounder is a pretty glaring mistake. They get a pass because how great the rest of the picks have been, but I never got the Jenkins pick, and now he might be even worse of a bust than Rashaun Woods, which is hard to do.

They moved up for Jenkins? I had no idea. I do not think that happened.
Originally posted by doc_brown_:
Are Baalke and Co. bad at scouting and evaluating college WR's?

In the 2011 draft, The Niners selected Ronald Johnson in the 6th round, who no longer is in the NFL

In the 2012 draft, The Niners selected A.J. Jenkins in the 1st round. Jenkins is probably the 7th best WR currently on the Niners roster and has looked terrible in games.

Notable WR's taken after Jenkins are:
- Alshon Jeffery
- Ryan Broyles
- Reuben Randle
- T.J. Graham
- Mohamed Sanu
- T.Y. Hilton
- Chris Givens
- Josh Gordon

Baalke and Co. stared these guys in the faces and still decided to pull the trigger on Jenkins. For me, this begs the question; Is Baalke bad at evaluating college WR's? It remains to be seen if Quinton Patton succeeds in the NFL, or if Jenkins can salvage his young career.

The Niners have drafted players with character concerns before, so for me, that is not an excuse for passing on guys like Alshon Jeffery and Josh Gordon.

Tell me what you guys think.

We didn't pass on Josh Gordan man. He was a supplemental pick
Originally posted by Pillbusta:
Originally posted by jreff22:
If Crabs walks and Boldin doesn't stay it will get interesting

Then we will spend some of our considerable draft capital on WRs


Guys, you know what ? This is not a totally impossible scenario. Boldin will be 33 next year, he did say he would like to play for more than a year, but we will never know how he will hold up physically. But, seriously even if he is in top physical condition come next year, you still need to plan ahead cos at most may be you can give him one more year or at most 2 ? As for Crab, Harvin got $11 mil, Wallace got $12 mil, my guess is Crab is probably looking at $10 mil minimum. How much will Baalke be willing to pay ? $8 mil ? I have a feeling we might be quite a bit apart.

So, here is the thing, is all about planning ahead, just like we should have planned ahead to take into account of injuries, you don't just wait until Boldin and/or Crab leave before you action. That is why I have been suggesting we should have drafted 2 WRs last year, but since they didn't do it we will need to do that next year, one high rounder and one middle rounder. Imagine the worst case scenario, Boldin leaves and Crab holds out, 2 more wideouts go down with injuries, then what ?

So, yes it will definitely be interesting to see what Baalke does in the next draft, but NOT wait until Bodin and/or Crab leaves cos by then it will be DEFCON 1 and way too late. LOL.
  • xcfan
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you can go mad trying to find a can't-miss WR. so many of the good ones have personality issues. they're not high achievers; only rely on native talent alone, and don't work hard enough on the technical stuff. or, you get great athletes that can't use it on the field, and coaches think they can be the one to fix them. the bears' jeffery was definitely one of them. such a great physical talent for WR, but hard to trust he will come through in a big way. if he comes through, you're a genius; if he fails to be a playmaker, you're incompetent.

my philosophy for drafting wide receivers is: (1) to only draft nfl-style playmaking that has been successfully shown on the field against draftable defenders. (2) draft natural hands that can catch while being molested.
project very little. it's too risky trying to figure where a wr might be, based on your hopes.
don't draft a wr early who doesn't have a resume of doing nfl stuff against nfl-level talent. anything else can easily result in an optical illusion; eg watching an illinois wr kill it against an indiana cornerback might trick you.
Originally posted by PrimeTime:
Originally posted by Pillbusta:
You would have taken desean over I believe it was Balmer that year but mccloughan believed smaller players would not last the season

I was just having this convo with a buddy the other day and I still can't believe we didn't take DeSean when Rice trained him. Not only did we pass on DeSean once, but we took Chilo Rachal instead of him also.. SMH, we still haven't found that deep threat speedster and it's been how long?


That is a good point ! Too long, way too long !!
  • xcfan
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Originally posted by buck:
They moved up for Jenkins? I had no idea. I do not think that happened.

correct
Ronald Johnson. lol No one should care a sixth round pick didn't pan out.

Missing on Aj Jenkins is certainly not enough data to say Baalke can't evaluate WR's.
Sorry just saying this is one of the worst threads I've seen in some time. I has to be up there with Kap Dolphins' gear thread.
Originally posted by random49er:
Originally posted by eonblue:
Originally posted by AmpLee:
It think that since Johnson was a sixth round pick and Patton is unknown, you just created another AJ Jenkins thread. Redundant, no?

This.


I disagree. Instead of whining about it being another thread or about Jenkins, we can actually discuss the ability of our front office management to fill the WR position.



We have a primetime QB and a glaring weakness at WR since Lord only knows how much Crabtree is going to ask for. So our ability to scout WRs is a good subject because it isint an AJ Jenkins-alone issue and it isint an issue that's just going to just disappear tomorrow.

Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74: ............... They're built on defense, a strong running game, one of the league's best TEs (and his rookie companion), one of the game's most dangerous all-around QB threats and just enough WR production to keep people honest.


You kinda lost me when you listed a 2nd round rook under what we're built on and we've had 1 preseason game.

This league is a passing league. What makes our "dangerous" QB most dangerous is getting the ball down the field to WRs. Last year he were able to start the year with the most dangerous deep threat in NFL history, a budding star in Crabtree, a healthy Manningham and Kyle Williams (pre injury), and an extra 4.5 Million dollar tight end.

We have to recognize the fact that we're going to start off the year without them, so when that many valuable players are not there, it is a concern worth discussing.

Crabtree isint a speedster by any means, but Boldin certainly doesn't wont have the young legs Crabs has to stretch the field any. We expect him to fill in nicely on short routes tho.....

....then who else? It's just a mystery we'll have to wonder about until it's solved.


Absolutely !! My point exactly, when we are so lucky to have struck gold in Kap, is just absurd we don't give him to best weapons to fully harness Kap's full potential.