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Could Crabtree be looking for Mike Williams money next year?

Originally posted by GNielsen:
Originally posted by Rsrkshn:
Now, why exactly do "most of us agree" that Crabtree will not accept the Niners' offer (if one is made)? And does this "most of us agree", in fact, make it a fait accompli? Why don't we wait and see.

If it comes down to it, Crabtree will at least test the market first. He may well find out that the market for his services are not as strong as he anticipated. Remember: No probowls. History of injuries. The Niners are not a cheap-skate organization. They will pay you value if you are worth it.

Okay, let's just say that I think Crabtree will not accept what Baalke has in mind for compensation. Just my opinion. That doesn't mean I don't like him, but as far as I'm concerned, he's already proven with his original holdout that money is more important than chemistry and that's fine. Yes, he'll test the market. Let's just leave Larry Fitzgerald, Calvin Johnson and Mike Wallace out of this for a second. Do you think Crabtree thinks he's as good as, say, Dwayne Bowe, Devin Hester or Vincent Jackson? I think he sees himself as equal to those guys and they all have contracts making over $10 mil a season. Percy Harvin, Jackson and Bowe all average over $11 mil a season. With the money the Niners pay for defense, and with Kaepernick, Iupati and Aldon Smith needing to get paid, I just don't think Baalke will want to pay over $10 million for Crabtree.

Crabtree is a fabulous receiver, but he's a possession receiver. He's not a stretch the field kind of player. I think they're hoping Jenkins, Lockette or Moore become stretch-the-field guys and Patton becomes a dynamic possession receiver similar to Crabtree. On top of that, I think they feel McDonald can be a classic possession TE to compliment Davis and James/Hunter can be the Darren Spoles type guys. With all that on their offensive plate, I just don't see them putting out $10 mil a year for Michael Crabtree.

It's all very well what you say, but you're overlooking one very significant factor: It doesn't matter how good Crabtree thinks he is and how much he thinks that he's worth. It only matters what the guys holding the purse strings think. If noone is offering him $10million a year, how is he going to hold out for that amount? You mean he'll just not play unless someone pays him $10 million? There are two giant assumptions that you are making:

1. Someone out there will pay Crabtree $10 million a year. I'm saying this is far from a sure thing given his history of injury and production. Teams place a premium on speed. He lacks that in his repertoire. Cruz is way faster than Crabtree and he only raked in $7million a year. All the guys you mention are stretch-the-field kind of players. BTW I didn't know Hester was pulling down $10 million +. Really?! Wow! Chicago is also talking about releasing him though.

2. That Crabtree will not be satisfied with a fair offer that the team makes before he hits FAcy. If they in fact do decide to make this offer, given Crabtree's injury history.

You talk like you know (i) what kind of offer Baalke would make Crabtree, and (ii) that Crabtree would only accept a $10million + offer. You don't KNOW either. I'm saying let's wait and see, because the scenario you're painting is not a sure thing.

Personally, I like Crabtree a lot. I hope he stays. But the one thing we agree on s that the Niners shouldn't break the bank over him. They may not have to, I'm saying.
Originally posted by Rsrkshn:

You talk like you know (i) what kind of offer Baalke would make Crabtree, and (ii) that Crabtree would only accept a $10million + offer. You don't KNOW either. I'm saying let's wait and see, because the scenario you're painting is not a sure thing.

Sports forum... people speculate and predict sh*t all the time... and it's ok.
@Rsrkshn

Easy man. I clearly said "just my opinion." To make a prediction is not to know or pretend that you know. It's just a guess. I have a feeling that someone is going to step up and offer Crabtree more than Baalke wants to pay. That's all. Crabtree is a legitimate #1 receiver and few receivers have better hands if any. If Baalke offers Cruz money, which I think is possible, I hope Crabtree takes it. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Cruz money is about $7 to $8 million a year. It's not like Crabtree is slow. He got behind DB's quite a few times this last season. I'll be glad if I'm wrong, but I think some GM or owner is going to fall in love with the idea of getting Crabtree (I'm looking at you, Jerry Jones).
Originally posted by Mr.Mcgibblets:
Sports forum... people speculate and predict sh*t all the time... and it's ok.

I appreciate your support.
Crabtree is a playmaker. He catches what is in his reach, he fights for the ball in the air, he snatches it away from defenders, he goes over the middle, fights through traffic, blocks downfield, is tough and when he catches the ball he gets that YAC. This guy can be a 100 catch 1400 yd guy in an offense that features him. He makes first downs and touchdowns. He can be a star and he will probably want to be paid like it. I am sure the Ravens were plenty scared of him as were all of our playoff foes this past winter. I won't rule out our front office sitting Kaep, Aldon, Iupati and Crabtree down and asking them together do they want to stay on and ask them to work together to make it happen
Originally posted by GNielsen:
I appreciate your support.

Hey . . . you have my support too.

I think that your posts are very well thought out.

BTW I agree with your sentiments re Jerry Jones. He's the one most likely to outbid the Niners for Crabtree's services. Hopefully not. I'm just saying that there is good reason not to be as pessimistic as you seem to be on resigning Crabtree.
Crabs should just consintrate on getting healthy and contributing this season if the MD's ever clear him.

Idk if he's is a position to demand anything at this point or, the begining of next season other then an ice pack or a Gatorade.
@Rsrkshn

Just got back from a long day at work - thanks for the kind words!

I think Crabtree is a fabulous receiver. He's got incredible hands - Kaepernick's fastballs don't seem to phase him one bit. And he gets serious YAC almost all the time. He's very shifty. I don't know why I'm so pessimistic about the Niners retaining him.
Withholding judgment on the situation.
[ Edited by tjd808185 on Jul 26, 2013 at 10:38 PM ]
I doubt he wants a Mike Williams deal now that the terms are known. Williams got NO Signing Bonus, just guaranteed base salary, and yearly workout and roster bonuses, biggest being $4M in 2018. $1M for 2014-2017. $600K Workout each year.
correction, he gets $1M roster this year, but not next year, then 2015-2017, then $4M in 2018. He got a guaranteed $7.2M base salary for 2013.
Originally posted by GNielsen:
Okay, let's just say that I think Crabtree will not accept what Baalke has in mind for compensation. Just my opinion. That doesn't mean I don't like him, but as far as I'm concerned, he's already proven with his original holdout that money is more important than chemistry and that's fine. Yes, he'll test the market. Let's just leave Larry Fitzgerald, Calvin Johnson and Mike Wallace out of this for a second. Do you think Crabtree thinks he's as good as, say, Dwayne Bowe, Devin Hester or Vincent Jackson? I think he sees himself as equal to those guys and they all have contracts making over $10 mil a season. Percy Harvin, Jackson and Bowe all average over $11 mil a season. With the money the Niners pay for defense, and with Kaepernick, Iupati and Aldon Smith needing to get paid, I just don't think Baalke will want to pay over $10 million for Crabtree.

Crabtree is a fabulous receiver, but he's a possession receiver. He's not a stretch the field kind of player. I think they're hoping Jenkins, Lockette or Moore become stretch-the-field guys and Patton becomes a dynamic possession receiver similar to Crabtree. On top of that, I think they feel McDonald can be a classic possession TE to compliment Davis and James/Hunter can be the Darren Spoles type guys. With all that on their offensive plate, I just don't see them putting out $10 mil a year for Michael Crabtree.

I don't see how Crabtree's original holdout proves he prefers money over chemistry. He was a rookie during his original holdout and therefore didn't have chemistry with anybody on the team including the coaches. I just think that he came out of college with a big head which i'm sure he still has, but he must have been humbled by the fact that he hasn't taken the league by storm and even with his year last year has still only accomplished pretty mediocre numbers. I would take Victor Cruz over every guy you mentioned above and he make less then all of them. It's just not so clear cut, not to mention Crabtree is coming off a major injury. He may be forced to resign with the 49ers just to prove he can still be a playmaker.
I love me some Crabs but if it comes down to signing Kap & Aldon, it's a no brainer
Originally posted by GNielsen:
@Rsrkshn

Just got back from a long day at work - thanks for the kind words!

I think Crabtree is a fabulous receiver. He's got incredible hands - Kaepernick's fastballs don't seem to phase him one bit. And he gets serious YAC almost all the time. He's very shifty. I don't know why I'm so pessimistic about the Niners retaining him.

Sure!
Originally posted by jvangeystel:
Originally posted by GNielsen:
Okay, let's just say that I think Crabtree will not accept what Baalke has in mind for compensation. Just my opinion. That doesn't mean I don't like him, but as far as I'm concerned, he's already proven with his original holdout that money is more important than chemistry and that's fine. Yes, he'll test the market. Let's just leave Larry Fitzgerald, Calvin Johnson and Mike Wallace out of this for a second. Do you think Crabtree thinks he's as good as, say, Dwayne Bowe, Devin Hester or Vincent Jackson? I think he sees himself as equal to those guys and they all have contracts making over $10 mil a season. Percy Harvin, Jackson and Bowe all average over $11 mil a season. With the money the Niners pay for defense, and with Kaepernick, Iupati and Aldon Smith needing to get paid, I just don't think Baalke will want to pay over $10 million for Crabtree.

Crabtree is a fabulous receiver, but he's a possession receiver. He's not a stretch the field kind of player. I think they're hoping Jenkins, Lockette or Moore become stretch-the-field guys and Patton becomes a dynamic possession receiver similar to Crabtree. On top of that, I think they feel McDonald can be a classic possession TE to compliment Davis and James/Hunter can be the Darren Spoles type guys. With all that on their offensive plate, I just don't see them putting out $10 mil a year for Michael Crabtree.

I don't see how Crabtree's original holdout proves he prefers money over chemistry. He was a rookie during his original holdout and therefore didn't have chemistry with anybody on the team including the coaches. I just think that he came out of college with a big head which i'm sure he still has, but he must have been humbled by the fact that he hasn't taken the league by storm and even with his year last year has still only accomplished pretty mediocre numbers. I would take Victor Cruz over every guy you mentioned above and he make less then all of them. It's just not so clear cut, not to mention Crabtree is coming off a major injury. He may be forced to resign with the 49ers just to prove he can still be a playmaker.

What I'm sayin'. 'cept you said it better.