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Whitner unhappy?

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Thanks for the PFF post Drinkamiller. The one name that just roars out off the page? Charles Woodson. question is when will he lower his pricetag to make himself attractive to 9ers...and a shot at the SB ring? Are trent and jim really waiting him out on his salary? If not, they saw something they didn't like, kinda hard to believe, which makes me think woodson ends up here before season starts. We'll see. Also I want to see all our talent slug it out for the positions.Don't know who it will be but someone is going to make a move on Whitner, and with all the guys our F.O has worked out, I can't believe we will not improve on whitner. But one never knows...

Doc he signed with Oakland about a month ago. Losing it I see ole friend,
  • LVJay
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Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:
Originally posted by LVJay:
^^^

Rogers can be cut after the season with very minimal dead money I believe.

True that... and prolly best off that way.
The guy should have been cut in the offseason to help make room to retain Dashon in the first place. The only thing he can do is hit, but he is next to useles in defending the pass.
Originally posted by RishikeshA:
Each year is different from the previous one. Goldson was gone as soon as the SB was over. Do you want to start a season with two new safeties? Whitner is most likely gone next year. Managing the Cap has become as important as coaching a team.

Very astute . . . more important. The Niners so far seem to be in very good hands with Paraag and Trent. This the most important element in allowing them to keep ahead of the game.

For the reasons you state, I would agree with your scenario as most likely. Perhaps reduced playing time for Whitner even, while they prepare for someone else to take over. Whitner himself sees the writing on the wall. He's not stupid. What would be stupid and unfortunate, would be if he were to pout about it during the season. That creates a negative influence in the locker room, which effects and contaminates other players. There was some of that going on with Goldson last season. The Niners managed it as best they could.
  • BobS
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Originally posted by SportsFan:
Originally posted by adamcarrillo85:
49ers are gonna have Salary Cap problems Next Season I wouldnt be surprised if 49ers Clean House like the Ravens next season

Someone has no idea what they are talking about. Please don't let the door hit you on the way out. AB can say for sure but I think we have 20+ million in cap space for next year at this point in time.
Aren't you forgetting # 7 gets paid next year?
Originally posted by Pillbusta:
Originally posted by adamcarrillo85:
49ers are gonna have Salary Cap problems Next Season I wouldnt be surprised if 49ers Clean House like the Ravens next season

No way we do that. Our personnel and cap management is a notch above theirs in recent years. We still have ample cap space remaining this year to extend someone long term thanks to Justin smith. Plus we have a boatload of picks. No way we blow this team up. We are set to add talent to the roster

Agree. Our front office has done an amazing job and will continue to do so.
Originally posted by CorvaNinerFan:
Think it's sinking in he probably won't be here next year...unless he reverts back to his 2011 form. That could mean a rebound in performance...or he'll be hitting the road out of SF. Additions of Reid, Dahl and seemingly a maturing Robinson, he could well be aced out.

Well said. The Niners front office is all about keeping as many red chip level players that they can while filling in with cheaper, younger talent around them. Goldson this year is a perfect example. Whitner should look at this year as a tryout for one last big contract score, whether it comes from the Niners or someone else. However Whitner is behind Iupati, Kaepernick, Aldon Smith, and even Crabtree in the resigning pecking order. Reality bites.
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
excuse me for not thinking too much about what pff has to say on the matter but they do have woodson ranked about 30 spots higher than landry who signed a multi year contract worth around 6 mil a year compared to woodson's 1 year 1.8 mil dollar contract.. A lot of different teams showed more interest in landry than woodson and landry was picked up waaay earlier than woodson. I tend to think those teams know more than pff.

Again we had 11 draft picks to find a prospect safety to groom in a draft loaded with safety talent and what did we do? We only took reid. Yeah he could play SS in the future but I'll wait until I see it first. You could think he is the weak link all you want but there were options out there to imrpove if harbalke felt the need to but they didn't. Instead we got craig dahl and that vatrone character.

Citing contracts as some sort of measurement of skill and value is pretty ridiculous. Dashon Goldson best safety in the league because he makes the most money! Fact is there weren't good options to replace Whitner this offseason, and we sure as hell weren't gonna start 2 rookie safeties.
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Originally posted by Disp:
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
yeah and the contract that landry signed tells me he is a bit more than a "WARM BODY" . If none of these guys would be a noticeable upgrade over whitner than maybe whitner is better than you guys give him credit for.

I think landry is a hell of a player, he has much to improve on but that guy is a machine that rivals just about anyone in the league in athleticism.

Well you don't agree with PFF's ratings, but I'll post em anyway. I don't watch enough Bills, Cardinals, Jets, etc. games to get a good enough judgment based on what I watch, so I have to rely more on articles and PFF/Football Outsiders to get a better understanding. George Wilson was rated well and Moore was pretty good as well, but like said, Moore was never really a free agent. Landry has always been known as an athletic freak, but that doesn't make him a consistent or particularly good player. So here are the remaining free agent players you mentioned as Whitner replacements. This is their grade for SS/FS's last year.


For everyone that doesn't know what those numbers mean, please explain each category?? I'm sure fans wanna know how those numbers equate to how good or poor a player is or did in games.
Originally posted by LoneWolf:
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
excuse me for not thinking too much about what pff has to say on the matter but they do have woodson ranked about 30 spots higher than landry who signed a multi year contract worth around 6 mil a year compared to woodson's 1 year 1.8 mil dollar contract.. A lot of different teams showed more interest in landry than woodson and landry was picked up waaay earlier than woodson. I tend to think those teams know more than pff.

Again we had 11 draft picks to find a prospect safety to groom in a draft loaded with safety talent and what did we do? We only took reid. Yeah he could play SS in the future but I'll wait until I see it first. You could think he is the weak link all you want but there were options out there to imrpove if harbalke felt the need to but they didn't. Instead we got craig dahl and that vatrone character.

Woodson got a tiny contract late because of age, Landry got a big contract because of potential (and because its the Jets).


First I thought landry signed with the colts not the jets...

Second woodson got a tiny contract because of his ability as well as his age. His abilities have diminished over the years..

Third, potential? really, I mean we aren't talking about the draft here. Landry had some pretty productive years in Washington. Yes obviously they think he has a lot more potential than he showed last season but they also paid him based on his past production.

Let me conclude this by saying that I do not think whitner is that great of a safety but I do think he is better than some of you are saying he is. He did have a dreadful year last season but I think he can improve in pass coverage. He will not miss 14 tackles or w/e it was again, you can bank on that.

Also some of you make me laugh. Your saying that whitner won't ever be good in coverage because he is simply too small, but you think Trenton robinson who is smaller than whitner will be better? Don't forget that ed reed is also 5'10 and was one of the best coverage safeties of all time. Whitner just isn't very fluid in coverage but players can adapt and improve, so we will see how he fairs this coming season.
Originally posted by Disp:
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
excuse me for not thinking too much about what pff has to say on the matter but they do have woodson ranked about 30 spots higher than landry who signed a multi year contract worth around 6 mil a year compared to woodson's 1 year 1.8 mil dollar contract.. A lot of different teams showed more interest in landry than woodson and landry was picked up waaay earlier than woodson. I tend to think those teams know more than pff.

Again we had 11 draft picks to find a prospect safety to groom in a draft loaded with safety talent and what did we do? We only took reid. Yeah he could play SS in the future but I'll wait until I see it first. You could think he is the weak link all you want but there were options out there to imrpove if harbalke felt the need to but they didn't. Instead we got craig dahl and that vatrone character.

Citing contracts as some sort of measurement of skill and value is pretty ridiculous. Dashon Goldson best safety in the league because he makes the most money! Fact is there weren't good options to replace Whitner this offseason, and we sure as hell weren't gonna start 2 rookie safeties.

I think using other peoples evaluations that aren't your own is pretty ridiculous.. but hey do what you like.

Not only did landry get 6 mil a year which BTW was the same as moore but he also is on a 4 year contract which tells me that the colts have faith in him. I don't see why contracts wouldn't be a good indication of how good an organization thinks a player is or how valuable he is. If they thought he wasn't good and had something to prove than he would've been offered a 1 year deal and less money. Remember also that there were plenty of teams that showed interest in landry, the 49ers being one of them.

Fact is that there were plenty of good options to replace whitner if we felt the need and we didn't. Nobody implied that we were going to start 2 rookies but you can keep thinking that, all I was saying is that we didn't even bring in somebody to groom.

BTW goldson was the top safety on the market, which is why he got paid as much as he did. Is he worth that much? no probably not, but since there weren't any safeties that were better than goldson out there he got top dollar. If Thomas was available than he probably would've gotten more money than goldson but he wasn't.
49ers typical M.O. for pending free agents who ARE NOT aren't sure fire pro-bowl level players:

1. Make an extension offer
2. Stick to your guns
3. Let them hit the market to find out their value
4. Wait them out

It doesn't always work out, but it's a sound strategy IMO.

BTW, I know Whitner got voted into the pro-bowl last year, but it was a questionable pick.
[ Edited by SonocoNinerFan on Jul 20, 2013 at 10:32 AM ]
Originally posted by Pillbusta:
Originally posted by adamcarrillo85:
49ers are gonna have Salary Cap problems Next Season I wouldnt be surprised if 49ers Clean House like the Ravens next season

No way we do that. Our personnel and cap management is a notch above theirs in recent years. We still have ample cap space remaining this year to extend someone long term thanks to Justin smith. Plus we have a boatload of picks. No way we blow this team up. We are set to add talent to the roster

Dont forget we have stars who are willing to take pay cuts like Vernon and Willis did.
Originally posted by adamcarrillo85:
49ers are gonna have Salary Cap problems Next Season I wouldnt be surprised if 49ers Clean House like the Ravens next season


Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
First I thought landry signed with the colts not the jets...

Second woodson got a tiny contract because of his ability as well as his age. His abilities have diminished over the years..

Third, potential? really, I mean we aren't talking about the draft here. Landry had some pretty productive years in Washington. Yes obviously they think he has a lot more potential than he showed last season but they also paid him based on his past production.

Let me conclude this by saying that I do not think whitner is that great of a safety but I do think he is better than some of you are saying he is. He did have a dreadful year last season but I think he can improve in pass coverage. He will not miss 14 tackles or w/e it was again, you can bank on that.

Also some of you make me laugh. Your saying that whitner won't ever be good in coverage because he is simply too small, but you think Trenton robinson who is smaller than whitner will be better? Don't forget that ed reed is also 5'10 and was one of the best coverage safeties of all time. Whitner just isn't very fluid in coverage but players can adapt and improve, so we will see how he fairs this coming season.

first im wrong thanks for catching that for me.

Second woodson is still a great safety, just with age comes multiple factors, injuriy liability, slowing down etc so no tsam in there right mind would sign him to a huge long contract its just a fact of the sport.

Third, yes potential. Hes had multpile injury riddled seasons since drafted but most times hes come back as a solid player.

Im not sayinf whitner is a bad safety at all given the chance i wouldnt mind keeping him depending on how well the rest of our secondary does this season. hes excellwnt against the run good tackler and he is a hell of a veteran leader for our secondary. I think him staying on the team all hinges on 2 things how well he plays this season and if he improves on some of his weaknesses and how much money he wants.