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Read Option WON'T catch teams by surprise this year

Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
dtg, I agree, mobile QBs are way more exciting than pocket passers. But watching a talent like RG3 go down....well, it lessens my enthusiasm for mobile QBs. Now that is not to say that kap won't scramble, because he will. My point was I believe JH got the point when RG got carried off on a cart. Right then the SKins were done. NO SB in Washington with RG out for season. 49ers as well as most other teams are in the same boat. We have one of the top 10 Qbs, and he is not far below the top 5....if he stays healthy. Fans often forget that what may be exciting as all get out, may also be conducive to losing your QB early and often. As you well know, DLs, LBs. CBs, are all bigger , faster, stronger, better. And they keep going that way. Not exactly the kind of guys you want to put a real lick on your starting QB who is making a designed run.

Understood, but CK seems to protect himself much better than RGIII. The latter seemed to invite hits at times with macho moves, while Kaepernick avoids hits better than almost any running QB I've watched. But I agree with you that the risk-reward of running your QB heavily weighted against calling intentional running plays very often. Luck also seems to take more hits than CK. Will be interesting to see if this is due to quickness or was Colin just lucky?

I've always wanted to see a team bring in three QBs who could run and pass, subbing to keep them fresh. But that would be a difficult assignment...find three really good all around running/passing QBs...within budget? Last year the niners had Smith and CK, who were both very capable runners, but their third QB was not very mobile.
  • dwett
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I watched the Packer Divisional game again last night where Kaep just destroyed them with his legs. I will say there were only a few designated run plays for Kaep. It really reminded me of Steve Young, where the defense was playing man to man and sending an extra guy, he would simply read his options and if no one was open would take off for a 10 plus yard gain since most the D had their backs turned.

Now this has to drive defenses nuts. You get a team in a 3rd and long and they continue the drive because the QB scrambles for a 10 yard run on a broken play. It means their defense stays on the field, ours gets to rest and we have 3 more downs to hit a big play. I love it!!!. Really am excited to see how Kaep playing a whole season helps our 3rd down conversion rate.
dtg, I too would be fascinated with a triumvirate of Qbs, all runners. Over time, I still think you run into the injury bug. Your point about Luck is of interest, because that kid has been rocked and then some. Lousy Oline and he stands in anyway. Point is there comes a time where that is overdone also. He is a guy who either needs a better Oline or needs to do some scampering.

dwett, the Packer game was the most fun and most watched game in this house. I have worn out my tapes. If you didn't have one of the best days of your football life that game, you probably were a fan of roller derby. I bet a poll would show we all liked that beauty as much as any game played in yrs. Sure like to see that again. Now there was a case where Kap ran a lot, and they, incredibly, had no idea what to do. Surely that is fixed now, but I wouldn't mind seeing us do that to them again.
David Carr would argue that you don't need to be a running QB to take a beating. The whole read option thing is overdone as well. Having it is just like having another bullet in the clip, you may not need it to win but your better off having it as an option (no pun intended) than not having it.
Oh, brother, just thinking about the beating Carr took in NFL is depressing. Reminds me of QB in Houston who used to play for Raiders. His favorite line:

"Oh we play by the "lookout block " method. When the ball is hiked the center turns around and yells "look out". Can't remember his name but he raced speedboats too and got broken up a number of times. " No Worse than the NFL", he said while in hospital after another boat destroying race, with broken hands, arms, and legs.

dtg, one last thot, and that is your comment about kap seems to not get hit so hard. I have heard that, and watched carefully on a number of tapes, and can't tell why he doesn't take worse licks. He has a good slide, but maybe his escapability behind LOS is way better than Luck's which means Colin will be playing a lot longer at that rate. Surely after Coach got after him about trying to run over LBs, he seemed to do better. Also he reluctantly went out of bounds rather than getting that last Gore yard.

edit: that QB was Dan Pastorini, an official wild man
[ Edited by pasodoc9er on Jul 16, 2013 at 6:40 PM ]
yeah but over compensating for the read-option will.................
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Oh, brother, just thinking about the beating Carr took in NFL is depressing. Reminds me of QB in Houston who used to play for Raiders. His favorite line:

"Oh we play by the "lookout block " method. When the ball is hiked the center turns around and yells "look out". Can't remember his name but he raced speedboats too and got broken up a number of times. " No Worse than the NFL", he said while in hospital after another boat destroying race, with broken hands, arms, and legs.

dtg, one last thot, and that is your comment about kap seems to not get hit so hard. I have heard that, and watched carefully on a number of tapes, and can't tell why he doesn't take worse licks. He has a good slide, but maybe his escapability behind LOS is way better than Luck's which means Colin will be playing a lot longer at that rate. Surely after Coach got after him about trying to run over LBs, he seemed to do better. Also he reluctantly went out of bounds rather than getting that last Gore yard.

edit: that QB was Dan Pastorini, an official wild man

History has been very unkind to many QBs...Plunkett, and Archie Manning spent most of their years playing for very bad teams. I always wonder...what if? Kaepernick is very good but he is also very fortunate landing in SF at this time. Just Hope Baalke can keep finding talent to sustain this success.
Just like what that phaggot Terrell Suggs did at the superbowl, does it give the go ahead for OLB's giving a cheapshot to Keap in the WildKap after the fake/nonfake handoff to Gore?
I'm coming in late to this thread, but had to respond.

I keep hearing about read/option, and I've had enough.

This is exactly the the thing that is wrong with our society, and continues to lead us down a horrible path.

There is no way reading should be an option! It should be mandatory curriculum for all kids period. No question.

This read/option has allowed players like CK, Cam Newton, and RW to flourish in the NFL, but is it right for everyone to throw around willy nilly the fact that they may not be able to read?

Our school systems need to be held to a higher standard, and the NFL should step and set an example as well. There is no way that illiterate players should be celebrated as setting some kind of trend in the league.

Sorry to get on my pulpit, just disgusted with this topic!
  • dwett
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 627
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
dtg, I too would be fascinated with a triumvirate of Qbs, all runners. Over time, I still think you run into the injury bug. Your point about Luck is of interest, because that kid has been rocked and then some. Lousy Oline and he stands in anyway. Point is there comes a time where that is overdone also. He is a guy who either needs a better Oline or needs to do some scampering.

dwett, the Packer game was the most fun and most watched game in this house. I have worn out my tapes. If you didn't have one of the best days of your football life that game, you probably were a fan of roller derby. I bet a poll would show we all liked that beauty as much as any game played in yrs. Sure like to see that again. Now there was a case where Kap ran a lot, and they, incredibly, had no idea what to do. Surely that is fixed now, but I wouldn't mind seeing us do that to them again.


Man I agree I love that game. Now not sure how you fix it if you are a defense as long as Kaep can beat zone coverage with his arm. The loss of Crabs scares me on this because man was he Kaep's go to guy. If he can the other team will have to change and go man to man with blitzes and Kaep legs will own you. Atlanta did a better job but that opened up the inside run game. We could be a scary offense if we can get production from our receiving crew despite the loss of Crab.
Originally posted by maltz88:
I'm coming in late to this thread, but had to respond.

I keep hearing about read/option, and I've had enough.

This is exactly the the thing that is wrong with our society, and continues to lead us down a horrible path.

There is no way reading should be an option! It should be mandatory curriculum for all kids period. No question.

This read/option has allowed players like CK, Cam Newton, and RW to flourish in the NFL, but is it right for everyone to throw around willy nilly the fact that they may not be able to read?

Our school systems need to be held to a higher standard, and the NFL should step and set an example as well. There is no way that illiterate players should be celebrated as setting some kind of trend in the league.

Sorry to get on my pulpit, just disgusted with this topic!
lol. Funny on so many different levels.

Or maybe I didn't read it right.

Is that an option?
Originally posted by maltz88:
I'm coming in late to this thread, but had to respond.

I keep hearing about read/option, and I've had enough.

This is exactly the the thing that is wrong with our society, and continues to lead us down a horrible path.

There is no way reading should be an option! It should be mandatory curriculum for all kids period. No question.

This read/option has allowed players like CK, Cam Newton, and RW to flourish in the NFL, but is it right for everyone to throw around willy nilly the fact that they may not be able to read?

Our school systems need to be held to a higher standard, and the NFL should step and set an example as well. There is no way that illiterate players should be celebrated as setting some kind of trend in the league.

Sorry to get on my pulpit, just disgusted with this topic!

interdasting.
OK...kinda been laying off this topic for awhile....

So here's my take.

The Read/Option ain't going anywhere. There is no magic "fix" to solve it. Its about math. If Defenses find a way to put a 12th defender on the field, then I'll worry.

Can it be defensed? Of course. Everyone do their job and it can be stopped...just like almost any other type of play. All the Read/Option does is make the D play honest and forces them to account for the QB as a runner. They can't sell out to stop the QB and they can't sell out to stop the RB. Defenses are used to essentially playing with an 11 vs. 10 advantage in the run game. This just evens the playing field.

Hitting the QB? How well did that work for the Ravens in the SB? Yes, they won the game, but they didn't stop the Read/Option. They won on offense and by beating the 49ers to the punch in the redzone. They did alot of that by bliting like crazy right up the middle. That was why the 49ers started attacking the edges and is why the TD call to Gore was genius.

Here's the thing tho...if you are gonna blitz up the middle on every down to stop one play that the 49ers run like 10% of the time, you are going to expose yourself to other stuff because you have just sold out to stop the play. You only have 11. If you devote another guy to stopping that play...SOMETHING will be open.

I saw the hits that Suggs put on Kaep in the SB. Most of them were nothing more than shoves. The NFL is protecting the QBs so anything after the handoff is a 15 yard penalty.

The only thing that concerns me is if the DEs begin to do the opposite of what they are doing now....IE they begin to crash on every down to stop the RB forcing Kaep to run. I don't want Kaep running all the time on those runs. Eventually, the hits will take a toll. I don't see DCs doing that tho because a good number of those hits will come 10+ yards downfield.

The best part of all of this tho is that it's implications go far beyond the run game. Defenses spend so much time worrying about who to watch...RB or QB....that they end up with their eyes in the backfield for an extended period of time. that opens up HUGE holes in Play Action.

I love it.
[ Edited by Marvin49 on Jul 19, 2013 at 10:36 AM ]
Originally posted by maltz88:
I'm coming in late to this thread, but had to respond.

I keep hearing about read/option, and I've had enough.

This is exactly the the thing that is wrong with our society, and continues to lead us down a horrible path.

There is no way reading should be an option! It should be mandatory curriculum for all kids period. No question.

This read/option has allowed players like CK, Cam Newton, and RW to flourish in the NFL, but is it right for everyone to throw around willy nilly the fact that they may not be able to read?

Our school systems need to be held to a higher standard, and the NFL should step and set an example as well. There is no way that illiterate players should be celebrated as setting some kind of trend in the league.

Sorry to get on my pulpit, just disgusted with this topic!

Originally posted by oldninerdude:
Originally posted by maltz88:
I'm coming in late to this thread, but had to respond.

I keep hearing about read/option, and I've had enough.

This is exactly the the thing that is wrong with our society, and continues to lead us down a horrible path.

There is no way reading should be an option! It should be mandatory curriculum for all kids period. No question.

This read/option has allowed players like CK, Cam Newton, and RW to flourish in the NFL, but is it right for everyone to throw around willy nilly the fact that they may not be able to read?

Our school systems need to be held to a higher standard, and the NFL should step and set an example as well. There is no way that illiterate players should be celebrated as setting some kind of trend in the league.

Sorry to get on my pulpit, just disgusted with this topic!
lol. Funny on so many different levels.

Or maybe I didn't read it right.

Is that an option?

OND! I haven't seen you around in a while and THEN you post to this. Welcome back! (in case I missed you). This had me laughing so hard!