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Aldon Smith vs. DeMarcus Ware

Originally posted by LoneWolf:
No surprise there..................


Did you expect anything else out of me?
No not really.
Originally posted by GNielsen:
@buck:

No question about it. Demarcus Ware is an unbelievably good NFL player - absolutely top five in the league defensively. But I also think lots of fans around the league and quite a few Niner fans I've seen are underestimating Aldon Smith. He's only entering his third season, but if it's another one like the first two, he deserves to be considered close to the top of the bunch if not at the top.


Aldon Smith makes some things look so easy, that it is dismissed as nothing.
The perfect example of this is with Justin Smiths "hook" move to open up a lane. People act as if this is some new play that has just come around. As if Justin Smith is the only one capable of pulling it off. The fact is, this play has been around forever, other players can do it as well as Justin Smith can, its just that Aldon gets around the edge so fast, and makes it look so easy, that everyone ignores the fact that he deserves credit for these plays.

Most of Aldon's sacks come from destroying people one-on-one (as is true with JJ Watt, Von Miller etc). Aldon also makes plays in the run game. He makes them look so easy, that sometimes people just assume it was a missed block and Aldon deserves no credit. I don't think people realize just how much ground this guy covers with his long step. It reminds me of Julian Peterson except he has an enormous amount of power to go along with his cat-like agility.
Originally posted by BrianGO:
Aldon Smith makes some things look so easy, that it is dismissed as nothing.
The perfect example of this is with Justin Smiths "hook" move to open up a lane. People act as if this is some new play that has just come around. As if Justin Smith is the only one capable of pulling it off. The fact is, this play has been around forever, other players can do it as well as Justin Smith can, its just that Aldon gets around the edge so fast, and makes it look so easy, that everyone ignores the fact that he deserves credit for these plays.

Most of Aldon's sacks come from destroying people one-on-one (as is true with JJ Watt, Von Miller etc). Aldon also makes plays in the run game. He makes them look so easy, that sometimes people just assume it was a missed block and Aldon deserves no credit. I don't think people realize just how much ground this guy covers with his long step. It reminds me of Julian Peterson except he has an enormous amount of power to go along with his cat-like agility.

Dont forget Aldon's giant wingspan.
Just rewatched the packers and falcons playoff games, to say Aldon fell off after Justin went down just isnt true. He may not have registered a sack in the playoffs, but he forced fumbles, made tackles behind the line of scrimmage and was constantly in the QB's face. What gets overlooked is that in the final stretch he faced some damn good QBs who are good at getting rid of the ball and not taking sacks, but his impact was definitely felt.

Also a little off topic... but Brown is by far and away our best CB and made Goldson look much better than he should. It was very noticeable the bad angles Goldson took to either make a play on the ball (which he whiffed) or just took way too shallow of an angle. In his 'over the top coverages' the CBs were usually farther down the field than Goldson which led to some big plays. See the James Jones catch against Culliver, Cully had great coverage but Rodgers made an unbelievable throw and Jones made a great catch... while Goldson took a bad angle and wasnt in the over the top position to sandwich Jones with a big hit and most likely knock the ball away.
[ Edited by 5280High on Jul 2, 2013 at 8:28 PM ]
Originally posted by 5280High:
Just rewatched the packers and falcons playoff games, to say Aldon fell off after Justin went down just isnt true. He may not have registered a sack in the playoffs, but he forced fumbles, made tackles behind the line of scrimmage and was constantly in the QB's face. What gets overlooked is that in the final stretch he faced some damn good QBs who are good at getting rid of the ball and not taking sacks, but his impact was definitely felt.


If the ball is not in your hands, you cannot get sacked.
  • buck
  • Veteran
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ALL PRO

There are three 2012 All-Pro Teams—one each named by the Associated Press (AP), Pro Football Writers Association (PFWA), and Sporting News—for performance in the 2012 NFL season. None of the teams are officially sanctioned by the NFL, but I think, and I may well be wrong, the Associated Press team is more highly regarded.

Two outside linebackers made all three of the teams; Von Miller and Aldon Smith.

DeMarcus Ware made the Sporting News All Pro team, and the Associated Press's second team.

The NFL Top 100

7. Aldon Smith (fan ranking 22)

12. DeMarcus Ware (fan ranking 38)


Just some more opinions.
Originally posted by buck:
ALL PRO

There are three 2012 All-Pro Teams—one each named by the Associated Press (AP), Pro Football Writers Association (PFWA), and Sporting News—for performance in the 2012 NFL season. None of the teams are officially sanctioned by the NFL, but I think, and I may well be wrong, the Associated Press team is more highly regarded.

Two outside linebackers made all three of the teams; Von Miller and Aldon Smith.

DeMarcus Ware made the Sporting News All Pro team, and the Associated Press's second team.

The NFL Top 100

7. Aldon Smith (fan ranking 22)

12. DeMarcus Ware (fan ranking 38)


Just some more opinions.

It would seem the buck stops nowhere.
  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 9,762
Pro Bowl NFC starting starting outside linebackers

Aldon Smith
DeMarcus Ware

Equal billing
  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 9,762
Some still argue that Aldon is not a well rouonded linebacker; that his run defense is weak.

Here are the top five linebackers in sacks with total yards lost.

1. Aldon Smith-19.5--145 yards
2. Von Miller-18.5--130 yards
3. Cameron Wake-15--92 yards
4. DeMarcus Ware-11.5--64 yards
5. Elvis Dumervil11--83 yards

Here are same 5 linebackers with their tackle numbers.

1. Von Miller--55--13-68
2. Aldon Smith-- 50--16--66
3. DeMarcus Ware--33--23--56
4. Cameron Wake--38--15--53
5. Elvis Dumervil--32--22--54

I have also noticed that now some people are saying that Aldon's numbers are a by product not only of playing behind Justin Smith, but also of playing along side of Willis and Bowman. The argument seems to continue expanding. If I remember correctly, some have also added that he is getting some of the his sacks because the secondary is forcing the quarterbacks to hold the ball longer.

There is no denying that all of the above factors do indeed help Aldon Smith do his job better, I just find it odd that I never hear similar remarks being made about any other of our Pro Bowl players.

The same 49er players who have contributed to Aldon's success did vote him the team's Most Valuable Player.
I just going to guess that they think Aldon is in fact deserving of the acclaim that he has gotten, no that he has earned, in his two years in the league.

edit: The stats is this post came from ESPN.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/defense/sort/sacks/year/2012/seasontype/2
[ Edited by buck on Jul 2, 2013 at 11:12 PM ]
Originally posted by buck:
Some still argue that Aldon is not a well rouonded linebacker; that his run defense is weak.

Here are the top five linebackers in sacks with total yards lost.

1. Aldon Smith-19.5--145 yards
2. Von Miller-18.5--130 yards
3. Cameron Wake-15--92 yards
4. DeMarcus Ware-11.5--64 yards
5. Elvis Dumervil11--83 yards

Here are same 5 linebackers with their tackle numbers.

1. Von Miller--55--13-68
2. Aldon Smith-- 50--16--66
3. DeMarcus Ware--33--23--56
4. Cameron Wake--38--15--53
5. Elvis Dumervil--32--22--54

I have also noticed that now some people are saying that Aldon's numbers are a by product not only of playing behind Justin Smith, but also of playing along side of Willis and Bowman. The argument seems to continue expanding. If I remember correctly, some also has added that some of the sacks are because the secondary is forcing the quarterbacks to hold the ball longer.

There is no denying that all of the above factors do indeed help Aldon Smith do his job better, I just find it odd that I never hear similar remarks being made about any other of our Pro Bowl players.

The same 49er players who have contributed to Aldon's success did vote him the team's Most Valuable Player.
I just going to guess that they think Aldon is in fact deserving of the acclaim that he has gotten, no that he has earned, in his two years in the league.

edit: The stats is this post came from ESPN.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/defense/sort/sacks/year/2012/seasontype/2

I also find it odd, that if playing next to all those stars makes Aldon that much better and makes it easier for him to get sacks, why did Haralson only get 2 sacks in 2011 when our defense was even "better" all around and he was on the field more than Aldon?
  • buck
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Pass Coverage # 1

I have heard two claims with regularity.

1. The first claim is that DeMarcus is asked to do more in coverage than Aldon.

The two are among the 28 outside linebackers that dropped into coverage more than 50 times in 2012.

Their rankings among this group are:

Drops

16th Smith--88 times
26th Ware—66 times

Targeted

13th Smith—12 times
19th Ware—10 times

2. The second claim is that Ware is better in coverage.

Yards given up per coverage snap

11th Aldon Smith--0.75 yard
26th DeMarcus Ware--1.22 yards

Receptions given up per snap

21st Aldon Smith--1 reception for every 8.8 snaps.
26th DeMarcus Ware--1 reception for every 7 snaps.

https://www.profootballfocus.com/data/signature.php?tab=signature&season=2012&stype=r&pos=3oc&teamid=-1&filter=25
[ Edited by buck on Jul 3, 2013 at 2:59 AM ]
" Anything that can be destroyed by truth should be."

Way to shine the light of truth on some grievous misconceptions Buck.
@JimDrinkAMiller
I believe the reason you don't care what PFF is saying is because it doesn't support your opinion. I understand that under the weight of attempting to reach and win a superbowl stats are least important. That being said, during the offseason and after a player's career is over what other form of measurement is there? The stats clearly show that as of right now Aldon drops into coverage more often and has a higher rate of success. He is also better at stopping the run. Some may discredit Aldon because of the defense he plays on, but I say that helps prove his skill. He shines even when there are other highly skilled players on the team. He is a shiny diamond in a bag full rather than a diamond laying in a pile of mud. I just don't understand how someone could deny that he was the better player at every aspect of the game than Ware last season. It would also be a hard argument to claim that Ware will have a better season this year.

Nobody knows whether Aldon is a product of his environment or how the two players would do if they were allowed to switch spots. To argue that is taking the easy way out because it cannot be proven wrong and also cannot be proven right. So who do you believe is the better all around player in 2013?
I don't want to keep sticking up for a cowboys player anymore than the next 49er fan, so I'm not going to continue posting reasons why he is as good or better than aldon. It just seemed like this was turning into a "reasons why aldon is better than demarcus" thread.