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bold prediction for the upcoming season

  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 8,473
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
But according to all of you goofballs he comes up with money plays . .
goofballs.


1. Don't be a jerk.
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
But according to all of you goofballs he comes up with money plays . .
goofballs.


1. Don't be a jerk.

  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 8,473
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
Let's look at walker's and gore's numbers over the past 2 seasons.

You specifically stated that Gore's hands were just as bad as Delanie's last season.

The numbers show that claim was far from accurate.

I maybe a goofball, but if I make an obvious mistake, I am willing to admit it, and move on.
[ Edited by buck on Jun 17, 2013 at 7:27 PM ]
My bold prediction is that most Niner fans will continue to stick up for Frank Gore because Frank Gore is awesome. I also predict that most Niner fans will realize that even though he is a strong-side LB playing with a bunch of other amazing LB's, Ahmed Brooks will be recognized as a vital part of a great Niners defense.
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
Let's look at walker's and gore's numbers over the past 2 seasons. This is according to the first source.

40 receptions for walker. 10 drops. 8 last season 2 the previous

45 receptions for gore. 10 drops. 4 last season 6 the previous.

Yeah according to the numbers delanie's hands are a bit worse, but they are def comparable.

The fact that the numbers you gave me and the numbers the first source gave me are different tells me neither is reliable.

I do know that the passes thrown to delanie had a faster velocity than the ones thrown to frank. It's common sense more than it is a fact. You throw a ball down field with a faster velocity than those at the LOS. Kind of hard to gauge when you sit behind a computer all day..

Also a new scheme change has nothing to do with a runningback catching the ball. Are any of the routes more difficult than the ones he was running when he averaging around 50 receptions a game? no they aren't. Did he have to learn how to catch a football differently in the new scheme? no he didn't. He's been doing it for years and has no excuse not to be able to catch the ball.
Lol, sitting behind the computer comment. classic. You have obviously never caught a full range of passes before while wearing full pads. You keep bringing up velocity as if thats the only factor to difficulty of catching a pass.

Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
Wasn't just talking about brooks' sacks. His overall production is pretty poor. Doesn't get a substantial amount of turnovers or tackles either. He is stout against the run, I'll give you that. But according to all of you goofballs he comes up with money plays . Notice how our defensive production tanked after the smiths went down, so apparently these money plays weren't as good as you make them out to be. We gave up way more points and yards than we had and had a total of 4 sacks in the entire playoffs. You can point the finger to the smiths being injured all you want, but at the end of the day they still played, and we lost the superbowl.

This is really begining to look like trolling lol.

Bet you I have. I've played tight end, D-end, safety and believe it or not quarterback. Only in pee-wee and high school though. I've also played numerous other sports growing up. I know there is more to it than just velocity which is also only going to help my argument so thanks for being that up. Kaep doesn't throw too many ducks so that's really a non-factor, but the location of the ball is everything in this argument as well. Delanie's degree of difficulty is much harder than gores. Typically gore doesn't have to adjust to catch the ball as he isn't very far away. Usually the ball is right on the money. Delanie usually has to contort his body and adjust to where the ball is being thrown. So thank you for bringning that up. Timing is another aspect to throwing the ball. Kaep's timing with his receivers needs to be improved going forward. I can't say that it was an advantage or disadvantage for delanie or gore but usually timing with your runningback isn't really as much of a factor as it is with tight ends. You have to hit a tight end as he is breaking off of a route while your usually checking down to your runningback. You rarely have to hit gore coming off his break because he doesn't run very complex routes.

Also if I am wrong on so many levels, why don't you tell me exactly where and how I am wrong? Again James is a scat back. I watched him plenty of times at Oregon but you insist that he runs like gore, which he doesn't. "he hides behind the line and jukes and picks his hole".. hmm sounds like a scat back to me. If you look at how he is used on our team and how he was used at Oregon then you would see the similarities between him and traditional scat backs. Typically downhill runners pick there hole early, lower their head and brace for contact. Those runningbacks are going to find it hard to succeed in the nfl with the new rule change. Your right gore is more of a patient runner than a downhill runner. James has some runs in which he is patient too, but usually when you see james run he is accelerating right away and then jumps between holes and picks one. James is NOT a traditional runningback. He is a scat back who plays better in space. He uses his speed to spread out the d and open up holes. The reason he runs inside the tackles so much is because d's respect his speed and don't let him get outside. So he fakes like he is going outside and bursts back inside.

As far as "halfbacks", there actually used to be 2 of them. The names pretty much speak for themselves. It tells how far away they lined up from the ball, but I guess you knew that already. Halfback is now used pretty commonly as if it was a running back or tailback. That's what I was referring to.
Originally posted by KegBert:
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
Originally posted by GNielsen:
I don't see them cutting Brooks. He's much more valuable to the defense than some believe. And he doesn't even cost the team that much money. He was actually subject to de-escalator options in his contract because the team didn't win 12 games and his playing percentage was about 1% short of a marker, so his 2013 salary will be something like $2.7 mil instead of the original $4.3 mil. At that cost, he's a tremendous asset to the team. He's under contract through 2017, so the FO obviously believes he's someone they would like to have the option to keep around.

Brooks is soo underrated to the function of the defense around here its not even funny.

Not by me. I think Brooks is a solid asset for the team, and I have argued this in other threads.

Wasnt pointing fingers at anyone buck. Anyone that has been following the defense thoroughly understands his value. Just comenting on the overall trend. People seem to think every OLB should be breaking 15 sacks every season and that is all they are there for.

Wasn't just talking about brooks' sacks. His overall production is pretty poor. Doesn't get a substantial amount of turnovers or tackles either. He is stout against the run, I'll give you that. But according to all of you goofballs he comes up with money plays . Notice how our defensive production tanked after the smiths went down, so apparently these money plays weren't as good as you make them out to be. We gave up way more points and yards than we had and had a total of 4 sacks in the entire playoffs. You can point the finger to the smiths being injured all you want, but at the end of the day they still played, and we lost the superbowl.

Those "money plays" they are referring to are the kind that secured wins for us like in the NFCCG last year. When the falcons are in our RZ driving on us for the go ahead score in the 4th qtr, on back to back snaps Brooks make huge plays. The first one, on 2nd down, he pressures Ryan forcing a short throw and gets a big hit on him that noticeably hurts his shoulder. Then on 3rd down Ryan rolls right, brooks shadows him and jumps up and bats the ball down, setting up Bowman's big 4th down pass breakup. That game could have turned out very different if brooks doesn't make those plays.

To see the plays i'm talking about go to the 8:40 mark in the video.

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/0ap2000000128766/49ers-vs-Falcons-highlights


So ahmad brooks takes credit for ryan landing wrong on his shoulder and getting injured?

That's only 2 plays too...
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
But according to all of you goofballs he comes up with money plays . .
goofballs.


1. Don't be a jerk.


good stuff buck-o. That made me laugh.
My bold prediction is that someone will make a

JimDrinkAMiller's lack of football knowledge thread

if the mods allow it.
  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 8,473
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
But according to all of you goofballs he comes up with money plays . .
goofballs.


1. Don't be a jerk.


good stuff buck-o. That made me laugh.

My name is not buck-o. My post was not intended to make you laugh.

I found your both your goofball remark and your response to my post insulting.

If you want to play the jerk go ahead, but it is against the rules.

Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
Bet you I have. I've played tight end, D-end, safety and believe it or not quarterback. Only in pee-wee and high school though. I've also played numerous other sports growing up. I know there is more to it than just velocity which is also only going to help my argument so thanks for being that up. Kaep doesn't throw too many ducks so that's really a non-factor, but the location of the ball is everything in this argument as well. Delanie's degree of difficulty is much harder than gores. Typically gore doesn't have to adjust to catch the ball as he isn't very far away. Usually the ball is right on the money. Delanie usually has to contort his body and adjust to where the ball is being thrown. So thank you for bringning that up. Timing is another aspect to throwing the ball. Kaep's timing with his receivers needs to be improved going forward. I can't say that it was an advantage or disadvantage for delanie or gore but usually timing with your runningback isn't really as much of a factor as it is with tight ends. You have to hit a tight end as he is breaking off of a route while your usually checking down to your runningback. You rarely have to hit gore coming off his break because he doesn't run very complex routes.

Also if I am wrong on so many levels, why don't you tell me exactly where and how I am wrong? Again James is a scat back. I watched him plenty of times at Oregon but you insist that he runs like gore, which he doesn't. "he hides behind the line and jukes and picks his hole".. hmm sounds like a scat back to me. If you look at how he is used on our team and how he was used at Oregon then you would see the similarities between him and traditional scat backs. Typically downhill runners pick there hole early, lower their head and brace for contact. Those runningbacks are going to find it hard to succeed in the nfl with the new rule change. Your right gore is more of a patient runner than a downhill runner. James has some runs in which he is patient too, but usually when you see james run he is accelerating right away and then jumps between holes and picks one. James is NOT a traditional runningback. He is a scat back who plays better in space. He uses his speed to spread out the d and open up holes. The reason he runs inside the tackles so much is because d's respect his speed and don't let him get outside. So he fakes like he is going outside and bursts back inside.

As far as "halfbacks", there actually used to be 2 of them. The names pretty much speak for themselves. It tells how far away they lined up from the ball, but I guess you knew that already. Halfback is now used pretty commonly as if it was a running back or tailback. That's what I was referring to.

Never once have i said, or even eluded to Gore and James being similar backs. The rest of your post is amusing though. Your analysis of both RB's, HB's and Receiving routes is less than stellar to say the least. I dont need to tell you where you are wrong any longer. I have done so several times in this thread, as have other posters. It wouldnt make a differance if we went back and forth all off season, you would never concede that you are wrong and would continue to manipulate your conversation in an attempt to prove to yourself you are correct.

My bold prediction, as stated earlier, is Gore will be better in every statistical category than last season, having possibly the best season of his career.

We will see who is more correct about Gore at the end of the season, that is if you are around long enough.

My not so bold prediction is you will fizzle out here pretty quickly like other similar posters that came before you.
[ Edited by IdahoNiner on Jun 17, 2013 at 8:06 PM ]
Just for the record:

Frank Gore's career drop percentage is 6.78% (31 drops in 457 targets, or on average just below 4 drops a season), which is not so bad. However, he's had a bad two years with a drop percentage of 11.11% in 2012 and 19.35% in 2011. Why is this?

If you look at his by year numbers, Frank Gore only had 36 targets in 2012 and only 31 targets in 2011. Before that?

2010 - 72 targets (4.17% drop percentage)
2009 - 75 targets (1.33% drop percentage)
2008 - 66 targets (7.58% drop percentage)
2007 - 69 targets (10.14% drop percentage)
2006 - 86 targets (3.49% drop percentage)
2005 - 22 targets (9.09% drop percentage)

So, by looking at this numbers, the less targets Frank Gore has on a season basis, the higher his drop percentage is. This is probably because Frank Gore is out of practice of receiving passes. Because he's out of practice, his hands are not as much in tune. So this tells me it's not so much as Frank Gore's fault as it is the offensive gameplan's fault. Frank Gore has always been a receiving threat. I don't know why since Jim Harbaugh got here that all of a sudden we're not using him a receiver. He's had 67 targets in 2012 and 2011 combined, but 72 targets alone in all of 2010. We need to get Gore back into the pass game.

And for the record, taking out Gore's rookie season when he split playing time with Kevan Barlow, Gore averages 62 receptions a season. Between 2006 and 2010, he averaged 73.6 receptions per season.

~Dann
Year Rec Drops Targets Drop %
2012 28 4 36 11.11%
2011 16 6 31 19.35%
2010 46 3 72 4.17%
2009 52 1 75 1.33%
2008 43 5 66 7.58%
2007 53 7 69 10.14%
2006 61 3 86 3.49%
2005 15 2 22 9.09%
Career 314 31 457 6.78%
Originally posted by IdahoNiner:
Originally posted by JimDrinkAMiller:
Bet you I have. I've played tight end, D-end, safety and believe it or not quarterback. Only in pee-wee and high school though. I've also played numerous other sports growing up. I know there is more to it than just velocity which is also only going to help my argument so thanks for being that up. Kaep doesn't throw too many ducks so that's really a non-factor, but the location of the ball is everything in this argument as well. Delanie's degree of difficulty is much harder than gores. Typically gore doesn't have to adjust to catch the ball as he isn't very far away. Usually the ball is right on the money. Delanie usually has to contort his body and adjust to where the ball is being thrown. So thank you for bringning that up. Timing is another aspect to throwing the ball. Kaep's timing with his receivers needs to be improved going forward. I can't say that it was an advantage or disadvantage for delanie or gore but usually timing with your runningback isn't really as much of a factor as it is with tight ends. You have to hit a tight end as he is breaking off of a route while your usually checking down to your runningback. You rarely have to hit gore coming off his break because he doesn't run very complex routes.

Also if I am wrong on so many levels, why don't you tell me exactly where and how I am wrong? Again James is a scat back. I watched him plenty of times at Oregon but you insist that he runs like gore, which he doesn't. "he hides behind the line and jukes and picks his hole".. hmm sounds like a scat back to me. If you look at how he is used on our team and how he was used at Oregon then you would see the similarities between him and traditional scat backs. Typically downhill runners pick there hole early, lower their head and brace for contact. Those runningbacks are going to find it hard to succeed in the nfl with the new rule change. Your right gore is more of a patient runner than a downhill runner. James has some runs in which he is patient too, but usually when you see james run he is accelerating right away and then jumps between holes and picks one. James is NOT a traditional runningback. He is a scat back who plays better in space. He uses his speed to spread out the d and open up holes. The reason he runs inside the tackles so much is because d's respect his speed and don't let him get outside. So he fakes like he is going outside and bursts back inside.

As far as "halfbacks", there actually used to be 2 of them. The names pretty much speak for themselves. It tells how far away they lined up from the ball, but I guess you knew that already. Halfback is now used pretty commonly as if it was a running back or tailback. That's what I was referring to.

Never once have i said, or even eluded to Gore and James being similar backs. The rest of your post is amusing though.

My bold prediction, as stated earlier, is Gore will be better in every statistical category than last season, having possibly the best season of his career.

We will see who is more correct about Gore at the end of the season, that is if you are around long enough.

My not so bold prediction is you will fizzle out here pretty quickly like other similar posters that came before you.

I am going to have to agree with this guys prediction. ^^^ As he said it isn't that bold but ill put my money in his corner.
I don't know if Gore will have the best season of his career, but I stand by my earlier prediction that he will go over a thousand again and have over 10 TD's.
  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 8,473
ElDannMann

Where did you get the stats for Gore?

I have different numbers. I got them from Pro Football Focus.

It would be nice to have another source of information.

Thanks
Originally posted by GNielsen:
I don't know if Gore will have the best season of his career, but I stand by my earlier prediction that he will go over a thousand again and have over 10 TD's.

10 TD's is bold IMO, really depends on how much of the focus shift to rushing in the RZ. Gore has only acheived 10 rushing TD's once in his career,and that was in 2009. But i will say it is certainly doable. He has had 8 each of the last two seasons, and he certainly left several on the field each season. It seems like i recall several times over the last two season where we got into the redzone based on his legs, but then once in the redzone they took him off the feild for rest, and someone else got the gimme TD.

Certainly doable.
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