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Secondary is Niners X factor this year

  • Kolohe
  • Hall of Fame
  • Posts: 31,337
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Kolohe:
Originally posted by NCommand:
As to the OP, yes, I have some major concerns about our secondary and I'm not sure if we fully addressed the issues.
  • Slot CB - Amendola (with one collar bone) destroyed us last year. Welker did OK. But now we face Austin and Harvin and maybe more. Aside from the size, quickness and speed of Darryl Morris, do we really have anyone who can seriously fit this role to a T?

I think we do in Tarrell Brown, but Fangio keeps him outside covering the bigger receiver. Its frustrating as hell cause we all know Brown has the size, fluidity and quickness to blanket these slot receivers, but instead has Carlos Rogers covering them.

In the 2001 NBA Championship when Derek Fisher use to guard Allen Iverson and Iverson was too quick and fast for him. Then Phil Jackson got smart and put Tyronn Lue on Iverson and Iverson couldn't do s**t small vs. small. Tarrell Brown = Tyronn Lue

Thanks K...you know, I thought about that one as well. I think I even proposed sticking with the new Baalke-theme and going more press coverage (physical/aggressive) with Culliver and Nnamdi on the outside with Brown slipping inside to the slot. But right now, Brown is our best outside CB so are the coaches really willing to do this? They do have balls...so let's see.

True, Brown maybe be our best cover corner and I can also understand why Fangio and Donatell would keep him outside. Believe it or not but Brown actually had good coverage on Roddy White and Julio Jones in the playoffs, only reasons why he was beat one, height and two refs didn't call a couple of push offs. Hopefully Nnamdi will allow Brown to move inside to cover the slot, cause I really think he matches up well with Percy Harvin and Tavon Austin.
Browns gotta be in the 4.55-4.6 area in this juncture of his career. Which, smarts and quickness will get you only so far when your dealing with receivers of that long speed caliber. Bailey also could be a threat..
You see those biceps bro?

Originally posted by jrg:
You see those biceps bro?


here comes a taylor mays comment in 3....2....1.....
Interesting fact: To date, no team that Nnamdi Asomugha has played for in his career has ever made the playoffs. Furthermore, only twice (OAK 2010 & PHI 2011) has that team finished with a record of .500. The remaining seasons, 5 wins or less.
Originally posted by spizzy:
Interesting fact: To date, no team that Nnamdi Asomugha has played for in his career has ever made the playoffs. Furthermore, only twice (OAK 2010 & PHI 2011) has that team finished with a record of .500. The remaining seasons, 5 wins or less.

And Tracy McGrady had never made the 2nd round of the playoffs before
Originally posted by dhp318:
And Tracy McGrady had never made the 2nd round of the playoffs before

Not saying it means anything, just saying its interesting. Cool your jets bro
Originally posted by spizzy:
Interesting fact: To date, no team that Nnamdi Asomugha has played for in his career has ever made the playoffs. Furthermore, only twice (OAK 2010 & PHI 2011) has that team finished with a record of .500. The remaining seasons, 5 wins or less.

Why do you think it was so easy and painless for the Niners to sign him? Nnamdi finally gets to the playoffs this season. Maybe even a SB.
Originally posted by bdub2588:
Originally posted by NCommand:
As to the OP, yes, I have some major concerns about our secondary and I'm not sure if we fully addressed the issues.
  • Pass rush - No doubt Baalke feels with added pass rush and rotation in the front 7, the secondary will benefit (duh). That said, with a stronger back end, we'd get more "coverage sacks" too. So it works both ways. Did Baalke help the front 7 by improving the back end?
  • Scheme - quick, it's 3 and 3. How far off will our CB's play off? 5 or 10 yards? This is an issue b/c we don't have any burners who can recover on a poor first step and we don't have the physical CB's (minus Culliver) to play press...welcome Nnamdi.
  • Technique - I noticed a BIG difference from the previous year. Rogers got his big contract by breaking off routes with over-the-top coverage and undercutting WR routes. He didn't do that one time last year and it, to me, appeared we stayed with the theme of keeping everything in front of them (very few challenges) but worse, the CB's didn't play the ball until it reached the WR's; in short, they didn't keep an eye on the QB and didn't use their experience to jump balls . As a result, our TO's went WAY down. For a microcasm of this issue, watch how differently the CB's for the Ravens played vs. ours. Polar opposite. This is a combination of scheme and technique. Also, as noted on NFL Network, our S's got so used to playing so deep and down hill, they were VERY susceptible to double moves and even blown coverages (even as last as the freaking Superbowl).
  • Whitner - let's be real, we love this dude and he is SO well spoken, he'll have a long career as a commentator. He's a leader and helps relay the defensive plays. He is excellent playing down hill and in the box. The problem is he is short, has no vertical and is even slower now. He was destroyed for 14 TD's alone last year and most were on bigger, taller, more physical slot WR's and TE's. This is STILL a huge glaring weakness. Unless the FO feels Dahl can step in and give up less (possible), we still have no answer for this and teams will continue to exploit him.
  • Rogers - dude got paid and IMHO, half-asses it all last year. Once he got burned and the spot light was on him, then he'd play harder. But the fact is, when we needed him most (3rd down against Boldin), he failed. Baalke has noted he wants to get taller, strong, more physical at CB (ala Seattle). Rogers, his half-ass attitude and his contract don't align. Nnamdi was brought in to not only fit that mold but push Rogers ass! Again, welcome Nnamdi!
  • Nnamdi - already stated he fits the Baalke ideal now (see also, Marcus Cooper)
  • Reid for Goldson - upside is even higher than Goldson and he's already smarter than him. Fingers crossed here he develops and develops quickly.
  • Slot CB - Amendola (with one collar bone) destroyed us last year. Welker did OK. But now we face Austin and Harvin and maybe more. Aside from the size, quickness and speed of Darryl Morris, do we really have anyone who can seriously fit this role to a T?
Not a lot to pick apart here.

Just to add visual evidence, if you watch the second video imbedded here of Lockette beating both Rogers and Goldson, you'll see the poor technique I'm talking about. We currently see it with both Cully and Brown as well. They don't play the ball. Instead, they play the WR once the ball arrives in the WR's hands (too late and never once looked back for the ball). The other issue here is it's a free, clean release by the CB off the LOS. Even with GREAT pressure, the secondary sets itself up for failure with poor technique and no safety help. As usual, our CB's have no over-the-top help while Goldson trails, jogging along watching Rogers get burned...big issue for us. In a synchronized effort, the S is supposed to yell "turn" just as the ball is arriving so the CB can continue to sprint/recover through the coverage and turn and play the ball at the right moment.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000206076/article/san-francisco-49er-sleeper-kaepernicks-roommate
  • KK49
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 141
Originally posted by NCommand:
Agreed, this is a worry for me as well. Hopefully Dorsey is motivated to play NT (and can play it well). Ian's been developing for years so let's "hope" he's ready now. But for big bruising running teams (a struggle for us), we may see more 4-man DL rotations this year, maybe even a wild card such as NT Lamar Divens (6'3" 340) making the team for this situation as well as goal line and short yardage situations. The problem with 4 man DL is it takes one guy out of the secondary which can be trouble on a play-action pass.

agreed too... after crabs injury we r talking about who will play WR , but I think the biggest question is how DL will manage. at least on offense we have Keapernick. . do u really trust ian, coz I don't see Dorsey as full time NT?? and who is this guy Divens ?? any good, .. I guess not coz I just saw on 49ers.com that he has more experience that jerod-eddie.. at least I ve heard of jerod.. . by the way wish Cooper and Morris make the team... we need some fresh blood to replace those short , mostly ST , players....
I'm leveling my expectations for our secondary this year. A lot of new faces.

Goldson was replaceable i agree, and i know we couldn't afford that contract. But I see Dahl starting and eventually giving way to Reid. Unless another cat jumps in

Namdi??? Does he still got enough left? TBD. I do like him in a nickel package.

I'm liking Brown a lot this yr. Much more than Rogers for sure.

I think too Culliver got mentally raped super bowl week so jury is still out on him. he needs to check that tude at the door.

NEED THAT PASS RUSH!!! Healthy and DEEP!
Originally posted by wailers15:
I'm leveling my expectations for our secondary this year.

I think too Culliver got mentally raped super bowl week so jury is still out on him. he needs to check that tude at the door.

NEED THAT PASS RUSH!!! Healthy and DEEP!

And physically

Originally posted by bdub2588:
Browns gotta be in the 4.55-4.6 area in this juncture of his career. Which, smarts and quickness will get you only so far when your dealing with receivers of that long speed caliber. Bailey also could be a threat..

He just finished his sixth year and outside his rookie year he has only missed 2 career games and has stayed pretty much injury free. Doubt he'd lose that much speed in that short of time.