Mario Manningham has a Torn ACL and PCL

Originally posted by dj43:
I'm not knocking either of those two guys. I am only responding to those who see them as anything more than decent #3s behind two strong guys above them. In this case, the 49ers need a big strong guy with above average speed to draw at least some of the fire away from Crabtree. Williams and Manningham can easily be defended by a single defensive back. So while a good team needs that level of player, they are only effective if there are two strong players above them.

I agree with this. Manningham is and always has been a #3, nothing wrong with that, but he's not the sort of playmaker that defenses will fret about. Houston has had the issues of constantly finding #3 and #4 WR's and putting them opposite Andre Johnson with little success. This team ultimately needs another top WR that can pick up the slack when team's are focusing on Crabtree and Davis.

If you've got 2 very good WR's, a guy like Manningham is a nice complement, but if all you've got besides Crabtree is him, Williams, Jenkins and Vince Papale, that's a pretty sorry WR receiving corps.

Originally posted by okdkid:
No #2 or #3 WR causes a defense to lose any sleep. That's why they're a #2 or #3.

Not every player can be in the Pro Bowl. Players like Kyle Williams and Mario Manningham are incredibly valuable to a roster like ours.

Are you sure about that? Explain Jordy Nelson, Julio Jones and Victor Cruz then.

Originally posted by Phoenix49ers:

Originally posted by okdkid:
No #2 or #3 WR causes a defense to lose any sleep. That's why they're a #2 or #3.

Not every player can be in the Pro Bowl. Players like Kyle Williams and Mario Manningham are incredibly valuable to a roster like ours.

Are you sure about that? Explain Jordy Nelson, Julio Jones and Victor Cruz then.

Yeah. The Packers are de-valuing Jennings because they know Nelson is their go to guy. Cruz is the top WR option in NY both in receptions and yards. And there is no #2 between Jones and Roddy White, both are targeted equally.

Originally posted by okdkid:
No #2 or #3 WR causes a defense to lose any sleep. That's why they're a #2 or #3.

Not every player can be in the Pro Bowl. Players like Kyle Williams and Mario Manningham are incredibly valuable to a roster like ours.

Not sure how you define #2 receiver, but there are clearly teams that more than one receiver who might cause a team to lose sleep.

Off the top of my head, here are a few:

Atlanta White and Jones
Denver Thomas and Decker
NO Colson and Moore
Baltimore Boldin and Smith
New England Welker and Lloyd
Indianapolis Wayne and Hilton
Green Bay Cobb, Jones, Nelson
NYG Cruz and Hicks
Philadelphia Jackson and Maclin

The fact is the team needs better wide receivers.
The reality is our wide receivers are the weakest unit on the team.

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by okdkid:

Originally posted by dj43:
He isn't a "scrub." He just isn't anyone that is going to cause a good defense to lose any sleep. Remember, he was #3 in NY. He has never come close to fulfilling his pre-draft hype. Sometimes that is just the way it falls.

In any case, his injury status precludes him figuring in any way into fall plans. The best he can hope for is an injury settlement and a chance to hook on somewhere later in the season.

No #2 or #3 WR causes a defense to lose any sleep. That's why they're a #2 or #3.

Not every player can be in the Pro Bowl. Players like Kyle Williams and Mario Manningham are incredibly valuable to a roster like ours.

I'm not knocking either of those two guys. I am only responding to those who see them as anything more than decent #3s behind two strong guys above them. In this case, the 49ers need a big strong guy with above average speed to draw at least some of the fire away from Crabtree. Williams and Manningham can easily be defended by a single defensive back. So while a good team needs that level of player, they are only effective if there are two strong players above them.

One would hope that Vernon Davis would be enough here but for some reason this doesn't seem to be the case... we almost have the ideal situation for 2nd WR to excel but it's amazing that it hasn't happened.

Originally posted by 9erfanAUS:
One would hope that Vernon Davis would be enough here but for some reason this doesn't seem to be the case... we almost have the ideal situation for 2nd WR to excel but it's amazing that it hasn't happened.

I disagree. I think Crabtree has done a fantastic job of excelling the past two seasons. Now if we can get a true #1 in here we'll be in business.

Originally posted by NinerG94:
I disagree. I think Crabtree has done a fantastic job of excelling the past two seasons. Now if we can get a true #1 in here we'll be in business.

How would you go about getting a #1 WR?

How am I supposed to know if the 49ers organization doesn't know? We haven't had on since Owens. I know Crabtree was supposed to be that guy but I never thought he was big or fast enough for that role. He has been playing the position and is the #1 WR on this team but his skillset isn't that of a one. I'm sorry, and I'm not saying he isn't a good receiver. In fact I think he's an above average WR but his game is limited. He can't get deep and he hasn't faced double teams very much if at all compared to other #1 wideouts. Davis gets all the extra attention and its why Crabtree has excelled. If we could get one more big time threat at receiver on this team, I think defenses would have at ton of trouble in the secondary trying to cover all these guys. We need a legitimate deep threat that isn't a TE.

In one of the Rams game we lost he was damn near impossible to stop on the quick slants. Really thought he was coming into his own then. His quickness at the line will give help us in the RZ if he comes back to full strength.

Originally posted by Squidp:
In one of the Rams game we lost he was damn near impossible to stop on the quick slants. Really thought he was coming into his own then. His quickness at the line will give help us in the RZ if he comes back to full strength.

I personally feel we need a big bodied red zone target. Someone to free up not only Crabtree, but VD as well. We have the quickness in Crabtree, Ham and hopefully Jenkins. What we need is someone who can win a jump ball, go up high to get a pass, and relieve pressure off this entire offense down there. Maybe someone who could also help stretch the field.

Why I wish we would have drafted Stephen Hill. Not sure exactly how good he's going to be, but add a little weight to him he fits that mold pretty well.

Originally posted by okdkid:
No #2 or #3 WR causes a defense to lose any sleep. That's why they're a #2 or #3.

Not every player can be in the Pro Bowl. Players like Kyle Williams and Mario Manningham are incredibly valuable to a roster like ours.

Hahah, kyle williams and Manningham shouldn't even be mentioned in the same sentence. Mannigham is far more productive than kw ever will be. And greatest of all Manningham is clutch in all the big games. He could have been the difference maker in the super bowl for us.

Originally posted by JiksJuicy:
I personally feel we need a big bodied red zone target. Someone to free up not only Crabtree, but VD as well. We have the quickness in Crabtree, Ham and hopefully Jenkins. What we need is someone who can win a jump ball, go up high to get a pass, and relieve pressure off this entire offense down there. Maybe someone who could also help stretch the field.

Why I wish we would have drafted Stephen Hill. Not sure exactly how good he's going to be, but add a little weight to him he fits that mold pretty well.

I agrre with your post. I'm still pounding my head against the concrete wondering why the hell they drafted jenkins. We def should have got Stephen Hill. We trully need the big body and fast Moss/Owens/ Calvin Johnson type Wide out. No scrawny little receivers like jenkins who's short and can't get off the line even after the play is over. We have been desperate for the big game breaking WR since TO left.

I'm not sure why everyone is so perplexed about this. Jenkins and Hill had very similar 40 times, but Jenkins looked like he had better breakaway long speed and Jenkins was much more consistently productive on film in college so they probably thought he won on "intangibles". Jenkins also had a better vertical leap. They drafted Jenkins in expectation that Kaepernick would eventually be throwing real long passes to him. I think it's too early to conclude that they made the wrong decision between the two.

Originally posted by 49ersHeroine:
I agrre with your post. I'm still pounding my head against the concrete wondering why the hell they drafted jenkins. We def should have got Stephen Hill. We trully need the big body and fast Moss/Owens/ Calvin Johnson type Wide out. No scrawny little receivers like jenkins who's short and can't get off the line even after the play is over. We have been desperate for the big game breaking WR since TO left.

Agree as well. I want a size speed guy at WR and I don't care when or how we get one. Cordarrelle Patterson would be an option. Before any of you jump on me about this guy being risky let me say this. Every college prospect is risky and if Cordarrelle is so risky then why is he projected to go in the first round? My guess is potential. Seen way too many post on this forum about this being to risky of a pick for the first round. So its only risky for the 49ers? I don't get it. Like AJ Jenkins wasn't risky? Patterson's may not have the college production that Jenkins had but Jenkins is living proof that college production isn't the be all end all for wide receivers at the next level either. At the very least Patterson is big enough to beat press coverage and be a nice red zone target and hopefully develop into well rounded WR. I don't want to see anymore fades to Crabtree!

Originally posted by GNielsen:
I'm not sure why everyone is so perplexed about this. Jenkins and Hill had very similar 40 times, but Jenkins looked like he had better breakaway long speed and Jenkins was much more consistently productive on film in college so they probably thought he won on "intangibles". Jenkins also had a better vertical leap. They drafted Jenkins in expectation that Kaepernick would eventually be throwing real long passes to him. I think it's too early to conclude that they made the wrong decision between the two.

Not really perplexed, just saying that I think he probably would have at least given us a different option with the bigger body. I'm not disappointed about the Jenkins pick, but just think that's what we need. Hill possess both, while Jenkins possesses the speed and quickness.

Actually excited to see what Jenkins has, cause at this point I don't have a clue. Hopefully a year to sit and learn has really benefitted him and he can get things going and add that vertical threat.

Regardless I still think we need that bigger receiver. Doesn't have to be a super star, but someone.