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Greg Roman, is he really good?

  • 9er2k
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 6,552
Originally posted by sincalfaithful:
Originally posted by 9er2k:
Originally posted by sincalfaithful:
Originally posted by 9er2k:
Roman=Mike Martz Jr

no Roman doesn't know what a passing game is

I meant there both creative as hell but when it comes down to doing the obvious(running in the redzone when your on a roll,etc.) they stick to their stubborn ways because they think there going to out think everyone

you mean like calling for Lamichael James to set up to attempt a halfback option on the last drive of the NFC title game

exactly
Originally posted by NCommand:
True...I think the orginal point was that every play call is signed off by Harnaugh himself before going into CK (although, this is an assumption TMBK).

The other issue is that if the passing calls change dramatically, we'll know Roman WAS the primary issue. Also, if Roman was so renowned, why has Harbaugh been assisting more with play calling and why is he going to call more next year?

Like I said all along, I've been hoping Baalke steps in at some point and relieves Roman and hires a true OC who can utilize all of our weapons consistently and is much more well-rounded and experienced...perhaps a better QB coach as well and I hope Baalke turns the offense completely over to this OC (like how the DC is totally left up to Fangio)...this way, Harbaugh can focus on JUST coaching and developing his young QB and the nuances of the game like time management and situational awareness. I can dream...right?

baalke doesn't have that power...and if he did i'd be worried cuz that is a recipe for disaster, u want ur head coach to have full power over his coaching staff and the 53 man roster and the GM to have full power over drafting/trading etc

once players are drafted and on team they belong to the head coach not the GM

that's how we have it now and its working real well
can harbaugh call plays? i wonder if he even is the type to be able to do that
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by NCommand:
True...I think the orginal point was that every play call is signed off by Harnaugh himself before going into CK (although, this is an assumption TMBK).

The other issue is that if the passing calls change dramatically, we'll know Roman WAS the primary issue. Also, if Roman was so renowned, why has Harbaugh been assisting more with play calling and why is he going to call more next year?

Like I said all along, I've been hoping Baalke steps in at some point and relieves Roman and hires a true OC who can utilize all of our weapons consistently and is much more well-rounded and experienced...perhaps a better QB coach as well and I hope Baalke turns the offense completely over to this OC (like how the DC is totally left up to Fangio)...this way, Harbaugh can focus on JUST coaching and developing his young QB and the nuances of the game like time management and situational awareness. I can dream...right?

The article was speaking about the future. It clearly indicated, rightly or wrongly, that Harbaugh will be more active in setting the passing scheme and the play calling.

Your dreams of Baalke forcing a change at offensive coordinator seem to be well just dreams.

First, we have no indication that Baalke had anything to do with the presumed independence of Fangio. My understanding is that that independence was the result of an agreement between Harbaugh and Fangio. But, my understanding is not based upon anything concrete. I do not know enough to pretend that my assumptions are more than my assumptions.

In the last year, Fangio rotated more on the defensive line and called more blitzes. Those changes might have been due to the influence of Baalke or Baalke and Harbaugh. But, the changes could have been made by Fangio by himself. My best guess, and it only a guess, that these changes were the result of a collaborative effort involving Fangio, Harbaugh, and Baalke.

Based upon the article, it seems that there is a recognized need to improve the passing scheme, passing play calls, and to improve the wide receiving corps. The article may or not be correct.

It will be interesting to see what happens in the future. In fact, I believe it will more than just interesting.

Way to kill my dream/hope, man!

I agree about Fangio...usually when a coach is hired "control" over certain aspects of the team are discussed. My contention though is that if there IS a problem like we clearly have here with the passing game, a GM can implement his power...in fact, he can downright FIRE the OC and if the coach doesn't like it, he could be fired as well. But given the relationship HarBaalke have, my best guess is that, like you noted, there is a collaboration at works and this article is just more proof its well recognized within the organization itself. I'm VERY curious to see what happens...they brought in Mangini to help Roman and now Harbaugh is going to assume even more control of, at least, the passing game. I wonder if someone else is going to be given more play calling responsbilities in lieu of Roman in the booth as a contigency plan or they look to streamline the game planning and in-game process of play calling.
  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 11,345
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by NCommand:
True...I think the orginal point was that every play call is signed off by Harnaugh himself before going into CK (although, this is an assumption TMBK).

The other issue is that if the passing calls change dramatically, we'll know Roman WAS the primary issue. Also, if Roman was so renowned, why has Harbaugh been assisting more with play calling and why is he going to call more next year?

Like I said all along, I've been hoping Baalke steps in at some point and relieves Roman and hires a true OC who can utilize all of our weapons consistently and is much more well-rounded and experienced...perhaps a better QB coach as well and I hope Baalke turns the offense completely over to this OC (like how the DC is totally left up to Fangio)...this way, Harbaugh can focus on JUST coaching and developing his young QB and the nuances of the game like time management and situational awareness. I can dream...right?

The article was speaking about the future. It clearly indicated, rightly or wrongly, that Harbaugh will be more active in setting the passing scheme and the play calling.

Your dreams of Baalke forcing a change at offensive coordinator seem to be well just dreams.

First, we have no indication that Baalke had anything to do with the presumed independence of Fangio. My understanding is that that independence was the result of an agreement between Harbaugh and Fangio. But, my understanding is not based upon anything concrete. I do not know enough to pretend that my assumptions are more than my assumptions.

In the last year, Fangio rotated more on the defensive line and called more blitzes. Those changes might have been due to the influence of Baalke or Baalke and Harbaugh. But, the changes could have been made by Fangio by himself. My best guess, and it only a guess, that these changes were the result of a collaborative effort involving Fangio, Harbaugh, and Baalke.

Based upon the article, it seems that there is a recognized need to improve the passing scheme, passing play calls, and to improve the wide receiving corps. The article may or not be correct.

It will be interesting to see what happens in the future. In fact, I believe it will more than just interesting.

Way to kill my dream/hope, man!

I agree about Fangio...usually when a coach is hired "control" over certain aspects of the team are discussed. My contention though is that if there IS a problem like we clearly have here with the passing game, a GM can implement his power...in fact, he can downright FIRE the OC and if the coach doesn't like it, he could be fired as well. But given the relationship HarBaalke have, my best guess is that, like you noted, there is a collaboration at works and this article is just more proof its well recognized within the organization itself. I'm VERY curious to see what happens...they brought in Mangini to help Roman and now Harbaugh is going to assume even more control of, at least, the passing game. I wonder if someone else is going to be given more play calling responsbilities in lieu of Roman in the booth as a contigency plan or they look to streamline the game planning and in-game process of play calling.

Sorry.

I would like to know what is going to happen--and I would love to know right now.

But, reality and my desires often do not match.

We just have to wait and see.

edit: at least there seems to be recognition that the passing game needs to improve.
[ Edited by buck on Feb 5, 2014 at 10:30 AM ]
Originally posted by NCommand:
Way to kill my dream/hope, man!

I agree about Fangio...usually when a coach is hired "control" over certain aspects of the team are discussed. My contention though is that if there IS a problem like we clearly have here with the passing game, a GM can implement his power...in fact, he can downright FIRE the OC and if the coach doesn't like it, he could be fired as well. But given the relationship HarBaalke have, my best guess is that, like you noted, there is a collaboration at works and this article is just more proof its well recognized within the organization itself. I'm VERY curious to see what happens...they brought in Mangini to help Roman and now Harbaugh is going to assume even more control of, at least, the passing game. I wonder if someone else is going to be given more play calling responsbilities in lieu of Roman in the booth as a contigency plan or they look to streamline the game planning and in-game process of play calling.

baalke doesn't have the power to fire harbaugh's coaches...he can suggest it to harbaugh and harbaugh can tell him to go fck himself and at which point jed would have to step in

as a rule coaches are loyal to their assistants and they won't be told who to fire/hire...that's their domain
in fact, u might re-call the presser b4 the nfc champ game where harbaugh patted himself on the back for having a unique skill to identify great coaches...and he credited that to his growing up around coaches his whole life
  • buck
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 11,345
Originally posted by iLL49er:
baalke doesn't have the power to fire harbaugh's coaches...he can suggest it to harbaugh and harbaugh can tell him to go fck himself and at which point jed would have to step in

as a rule coaches are loyal to their assistants and they won't be told who to fire/hire...that's their domain

Are you sure that Baalke can not fire one of Harbaugh's coaches?

Do you have a link that supports this claim or it just your assumption?

I really do not know.
It seems like Roman/Harbaugh live and die by there style of offense and refuse to adapt and change. The offense is very simple run the ball with Gore and Kaepernick with his strong arm throw down field or run. That's a huge chunk of the offense not much else happens.
There is so much talent here that just isn't used ( Davis Crabtree Boldin Gore ) and no one else. To throw defenses off how about getting Patton involved or LMJ or Mcdonald or Osgood or Hunter or Dixon or Baldwin all those players get very little use are they not good enough? or does Roman just now know to come up with plays for them?

My dream Roman offense for next year Crabtree and Boldin for possession receiving to keep the chains moving Patton and hopefully a rookie speedster to throw down field to. Davis can be both down field and possession. Also in the draft i want a true slot receiver a small super quick guy to throw to underneath. Also some screens to Gore and Lattimore if no ones open down field throw it underneath to them only Miller was used in this role last season. They need to make teams pay all over the field underneath middle and deep right now other teams only respect the line of scrimmage with Gore they need to make teams fear them on all parts of the field.
[ Edited by Raul98 on Feb 5, 2014 at 10:48 AM ]
Originally posted by iLL49er:
Originally posted by NCommand:
Way to kill my dream/hope, man!

I agree about Fangio...usually when a coach is hired "control" over certain aspects of the team are discussed. My contention though is that if there IS a problem like we clearly have here with the passing game, a GM can implement his power...in fact, he can downright FIRE the OC and if the coach doesn't like it, he could be fired as well. But given the relationship HarBaalke have, my best guess is that, like you noted, there is a collaboration at works and this article is just more proof its well recognized within the organization itself. I'm VERY curious to see what happens...they brought in Mangini to help Roman and now Harbaugh is going to assume even more control of, at least, the passing game. I wonder if someone else is going to be given more play calling responsbilities in lieu of Roman in the booth as a contigency plan or they look to streamline the game planning and in-game process of play calling.

baalke doesn't have the power to fire harbaugh's coaches...he can suggest it to harbaugh and harbaugh can tell him to go fck himself and at which point jed would have to step in

as a rule coaches are loyal to their assistants and they won't be told who to fire/hire...that's their domain

You're right...he only has the power to hire him.
[ Edited by NCommand on Feb 5, 2014 at 10:59 AM ]
Originally posted by buck:
Sorry.

I would like to know what is going to happen--and I would love to know right now.

But, reality and my desires often do not match.

We just have to wait and see.

edit: at least there seems to be recognition that the passing game needs to improve.

Truuuuuuue!
Originally posted by Raul98:
There is so much talent here that just isn't used ( Davis Crabtree Boldin Gore ) and no one else. To throw defenses off how about getting Patton involved or LMJ or Mcdonald or Osgood or Hunter or Dixon or Baldwin all those players get very little use are they not good enough? Or does Roman just now know to come up with plays for them?

He usually will throw James, Hunter and McDonald 1 bone a game...they usually work too...and then never goes back to them again. This one I don't understand at all.
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by iLL49er:
baalke doesn't have the power to fire harbaugh's coaches...he can suggest it to harbaugh and harbaugh can tell him to go fck himself and at which point jed would have to step in

as a rule coaches are loyal to their assistants and they won't be told who to fire/hire...that's their domain

Are you sure that Baalke can not fire one of Harbaugh's coaches?

Do you have a link that supports this claim or it just your assumption?

I really do not know.

its been stated b4 in articles, you're free to go find them if you desire

its pretty standard at the NFL level, coaches w/ any amount of leverage will have the ability to control their staff

i'm pretty sure harbaugh has leverage
Originally posted by iLL49er:
Originally posted by buck:
Originally posted by iLL49er:
baalke doesn't have the power to fire harbaugh's coaches...he can suggest it to harbaugh and harbaugh can tell him to go fck himself and at which point jed would have to step in

as a rule coaches are loyal to their assistants and they won't be told who to fire/hire...that's their domain

Are you sure that Baalke can not fire one of Harbaugh's coaches?

Do you have a link that supports this claim or it just your assumption?

I really do not know.

its been stated b4 in articles, you're free to go find them if you desire

its pretty standard at the NFL level, coaches w/ any amount of leverage will have the ability to control their staff

i'm pretty sure harbaugh has leverage

This I wouldn't be surprised about at all...in fact there was an article recently that noted that Harbaugh's next contract, he will probably want more "power." That's defined in contracts. But at the end of the day, Harbaugh is still hired by Baalke and if it doesn't work out, Baalke can fire him as well. Hopefully it would never come to that and Harbaugh adjusts and either rethinks his offensive philosophy and/or tinkers with all the aspects (including Roman and company and the system) to make the offense much more complete and effective esp. re: the passing game.
Roman did a better coaching job than the #1 offense in Denver
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