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Greg Roman, is he really good?

http://espn.go.com/blog/san-francisco-49ers/post/_/id/3753/will-greg-roman-get-head-coaching-looks

Anyone think Greg Roman has a shot? Before the season I thought Carolina would be a good spot for Greg Roman, but obviously the Panthers have turned it around. Minnesota is a nice possibility. Although many may think Rex Ryan deserves to be fired, I think he did a good job this year under the circumstances. Washington seems like another logical choice. What other coaching jobs will be open (besides Houston)?
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Thl, no harm done, and in retrospect, I reread your post, and as noted, I noted the AS reference, and we WERE talking about two entirely different things. Sorry for the confusion.

jonnydel and Adrian I respect you guys and am in the process of completely relearning football as I thot I knew it since back in the B & W 12" TV days, that broadcast the mudbowl, circa 1956. After h.s. and then college, I have just watched games and thot I knew what I was seeing...but obviously didn't .Thanks to you two and Thl, and NC, it has been a revelation, not to mention a fascinating experience. But... I certainly agree the 2nd half we were coached a lot better, or heck, even well. The first half, however, had this been an elite team, which we face from here on out, we would have been blown out of the tub. The craziness of the calls, the nutty sequences, finding a winner and then going away from it, the disjointedness of what was being called...gad, it was painful...and also, nowhere near enough to get us past our first playoff game...let alone any others.

so I ask you: just exactly what would you all recommend we do, coaching wise, to get an entire game coached coherently? I wouldn't worry as bad if this were a first time event...but it isn't. It is the antithesis of a BW coached game, with the first 25 plays written on a cardboard. Here the first half is just by gosh and by golly, no reasoning, no direction, nothing. How in the world do we win from here on if we play goofball football the first half? Frankly we were lucky to win this one, giving the first half away like it didn't matter. Maybe some of this is on the players, but #81 and #15 were ready to play...not so much some of the others. But overall,the coaching calls in first half were epically bad. Why and how is this fixed? Or, can it be?

Rereading this maybe I answered my own question. Should we be using 25 scripted plays for the first half? Can't be any worse than it is now.

Don't get me wrong, there were some bad play calls in the first half. But, there were also execution mishaps happening a lot in that first half; especially from Kaep. I haven't watched the coaches film yet cause it's not up yet, but, from the broadcast I could see that Kaep's footwork was pretty bad, so he missed some throws. I think Nolan managed to spook him with the different blitzes and knocked him off kilter. As I watched the game, we attacked ATL pretty much how I thought we would. I, again, was a little surprised at how accurate I was in my scouting report from what we would do. What I did not expect, was the way ATL would play D. I think in the future, our players really need to settle in more. I think we should look to get some more 3 step drop passes included into the passing game to get the ball out of Kaep's hands sooner. It's hard though, a lot of our passing success comes off of play action. When we run play action, it really makes it harder on the QB because he has to turn his back to the defense, so, to get the ball out before the pass rush gets there, he has to read the defense very quickly(also requires the QB to make very good pre-snap reads).

But, the shorter passing plays will help Kaep when he goes to the sideline to look at the photos and see what the defense has been doing. If we can extend the first couple drives by a few more plays it will really help him get a feel for what the defense is doing and see the field better. But that's just my opinion.
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
http://espn.go.com/blog/san-francisco-49ers/post/_/id/3753/will-greg-roman-get-head-coaching-looks

Anyone think Greg Roman has a shot? Before the season I thought Carolina would be a good spot for Greg Roman, but obviously the Panthers have turned it around. Minnesota is a nice possibility. Although many may think Rex Ryan deserves to be fired, I think he did a good job this year under the circumstances. Washington seems like another logical choice. What other coaching jobs will be open (besides Houston)?
considering roman's creativity, production, and commitment to the running game. I see him being deadly in Minnesota with AP.
I think if we win the Championship, then Roman might get taken off our hands.

If we fall short, he will probably get fired.
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Me neither, in Roman's defense. I looked at last years NFCCG, and 5 of ATL's games this year and didn't see any of the type of stuff that Nolan threw at Kaep this last week. I'm still waiting for the coaches film to be uploaded to be sure though. However, I did find some interesting tidbits from our playbook in Gruden's playbook from the Raiders that I posted over in my Tampa Bay coaches film thread.

well yea last year they were different and we were different. last year we had just come off the packers read option massacre and colin setting records. that totally destroyed the game plan he could have implemented.. he did this type of thing to peyton manning remember? qb's who are going to be in a certain place and if you use speed they aren't going to get out of it they have to make the hot read or get hit..

because of colin teams cannot blitz corners or safeties... he's proven he beats the blitz.. 1 mistake 1 miss tackle and it's curtains so teams don't do it with all out blitzes from the outside..

this was their super bowl and i respect the falcons for playing like it. he threw everything at him. he blitz 2 corners blitzed 1 combinations and all things we aren't going to see again.

also because we rarely get blitzed LIKE THAT there are no plays for it. there is no real tell if they line up all the way until the snap and then blitz. it's not something we'll see again.. and if we do they'll be completely foolish to do.
Originally posted by jonnydel:
We have hot reads, but we don't have "sight adjustment" reads. Hots, are only to a specific player against a specific blitz(Gruden talks a lot about them in his playbook) and the WCO has some hot routes but, they have to be against a specific blitz and only on certain plays. Sight adjustment plays are ones where the route for a receiver will change based on the coverage. Dallas runs a lot of these type of plays. Romo threw a pick six once because the sight adjustment was for the receiver to run a comeback and Dez Bryant ran a streak. The WCO is not a sight adjusted offense(according to both Gruden's playbook and Sterling Sharpe has also outright said that).

right. because we don't have a team that gets blitzed from the outside or both outsides teams blitz us and feel they are most effective either obviously overloading
or right up the middle
Originally posted by jonesadrian:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
We have hot reads, but we don't have "sight adjustment" reads. Hots, are only to a specific player against a specific blitz(Gruden talks a lot about them in his playbook) and the WCO has some hot routes but, they have to be against a specific blitz and only on certain plays. Sight adjustment plays are ones where the route for a receiver will change based on the coverage. Dallas runs a lot of these type of plays. Romo threw a pick six once because the sight adjustment was for the receiver to run a comeback and Dez Bryant ran a streak. The WCO is not a sight adjusted offense(according to both Gruden's playbook and Sterling Sharpe has also outright said that).

right. because we don't have a team that gets blitzed from the outside or both outsides teams blitz us and feel they are most effective either obviously overloading
or right up the middle

Yeah, and I should also make sure we all know that there is a different from a "hot read" and a "sight adjust" read. A "sight adjust" read is when the receiver and the QB see the coverage and adjust the route to a better route against the coverage. New England runs a LOT of these. This is why Brady said it was so nice having Moss as a receiver because he saw defenses, "like a QB". It helped in a lot of their "sight adjustments". It puts a lot on a receiver identifying his coverage off the snap.

A "hot route" is when the play has a built in "hot read". Meaning, there's the primary progression, 1,2,3 etc. But, a route built in from an expected blitz. (e.g. a TE flaring out to the flat). The reason it's identified as a "hot route" is that the receiver needs to understand that his route is primarily a clearing route, but, if the defense blitzes, the QB may throw it "hot" to him. "hot" meaning the QB will abandon the progression due to the blitz and dump it off to his outlet. So, the receiver needs to expect the ball to be thrown to him in that situation and look for the ball quick.
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Thl, no harm done, and in retrospect, I reread your post, and as noted, I noted the AS reference, and we WERE talking about two entirely different things. Sorry for the confusion.

jonnydel and Adrian I respect you guys and am in the process of completely relearning football as I thot I knew it since back in the B & W 12" TV days, that broadcast the mudbowl, circa 1956. After h.s. and then college, I have just watched games and thot I knew what I was seeing...but obviously didn't .Thanks to you two and Thl, and NC, it has been a revelation, not to mention a fascinating experience. But... I certainly agree the 2nd half we were coached a lot better, or heck, even well. The first half, however, had this been an elite team, which we face from here on out, we would have been blown out of the tub. The craziness of the calls, the nutty sequences, finding a winner and then going away from it, the disjointedness of what was being called...gad, it was painful...and also, nowhere near enough to get us past our first playoff game...let alone any others.

so I ask you: just exactly what would you all recommend we do, coaching wise, to get an entire game coached coherently? I wouldn't worry as bad if this were a first time event...but it isn't. It is the antithesis of a BW coached game, with the first 25 plays written on a cardboard. Here the first half is just by gosh and by golly, no reasoning, no direction, nothing. How in the world do we win from here on if we play goofball football the first half? Frankly we were lucky to win this one, giving the first half away like it didn't matter. Maybe some of this is on the players, but #81 and #15 were ready to play...not so much some of the others. But overall,the coaching calls in first half were epically bad. Why and how is this fixed? Or, can it be?

Rereading this maybe I answered my own question. Should we be using 25 scripted plays for the first half? Can't be any worse than it is now.

the most important thing they can do, is have a direct plan of action for every situation.
that's what's missing. they have a chart i imagine of possible plays and things we can try but they are probably labeled under play type. so in a 2nd and 5 from the 40 yard line.. when colin threw the bomb roman went to his "shot" plays. see what i mean?

then you see on a 3rd and 1 and a 3rd and 2 in the 1st half yesterday instead of securing the 1st down he went with his "confuse and gamble" plays that didn't pay off... jumbo formation fake the hand off hope the 1receiver breaks open fooling the coverage and getting a big chunk. and it didn't work, so it looks bad.

going forward we need to secure things. get positive gains on 1st depending on how positive we can take a shot or just get the 1st down.

i'll go back to my first posts in here and last night we got a glimpse of what i have been saying our offense should be or should have been or could be the entire season.

if you look at the 2nd half we came out and ran ar and progression routes spreading the falcons out and with crab and boldin able to beat their 1 on 1's (which they can do against anyone) the offense popped. this is an offense we can run at will but choose not too, OR we run a play or 2 like that and then mix it up and do something else.

which goes to my next point, personnel groupings.. how many times do we see someone make a play and then come out for 4 or 5 plays? that messes with rhythm. you need it kap needs it the offense needs it. so i feel we should commit to a style on a per series basis.

notice last night we ran our passing offense, and went down for the score which included rub routes and a wr screen.

and then on the next possession notice we went pistol and option read on them, rendering everything that the defensive coordinator and position coaches had been going over with them completely useless. and you see we march down the field and score.

and then notice the next possession the falcons adjusted their defense to defend colin from running and the option... and in response we ran power run plays no pass plays.. and broke every single one of them.. once again rendering everything that the defense just went over, making their adjustments useless

i don't know how many times i have said that there should be no way you can game plan against us. and that last night proved the point ive been making all along.

whatever a team preps for do the opposite.

against seattle and carolina they feel they can stop our power running.. they can't just power run it down their throats.. and especially against carolina their db's aren't up to par so beat their 1 on 1 coverage.. that's a win every time...

against a dallas or a chicago, run it. they cannot stop it period. just do it and keep doing it

you see what i mean?

whatever it is you want to stop, then we don't even run what you've been prepping for.. we just do something totally different and your plan is useless and the DEFENSE is guessing and winging it on possession by possession basis instead of US
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
Kaui , we do need to blitz more. But on two of those blitzes, ryan beat us.

we don't need to blitz at all.
we just need to make a decision.

if we're going to play zone we need to rush 1 more so they cannot double aldon every play

or

we need to go straight man to man (our corners can easily do this.. they're built for it) and redirect routes which gives our line time to get there.

last night the zone coverage was a huge mistake. we didn't need to blitz ryan, pressure was arriving and he'd step up. but the receivers were in soft spots wide open in the zone. that killed us.

if we play press man their routes aren't clean and our line gets to him and sacks him a lot of times.

db's can't cover for 6 seconds

and 4 people can't beat 5 blockers and 2 extra people chipping them at the los
[ Edited by jonesadrian on Dec 24, 2013 at 4:56 PM ]
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Yeah, and I should also make sure we all know that there is a different from a "hot read" and a "sight adjust" read. A "sight adjust" read is when the receiver and the QB see the coverage and adjust the route to a better route against the coverage. New England runs a LOT of these. This is why Brady said it was so nice having Moss as a receiver because he saw defenses, "like a QB". It helped in a lot of their "sight adjustments". It puts a lot on a receiver identifying his coverage off the snap.

A "hot route" is when the play has a built in "hot read". Meaning, there's the primary progression, 1,2,3 etc. But, a route built in from an expected blitz. (e.g. a TE flaring out to the flat). The reason it's identified as a "hot route" is that the receiver needs to understand that his route is primarily a clearing route, but, if the defense blitzes, the QB may throw it "hot" to him. "hot" meaning the QB will abandon the progression due to the blitz and dump it off to his outlet. So, the receiver needs to expect the ball to be thrown to him in that situation and look for the ball quick.


right was on the same page with that

but the reasons we don't have those is offensive philosophy and generally because teams CAN'T do certain things to us
Originally posted by jonesadrian:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Yeah, and I should also make sure we all know that there is a different from a "hot read" and a "sight adjust" read. A "sight adjust" read is when the receiver and the QB see the coverage and adjust the route to a better route against the coverage. New England runs a LOT of these. This is why Brady said it was so nice having Moss as a receiver because he saw defenses, "like a QB". It helped in a lot of their "sight adjustments". It puts a lot on a receiver identifying his coverage off the snap.

A "hot route" is when the play has a built in "hot read". Meaning, there's the primary progression, 1,2,3 etc. But, a route built in from an expected blitz. (e.g. a TE flaring out to the flat). The reason it's identified as a "hot route" is that the receiver needs to understand that his route is primarily a clearing route, but, if the defense blitzes, the QB may throw it "hot" to him. "hot" meaning the QB will abandon the progression due to the blitz and dump it off to his outlet. So, the receiver needs to expect the ball to be thrown to him in that situation and look for the ball quick.


right was on the same page with that

but the reasons we don't have those is offensive philosophy and generally because teams CAN'T do certain things to us

agreed, I wasn't saying you didn't know the difference, I had just realized I may have said something that not everyone might know and wanted to clarify.
how about that screen pass for a touchdown

that was pretty awesome right? maybe they will call more of them
Originally posted by xtm059:
how about that screen pass for a touchdown

that was pretty awesome right? maybe they will call more of them

we started doing that after we saw the Corner blitzes. That was a great adjustment by Roman to keep ATL from doing that all night. After that, they were much more reluctant to blitz their corners.
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by xtm059:
how about that screen pass for a touchdown

that was pretty awesome right? maybe they will call more of them

we started doing that after we saw the Corner blitzes. That was a great adjustment by Roman to keep ATL from doing that all night. After that, they were much more reluctant to blitz their corners.

it was a top notch adjustment, seeing as we never run screens ever
Originally posted by xtm059:
Originally posted by jonnydel:
Originally posted by xtm059:
how about that screen pass for a touchdown

that was pretty awesome right? maybe they will call more of them

we started doing that after we saw the Corner blitzes. That was a great adjustment by Roman to keep ATL from doing that all night. After that, they were much more reluctant to blitz their corners.

it was a top notch adjustment, seeing as we never run screens ever

which a lot of us have called for.

notice who was blocking? 2te's it was a run play basically they opened the hole and boldin went through.

in essence we should have and could have done that all year. if blocking is a major requirement to even get on the field why not take advantage of that?