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The Michael Crabtree Thread

Originally posted by I_Saw_a_Fish:
Originally posted by GNielsen:
Originally posted by Pillbusta:
Basketball has more athletes that could cross over and excel in the NFL. Lebron could play anything in the NFL from TE, OLB, S, FS, CB, QB, WR. He would rule the NFL combine and he would go before Clowney. But why would he choose the NFL when the NBA is more lucrative with greater longevity. Now just what position would any NFL player play in the NBA?? The NBA takes much more size, skill and ability just to play any of the 5 spots on the floor. There is a physocal element to the NFL but once he takes a few hits, LBJ would rule the NFL. I would want him on the 49ers. And there are plenty others in the NBA that could do some of the same things. What could an NFL player do in the NBA? Natural selection bro

The only reason most NFL players couldn't play in the NBA is height. And LeBron James himself stated that he ran the 40 yard dash in 4.6 seconds. Nobody can "rule the NFL" with a 40 time of 4.6. He wouldn't even crack the Niner first string defense - too slow for any LB position and certainly couldn't run in the secondary. Impossible. He MIGHT be able to cut it as a TE, but Vance McDonald is the same speed, much bigger and much stronger. NFL players are in better shape, they have more discipline, they are lots faster and a lot stronger. The game they play is orders of magnitude more complicated. They are, on the average, much smarter athletes. If you were correct that basketball has more athletes who could play in the NFL, we would have seen that by now because only a small number make the big money. James would, at best, be a decent tight end. He's not fast enough to be one of the best tight ends. The lucrative aspect you keep repeating is irrelevant to the argument. Your argument that the NBA takes more skill and ability to play any of the five spots is arguable. How much skill does it take for a 7 foot tall person to dunk a basketball? I know a 65 year old man who can consistently make over 95 out of 100 free throw shots. I once saw him make 77 in a row. On the other hand, there are probably less than 32 athletes on the entire planet who can play quarterback for an NFL football team effectively at any given time. How many NBA basketball players have the speed, quickness and strength to cover the average #1 receiver on a given NFL offense? How many NBA starters could get open and catch a football with Richard Sherman guarding them? Is there any player in the NBA who could hold his ground with two NFL linemen trying to push him out of a play? Is there any athlete in the NBA who could go sideline to sideline as quickly as Patrick Willis or Navaro Bowman. How many NBA starters could assimilate a typical NFL playbook? How many plays does an NBA player need to prepare for? Come on. They draw up new ones on the floor in the middle of games sometimes. It's not even in the same universe as far as complexity. Basketball is a simple game by comparison. American football is the most complicated, complex and demanding team sport ever invented.

My God GNielsen! Reading your comment really made me fee like by brain had an orgasm. Nicely said.l

Most athletes and coaches I know would disagree with you. I have asked them and they told me that it is much tougher to get into the NBA than it is the NFL and if they had a choice it would be the NBA. Natural selection of money and ability. 15 man roster in the NBA and 5 positions on the floor compared to a 53 man roster in the NFL and a multitude of positions to play. If Lebron wanted to play football he would dominate and Dick Sherman or no one could get up and cover him. He would draw a triple team leaving teammates open if anything. What would Sherman do with that beast on a jump ball? Now I ask you people once more, what position would an NFL player play in the NBA?? PG SG SF PF C? They could not make the team. There is a reason MJ23 was the athlete of the past century when it should have been Ali and that is because there was no NFL player that came close to him. Every NFL player wanted to be like Mike. Mike never, ever, never, ever wanted to be like Jerry, Bo, or Joe! NFL gives me more satisfaction in watching but an NBA player is much more likely to crack an NFL roster and star than it would be for an NFL player to make an NFL roster. Please explain to me if so
Originally posted by 5NorCalSavage2:
Originally posted by 5NorCalSavage2:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
dont get me wrong, i think Kobe is second only to Jordan and im not even a lakers fan. Kobe is the man but Jordan is still the King. offense, defense, leadership, clutch and he made everyone around him better. winning a championship without a household name at center is pretty damn tough and jordan did it six times.
Yeah rodman, pippen and phil jackson had zero to do with Jordan winning 6 rings. When jordan ran to baseball due to his gambling problems(stern was about to suspend him for the upcoming season) the bulls still made a deep playoff run. They had a legit shot at making it to the finals but I believe they ran into the knicks. All that with no Jordan.

Jordan didn't win a single chip until I. thomas, Magic, and Bird has a foot out the door. Then he took advantage of the over hyped teams of the 90's where there was no one at the time playing MJ type ball. Also there was a huge influx of expansion teams in the late 80's early 90's.

Not to mention Kobe won In the tail end of jordan career, allen iverson, tim duncan era lebron era and even the begining of the durant era. Kobe even beat the original big 3 in Boston. All hall of fame members still in their prime. crazy thing is he's not even done yet.


checkmate!

The suspension thing is a tired rumor that Stern and everyone else has denied. Jordan went to baseball because he was reeling from his father's murder and wanted to do something he and his father spoke about for years. As for the next comment about MJ not winning anything until Bird, Thomas and Magic had one foot out the door, that doesn't make Jordan any less great, he simply had nothing around him to compete prior to that. Once Pippen came into his own he won and won big, if he hadn't went to baseball that Bulls team would have won 8 in a row. If he would have kept playing another couple years I'm sure 10 would've been taken by Jordan. Kobe is a ball hogging, bad teammate plain and simple. Nobody wants to play with him because he's a jerk off, MJ wasn't some sweet nice guy, but he earned the respect of everyone and made his teammates better on the court something Kobe never has and never will do. I put several players above Kobe.
Man we have straight hijacked this thread. I apologize for getting into this but I saw some comments and had to respond because I know from cousins of mine that went to the NFL and coaches of both sports that NFL clubs mine the basketball leagues for players at certain positions but the NBA won't look for talent in the NFL. This is because the NFL game doesn't translate to basketball but the NBA can translate to the NFL. One of my cousins was an NFL player and he admitted that many NBA players could play in the NFL and do very well if they chose the sport and committed themselves to it but he said an NFL player can't just pick up a basketball and harvest that type of skill set. Crabtree please but yet I keep responding. Lebron at a 4.6 and 6'8" 260 with a 43" vertical huge hands and wingspan and not to mention his footwork and agility. That's easy offense and he hasn't properly trained for a 40 yd dash. Limitless stamina as well to play through 3 NBA finals while playing all summer to carry the US to a gold medal. There isn't an NFL player alive that can touch him!! Now Michael Phelps or Usain Bolt but NFL player? They wish they were LeBron and this is why he wins every award from his peers in all of sports
Originally posted by Pillbusta:
Originally posted by I_Saw_a_Fish:
Originally posted by GNielsen:
Originally posted by Pillbusta:
Basketball has more athletes that could cross over and excel in the NFL. Lebron could play anything in the NFL from TE, OLB, S, FS, CB, QB, WR. He would rule the NFL combine and he would go before Clowney. But why would he choose the NFL when the NBA is more lucrative with greater longevity. Now just what position would any NFL player play in the NBA?? The NBA takes much more size, skill and ability just to play any of the 5 spots on the floor. There is a physocal element to the NFL but once he takes a few hits, LBJ would rule the NFL. I would want him on the 49ers. And there are plenty others in the NBA that could do some of the same things. What could an NFL player do in the NBA? Natural selection bro

The only reason most NFL players couldn't play in the NBA is height. And LeBron James himself stated that he ran the 40 yard dash in 4.6 seconds. Nobody can "rule the NFL" with a 40 time of 4.6. He wouldn't even crack the Niner first string defense - too slow for any LB position and certainly couldn't run in the secondary. Impossible. He MIGHT be able to cut it as a TE, but Vance McDonald is the same speed, much bigger and much stronger. NFL players are in better shape, they have more discipline, they are lots faster and a lot stronger. The game they play is orders of magnitude more complicated. They are, on the average, much smarter athletes. If you were correct that basketball has more athletes who could play in the NFL, we would have seen that by now because only a small number make the big money. James would, at best, be a decent tight end. He's not fast enough to be one of the best tight ends. The lucrative aspect you keep repeating is irrelevant to the argument. Your argument that the NBA takes more skill and ability to play any of the five spots is arguable. How much skill does it take for a 7 foot tall person to dunk a basketball? I know a 65 year old man who can consistently make over 95 out of 100 free throw shots. I once saw him make 77 in a row. On the other hand, there are probably less than 32 athletes on the entire planet who can play quarterback for an NFL football team effectively at any given time. How many NBA basketball players have the speed, quickness and strength to cover the average #1 receiver on a given NFL offense? How many NBA starters could get open and catch a football with Richard Sherman guarding them? Is there any player in the NBA who could hold his ground with two NFL linemen trying to push him out of a play? Is there any athlete in the NBA who could go sideline to sideline as quickly as Patrick Willis or Navaro Bowman. How many NBA starters could assimilate a typical NFL playbook? How many plays does an NBA player need to prepare for? Come on. They draw up new ones on the floor in the middle of games sometimes. It's not even in the same universe as far as complexity. Basketball is a simple game by comparison. American football is the most complicated, complex and demanding team sport ever invented.

My God GNielsen! Reading your comment really made me fee like by brain had an orgasm. Nicely said.l

Most athletes and coaches I know would disagree with you. I have asked them and they told me that it is much tougher to get into the NBA than it is the NFL and if they had a choice it would be the NBA. Natural selection of money and ability. 15 man roster in the NBA and 5 positions on the floor compared to a 53 man roster in the NFL and a multitude of positions to play. If Lebron wanted to play football he would dominate and Dick Sherman or no one could get up and cover him. He would draw a triple team leaving teammates open if anything. What would Sherman do with that beast on a jump ball? Now I ask you people once more, what position would an NFL player play in the NBA?? PG SG SF PF C? They could not make the team. There is a reason MJ23 was the athlete of the past century when it should have been Ali and that is because there was no NFL player that came close to him. Every NFL player wanted to be like Mike. Mike never, ever, never, ever wanted to be like Jerry, Bo, or Joe! NFL gives me more satisfaction in watching but an NBA player is much more likely to crack an NFL roster and star than it would be for an NFL player to make an NFL roster. Please explain to me if so

Biggest difference being the physical punishment. There is a reason Basketball players can play forever but the average NFL career is under 5 years. Most basketball players aren't tough enough to play in the NFL.
Originally posted by matt49er:
Originally posted by 5NorCalSavage2:
Originally posted by 5NorCalSavage2:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
dont get me wrong, i think Kobe is second only to Jordan and im not even a lakers fan. Kobe is the man but Jordan is still the King. offense, defense, leadership, clutch and he made everyone around him better. winning a championship without a household name at center is pretty damn tough and jordan did it six times.
Yeah rodman, pippen and phil jackson had zero to do with Jordan winning 6 rings. When jordan ran to baseball due to his gambling problems(stern was about to suspend him for the upcoming season) the bulls still made a deep playoff run. They had a legit shot at making it to the finals but I believe they ran into the knicks. All that with no Jordan.

Jordan didn't win a single chip until I. thomas, Magic, and Bird has a foot out the door. Then he took advantage of the over hyped teams of the 90's where there was no one at the time playing MJ type ball. Also there was a huge influx of expansion teams in the late 80's early 90's.

Not to mention Kobe won In the tail end of jordan career, allen iverson, tim duncan era lebron era and even the begining of the durant era. Kobe even beat the original big 3 in Boston. All hall of fame members still in their prime. crazy thing is he's not even done yet.


checkmate!

The suspension thing is a tired rumor that Stern and everyone else has denied. Jordan went to baseball because he was reeling from his father's murder and wanted to do something he and his father spoke about for years. As for the next comment about MJ not winning anything until Bird, Thomas and Magic had one foot out the door, that doesn't make Jordan any less great, he simply had nothing around him to compete prior to that. Once Pippen came into his own he won and won big, if he hadn't went to baseball that Bulls team would have won 8 in a row. If he would have kept playing another couple years I'm sure 10 would've been taken by Jordan. Kobe is a ball hogging, bad teammate plain and simple. Nobody wants to play with him because he's a jerk off, MJ wasn't some sweet nice guy, but he earned the respect of everyone and made his teammates better on the court something Kobe never has and never will do. I put several players above Kobe.

8 in a row?? lol I doubt he was getting past shaq and penny but say he does the rockets would've ripped his squad apart. those back to back champ houston rockets team were loaded. Jordan picked the right time to "suspend himself". Also say what you want about Kobe but a lot of people are wearing championship rings becuase of him. Shaq didn't win a thing in Orlando until he joined the Lakers and Kobe turned into Kobe. Gasol and Bynum became nation wide house hold names after playing with Kobe, or do you forget gasol never made it pass the first round of the playoffs prior to joining kobe. Kobe beat the big(boston) with Fisher, Odom, Bynum, and Gasol. Gasol might be the only hall of fame player along his side and that to some people is a reach.

checkmate!
Originally posted by matt49er:
Originally posted by 5NorCalSavage2:
Originally posted by 5NorCalSavage2:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
dont get me wrong, i think Kobe is second only to Jordan and im not even a lakers fan. Kobe is the man but Jordan is still the King. offense, defense, leadership, clutch and he made everyone around him better. winning a championship without a household name at center is pretty damn tough and jordan did it six times.
Yeah rodman, pippen and phil jackson had zero to do with Jordan winning 6 rings. When jordan ran to baseball due to his gambling problems(stern was about to suspend him for the upcoming season) the bulls still made a deep playoff run. They had a legit shot at making it to the finals but I believe they ran into the knicks. All that with no Jordan.

Jordan didn't win a single chip until I. thomas, Magic, and Bird has a foot out the door. Then he took advantage of the over hyped teams of the 90's where there was no one at the time playing MJ type ball. Also there was a huge influx of expansion teams in the late 80's early 90's.

Not to mention Kobe won In the tail end of jordan career, allen iverson, tim duncan era lebron era and even the begining of the durant era. Kobe even beat the original big 3 in Boston. All hall of fame members still in their prime. crazy thing is he's not even done yet.


checkmate!

The suspension thing is a tired rumor that Stern and everyone else has denied. Jordan went to baseball because he was reeling from his father's murder and wanted to do something he and his father spoke about for years. As for the next comment about MJ not winning anything until Bird, Thomas and Magic had one foot out the door, that doesn't make Jordan any less great, he simply had nothing around him to compete prior to that. Once Pippen came into his own he won and won big, if he hadn't went to baseball that Bulls team would have won 8 in a row. If he would have kept playing another couple years I'm sure 10 would've been taken by Jordan. Kobe is a ball hogging, bad teammate plain and simple. Nobody wants to play with him because he's a jerk off, MJ wasn't some sweet nice guy, but he earned the respect of everyone and made his teammates better on the court something Kobe never has and never will do. I put several players above Kobe.

I agree. I can't believe that argument. No one was playing MJ type of ball, as if that is Jordan's fault. I wonder if the same logic applies to the Celtics dominance of the 60s. It's a testament to Jordan's greatness that once the Bulls finally did break through in 91, no one ever came through while Jordan was playing a full season with the Bulls. And yea, Jordan never beat any Hall of Famers in their prime, smh.
Originally posted by Pillbusta:
Man we have straight hijacked this thread. I apologize for getting into this but I saw some comments and had to respond because I know from cousins of mine that went to the NFL and coaches of both sports that NFL clubs mine the basketball leagues for players at certain positions but the NBA won't look for talent in the NFL. This is because the NFL game doesn't translate to basketball but the NBA can translate to the NFL. One of my cousins was an NFL player and he admitted that many NBA players could play in the NFL and do very well if they chose the sport and committed themselves to it but he said an NFL player can't just pick up a basketball and harvest that type of skill set. Crabtree please but yet I keep responding. Lebron at a 4.6 and 6'8" 260 with a 43" vertical huge hands and wingspan and not to mention his footwork and agility. That's easy offense and he hasn't properly trained for a 40 yd dash. Limitless stamina as well to play through 3 NBA finals while playing all summer to carry the US to a gold medal. There isn't an NFL player alive that can touch him!! Now Michael Phelps or Usain Bolt but NFL player? They wish they were LeBron and this is why he wins every award from his peers in all of sports

You sure do have a ton of family that played/coached professional ball of some kind or another. I call b******t.
Originally posted by matt49er:
Originally posted by 5NorCalSavage2:
Originally posted by 5NorCalSavage2:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
dont get me wrong, i think Kobe is second only to Jordan and im not even a lakers fan. Kobe is the man but Jordan is still the King. offense, defense, leadership, clutch and he made everyone around him better. winning a championship without a household name at center is pretty damn tough and jordan did it six times.
Yeah rodman, pippen and phil jackson had zero to do with Jordan winning 6 rings. When jordan ran to baseball due to his gambling problems(stern was about to suspend him for the upcoming season) the bulls still made a deep playoff run. They had a legit shot at making it to the finals but I believe they ran into the knicks. All that with no Jordan.

Jordan didn't win a single chip until I. thomas, Magic, and Bird has a foot out the door. Then he took advantage of the over hyped teams of the 90's where there was no one at the time playing MJ type ball. Also there was a huge influx of expansion teams in the late 80's early 90's.

Not to mention Kobe won In the tail end of jordan career, allen iverson, tim duncan era lebron era and even the begining of the durant era. Kobe even beat the original big 3 in Boston. All hall of fame members still in their prime. crazy thing is he's not even done yet.


checkmate!

The suspension thing is a tired rumor that Stern and everyone else has denied. Jordan went to baseball because he was reeling from his father's murder and wanted to do something he and his father spoke about for years. As for the next comment about MJ not winning anything until Bird, Thomas and Magic had one foot out the door, that doesn't make Jordan any less great, he simply had nothing around him to compete prior to that. Once Pippen came into his own he won and won big, if he hadn't went to baseball that Bulls team would have won 8 in a row. If he would have kept playing another couple years I'm sure 10 would've been taken by Jordan. Kobe is a ball hogging, bad teammate plain and simple. Nobody wants to play with him because he's a jerk off, MJ wasn't some sweet nice guy, but he earned the respect of everyone and made his teammates better on the court something Kobe never has and never will do. I put several players above Kobe.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=we0myBZ6kv0

Jordan was better and Crabtree wears his shoes!! This thread is in danger of heading to the parking lot!!
Originally posted by WINiner:
You sure do have a ton of family that played/coached professional ball of some kind or another. I call b******t.

lol
Originally posted by LifelongNiner:
Originally posted by matt49er:
Originally posted by 5NorCalSavage2:
Originally posted by 5NorCalSavage2:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
dont get me wrong, i think Kobe is second only to Jordan and im not even a lakers fan. Kobe is the man but Jordan is still the King. offense, defense, leadership, clutch and he made everyone around him better. winning a championship without a household name at center is pretty damn tough and jordan did it six times.
Yeah rodman, pippen and phil jackson had zero to do with Jordan winning 6 rings. When jordan ran to baseball due to his gambling problems(stern was about to suspend him for the upcoming season) the bulls still made a deep playoff run. They had a legit shot at making it to the finals but I believe they ran into the knicks. All that with no Jordan.

Jordan didn't win a single chip until I. thomas, Magic, and Bird has a foot out the door. Then he took advantage of the over hyped teams of the 90's where there was no one at the time playing MJ type ball. Also there was a huge influx of expansion teams in the late 80's early 90's.

Not to mention Kobe won In the tail end of jordan career, allen iverson, tim duncan era lebron era and even the begining of the durant era. Kobe even beat the original big 3 in Boston. All hall of fame members still in their prime. crazy thing is he's not even done yet.


checkmate!

The suspension thing is a tired rumor that Stern and everyone else has denied. Jordan went to baseball because he was reeling from his father's murder and wanted to do something he and his father spoke about for years. As for the next comment about MJ not winning anything until Bird, Thomas and Magic had one foot out the door, that doesn't make Jordan any less great, he simply had nothing around him to compete prior to that. Once Pippen came into his own he won and won big, if he hadn't went to baseball that Bulls team would have won 8 in a row. If he would have kept playing another couple years I'm sure 10 would've been taken by Jordan. Kobe is a ball hogging, bad teammate plain and simple. Nobody wants to play with him because he's a jerk off, MJ wasn't some sweet nice guy, but he earned the respect of everyone and made his teammates better on the court something Kobe never has and never will do. I put several players above Kobe.

I agree. I can't believe that argument. No one was playing MJ type of ball, as if that is Jordan's fault. I wonder if the same logic applies to the Celtics dominance of the 60s. It's a testament to Jordan's greatness that once the Bulls finally did break through in 91, no one ever came through while Jordan was playing a full season with the Bulls. And yea, Jordan never beat any Hall of Famers in their prime, smh.

funny you bring up the celtics of the 60's because the same logic does apply to them, less teams, no three point line, not everyone was allowed to play at the time. How else do you explain a player with 11 rings not even being ranked in the top 5 of all time much less top 3 by most respected sports writers.
Originally posted by WINiner:
Originally posted by Pillbusta:
Man we have straight hijacked this thread. I apologize for getting into this but I saw some comments and had to respond because I know from cousins of mine that went to the NFL and coaches of both sports that NFL clubs mine the basketball leagues for players at certain positions but the NBA won't look for talent in the NFL. This is because the NFL game doesn't translate to basketball but the NBA can translate to the NFL. One of my cousins was an NFL player and he admitted that many NBA players could play in the NFL and do very well if they chose the sport and committed themselves to it but he said an NFL player can't just pick up a basketball and harvest that type of skill set. Crabtree please but yet I keep responding. Lebron at a 4.6 and 6'8" 260 with a 43" vertical huge hands and wingspan and not to mention his footwork and agility. That's easy offense and he hasn't properly trained for a 40 yd dash. Limitless stamina as well to play through 3 NBA finals while playing all summer to carry the US to a gold medal. There isn't an NFL player alive that can touch him!! Now Michael Phelps or Usain Bolt but NFL player? They wish they were LeBron and this is why he wins every award from his peers in all of sports

You sure do have a ton of family that played/coached professional ball of some kind or another. I call b******t.

They weren't famous but their names were Chris Williams (Buffalo Bills) Bruce Radford R.I.P. (Bucs Broncos Cardinals). These guys were role models for me and family in the very neighborhood I grew up in within walking distance of their homes. They might have played before you were born. Now I don't know you but you don't know me so the profanity directed towards me is not appropriate. Now the other people I know aren't my relatives but they are very good friends and there isn't a consensus of opinion but most agree that basketball players can find a role in football more likely than a football player would in basketball on the pro level. I am not claiming to know Phil Jackson but I have spoken with family that played in the NFL and a few friends that are coaching in sports. They might not be heavy weights but they all have their opinion and their opinion nor mine is gospel and I don't claim it to be. This is an old topic for me so I pretty much already have my opinions formed but I am not on the internet to fight but to discuss. Cmon man!! Calling BS on me. I am too old to seek cred online. I am just stating my opinion on the matter and I have kind of looked into it in my own biased way per se!
Originally posted by 5NorCalSavage2:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
dont get me wrong, i think Kobe is second only to Jordan and im not even a lakers fan. Kobe is the man but Jordan is still the King. offense, defense, leadership, clutch and he made everyone around him better. winning a championship without a household name at center is pretty damn tough and jordan did it six times.
Yeah rodman, pippen and phil jackson had zero to do with Jordan winning 6 rings. When jordan ran to baseball due to his gambling problems(stern was about to suspend him for the upcoming season) the bulls still made a deep playoff run. They had a legit shot at making it to the finals but I believe they ran into the knicks. All that with no Jordan.

Jordan didn't win a single chip until I. thomas, Magic, and Bird has a foot out the door. Then he took advantage of the over hyped teams of the 90's where there was no one at the time playing MJ type ball. Also there was a huge influx of expansion teams in the late 80's early 90's.

Not to mention Kobe won In the tail end of jordan career, allen iverson, tim duncan era lebron era and even the begining of the durant era. Kobe even beat the original big 3 in Boston. All hall of fame members still in their prime.


Is this an argument about someone being better at the game of basketball than Michael Jordan? I thought I would never see that day. Wow.

The Bulls were 47–35 in 1994. Which is pretty good. However, in 1995, when Jordan came back from retirement, they were 72–10. That is the greatest record in league history. They went from "meh" with no Jordan, and then with Jordan, they had the greatest record in league history.

Physically, Jordan could do things that no human before or since could do in his wildest dreams. As a leader, there is no comparison. Skill wise, Koby comes close.

Wayne Gretzky was the "Michael Jordan" of hockey.
Babe Ruth was the "Michael Jordan" of baseball.
Pele was the "Michael Jordan" of soccer.
Jerry Rice was the "Michael Jordan" of football.

There was never another athlete in any team sport, as profoundly dominant at their respective position, as Michael Jordan.

Kobe Bryant had a Hall-of-Fame dominant big man in Shaq to win his first three championships. Then he had Paul Gasol for the second two (at a time when there were no other good teams in the league). He always had a dominant big man. Jordan never had a player like that with him.

I could go on, but what's the point. If people want to believe Kobe, or LaBron, or whatever other new kid on the block comes along, is better than the best team sport player to ever exist in the history of the planet, I'm not going to be able to stop them.
[ Edited by BrianGO on Aug 27, 2013 at 10:30 PM ]
Man I need to be shot for engaging in totally inappropriate internet banter about subject matter that is totally off topic in a Michael Crabtree thread. We better get back on track peoples!! If Crabtree comes back this season, I will be thoroughly impressed. And for the record, I enjoy the NFL much much more than the NBA. I enjoy the parity and competitive balance. I enjoy the chess match and the violence. But most of all I enjoy the teamwork vs adversity involved in this game. And I have been personally motivated throughout my life by the legendary work ethic of the GOAT Jerry Rice
[ Edited by Pillbusta on Aug 27, 2013 at 10:34 PM ]
This reminds me of the "Do you think Joe Montana is the GOAT QB" thread here http://www.footballsfuture.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=527980
[ Edited by Ronnie49Lott on Aug 27, 2013 at 10:34 PM ]
Originally posted by BrianGO:
Originally posted by 5NorCalSavage2:
Originally posted by hondakillerzx:
dont get me wrong, i think Kobe is second only to Jordan and im not even a lakers fan. Kobe is the man but Jordan is still the King. offense, defense, leadership, clutch and he made everyone around him better. winning a championship without a household name at center is pretty damn tough and jordan did it six times.
Yeah rodman, pippen and phil jackson had zero to do with Jordan winning 6 rings. When jordan ran to baseball due to his gambling problems(stern was about to suspend him for the upcoming season) the bulls still made a deep playoff run. They had a legit shot at making it to the finals but I believe they ran into the knicks. All that with no Jordan.

Jordan didn't win a single chip until I. thomas, Magic, and Bird has a foot out the door. Then he took advantage of the over hyped teams of the 90's where there was no one at the time playing MJ type ball. Also there was a huge influx of expansion teams in the late 80's early 90's.

Not to mention Kobe won In the tail end of jordan career, allen iverson, tim duncan era lebron era and even the begining of the durant era. Kobe even beat the original big 3 in Boston. All hall of fame members still in their prime.


Is this an argument about someone being better at the game of basketball than Michael Jordan? I thought I would never see that day. Wow.

The Bulls were 47–35 in 1994. Which is pretty good. However, in 1995, when Jordan came back from retirement, they were 72–10. That is the greatest record in league history. They went from "meh" with no Jordan, and then with Jordan, they had the greatest record in league history.

Physically, Jordan could do things that no human before or since could do in his wildest dreams. As a leader, there is no comparison. Skill wise, Koby comes close.

Wayne Gretzky was the "Michael Jordan" of hockey.
Babe Ruth was the "Michael Jordan" of baseball.
Pele was the "Michael Jordan" of soccer.
Jerry Rice was the "Michael Jordan" of football.

There was never another athlete in any team sport, as profoundly dominant at their respective position, as Michael Jordan.

Kobe Bryant had a Hall-of-Fame dominant big man in Shaq to win his first three championships. Then he had Paul Gasol for the second two (at a time when their were no other good teams in the league). He always had a dominant big man. Jordan never had a player like that with him.

I could go on, but what's the point. If people want to believe Kobe, or LaBron, or whatever other new kid on the block comes along, is better than the best team sport player to ever exist in the history of the planet, I'm not going to be able to stop them.

agree to disagree

Yeah Jordan didn't have shaq he had someone that catered to him pippen(lebron jr.), Kobe lost out on a lot of stats because both him and shaq fought tooth and nail to establish dominance(alpha male) within the team. Jordan never had to do that, pippen automatically assumed the role of second fiddle. Pippen new Jordan had to eat first then the rest of the team. Jordan and Pippen pretty much came into the league together and hit their peaks together a decade of chemistry was built. Can you imagine what shaq and kobe would do if they got along and never broke apart? Shaq and kobe have said before they left titles on the table due to their egos. Shaq and Kobe could've easily won 2-3 more titles.

Babe Ruth was the Michael Jordan of baseball?!?! bwahahahahahah try Willie Mays or Barry Bonds
Pele was the Michael Jordan of Soccer? not a bad choice but I would go with Maradona or Messi
[ Edited by 5NorCalSavage2 on Aug 27, 2013 at 10:46 PM ]