How is Ahmad Brooks?

nm

wow... the hate on Brooks..

we forgive players like Aldon Smith and his knucklehead decisions or jokes, Culliver and his loose screws... but feel more pain and betrayal when someone like Brooks give out some attitude for not wanting to share time w/a rookie (Lynch) who probably feels that it should be Aldon who should be sharing time..

I love Brooks.

Very underestimated and comes through against the Saints, Panthers, Packers, Seahawks. What more do you want?

I hope we can keep him somehow.

Originally posted by Disp:

Originally posted by NCommand:
If you're going by PFF stats, they don't account for responsibilities for OLB's. Typically, the WILL is your primary pass rusher from the blind side and that's his primary job. The SAM, typically rushes up field but it's on the strong side so rushing up field is not with the intent to pass rush (but counted by PFF as a pass rush attempt), but form an angle to seal the RB and keep him from bouncing outside while containing the QB as well (i.e. Wilson). Pass rushing is often times the secondary responsibility and Brooks is probably the best in the business at this role. He's also one of the better OLB's at dropping back in zones and esp. great/clutch once inside the RZ. I didn't see any motivational issues with him last year and his numbers were on par from previous years even with Lynch taking some snaps. I could see why he'd be pissed though given he's been the good soldier and he had to share snaps with Lynch while Aldon didn't have to share any despite being a dipsh!t and hurting the team.

That said, he's restructured twice for us already so I wouldn't be surprised no matter what direction this ends up being...trade, restructure, cut, etc.

I think you're wrong man. They have Brooks listed with 247 pass rush snaps, which is 28'th of 29 3-4 OLB's (22'nd of 29 highest pass rush %, so only 7 OLB's rushed the passer with lower frequency) playing at least 50% of their team's defensive snaps. They also have him as the 28/29 on pressure per pass rush. Unless you're telling me he has a completely different role than every other 3-4 SAM in the league, then I'm not sure where you're coming from. I agree PFF isn't infallible, and WILL and SAM backers have different responsibilities, but they're rating all SAMs under the same metrics.

Thanks Disp!

Not sure how they are grouping these OLB's here. To start with, Brooks officially had 6 sacks last year, not 4. He also had to play WILL quite a bit while Aldon was out and shared snaps with Lynch (end of year) and Lemonier/Skuta (beginning of year).

These 16 teams played in a base 3-4 last year (SAM & WILL) per ESPN depth charts: ARI (A.Okafor & M.Shaughnessy), ATL (K.Biermann & M.Goodman), BAL (T.Suggs & C.Upshaw), CLE (P.Kruger & B.Mingo), GB (C.Matthews & J.Peppers), HOU (W.Mercilus & B.Reed), IND (E.Walden & B.Werner), KC (J.Houston & T.Hali), NE/Hybrid (J.Collins & D.Hightower), NO (P.Haralson & J.Galette), NYJ (Q.Coples & C.Pace), PHI (C.Barwin & T.Cole), PIT (J.Worilds & A.Moats), SD (M.Ingram & D.Freeney), SF(A.Brooks/A.Lynch & A.Smith) & WAS (R.Kerrigan & G.Miller)

Sacks (left side & right side):
AZ A.Okafor – 5 & 3
ATL K.Biermann – N/G
BAL T.Suggs – 3 & 11
CLE P.Kruger – 11 & 1
GB C.Matthews – 1 & 10
HOU W.Mercilus – 0 & 5
IND E.Walden – 4 & 3
KC J.Houston – 21 & 2
NE J.Collins – N/G (They have R.Ninkovich listed but he's their LDE; might be their hybrid SAM)
NO P.Haralson – N/G
NYJ Q.Coples – 1 & 6
PHI C.Barwin – 9 & 4
PIT J.Worilds – 8 & 0
SD M.Ingram – N/G
SF A.Brooks(A.Lynch) – 2 (6) & 2 (0)
WAS R.Kerrigan – 13 & 0


Many of the SAM's above were not in the grades, some were DE's and others exclusively WILL's like Freeney. Why? And as you see by the sacks numbers and pass rush snaps from the list above (left side/SAM vs. right side/WILL), about half use their SAM as their primary rushing side (and rush exclusively from there) and half use the WILL (while others even out their snaps rushing equally from both sides).

You also have to consider that we play the most vanilla 3-4 of any team in the NFL. Most teams move their OLB's around a lot and rush them from all over the place (not just outside but INSIDE as well; even the interior DL like Brooks) AND bring heat from CB's and S's and ILB's to generate pressure which also increases the probability of someone like Brooks getting a clean shot at the QB or in clean-up more often. This FO recognized his value which was top 3 SAM's in the game at the time and ponied up for him. I'd say he dropped off a bit last year but as noted, there were a lot of factors in that as well.

Where I have an issue with PFF is how they define "Pass rush snaps." Unless they know what the defensive call is, it's hard to decipher what that is. Just b/c an OLB pushes up field and it appears he's in a pass rush snap, you just don't know. His first responsibility may be to watch the RB, mobile QB or even TE (does he stay in?). All these assignments slow down the pass rush. I can usually tell b/c I know Brooks and his techniques by now. Sometimes he'll line way outside, even off the LOS and push up field but remain out wide to contain the edge...other times he'll do the same, see it's a run (brief pause to diagnose) and THEN rush the passer from there already putting him behind in the potential sack, hurry, hit-column. Other times he lines up tight at the LOS and stunts inside to help others while still pushing up field. Other times he's given the green light but it's a run. Coverage sacks. So until they can accurately be ensured the OLB was actually rushing the passer from start to finish via their assignment, I take their stats with a grain of salt esp. in our defense.

No way can someone convince me that Brooks is rushing the passer 73% of the time. I'd say closer to Mingo/Pace at 56% of the time. Also, when you are playing "assignment" football esp. on the strong side, you wear down from taking on OT's and TE's and chipping RB's so he likelihood of you just turning it on in the pass rush department is more difficult...yet most of Brooks biggest sacks and stops (clutch plays) have come late in games which is pretty remarkable.

Originally posted by Young2Rice:
He's a good player but he's also a headcase and he's good for a penalty per game.

He does come through in the clutch though when games are on the line or in big moments. Thats one thing to consider.

Well you got half of that right!

Originally posted by NCommand:
No way can someone convince me that Brooks is rushing the passer 73% of the time. I'd say closer to Mingo/Pace at 56% of the time. Also, when you are playing "assignment" football esp. on the strong side, you wear down from taking on OT's and TE's and chipping RB's so he likelihood of you just turning it on in the pass rush department is more difficult...yet most of Brooks biggest sacks and stops (clutch plays) have come late in games which is pretty remarkable.

This specific chart only tracks them rushing from a traditional OLB spot on the outside and doesn't show when they're rushing from the inside against a guard/center. It's not saying he's rushing the passer 73% of the time. It's saying 73% of pass plays he's rushing the passer. Here's how they have his snaps broken down:

Total: 621
Run Def: 260
Pass Rush: 262
Pass Def: 99

So they're essentially agreeing with you, that he is covering backs and linebackers quite a bit more than most other 3-4 OLB. When he rushes the passer, he's almost bottom of the league in getting pressure going against tackles though.

For those asking, if they cut him prior to June 1 they only save $1.5M, if after June 1st, it's an extra 3M, but they split the dead money over 2 years, and don't see the money till June.

Originally posted by AB81Rules:
For those asking, if they cut him prior to June 1 they only save $1.5M, if after June 1st, it's an extra 3M, but they split the dead money over 2 years, and don't see the money till June.

What about a trade in the next few weeks for say a 5th round pick? Then what would the hit be?

Originally posted by JTsBiggestFan:
I love Brooks.

Very underestimated and comes through against the Saints, Panthers, Packers, Seahawks. What more do you want?

I hope we can keep him somehow.

Same here. I hope we keep him somehow.

Keep Brooks >>> Keep Crabs / Iupati

Originally posted by Disp:

Originally posted by NCommand:
No way can someone convince me that Brooks is rushing the passer 73% of the time. I'd say closer to Mingo/Pace at 56% of the time. Also, when you are playing "assignment" football esp. on the strong side, you wear down from taking on OT's and TE's and chipping RB's so he likelihood of you just turning it on in the pass rush department is more difficult...yet most of Brooks biggest sacks and stops (clutch plays) have come late in games which is pretty remarkable.

This specific chart only tracks them rushing from a traditional OLB spot on the outside and doesn't show when they're rushing from the inside against a guard/center. It's not saying he's rushing the passer 73% of the time. It's saying 73% of pass plays he's rushing the passer. Here's how they have his snaps broken down:

Total: 621
Run Def: 260
Pass Rush: 262
Pass Def: 99

So they're essentially agreeing with you, that he is covering backs and linebackers quite a bit more than most other 3-4 OLB. When he rushes the passer, he's almost bottom of the league in getting pressure going against tackles though.

That's the same thing Disp. No OLB is rushing on running calls/plays. So they count every drop-back-to-pass by the QB and define of those drop backs, Brooks is rushing 73% of the time on those passing plays. I don't buy that at all esp. in our alignments/assignments and esp. in the "straight-up" 3-4 we ran under Fangio.

Brooks' value to the team is his durability, consistent play (PFF noted that he was our most consistent OLB game-to-game), sealing the edge (no off-tackle edge runs), filtering RB's inside to the LB's, ability to play through and off blocks (usually 2 bodies), versatility, chasing down runs on the backside, TFL, containing the front-side for mobile QB's (allowing Aldon/Justin to get to the QB from the backside/blindside), knocking down passes at the LOS, utilizing terrific RZ instincts/play diagnosis (go with the TE/RB or rush the passer?), goal line defense, and THEN QB (big) hits, pressures and sacks (forced fumbles/recoveries).

I've said all along, 6 sacks for a SAM is like 10+ for a WILL in "our defense." I love using Brooks and Lynch together as both combined for 12 sacks alone from the SAM and that is huge for our vanilla 3-4.

Keeping Brooks would be ideal if we could restructure his deal (heck, we may not even have too) and work him in with both Lynch and Aldon. Unless there is a clone of Lynch, no 5th rounder will come close to his production (and will lack experience big time). Also, we need to consider that Mangini "may" use our SAM/WILL differently. It sounds like he's more aggressive than Fangio and certainly, will blitz more and bring more exotic disguise pressures (Fangio = least in the NFL).

So who knows, perhaps the scheme unleashes Brooks more and he gets more of the glorified sacks/hits/pressures that everyone loves?

Originally posted by AB81Rules:
For those asking, if they cut him prior to June 1 they only save $1.5M, if after June 1st, it's an extra 3M, but they split the dead money over 2 years, and don't see the money till June.

He's worth more than 1.5 in savings IMO. Plus we can still trade him

Brooks has done a good job ever since Fangio moved him into the starting line-up as an outside linebacker.

He remains a quality player, at least in my opinion.

I tend to think that his future with the club depends on his willingness to accept the decisions made by the coaching staff and last year Brooks had problems doing that.

If Brooks is not happy with his projected playing time, moving on might be the right thing to do. A starting quality 3-4 OLB should get us at least two late round picks.

Straight up

A. Brooks was a solid LB that help the Niners stay a top defense run stopper. This guy fills gaps, tackles awesome and applys QB preasure. Trust his run stop and gap appility is hard to find in someone who can do it everydown.