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Colin Kaepernick

Kaep is a project. I said after we drafted him he needs about four years on the sideline learning the art of QB'ing if he ever has a chance. Personally, I don't ever think he will be good. I wanted us to draft Dalton and was pissed when we got Kaep. We'll see though. He should be the third stringer this year, that's for sure.
What are you guys basing your opinion of Kaepernick on? 5 preseason games? There just isn't enough here to think one way or another. Harbaugh, Baalke, Roman, etc. are around him everyday and are assuredly working their tails off coaching this guy up. They are around him a lot more than we are.

Now, what do WE actually know? We know that Kap is a physical freak with great talent. We know that he is raw and is a project. You cannot say one way or another that he will fail or succeed at this point in the game. He's a work in progress. 5 preseason games is not enough to judge whether this pick will work out or not. Just have to be patient and hope Alex can lock the job down until Kap is given his chance down the road.
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by alex2125:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by alex2125:
It's what I've been saying all along. Kap is not and will not be a starting QB in the NFL. This team's success is not sustainable if Kap is asked to start for an extended period of time. To think we will win by developing some hybrid of the Pistol/Option offense is wishful thinking. The Nfl is too fast and too athletic to get away with that for any extended period of time.

For those who believe Kap is developing or can develop into a traditional QB, I ask what you are basing that on? Everything I have seen in games (college/NFL), read about him in practice, tells me he is what he is = an athletic option QB with a strong arm.

Kap can be great in small portion sizes. He could even win a game or two ala Troy Smith. The option is hard to stop if you haven't prepared for it all week, remember the Wildcat's initial success. But Kap is a Gimmick QB.

Kap is still only slightly better than Tebow.

Clearly Harbaugh disagrees with you or he wouldn't have drafted KP, wouldn't be installing the very things you're saying won't work and wouldn't have declared him the backup to Smith. You might eventually be right, who knows...but the one person who is responsible for making all of things happen disagrees with you completely, and that's fairly obvious.

You are right GOFD. and I respect your opinion above most. I usually subscribe to that same theory. Let Harbaugh and Baalke do their thing and let's see how things play out. But I had such strong opinions of Kap coming out of college, even before he was a 49er. Surely a DraftNik such as yourself has had similar opinions on certain players coming out. I think we Can have opinions about unfinished prospects. And mine about Kap is based on something more than, "Alex is good! Kap is bad!" I've watched Kap for awhile. He is a local kid and a great person and success story.

If Harbaugh turns our offense into the Pistol/spread/option and Kap can be a winning QB for the 49ers, then Great! I will cook my crow and gladly eat it.

I respect that, I just think it seems clear what the plan is for Kap...devise an offense to fit his strengths and get young players around him (James, Jenkins, Hunter now, and others down the road) that are more spread/read-option/pistol-oriented. The older players we have seem much more traditional WCO types, and that fits what Alex/Tolzien seem to do best. But in parallel, it seems Harbaugh is also crafting something for the future. Whether it's an all-out pistol/read-option offense, and whether it's 2-3 years down the road or in small doses this year, who really knows. But those elements are definitely being added and Kap seems the perfect QB to execute them.

Again, just my opinion based on my observation.

I can see your point in that we are adding players that fit the Pistol/Option-Read offense. This is backed by the additions of those players you stated. However, whether running solely that offense is a good idea is another argument. But lets say that is Harbaugh's plan, to move to an option offense. I suggest Alex is still the QB, or at least type of QB, that you would want. While Alex does not match Colin's athleticism, Alex is underrated as a runner and all around athlete imho, and Alex does have a track record of being successful running a spread offense. I believe Alex was more complete coming out (and now of course) and I think the flaws that Colin has in his mechanics and ability to read defenses require even more time to develop than people are truly willing to wait (I'm thinking its closer to the Rodgers four year cushion).

But now I've regressed into the whole Alex vs. Colin argument. Which I don't want to do. My feelings on Colin as an NFL QB is in a vacuum and comparing it to every successful starting QB in the NFL, not just Alex or the 49ers.

Bottom line: I think we both agree that the best (and my opinion the only) way that Colin is going to be successful is if we shift the offense towards the Pistol/Read-Option Spread type offense. I guess where we disagree is if that is a good idea or not. Good debate though.
^^ It's possible that Harbaugh asks Smith to run more spread-type plays (not necessarily the pistol, but something close) as part of the base offense. Watching old Stanford games, you saw Luck in the traditional WCO, but also in plenty of pistol formations/read-option plays...Harbaugh was constantly mixing things up even before he came here, so it's more than just a gimmick or JH trying to make Kap more comfortable. I really believe that's where this offense is going, a true mix of power WC, pistol read-option and spread formations with multiple WRs/TEs.
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
^^ It's possible that Harbaugh asks Smith to run more spread-type plays (not necessarily the pistol, but something close) as part of the base offense. Watching old Stanford games, you saw Luck in the traditional WCO, but also in plenty of pistol formations/read-option plays...Harbaugh was constantly mixing things up even before he came here, so it's more than just a gimmick or JH trying to make Kap more comfortable. I really believe that's where this offense is going, a true mix of power WC, pistol read-option and spread formations with multiple WRs/TEs.

JH's thinking is that the more you make a D prepare for different formations, the less effective their preparation will be.
  • Eeks
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 110
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQ7xfvFgZ1E&feature=youtube_gdata_player
According to Sports Science, Kaep had the quickest release in his draft class from recognition to release. He doesnt need to change his motion. The arm is long but quick. Just need more hours behind the wheel. CK will be great
Originally posted by Eeks:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQ7xfvFgZ1E&feature=youtube_gdata_player
According to Sports Science, Kaep had the quickest release in his draft class from recognition to release. He doesnt need to change his motion. The arm is long but quick. Just need more hours behind the wheel. CK will be great

no no no...we have QB gurus on this forum...

I still don't know why Harbaugh still has him as the 2nd QB, let alone still on this team...there are sooo many things that need to be fixed. including that soul patch.
From a visual standpoint I don't like him. Don't like the way the ball comes out of his hand. Just looks odd.
Originally posted by Afrikan:
no no no...we have QB gurus on this forum...

I still don't know why Harbaugh still has him as the 2nd QB, let alone still on this team...there are sooo many things that need to be fixed. including that soul patch.

Imma let Jim and Trent figure out about Kaep and these others. By now, I can trust where we are headed. We have talent discipline and purpose and as long as Kaep shows that to Jimmy, he deserves his shot. Kaep is intelligent and talented and as long as he keeps his head in the books and on refining his play, he has a chance
  • rum53
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 762
How many seasons did the 49ers take to change Steve Young from a glorified running back into a Hall of Fame QB? These things don't happen overnight. They say it takes 10,000 hours of practice to master a craft. Kaepernick has had only one offseason to practice the nuances of the NFL game.

Kaepernick came from the Pistol offense that is a gimmick scheme used in college. We all knew he is raw coming out of college. Kaepernick is in the process of relearning how to play quarterback position the NFL way. These things take time. What if the 49ers gave up on Steve Young after one season of backing up Montana? I'm not saying that Kaepernick is going to be the next Young. The kid is extremely talented. Let's give him time to see how far he can go with his game.
Originally posted by sacniner:
Kaep is a project. I said after we drafted him he needs about four years on the sideline learning the art of QB'ing if he ever has a chance. Personally, I don't ever think he will be good. I wanted us to draft Dalton and was pissed when we got Kaep. We'll see though. He should be the third stringer this year, that's for sure.

I agree on the 3rd stinger. And I agree on Dalton. He's an accurate young QB. And drafting him. Well it was a high risk IMO. I'm not sure it will ever pay off either. Kaep to me seems like a real tall RB. I just don't see anything in the pocket with him. That takes years to fix and sometimes never gets fixed.
Originally posted by Eeks:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQ7xfvFgZ1E&feature=youtube_gdata_player
According to Sports Science, Kaep had the quickest release in his draft class from recognition to release. He doesnt need to change his motion. The arm is long but quick. Just need more hours behind the wheel. CK will be great

Have commented on this as well! He has an unusual motion but releases very fast. The computerized drills they ran all the QBs through were really interesting...but it wasn't on grass with huge people running at you.
Most speak of how Kaep doesn't sit in the pocket........MAYBE BECAUSE OUR LINE ISNT GOOD ENOUGH TO DO THAT!! This is not the Niners of old. We dont have Fiore, Deese, Ray Brown, Newberry, Sapolu. You can't just sit there and when you do picks happen plain and simple. When you move well and have an arm big and better things happen. Wow! Look at the Shanahans in here!!
  • kush
  • Veteran
  • Posts: 2,695
Originally posted by 49rz4Life:
Most speak of how Kaep doesn't sit in the pocket........MAYBE BECAUSE OUR LINE ISNT GOOD ENOUGH TO DO THAT!! This is not the Niners of old. We dont have Fiore, Deese, Ray Brown, Newberry, Sapolu. You can't just sit there and when you do picks happen plain and simple. When you move well and have an arm big and better things happen. Wow! Look at the Shanahans in here!!

Not to mention he only had like two plays that were not designed roll outs yesterday lol
[ Edited by kush on Aug 11, 2012 at 8:48 PM ]
Originally posted by Young2Rice:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
^^ It's possible that Harbaugh asks Smith to run more spread-type plays (not necessarily the pistol, but something close) as part of the base offense. Watching old Stanford games, you saw Luck in the traditional WCO, but also in plenty of pistol formations/read-option plays...Harbaugh was constantly mixing things up even before he came here, so it's more than just a gimmick or JH trying to make Kap more comfortable. I really believe that's where this offense is going, a true mix of power WC, pistol read-option and spread formations with multiple WRs/TEs.

JH's thinking is that the more you make a D prepare for different formations, the less effective their preparation will be.

Harbaugh is like an artist as coach. He will use whatever works given the players abilities on the team. Was listening to NFLN and one of my favorite pundits, Warren Sapp, mentioned coaches trying to force players into schemes that did not highlight their strengths. He thought it was very counter productive. I agree and believe great coaches can morph their schemes around the players talent--for the most part.

Totally agree that JH will never relent from overwhelming the opposition with multiple sets and movement...yeah!