The Aldon Smith thread

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:

Originally posted by NCommand:

Originally posted by Pillbusta:

Originally posted by AmpLee:
Okay, so he threw a house party that got out of hand. Last time I checked, that's not illegal. Stupid, maybe, but unethical? Absolutely not. Still waiting for you to prove how the act of being stabbed should be looked at as an incident against Aldon. The only thing that should be looked at as Aldon's poor decision making from the party is firing (illegal) firearms into the air to scatter the party goers instead of calling the police.

Thought Delanie fired the weapon?

IIRC, he didn't have the guns or fire them? I thought the cops found them AFTER the stabbing and searching his home? No? Either way, he wasn't charged with firing them but owning firearms that weren't modified to CA-law.

The firearm fired at the party was a pistol not one of the assault rifles. The sheriff's authorities somehow got wind of the AR's (maybe inadvertently from Aldon) and came back to confiscate them a day or two later . . . then charged him for illegal firearms possession 14 months later.

Thanks brother!

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:
The firearm fired at the party was a pistol not one of the assault rifles. The sheriff's authorities somehow got wind of the AR's (maybe inadvertently from Aldon) and came back to confiscate them a day or two later . . . then charged him for illegal firearms possession 14 months later.

Thanks for clarifying that! Not that it matters, but it makes the whole situation a bit more reasonable to me. The illegal firearms are less an issue with me if he keeps them under lock and key and they aren't used publicly. I know a number of very upstanding citizens with basements full of illegal arms...just gun collectors.

Is there a tendency to judge young, black football players as thugs when you read these accounts? I think there is and Aldon may be a victim of this with the press. Of his actions, most fall under the dumb category, not mobster mentality.

Originally posted by Pillbusta:

Thought Delanie fired the weapon?

i believe it was reported both fired the gun once in the air.

Originally posted by dtg_9er:

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:
The firearm fired at the party was a pistol not one of the assault rifles. The sheriff's authorities somehow got wind of the AR's (maybe inadvertently from Aldon) and came back to confiscate them a day or two later . . . then charged him for illegal firearms possession 14 months later.

Thanks for clarifying that! Not that it matters, but it makes the whole situation a bit more reasonable to me. The illegal firearms are less an issue with me if he keeps them under lock and key and they aren't used publicly. I know a number of very upstanding citizens with basements full of illegal arms...just gun collectors.

Is there a tendency to judge young, black football players as thugs when you read these accounts? I think there is and Aldon may be a victim of this with the press. Of his actions, most fall under the dumb category, not mobster mentality.

Totally agree, and I believe Aldon clearly falls into the gun enthusiast category.

When most people who are not into or hate guns hear "Assault rifles" they immediately think thug, nut ball doomsday prepper or gun runner. Some just don't get that firing guns is very very fun for a lot of people. Aldon seemed to connect on the subject enough with sheriff's deputies to the point where they invited him out to a function the county gun range to fire County owned weapons while he was under investigation for the possession charge. I mean . . . come on.

Originally posted by NCommand:
Now, what team is going to initiate their OWN consequences for a player? None! Every team is going to look at Aldon's case and say, "Well Aldon got clean, volunatrily took 5 games off AND got a 9 game suspension on top of it. So what's the point in taking care of this in-house?" The Raven's didn't do anything "in house."

I keep hearing this argument repeated over and over again, and quite frankly, I vehemently disagree with it.

If the 49ers were sincere, they sent Aldon Smith to rehab because they feared for his well-being. They felt like his problems with alcohol were severe, and felt like he genuinely needed help; if they didn't, he or someone else was going to get seriously hurt (or his problem was going to continue to get worse, etc). Rehab was about helping Aldon Smith the Human Being -- helping Aldon Smith the Football Player was an ancillary benefit.

People keep saying, "well, why would a player or team ever self-discpline themselves if Goodell isn't going to take it into consideration." First of all, let's stop calling it "discipline", because he was paid during all of the games he missed. Second, he voluntarily entered rehab (again, that's not discipline, that's a mutual agreement between him/the team). Furthermore, sending him to rehab was not a punishment, it was about getting him help. Do you think it was all just a charade? An attempt to gain brownie points from Goodell? My point is that whether or not they think it's going to lead to a reduced suspension, they should do it because it's the right thing to do. They thought, "hey, helping him with this problem will be mutually beneficial to him and us for years and years to come -- we see this guy in our long-term plans."

Honestly, the way some of you guys talk, you would have (with the benefit of hindsight) rather delayed Aldon Smith's rehab by a year so that he could've went in while he was serving this suspension he received. You would have put off giving someone help with substance abuse because you are scared he's going to miss more football games. I hope the front office is above that, because that is a morally repugnant stance to take. Come on you guys, this is a man's well-being, there's more to his life than football.

Also, I still contend that Goodell took the rehab into consideration. 9 games is way too arbitrary of a number. Looking at his history of suspensions, virtually every single one of them has been for an even number of games. Regardless of ambiguous tweets reporters have made or what they've speculated ("apparently it wasn't a factor"), I still think it's very likely that Goodell broke down the suspension like this:

14 game suspension initially
- 5 games served
= 9 games suspension

OR

16 game suspension initially
- 5 games served
- 2 games for voluntarily entering rehab
= 9 game suspension

OR

12 game suspension initially
- 3 game reduction for rehab
= 9 game suspension

Or, it's also totally possible that Goodell was going to credit Aldon with games served, but decided against it after the LAX incident. Remember, the airport incident occurred after Goodell's public statements about the rehab being a factor, so perhaps Goodell viewed that incident as a relapse and it destroyed any goodwill that Aldon had accumulated.

Originally posted by theduke85:
Also, I still contend that Goodell took the rehab into consideration. 9 games is way too arbitrary of a number. Looking at his history of suspensions, virtually every single one of them has been for an even number of games. Regardless of ambiguous tweets reporters have made or what they've speculated ("apparently it wasn't a factor"), I still think it's very likely that Goodell broke down the suspension like this:

14 game suspension initially
- 5 games served
= 9 games suspension

OR

16 game suspension initially
- 5 games served
- 2 games for voluntarily entering rehab
= 9 game suspension

OR

12 game suspension initially
- 3 game reduction for rehab
= 9 game suspension

Or, it's also totally possible that Goodell was going to credit Aldon with games served, but decided against it after the LAX incident. Remember, the airport incident occurred after Goodell's public statements about the rehab being a factor, so perhaps Goodell viewed that incident as a relapse and it destroyed any goodwill that Aldon had accumulated.

I think that may have played a big part of the decision. I know the LAPD said "It appeared that he had been drinking earlier, but intoxication wasn't a factor in the arrest." I think it's entirely possible that the NFL's own investigators followed up on that report and found that he had been drinking earlier that day. And that may be why the team fought so hard to keep Aldon around the team during the suspension so they can keep tabs on him.

Originally posted by NCommand:
Crazy rationale. Anyhow, nobody is claiming Aldon should NOT get reprimanded by any means. The argument is that his punishments don't fit the crime compared to others and that Roger clearly went back on his own saying (hypocrit). This was a perfect example for Roger to come out and say, "We've been working with Aldon very closely since he checked into rehab and voluntarily missed 5 games to get clean last year. As with most addictions, incidents happen in cluster. Aldon has been clean for 10 months now, has become a father and is in the best shape of his life. Our policy is not to punish players but to help and support them to get healthy and make better decisions going forward. Aldon, so far, has demonstrated that and has done all that has been asked of him. Therefore, the NFL suspends Aldon for the first 4-5 games of the season."

God had the perfect platform to prove to players AND teams that if you do screw up, make sure you get help, do the right thing and that is the goal...you'll still get punished but it won't be the sole focus of these policies; rather, to get right and making good decisions going forward.

Now, what team is going to initiate their OWN consequences for a player? None! Every team is going to look at Aldon's case and say, "Well Aldon got clean, volunatrily took 5 games off AND got a 9 game suspension on top of it. So what's the point in taking care of this in-house?" The Raven's didn't do anything "in house."

Here's a question:

Is there a valid basis for a class action lawsuit against Goodell/NFL on behalf of Niner season ticket holders because of the extra time he imposed on Aldon for possession of weapons deemed illegal in California, but legal in other states, such as Arizona, and likely owned by other NFL players in those states.

I've got no beef with Goodell for the 4 game suspension for the repeat DUI (other than his hypocrisy about Aldon's self imposed 5 game suspension).

But the additional 5 games for owning weapons deemed illegal under California's complex and confusing gun laws, when those same weapons are owned by other NFL players in other states and Goodell is not punishing them, that seems unfair.

Niner season ticket holders bought their tickets believing that the Niners would be able to field certain star players, and Goodell has stepped n and removed one of the team's stars based on an unfair criteria. That diminishes the value of those season tickets, does it not? (If I bought a ticket to a concert, thinking I'm gonna see and hear a certain rock star as a big part of the show, and then the producer of the show steps in and bans the rock star for some unfair, personal reason, shouldn't I get my money back?)

It appears that there is nothing the Niners, Aldon, or the player's association can do about the additional 5 game suspension, but what about the fans? And more specifically, the Niners' season ticket holders?

A class action lawsuit in federal court might send Goodell a message, if nothing else.

Originally posted by oldninerdude:
A class action lawsuit in federal court might send Goodell a message, if nothing else.

What message does that send, that the fans are willing to engage in frivolous class-action lawsuits? You've got to be kidding me. While we're at it, maybe this same group of fans should file a class-action lawsuit against the 49ers front office for signing so many players of questionable character?! (Oh wait, that wouldn't fit the "Goodell is an evil tyrant" narrative.)

Originally posted by oldninerdude:
Here's a question:

Is there a valid basis for a class action lawsuit against Goodell/NFL on behalf of Niner season ticket holders because of the extra time he imposed on Aldon for possession of weapons deemed illegal in California, but legal in other states, such as Arizona, and likely owned by other NFL players in those states.

I've got no beef with Goodell for the 4 game suspension for the repeat DUI (other than his hypocrisy about Aldon's self imposed 5 game suspension).

But the additional 5 games for owning weapons deemed illegal under California's complex and confusing gun laws, when those same weapons are owned by other NFL players in other states and Goodell is not punishing them, that seems unfair.

Niner season ticket holders bought their tickets believing that the Niners would be able to field certain star players, and Goodell has stepped n and removed one of the team's stars based on an unfair criteria. That diminishes the value of those season tickets, does it not? (If I bought a ticket to a concert, thinking I'm gonna see and hear a certain rock star as a big part of the show, and then the producer of the show steps in and bans the rock star for some unfair, personal reason, shouldn't I get my money back?)

It appears that there is nothing the Niners, Aldon, or the player's association can do about the additional 5 game suspension, but what about the fans? And more specifically, the Niners' season ticket holders?

A class action lawsuit in federal court might send Goodell a message, if nothing else.

To answer your initial question, no, there is not a valid basis for such a lawsuit.

49er season ticket holders bought season tickets understanding that the team and its players were subject to NFL rules and regulations, including those areas which have been collectively bargained between the NFL and the players. Included as part of the collectively bargained terms of employment for the players was the Commissioner's authority to hand down discipline, including suspensions. Moreover, the 9 game suspension was negotiated between the NFL and the NFLPA and agreed to by Smith, so this was not just a determination by Goodell.

While not phrased as a question, the answer to your last statement is...no, such a lawsuit would not send a message to Goodell other than to confirm that there is a lunatic fringe of 49er fans with too much time and money on their hands.

Originally posted by theduke85:
I keep hearing this argument repeated over and over again, and quite frankly, I vehemently disagree with it.

If the 49ers were sincere, they sent Aldon Smith to rehab because they feared for his well-being. They felt like his problems with alcohol were severe, and felt like he genuinely needed help; if they didn't, he or someone else was going to get seriously hurt (or his problem was going to continue to get worse, etc). Rehab was about helping Aldon Smith the Human Being -- helping Aldon Smith the Football Player was an ancillary benefit.

People keep saying, "well, why would a player or team ever self-discpline themselves if Goodell isn't going to take it into consideration." First of all, let's stop calling it "discipline", because he was paid during all of the games he missed. Second, he voluntarily entered rehab (again, that's not discipline, that's a mutual agreement between him/the team). Furthermore, sending him to rehab was not a punishment, it was about getting him help. Do you think it was all just a charade? An attempt to gain brownie points from Goodell? My point is that whether or not they think it's going to lead to a reduced suspension, they should do it because it's the right thing to do. They thought, "hey, helping him with this problem will be mutually beneficial to him and us for years and years to come -- we see this guy in our long-term plans."

Honestly, the way some of you guys talk, you would have (with the benefit of hindsight) rather delayed Aldon Smith's rehab by a year so that he could've went in while he was serving this suspension he received. You would have put off giving someone help with substance abuse because you are scared he's going to miss more football games. I hope the front office is above that, because that is a morally repugnant stance to take. Come on you guys, this is a man's well-being, there's more to his life than football.

Yes he was paid, but based on missing those 5 games he loses any chance of reaching bonus/escalators for sacks, tackles, games started, pro-bowl etc...he could have just played until he received his suspension much like every other player has done. I'm glad he went to rehab to get his life in order that is the first priority and I highly doubt it had anything to do with gaining brownie points lol.

I think what people are stating is Goodell has a chance to show the NFL players that if they take matters into their own hands (like voluntary leave for rehab) He will not come down as harsh. He didn't look at it like that at all and unfortunately we probably won't be seeing more players voluntary leaving to take care of their issues.

Originally posted by theduke85:
What message does that send, that the fans are willing to engage in frivolous class-action lawsuits? You've got to be kidding me. While we're at it, maybe this same group of fans should file a class-action lawsuit against the 49ers front office for signing so many players of questionable character?! (Oh wait, that wouldn't fit the "Goodell is an evil tyrant" narrative.)

So you don't care that a player is being unfairly singled out by the NFL?

And why would it be frivolous to complain about some unfair action causing a loss of ticket value?

Originally posted by AmpLee:
A couple issues...

• The Commissioner was quoted as saying that he was about correcting behavior, not punishment
• Aldon took steps to correct his behavior
• The commissioner was quoted as saying that Adons rehab would be taken into consideration
• It was reported after the punishment by Ed Werder that the commissioner did not consider the self-imposed rehab when punishing Aldon
• The breakdown of the suspension was 5 games for personal conduct and 4 games for the Reckless driving and DUI

Essentially, the commissioner said one thing (it's about behavioral correction not punishment) then did another (threw the book at Aldon while ignoring his steps to correct his own behavior). It's not hard to see the issue people have with how this all went down. 9 games is an unprecedented punishment for Aldon's type of crimes especially considering Aldon's steps to improve himself during the season (missing 5 additional games doing so).

Originally posted by AmpLee:
The commissioner was quoted as saying that Adons rehab would be taken into consideration

Goodell was quoted as saying this in 2013. The LAX incident took place in April of 2014. It's possible that he destroyed goodwill that he had built up with Goodell. That cannot be stressed enough. It is a very important sequence of events, because, regardless of the fact that he wasn't formally charged, it was yet another case of Smith exercising questionable judgement.

- The Commissioner was quoted as saying that he was about correcting behavior, not punishment

To me this boils down to semantics. You punish a player to correct the behavior. They're intertwined. If it wasn't "punishment", players wouldn't lose their game checks over it.

Essentially, the commissioner said one thing (it's about behavioral correction not punishment) then did another (threw the book at Aldon while ignoring his steps to correct his own behavior). It's not hard to see the issue people have with how this all went down.

This would be a more accurate portrayal of events:

- September 2013: Smith enters rehab. Appears to take responsibility / show a willingness to get help.
- October 2013: Goodell says he will taken rehab into consideration. It's about behavioral correction, not punishment.
- April 2014: Smith has the LAX incident. Was he drinking? Doesn't matter. Regardless of whether he was drunk or ultimately charged with a crime, he was "belligerent and uncooperative" with security personnel at an airport. TSA is notoriously tough, but if I'm Goodell, no way in hell do I give Aldon the benefit of the doubt given his history.

Again, like I said above, it's very possible that Smith damaged the sympathy Goodell had accumulated for him after the LAX incident. Maybe Goodell said, "hmm, even after rehab, he's still having problems off the field. Maybe this isn't an alcohol issue, maybe this is a maturity issue. What he needs is a harsh wake up call. Here's a 9-game suspension."

Originally posted by oldninerdude:
And why would it be frivolous to complain about some unfair action causing a loss of ticket value?

You're really stretching it. I mean, really stretching it.