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Gregg Williams wanted to seriously injure all our players (audio on first post)

Originally posted by DRUSTOPO:
Originally posted by Jesu80ncleats:
this why your getting attacked


This has been going on forever, its part of football and the reason coaches do not say much about injuries unless they have to.

Just by you Jesu, this has been part of the NFL for as long as the league existed. You cant deny that fact. The only difference is that Williams got caught. Buddy Ryan gave out money for hurting players WAY before Williams did.

I'm gonna assume you're just a Ain'ts troll.

This isn't the 80's anymore. The Ain'ts coaches were wrong to do what they did. They went overboard, crossed the line, whatever you want to call it. There's too much evidence that says the NFL told them to stop YEARS before this incident and they STILL offered money for seriously injuring players heads and ACL's!

So, what don't you get again?
IMO, if you're not cheating you're not trying. Good that these fools got caught, and they got caught because they were so brazen/open about it. But my bottom line is, I want my team(s) to be this aggressive and win at all costs (this is a violent sport where winning trumps all, even sportsmanship and civility), just be discreet about it...and don't get caught.
Originally posted by BSofSF:
Originally posted by DRUSTOPO:
Im a 9ers fan living 10 min from the Meadowlands.. The Giants players said and did the same thing with Kyle Williams. This was one of many articles = http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2012/01/giants_...

"Some Giants say they went after Williams with the intent to take him out of the game. "

I have not heard one thing about the Giants. This smells like a media witch hunt.Not saying that they were right, they lied and did it anyway, thats the biggest factor. This has been going on forever, its part of football and the reason coaches do not say much about injuries unless they have to. The other team goes after the weaknesses. Giants did it worse in that game and admitted it after. Im not upset about it, all part of the game.I love how everyone is appalled over this, wake up people, Buddy Ryan was 100 times worse! Hell the Lions were worse in 2011 and the Raiders have led the league in PFs for 20 years, think they dont have rewards? This is a joke how the media is latching onto this. Its like the Weather Channel when a Hurricane hits.

It's like the steroid investigation in the MLB. For years it seemed obvious what was going on, then all of the "surprise" in the media. But having specific, blatant examples are sometimes what it takes to blow the lid off a story that has been quietly simmering for some time. It is sweet that it was the Niners that belivered the knockout blow, figuratively and literally, to the Saints and that miserable SOB Williams. One last point...the NFL has ulterior motives for coming out strong on the issue of protecting the players because there is growing momentum against the NFL on the issue of all its past players suffering from demential and various disabilities as a result of years of head trauma. In the bigger picture I think the NFL is very much fighting a PR battle.

BSofSF....yes, totally agree. The difference in the last couple months is the pending lawsuits against the NFL. I just wish this kind of heat was put on the Giants publically after they did KW dirty.
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
IMO, if you're not cheating you're not trying. Good that these fools got caught, and they got caught because they were so brazen/open about it. But my bottom line is, I want my team(s) to be this aggressive and win at all costs (this is a violent sport where winning trumps all, even sportsmanship and civility), just be discreet about it...and don't get caught.

pushing the limits of the rules is one thing, outright cheating is another--just like the realities of a violent sport is one thing, and intentionally injuring players is another.
Originally posted by FILTHpigskin:
I'm gonna assume you're just a Ain'ts troll.

This isn't the 80's anymore. The Ain'ts coaches were wrong to do what they did. They went overboard, crossed the line, whatever you want to call it. There's too much evidence that says the NFL told them to stop YEARS before this incident and they STILL offered money for seriously injuring players heads and ACL's!

So, what don't you get again?

Been a 9ers fan for 30 years ( when the 9ers beat the Giants in 81-82 playoffs )..my beef is that I live in the NY area and dont understand why they get a pass. Its complete BS
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
IMO, if you're not cheating you're not trying. Good that these fools got caught, and they got caught because they were so brazen/open about it. But my bottom line is, I want my team(s) to be this aggressive and win at all costs (this is a violent sport where winning trumps all, even sportsmanship and civility), just be discreet about it...and don't get caught.

pushing the limits of the rules is one thing, outright cheating is another--just like the realities of a violent sport is one thing, and intentionally injuring players is another.

True, but it's a cut-throat sport where losing isn't tolerated. I guess I'm old school and know that this kinda stuff used to happen pretty regularly, cuz at the end of the day, these are MEN playing a MAN'S sport, not little girls playing hopscotch.

Do what you need to do to win, and if you get caught cheating, you pay the price.
[ Edited by GhostofFredDean74 on Apr 5, 2012 at 12:26 PM ]
Originally posted by DRUSTOPO:
Originally posted by Jesu80ncleats:
You act like most NFL teams have bounty systems in play, which is not a fact and to the contrary, I cant say with certainty that it doesn't happen. However, to right it off like its no big deal because you think that this bounty system is a part of football is an ignorant statement. I'm not going to disagree that the Saints weren't the only team to do this, but it is not normal that's for sure. Let me tell you what is normal, putting a hurttin' on someone for trying to come over to my portion of the field, that's what has been happening since footballs existence.

This does not mean you are intentionally trying to injure a player, its a tactic to try and make that player think twice about making a play in that player area of the field. I really hate it when fans try to down play this situation, its not a common practice to tell your players to go for the head (you take out the head you kill the body) or to take out someones ACL.

I really do not know hoiw to explain it any differently, but NFL.com just came out with an article with my point =

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d8281bb80/article/flashback-giants-targeted-49ers-williams-in-playoffs?module=HP11_around-the-league

================================================================================================================

The Saints weren't alone.

Giants defenders said after their NFC title game win over the 49ers that Kyle Williams' concussion history was a talking point for New York's special-teams unit, per linebacker Jacquian Williams and receiver Devin Thomas. It was Jacquian Williams who stripped Kyle Williams on the game-deciding punt-return fumble in overtime, which was recovered by Thomas.

"The thing is, we knew (Williams) had four concussions," Jacquian told NYMag.com after the game. "So that was our biggest thing -- was to take him out of the game."

Thomas spoke of similar tactics: "He's had a lot of concussions. We were just like, 'We got to put a hit on that guy.' (Defensive back Tyler) Sash did a great job hitting him early, and he looked kind of dazed when he got up. I feel like that made a difference, and he coughed it up."

It was a news item that came and went without much fanfare in the days leading up the Giants' win over the New England Patriots in Super Bowl XLVI.

The question stands: Was New York's strategy so different from what Williams asked his players to do?
=========================================================================================================


What because there wasnt money on the line it was different?
Its not about the money issue I have a problem with, i think I explained that my post what I have a problem with.

its not a common practice to tell your players to go for the head (you take out the head you kill the body) or to take out someones ACL.


Just because there are a few teams that used the same tactics as the Saints or the Giants, does not mean that every team or most teams partake in such horendous actions.
Originally posted by BSofSF:
Originally posted by DRUSTOPO:
Im a 9ers fan living 10 min from the Meadowlands.. The Giants players said and did the same thing with Kyle Williams. This was one of many articles = http://www.nj.com/giants/index.ssf/2012/01/giants_...

"Some Giants say they went after Williams with the intent to take him out of the game. "

I have not heard one thing about the Giants. This smells like a media witch hunt.Not saying that they were right, they lied and did it anyway, thats the biggest factor. This has been going on forever, its part of football and the reason coaches do not say much about injuries unless they have to. The other team goes after the weaknesses. Giants did it worse in that game and admitted it after. Im not upset about it, all part of the game.I love how everyone is appalled over this, wake up people, Buddy Ryan was 100 times worse! Hell the Lions were worse in 2011 and the Raiders have led the league in PFs for 20 years, think they dont have rewards? This is a joke how the media is latching onto this. Its like the Weather Channel when a Hurricane hits.

It's like the steroid investigation in the MLB. For years it seemed obvious what was going on, then all of the "surprise" in the media. But having specific, blatant examples are sometimes what it takes to blow the lid off a story that has been quietly simmering for some time. It is sweet that it was the Niners that belivered the knockout blow, figuratively and literally, to the Saints and that miserable SOB Williams. One last point...the NFL has ulterior motives for coming out strong on the issue of protecting the players because there is growing momentum against the NFL on the issue of all its past players suffering from demential and various disabilities as a result of years of head trauma. In the bigger picture I think the NFL is very much fighting a PR battle.

I think the league's worst fear would be the Congress investigate and mandate. No one want that sh*t. Better to show that they can policed themselves then having bureaucrats stepping in.
F*CK the Saints little b!t*ch ass f*gs... even if you visit this teams MB on the internet all they do is try to talk trash about our team.. if i catch fans in a bar one time talkking sh!t imma have me and the crew put there heads sideways
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
Originally posted by HessianDud:
Originally posted by GhostofFredDean74:
IMO, if you're not cheating you're not trying. Good that these fools got caught, and they got caught because they were so brazen/open about it. But my bottom line is, I want my team(s) to be this aggressive and win at all costs (this is a violent sport where winning trumps all, even sportsmanship and civility), just be discreet about it...and don't get caught.

pushing the limits of the rules is one thing, outright cheating is another--just like the realities of a violent sport is one thing, and intentionally injuring players is another.

True, but it's a cut-throat sport where losing isn't tolerated. I guess I'm old school and know that this kinda stuff used to happen pretty regularly, cuz at the end of the day, these are MEN playing a MAN'S sport, not little girls playing hopscotch.

yeah, i get it. i basically agree, but even in a violent sport of manly men there can be good sportsmanship. you can be both a gentleman and a brute. i don't want to root for a cheater, either.
Originally posted by Bryant4everYoung:
Originally posted by DRUSTOPO:
Originally posted by Bryant4everYoung:
This was an NFL coach, who was caught red handed, what's so hard to get. Just because we don't hear about this side of football doesn't justify it or make it right.

You guys are missing my point, I agree he was dead wrong and I agree he should be banned for life. Im blasting the media for jumping on this audio about the Saints calling out specific players with specific injuries after the fact. The Giants were given a pass against us when hurting a player actually affected the outcome. The media is in a frenzy over it TODAY because its the hot topic, if they REALLY cared about it, this would have been the topic the two weeks leading up to the SB. The Giants did exactly what the Saints did and admitted to it right after the game. What was the difference? The difference is them jumping on the gravy train for ratings.
No, I get your point, but what I'm saying there's a clear difference between a player saying he was targeting another player and a coach having a systematic injury reward program, because this cannot be put in the "heresay" category, per the evidence presented. I agree, the media will unnecessarily have a field day with this, but the giants got a pass because it was something someone said that could not be proven to be a long running intricately designed program being investigated for 3 years.

I agree BY, the difference between the two is that the Saints were wrong and got caught. Other teams do this though...not anymore though. This will be the first topic on day 1 of training camp.across the league
Greg Williams is trash.
Originally posted by DRUSTOPO:
Originally posted by FILTHpigskin:
I'm gonna assume you're just a Ain'ts troll.

This isn't the 80's anymore. The Ain'ts coaches were wrong to do what they did. They went overboard, crossed the line, whatever you want to call it. There's too much evidence that says the NFL told them to stop YEARS before this incident and they STILL offered money for seriously injuring players heads and ACL's!

So, what don't you get again?

Been a 9ers fan for 30 years ( when the 9ers beat the Giants in 81-82 playoffs )..my beef is that I live in the NY area and dont understand why they get a pass. Its complete BS

Okay, I'll take your word for it... sorry about the troll comment.

The Saint's had a prior history of this kind of behavior, that's all. They were warned. Williams basically threw it in the NFL's face with those recorded remarks. The Giant's players just said they wanted to lay a good hit on someone (which defenses should always try to do), not get paid extra cash to knock them out or tear their ACL.
Originally posted by Jesu80ncleats:
Its not about the money issue I have a problem with, i think I explained that my post what I have a problem with.

its not a common practice to tell your players to go for the head (you take out the head you kill the body) or to take out someones ACL.


Just because there are a few teams that used the same tactics as the Saints or the Giants, does not mean that every team or most teams partake in such horendous actions.

I think its a little more widespread than the public knows...but of course cant prove it totally. oh well, hopefully its out of the game for good
Originally posted by FILTHpigskin:
Okay, I'll take your word for it... sorry about the troll comment.

The Saint's had a prior history of this kind of behavior, that's all. They were warned. Williams basically threw it in the NFL's face with those recorded remarks. The Giant's players just said they wanted to lay a good hit on someone (which defenses should always try to do), not get paid extra cash to knock them out or tear their ACL.

I hear ya, just cant stand hearing all these Giants fans...lol Pent up anger since I see NY Giants SB Champs posters every day