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Assessing Receivers and the OL: We NEED Upgrades

Originally posted by Joecool:
I would not mind us trading up at all for a WR like Walsh did for Rice. When there is a deep class for a position, that just tells me the best one in that class is probably pretty damn good since the competition is higher. Sort of like the 83 QB class. I think teams tend to relax when there's a deep class at a certain position because they think they will still get a solid player even if they don't get the best one. But getting the best one in a deep class could mean getting a HOFer.

Agree if there is a huge, definate difference, but I doubt the 9ers would trade up high enough to get a top WR. Sounds like they will go in the top five or ten.

Originally posted by toppdogg32:
I'd just dump Swain and Rachal.. I'd get a mauler in FA at RG (unless a De Castro is still there when we pick). We can get a true #1 WR in FA if we want, or their are several WR in this draft that will be there in the 2nd round.. Also the Raiders dont have much of a draft left, they may trade a WR for a pick (just a thought)..

Doubt the Raiders would trade a top WR, especially to the 9ers...but Moore is one of my favorites! Goes for the ball like a heat seeking missile.
[ Edited by dtg_9er on Jan 6, 2012 at 11:16 AM ]
Originally posted by GolittaCamper:
An upgrade at QB would make the O-line and Wr's look better, Alex is fine for now, but anyone who thinks we have found our franchise is fooling themselves, Alex is better than average but we need hold to a higher standard.

Put this in the Alex thread.
Even if we had someone else its clear we could use another weapon. Crabs and Davis are the only threats we need to grab one within the first 2 rounds of the draft( I thought it was only the QB that was our problem but my view has shifted)
[ Edited by ninersrule4 on Jan 6, 2012 at 12:49 PM ]
It's time to bump this. This thread quieted before the playoffs. I think it's about time we start talking about it again, being less than two weeks away from the NFL combine, a month from free agency, and two months from the NFL draft.
Originally posted by OnTheClock:
It's time to bump this. This thread quieted before the playoffs. I think it's about time we start talking about it again, being less than two weeks away from the NFL combine, a month from free agency, and two months from the NFL draft.

We need to draft a WR, not spend big money on a FA who we only need to stretch the field. We already have plenty of possession type guys.

Crabtree should emerge as a 80-90 catch 1000+ yard guy who can do a little bit of everything.
Kyle Williams can easily stretch a defense horizontally.
Morgan: we still need to see if he can stretch a defense vertically. He shown to get jump balls and top level run after the catch speed/agility. but who knows how long it takes him to get back.

We need a taller and more reliable version of Ginn. That type doesn't require big money.
If anyone is interested of the 44 sacks we have all but 15 accounted for....

Joe Staley - 6
Mike Iupati - 3.5
Jonathan Goodwin - 6
Adam Snyder - 3
Chilo Rachal - 1
Anthony Davis - 9.5

Not sure if Alex Boone had any. Other than that the rest would be attributed to RB, FB, not sure if they put any on Alex or how rotoworld does it. If anyone can find the rest that would be awesome. As for the sack #s I bet Anthony's and Goodwin's really went down as the year went on and Snyder went in for Rachal. Rachal apparently only had 1 but I am sure a good chunk of Goodwin's and Davis' where because of him. Have to do much better than 44 next year. I would assume Gore and Hunter each had 3-5... they struggled at time with blitz pickups/confusion at times, Miller might have had a couple. Not sure if the stats allow any to go on Alex but he had probably 5-10 I think where he held the ball to long. Sometimes it was our philosphy to play it safe but at times he was way to hesitant.
Originally posted by Gore_21:
If anyone is interested of the 44 sacks we have all but 15 accounted for....

Joe Staley - 6
Mike Iupati - 3.5
Jonathan Goodwin - 6
Adam Snyder - 3
Chilo Rachal - 1
Anthony Davis - 9.5

Not sure if Alex Boone had any. Other than that the rest would be attributed to RB, FB, not sure if they put any on Alex or how rotoworld does it. If anyone can find the rest that would be awesome. As for the sack #s I bet Anthony's and Goodwin's really went down as the year went on and Snyder went in for Rachal. Rachal apparently only had 1 but I am sure a good chunk of Goodwin's and Davis' where because of him. Have to do much better than 44 next year. I would assume Gore and Hunter each had 3-5... they struggled at time with blitz pickups/confusion at times, Miller might have had a couple. Not sure if the stats allow any to go on Alex but he had probably 5-10 I think where he held the ball to long. Sometimes it was our philosphy to play it safe but at times he was way to hesitant.

dont know if that includes players who come unblocked
Rachal only has one sack attributed to him? umm whoever put that together should go rewatch the Ravens game. And how are 15.5 sacks being attributed to the center and RT when RG was the weakest position on the line this season only gets 4??? (although Snyder exceeded expectiations). Looks like whoever compiled these sack stats doesnt know how to account for stunts which accounted for the majority of sacks on the right side.
Excellent post and Thanks OTC for leading the thread to avoid the ASmith hijacking crap.

At this point I feel Center is a "B or a C" priority. It's really going to be exciting to see what a full off season will do for Kilgore/Pearson. If they are being groomed for that position or being groomed for a future utiltity Oline person.

RG is key and I will have Brandon Brooks as a 3-4th rounder in my mock draft next week. He plays for Miami of Ohio, 6'5" 330 and everything I've read, he is NFL ready. Maybe Kilgore/Perason are being groomed for RG? That would be great to be able to use the draft pick some where else.

WR is crucial. We need 2, unlike most in the Zone, I don't feel Cranbs is a #1 receiver. I really like Meechum - young, fast and excellent hands. I'm sure there are better - I also like Garcon. In the draft I like Streeter, McNutt - both are fast and big. For fast i like Joe "The Jet" adams but I feel he'll be long gone.

I'd keep Snyder as a utilty Oline guy. It's great to have one of thsoe until we can groom someone else for that role.

Finally, you sold me hook, line & sinker - OTC. Getting a TE like Fleener would be incredible. Putting 4 TE in at once would be like dynamite. I don't have a link but you guys should go read OTC, post in the draft section.
Originally posted by LasVegasWally:
Excellent post and Thanks OTC for leading the thread to avoid the ASmith hijacking crap.

At this point I feel Center is a "B or a C" priority. It's really going to be exciting to see what a full off season will do for Kilgore/Pearson. If they are being groomed for that position or being groomed for a future utiltity Oline person.

RG is key and I will have Brandon Brooks as a 3-4th rounder in my mock draft next week. He plays for Miami of Ohio, 6'5" 330 and everything I've read, he is NFL ready. Maybe Kilgore/Perason are being groomed for RG? That would be great to be able to use the draft pick some where else.

WR is crucial. We need 2, unlike most in the Zone, I don't feel Cranbs is a #1 receiver. I really like Meechum - young, fast and excellent hands. I'm sure there are better - I also like Garcon. In the draft I like Streeter, McNutt - both are fast and big. For fast i like Joe "The Jet" adams but I feel he'll be long gone.

I'd keep Snyder as a utilty Oline guy. It's great to have one of thsoe until we can groom someone else for that role.

Finally, you sold me hook, line & sinker - OTC. Getting a TE like Fleener would be incredible. Putting 4 TE in at once would be like dynamite. I don't have a link but you guys should go read OTC, post in the draft section.

I've been really disappointed in Meachem over his NFL career so far. Over all his years with the Saints, he never was able to solidify himself as a starter over Devery Henderson, a pure speed guy who really is nothing more than a #3 in this league. I understand the Saints distribute the ball a lot, but Robert is beginning to look like a combine standout who lacks the focus needed to be a legitimate starter in the NFL. I think he could be turning into another Jason Avant.

I think the 49ers should look to draft a tall red-zone threat with upside within the first 4 rounds. Streeter and Stephen Hill are two that match that description.
Originally posted by 12b6demurrer:
I think after this season, we have the pieces in place to start drafting receiver depth. We were missing too many key elements in the past. We should do it like the Packers: pretty much all their receivers are 2nd or 3rd round draft picks.

booom.! Draft your Big OL/DE's with your #1 picks.. then grab the receivers after that... There is soo many athletic WR's out there you just never know what your gonna get... granted Jerry Rice/ Randy Moss were 1st round picks, but Terrell owens was round 3.
If Crabtree doesn't have the speed to go deep and is only a possession type receiver who has trouble getting open, why did we draft him so high? Was that a run on sentence or what? It just seems to me that he shouldn't have been picked that high if he doesn't have the whole package as a receiver. Also, if Ted Ginn is so fast, why is he not a deep threat. Don't tell me he can't catch. Well, you can tell me that, but I'm tired of hearing it.
Originally posted by LeftBankeNiner:
If Crabtree doesn't have the speed to go deep and is only a possession type receiver who has trouble getting open, why did we draft him so high? Was that a run on sentence or what? It just seems to me that he shouldn't have been picked that high if he doesn't have the whole package as a receiver. Also, if Ted Ginn is so fast, why is he not a deep threat. Don't tell me he can't catch. Well, you can tell me that, but I'm tired of hearing it.

Crabtree is the total package. It all depends on how you use a receiver. He will be the focus of our passing game next season but Alex still needs to work on his outside the hash game.

Vernon may just light the league on fire if we replace Delanie with a blocker who can also catch and beat LBs when we need. As much of a mismatch Delanie is, we keep Vernon in to block too much for blocks Delanie just cant make. I dont want to see our 4.38 TE stay into block because the other guy cant.
Originally posted by Joecool:
Crabtree is the total package. It all depends on how you use a receiver. He will be the focus of our passing game next season but Alex still needs to work on his outside the hash game.

Vernon may just light the league on fire if we replace Delanie with a blocker who can also catch and beat LBs when we need. As much of a mismatch Delanie is, we keep Vernon in to block too much for blocks Delanie just cant make. I dont want to see our 4.38 TE stay into block because the other guy cant.

how so?

doesnt have elite size
doesnt have elite speed

what exactly does he posses that makes him the total package?

hes a good WR who could dominate lesser CB (shows by his stats) but cannot beat a true #1 CB or their secondaries
Originally posted by 49ersalldaway126:
Originally posted by Joecool:
Crabtree is the total package. It all depends on how you use a receiver. He will be the focus of our passing game next season but Alex still needs to work on his outside the hash game.

Vernon may just light the league on fire if we replace Delanie with a blocker who can also catch and beat LBs when we need. As much of a mismatch Delanie is, we keep Vernon in to block too much for blocks Delanie just cant make. I dont want to see our 4.38 TE stay into block because the other guy cant.

how so?

doesnt have elite size
doesnt have elite speed

what exactly does he posses that makes him the total package?

hes a good WR who could dominate lesser CB (shows by his stats) but cannot beat a true #1 CB or their secondaries

Rice was 6'2" and was considered slow.

No one but the 49ers know how fast crabtree is. I can tell you that crabtree has enough speed jugding by how well of a runner he is after the catch. He fights for the ball. Dude had one bad game with he drops. He put up elite stats considering the number of chances he got and the start of year injury. He really didnt get into anflow until game 4 or so. In limited time his rookie year without nnowing the playbook he put up respectable stats.

He is a total package similar to boldin. You want a guy like Johnson whos on another level. Good luck. Compare crabs stats with another WR some want on here, Steve from BUF.
[ Edited by Joecool on Feb 10, 2012 at 4:56 PM ]
Originally posted by Joecool:
Originally posted by LeftBankeNiner:
If Crabtree doesn't have the speed to go deep and is only a possession type receiver who has trouble getting open, why did we draft him so high? Was that a run on sentence or what? It just seems to me that he shouldn't have been picked that high if he doesn't have the whole package as a receiver. Also, if Ted Ginn is so fast, why is he not a deep threat. Don't tell me he can't catch. Well, you can tell me that, but I'm tired of hearing it.

Crabtree is the total package. It all depends on how you use a receiver. He will be the focus of our passing game next season but Alex still needs to work on his outside the hash game.

Vernon may just light the league on fire if we replace Delanie with a blocker who can also catch and beat LBs when we need. As much of a mismatch Delanie is, we keep Vernon in to block too much for blocks Delanie just cant make. I dont want to see our 4.38 TE stay into block because the other guy cant.

I agree this is possible. I also think the same can be said if we can find a guy at WR good enough to draw coverage away from Vernon Davis and the others.

So we have two ways to open things up in the passing game for various players.