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Week 14: Thoughts after re-watching the game....

Originally posted by Marvin49:
Originally posted by pasodoc9er:
JoeC, prior to AZ game we were # one in tackles at point of first impact (or something like that) .Sure we made the tackles here, Grant had 14 of 'em. But point is,
we missed p-52...way worse than I figured. It didn't look that bad, but there were scads of missed tackles at first point of contact. p-52 doesn't miss. He sticks and takes 'em down. That we didn't have, as well as his flying around about 2 feet off the ground covering rt to lt sideline in a heartbeat. I hope he stays out a long time because if he comes back early, that hammy is going to either recur, or make him way less effective than he is at full throttle.

Yeah...but it wasn't Grant who missed those tackles. It was the safeties who couldn't bring Fitz down.

Grant did whiff on some tackles, no doubt about that.
Maybe after getting exposed twice the coaches will work harder on defending against the blitz, among other things. This won't be the last time teams will blitz the living s**t out of us ala Ravens and Cards.

FIX IT.
What was up with the secondary couldn't tackle for sh*t? They looked like the Saints' secondary out there...
Originally posted by AXEGRINDER:
Maybe after getting exposed twice the coaches will work harder on defending against the blitz, among other things. This won't be the last time teams will blitz the living s**t out of us ala Ravens and Cards.

FIX IT.

The issue isn't "defending" the blitz. The issue is making the other team PAY for the blitz. On most occasions, the blitz was actually picked up....momentarily anyway.

Alex didn't have anywhere to throw the ball or anywhere to escape to.
[ Edited by Marvin49 on Dec 12, 2011 at 5:13 PM ]
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Originally posted by YungAce:
edwards is useless

i can't believe we are 10-3 with 2 good receivers and nobody else to show for. and we barely started fitting williams into the gameplan as well

I'll be honest with you....re-watching a BAD game is actually better than re-watcing a good one.

When you re-watch a bad game you almost always realize it's not as bad as you thought. You already know the outcome of the game so you can be more emotionally detached. I wanted to throw something at the TV on first viewing, but upon second viewing I was able to see what went well and WHY the O is struggling.

When they win, I almost always see it the other way. I se all the stuff they missed. The stuff they left on the field that could have made a 26-0 score a 40 burger.

Good stuff.
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Originally posted by AXEGRINDER:
Maybe after getting exposed twice the coaches will work harder on defending against the blitz, among other things. This won't be the last time teams will blitz the living s**t out of us ala Ravens and Cards.

FIX IT.

The issue isn't "defending" the blitz. The issue is making the other team PAY for the blitz. On most occasions, the blitz was actually picked up....momentarily anyway.

Alex didn't have anywhere to throw the ball or anywhere to escape to.

well yeah, been saying that for awhile now.

Screen passes. Make it work.

I guarantee teams will back off.
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Originally posted by YungAce:
edwards is useless

i can't believe we are 10-3 with 2 good receivers and nobody else to show for. and we barely started fitting williams into the gameplan as well

I'll be honest with you....re-watching a BAD game is actually better than re-watcing a good one.

When you re-watch a bad game you almost always realize it's not as bad as you thought. You already know the outcome of the game so you can be more emotionally detached. I wanted to throw something at the TV on first viewing, but upon second viewing I was able to see what went well and WHY the O is struggling.

When they win, I almost always see it the other way. I se all the stuff they missed. The stuff they left on the field that could have made a 26-0 score a 40 burger.

Good stuff.
Originally posted by Gore_21:
Re-watched it as well as I have all season... Larry wasn't bad but he did have a few missed tackles... the biggest was along with Goldson on the Fitz pass over the middle that get an extra 30 yards because of that. I would agree he was pretty solid against the run and even made a few nice plays but in coverage and over the middle we could have used Patrick. There are a few plays/scrambles I would have liked to see what Patrick would have done.

Ray McDonald missed about 5 sacks on Skelton. Not exaggerating either.. he spun out of a few, side stepped one.... Aldon missed one as well. Had him around the legs.. seriously, guys Skelton isn't Vick. It was sad but props to Skelton.

Edwards injury filled season pretty much derailed any hope of him being that #1 playmaker we need. He is out of sinc and at times looks not into it but he isn't the only one. A lot of half assed efforts at times... VD blocking at times, guys not sticking with their blocks or standing around watching plays. P.S. At 1st Edwards seemed like a team 1st guy and now guys are starting to bicker... Crabtree looked unhappy after his great block to help Gore get a TD.... Spencer talking down VD before half, Edwards...

More slants... they were working all day...

Try a fricking screen... I get it we typically don't do them and never really did them well but can't be any worse than running every time on 1st or 2nd down and making it 2nd/3rd and 13 every time. So many times we went backwards.

I wish we would go shotgun once in awhile since the OL can't block/gets confused as heck on who to block during blitzes. I would say the biggest problem with our sacks is not getting beat man up it's getting confused when they send guys. We had 2 blocking one rusher while another 1 comes free many times. Roman seems stubborn... at times he is a genius and at others it's like Singletary is whispering what play to call in his ear.

Yeah, more Kyle Williams, less Ginn. Ginn at times has done some nice things but save a spot for him as a return specialist/ emergency WR (next year).

More misdirection on runs...also, at times we pull too much clogging up lanes... especially in the red zone.... try a pass out of jumbo....

Also, what is up with the confusion... snapping the ball with around 3 seconds every time.... wasting TO's and then getting a delay after a TO... that's preseason bull crap.

Same here...here's a couple other points:

I noticed that the OL often time blocks for a second and then, literally, just stands there. An OL will turn around and there will bne five Cardinals laying on top of Alex.
I loved how exotic the Cards blitz scheme was (TAKE NOTES FANGIO)...constantly moving around, standing up, bringing pressure from everywhere and they were all meeting at the QB. They'd run up to the LOS and get us to jump, some would rush, some would not or they would all rush or not. The point was that the OL was on their heels, getting driven back and beaten and Alex was running for his life. They could have had as many sacks as the Ravens save for a few penalties we accepted (face mask, etc.). I think they had about the same number of QB hits/pressures/hurries. Very nice job. Pisses me right off b/c THAT'S how WE are supposed to play!
Boone played a very good game for Staley (yay!)
Crabree, Edwards and Miller hustled to block their asses off down field so at least that's encouraging too bad we didn't run this game.
Redzone Play calling - WTF! So I rewatched the red zone chances we had and WTF! Alex literally has ONE shot...ONE option. That's it! And that option is always taken away. It's always a WR to one side of the field and the 2nd and 3rd option are guys such as Miller and Gore who run well short of the end zone and (even run straight out of bounds). Again, WTF?
Originally posted by AXEGRINDER:
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Originally posted by AXEGRINDER:
Maybe after getting exposed twice the coaches will work harder on defending against the blitz, among other things. This won't be the last time teams will blitz the living s**t out of us ala Ravens and Cards.

FIX IT.

The issue isn't "defending" the blitz. The issue is making the other team PAY for the blitz. On most occasions, the blitz was actually picked up....momentarily anyway.

Alex didn't have anywhere to throw the ball or anywhere to escape to.

well yeah, been saying that for awhile now.

Screen passes. Make it work.

I guarantee teams will back off.

Yeah...I dunno where thats gone. I'd also like the seam route to Davis back in theis offense. Thats his best play.

I will day this....one of the problems the Niners had was Calais (sp?) Campbell. That guy is freakin' 6'8" and got his hands up to knock the ball down on 2 short passes. Not every team is going to have a 6'8" defender to block passes at the line. I think he did the same in the first game.
Originally posted by English:
Nice. As usual Marvin.

Sky aint falling and RUN GORE MORE 10 times or simply is just not enough.
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Originally posted by NCommand:
You hit on many points I saw too. I'd like to state some additional concerns here:

1. Dropped passes; we must be close to 7% now after this game and it's just mind-boggling. Receivers flat out dropping perfect throws, losing balls, never turning around, on crucial 3rd and 4th downs, etc. drop after drop after drop. This is more than a perpetual problem by now and certainly needs to be addressed. It finally caught up to us. It's become a culture.
2. Another concern is the inability to use screen passes against an aggressive defense esp. when you have a Sproles-like player in Hunter and an OL that is best in space and at the second level. We used it one time and it worked very well and then I never saw it again.
3. When was the last time WE brought a CB or S blitz, or overloaded blitzes like what teams are doing against us? I am seeing Brooks/Smith being moved back and forth, rushing from the WILL/SAM spots but that's about as creative as we get.
4. Players such as Crabs/VD are starting to get fed up. This is a WCO right? The redzone should be the easiest for us b/c the WCO "is" a full time redzone offense...short passing game with utilizing TE's, RB's, WR slats, crossing routes, draws, QB rollouts, screens, etc. Since November 1st, we are only 3 of 13 in TD's in the redzone. Inexcusable...on both accounts.
5. Calls - has there been one game this year where we weren't screwed on a HUGE call by the refs? Its like that rookie OT who starts getting flaged for false starts and then is called every single game for them. It's become a culture.
6. Will Fangio ever learn not to play his defenders 10 yards off on 3rd and 5 or 20 yards off on 3rd and 10+, etc. Ever?
7. OL...we need help. If you just watch the LOS, this line is CONSTANTLY being shoved backwards, sometimes up to ten yards. It means Gore and Hunter have to run through 2 guys often just to get back to the original LOS and it generally means Alex is running for his life, getting crushed/hit, scrambling, throwing off timing, etc.
8. Penalties and getting plays in - what is your deal Harbaugh? We call a TO...? We then get a penalty? Having to use all these Ttime outs? What's our deal?
9. It seems like teams are evolving on defense and offense and as a team now and we are regressing; the commentator noted yesterday that Harbaugh never deviates from his game-plan which is fine when its working, Teams are game-planning very well against us and adjusting very well esp. at halftime. We are not and we are not deviating from the original plan and not making the proper adjustments at halftime.
10. Tired defense - we need a rotation here more on the DL; the front 7 is still providing pressure but they are overworked and tired

Agree on most points. The problem tho isn't so much the line in my opinion. I'm not saying they are playing well, I'm just saying teams are stacking the box and blitzing up the middle and the 49ers haven't yet found a way to make them pay for doing it. The Line is getting pushed back because they are CONTANTLY outnumbered.
I feel the biggest problem is the play calling. The one screen we ran worked, the quick slant worked, these are quick plays that beat an aggressive defense, the running play off the fake fly play was perfect for an aggressive defense but we do not use these plays enough or play like them. If you beat the all out blitz 3 or 4 times they back off and open up room for the rest of the play book. Also Why are we always throwing to Edwards and Ginn on goal line plays. Where are VD,crabs and Williams who has the best TD catch in the corner of the year.
Originally posted by tohara3:
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Originally posted by YungAce:
edwards is useless

i can't believe we are 10-3 with 2 good receivers and nobody else to show for. and we barely started fitting williams into the gameplan as well

I'll be honest with you....re-watching a BAD game is actually better than re-watcing a good one.

When you re-watch a bad game you almost always realize it's not as bad as you thought. You already know the outcome of the game so you can be more emotionally detached. I wanted to throw something at the TV on first viewing, but upon second viewing I was able to see what went well and WHY the O is struggling.

When they win, I almost always see it the other way. I se all the stuff they missed. The stuff they left on the field that could have made a 26-0 score a 40 burger.

Good stuff.

Amen! I always watch the first one with my heart and the next two objectively.
[ Edited by NCommand on Dec 12, 2011 at 5:22 PM ]
Originally posted by NCommand:
Originally posted by Gore_21:
Re-watched it as well as I have all season... Larry wasn't bad but he did have a few missed tackles... the biggest was along with Goldson on the Fitz pass over the middle that get an extra 30 yards because of that. I would agree he was pretty solid against the run and even made a few nice plays but in coverage and over the middle we could have used Patrick. There are a few plays/scrambles I would have liked to see what Patrick would have done.

Ray McDonald missed about 5 sacks on Skelton. Not exaggerating either.. he spun out of a few, side stepped one.... Aldon missed one as well. Had him around the legs.. seriously, guys Skelton isn't Vick. It was sad but props to Skelton.

Edwards injury filled season pretty much derailed any hope of him being that #1 playmaker we need. He is out of sinc and at times looks not into it but he isn't the only one. A lot of half assed efforts at times... VD blocking at times, guys not sticking with their blocks or standing around watching plays. P.S. At 1st Edwards seemed like a team 1st guy and now guys are starting to bicker... Crabtree looked unhappy after his great block to help Gore get a TD.... Spencer talking down VD before half, Edwards...

More slants... they were working all day...

Try a fricking screen... I get it we typically don't do them and never really did them well but can't be any worse than running every time on 1st or 2nd down and making it 2nd/3rd and 13 every time. So many times we went backwards.

I wish we would go shotgun once in awhile since the OL can't block/gets confused as heck on who to block during blitzes. I would say the biggest problem with our sacks is not getting beat man up it's getting confused when they send guys. We had 2 blocking one rusher while another 1 comes free many times. Roman seems stubborn... at times he is a genius and at others it's like Singletary is whispering what play to call in his ear.

Yeah, more Kyle Williams, less Ginn. Ginn at times has done some nice things but save a spot for him as a return specialist/ emergency WR (next year).

More misdirection on runs...also, at times we pull too much clogging up lanes... especially in the red zone.... try a pass out of jumbo....

Also, what is up with the confusion... snapping the ball with around 3 seconds every time.... wasting TO's and then getting a delay after a TO... that's preseason bull crap.

Same here...here's a couple other points:

I noticed that the OL often time blocks for a second and then, literally, just stands there. An OL will turn around and there will bne five Cardinals laying on top of Alex.
I loved how exotic the Cards blitz scheme was (TAKE NOTES FANGIO)...constantly moving around, standing up, bringing pressure from everywhere and they were all meeting at the QB. They'd run up to the LOS and get us to jump, some would rush, some would not or they would all rush or not. The point was that the OL was on their heels, getting driven back and beaten and Alex was running for his life. They could have had as many sacks as the Ravens save for a few penalties we accepted (face mask, etc.). I think they had about the same number of QB hits/pressures/hurries. Very nice job. Pisses me right off b/c THAT'S how WE are supposed to play!
Boone played a very good game for Staley (yay!)
Crabree, Edwards and Miller hustled to block their asses off down field so at least that's encouraging too bad we didn't run this game.
Redzone Play calling - WTF! So I rewatched the red zone chances we had and WTF! Alex literally has ONE shot...ONE option. That's it! And that option is always taken away. It's always a WR to one side of the field and the 2nd and 3rd option are guys such as Miller and Gore who run well short of the end zone and (even run straight out of bounds). Again, WTF?

Its because they are running max protect so there are very few players in the pattern.
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Its because they are running max protect so there are very few players in the pattern.

Oh no question! B/c if they don't Gore is tackled for a loss or Alex is sacked for a loss. Pick your poison. That said, this can be combated with a shot gun and quick slants, the TE and esp. screen passes. Or just about any other WCO play you can think of...
Originally posted by Marvin49:
Yeah...I dunno where thats gone. I'd also like the seam route to Davis back in theis offense. Thats his best play.

I will day this....one of the problems the Niners had was Calais (sp?) Campbell. That guy is freakin' 6'8" and got his hands up to knock the ball down on 2 short passes. Not every team is going to have a 6'8" defender to block passes at the line. I think he did the same in the first game.

True, then again not every team is going to have a Terrell Suggs or a James Harrison...but the teams we've faced/will face did/do.

I think the VD seam was just something that fell out of favor after his record year. Even last year, teams were doubling on it and putting a safety to cover the route. I think we should bring it back NOT because it will be a gamebreaker in our favor, but it will force teams to account for it again.

Also, we only ran one HB screen yesterday and it went for 10 yards - big surprise. Stop with those crappy little TE screens and throw in more HB screens. I noticed they also didn't try any bubble screens this game, but then again, we used them a bit in our last game and they probably had that play scouted.