Singletary: Heitman's job in jeopardy

Originally posted by dj43:
The reason a lot of people wanted Baas at center instead of Heitmann was because they thought Baas would get more "push" in short yardage situation. Well, that has not happened. In fact, statistically, running up the middle is the LEAST effective area for the 49ers to run. They are best on the right, next is the left, and LAST is up through the middle where Baas is supposed to be a beast.

I believe Heitmann should be at center because of his experience in calling blocking assignments, and because he won't be any less effective than Baas.

Move Baas to RG in place of Rachal if the team has truly given up on Rachal. I don't think so but I don't know.

However, another thing to remember, Baas is out of contract and the team has already as much as told him he will not be re-signed. Therefore, try Baas at RG, and if he succeeds better than Rachal, then try to re-sign him. If not, then Rachal is the RG.

I'm pretty sure Baas will remain our center for the foreseeable future. He has been the best member of the line this year. His one low point was his snap through the back of the end zone against the Saints. Heitmann needs to come back and play RG for us. Rachal needs to be sent packing. Staley needs to be moved back to RT. And Simms needs to be starting at LT with Davis backing him up.

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by dj43:
The reason a lot of people wanted Baas at center instead of Heitmann was because they thought Baas would get more "push" in short yardage situation. Well, that has not happened. In fact, statistically, running up the middle is the LEAST effective area for the 49ers to run. They are best on the right, next is the left, and LAST is up through the middle where Baas is supposed to be a beast.

I believe Heitmann should be at center because of his experience in calling blocking assignments, and because he won't be any less effective than Baas.

Move Baas to RG in place of Rachal if the team has truly given up on Rachal. I don't think so but I don't know.

However, another thing to remember, Baas is out of contract and the team has already as much as told him he will not be re-signed. Therefore, try Baas at RG, and if he succeeds better than Rachal, then try to re-sign him. If not, then Rachal is the RG.

I'm pretty sure Baas will remain our center for the foreseeable future. He has been the best member of the line this year. His one low point was his snap through the back of the end zone against the Saints. Heitmann needs to come back and play RG for us. Rachal needs to be sent packing. Staley needs to be moved back to RT. And Simms needs to be starting at LT with Davis backing him up.

Why would you put Heitmann at guard instead of center?

Why not move Baas to RG? He played there when he first came here.

They want maulers. They aren't interested in finesse/intelligent linemen like Heitmann.

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by dj43:
The reason a lot of people wanted Baas at center instead of Heitmann was because they thought Baas would get more "push" in short yardage situation. Well, that has not happened. In fact, statistically, running up the middle is the LEAST effective area for the 49ers to run. They are best on the right, next is the left, and LAST is up through the middle where Baas is supposed to be a beast.

I believe Heitmann should be at center because of his experience in calling blocking assignments, and because he won't be any less effective than Baas.

Move Baas to RG in place of Rachal if the team has truly given up on Rachal. I don't think so but I don't know.

However, another thing to remember, Baas is out of contract and the team has already as much as told him he will not be re-signed. Therefore, try Baas at RG, and if he succeeds better than Rachal, then try to re-sign him. If not, then Rachal is the RG.

I'm pretty sure Baas will remain our center for the foreseeable future. He has been the best member of the line this year. His one low point was his snap through the back of the end zone against the Saints. Heitmann needs to come back and play RG for us. Rachal needs to be sent packing. Staley needs to be moved back to RT. And Simms needs to be starting at LT with Davis backing him up.

Why would you put Heitmann at guard instead of center?

Why not move Baas to RG? He played there when he first came here.

Heitmann was better for us as a guard than as a center. Baas has been better as a center, where he was a stud in college, than he has as a guard. This stuff isn't hard.

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by dj43:
The reason a lot of people wanted Baas at center instead of Heitmann was because they thought Baas would get more "push" in short yardage situation. Well, that has not happened. In fact, statistically, running up the middle is the LEAST effective area for the 49ers to run. They are best on the right, next is the left, and LAST is up through the middle where Baas is supposed to be a beast.

I believe Heitmann should be at center because of his experience in calling blocking assignments, and because he won't be any less effective than Baas.

Move Baas to RG in place of Rachal if the team has truly given up on Rachal. I don't think so but I don't know.

However, another thing to remember, Baas is out of contract and the team has already as much as told him he will not be re-signed. Therefore, try Baas at RG, and if he succeeds better than Rachal, then try to re-sign him. If not, then Rachal is the RG.

I'm pretty sure Baas will remain our center for the foreseeable future. He has been the best member of the line this year. His one low point was his snap through the back of the end zone against the Saints. Heitmann needs to come back and play RG for us. Rachal needs to be sent packing. Staley needs to be moved back to RT. And Simms needs to be starting at LT with Davis backing him up.

Why would you put Heitmann at guard instead of center?

Why not move Baas to RG? He played there when he first came here.

Heitmann was better for us as a guard than as a center. Baas has been better as a center, where he was a stud in college, than he has as a guard. This stuff isn't hard.

I appreciate your opinion although I disagree with your conclusion that Baas is the best choice at center.

Originally posted by dj43:
The reason a lot of people wanted Baas at center instead of Heitmann was because they thought Baas would get more "push" in short yardage situation. Well, that has not happened. In fact, statistically, running up the middle is the LEAST effective area for the 49ers to run. They are best on the right, next is the left, and LAST is up through the middle where Baas is supposed to be a beast.

I believe Heitmann should be at center because of his experience in calling blocking assignments, and because he won't be any less effective than Baas.

Move Baas to RG in place of Rachal if the team has truly given up on Rachal. I don't think so but I don't know.

However, another thing to remember, Baas is out of contract and the team has already as much as told him he will not be re-signed. Therefore, try Baas at RG, and if he succeeds better than Rachal, then try to re-sign him. If not, then Rachal is the RG.

Gore was getting stopped behind the line of scrimmage for losses last year at least 4 times as often (which is a huge underestimate, but I don't want to spend hours figuring the exact numbers).

When looking at runs of less than 10 yards, our running average up the middle is far better.

Heitmann can get to the second level better than Baas (maybe this is why Gore had so many home runs last year), but Baas certainly gets better push in the run game (which contributes to why our short yardage runs are far better).

It's probably a wash, but most importantly, you don't want to make changes to the line unless you have to. The line is playing better than it has in years, despite the fact that they are eternal scapegoats. There is no reason to move Baas; I am more comfortable with a line that gets small chunks of yards for Gore, then a line that gets him stuffed 20 times behind the line, with an occasional 50 yard run (which Gore had the other day BTW).

The "elephant in the room" is the fact that this offense has been playing better than it has in many years; its just that we have killed ourselves with unforced turnovers.

[ Edited by BrianGO on Oct 18, 2010 at 23:07:06 ]

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by dj43:
The reason a lot of people wanted Baas at center instead of Heitmann was because they thought Baas would get more "push" in short yardage situation. Well, that has not happened. In fact, statistically, running up the middle is the LEAST effective area for the 49ers to run. They are best on the right, next is the left, and LAST is up through the middle where Baas is supposed to be a beast.

I believe Heitmann should be at center because of his experience in calling blocking assignments, and because he won't be any less effective than Baas.

Move Baas to RG in place of Rachal if the team has truly given up on Rachal. I don't think so but I don't know.

However, another thing to remember, Baas is out of contract and the team has already as much as told him he will not be re-signed. Therefore, try Baas at RG, and if he succeeds better than Rachal, then try to re-sign him. If not, then Rachal is the RG.

I'm pretty sure Baas will remain our center for the foreseeable future. He has been the best member of the line this year. His one low point was his snap through the back of the end zone against the Saints. Heitmann needs to come back and play RG for us. Rachal needs to be sent packing. Staley needs to be moved back to RT. And Simms needs to be starting at LT with Davis backing him up.

Why would you put Heitmann at guard instead of center?

Why not move Baas to RG? He played there when he first came here.

Heitmann was better for us as a guard than as a center. Baas has been better as a center, where he was a stud in college, than he has as a guard. This stuff isn't hard.

I appreciate your opinion although I disagree with your conclusion that Baas is the best choice at center.

i guess being the nations best center when drafted means nothing. i believe the quote was "THe nations best center equelly good at guard"

Originally posted by BrianGO:

Originally posted by dj43:
The reason a lot of people wanted Baas at center instead of Heitmann was because they thought Baas would get more "push" in short yardage situation. Well, that has not happened. In fact, statistically, running up the middle is the LEAST effective area for the 49ers to run. They are best on the right, next is the left, and LAST is up through the middle where Baas is supposed to be a beast.

I believe Heitmann should be at center because of his experience in calling blocking assignments, and because he won't be any less effective than Baas.

Move Baas to RG in place of Rachal if the team has truly given up on Rachal. I don't think so but I don't know.

However, another thing to remember, Baas is out of contract and the team has already as much as told him he will not be re-signed. Therefore, try Baas at RG, and if he succeeds better than Rachal, then try to re-sign him. If not, then Rachal is the RG.

Gore was getting stopped behind the line of scrimmage for losses last year at least 4 times as often (which is a huge underestimate, but I don't want to spend hours figuring the exact numbers).

When looking at runs of less than 10 yards, our running average up the middle is far better.

Heitmann can get to the second level better than Baas (maybe this is why Gore had so many home runs last year), but Baas certainly gets better push in the run game (which contributes to why our short yardage runs are far better).

It's probably a wash, but most importantly, you don't want to make changes to the line unless you have to. The line is playing better than it has in years, despite the fact that they are eternal scapegoats. There is no reason to move Baas; I am more comfortable with a line that gets small chunks of yards for Gore, then a line that gets him stuffed 20 times behind the line, with an occasional 50 yard run (which Gore had the other day BTW).

The "elephant in the room" is the fact that this offense has been playing better than it has in many years; its just that we have killed ourselves with unforced turnovers.

Now include younger and possibly cheaper.

If Heitman is better than Baas at Center than I can't see a difference. They seem about the same and I disagree about pulling. Baas has been very effective pulling for us and we have had less runs for a loss. Baas lost his job to a rookie at Guard so I don't understand the assumption that he would make a better RG than Heitman aloe considering Heitman played VERY solid as a RG. It almost seems as though some want to force Hietman into Center just because and not even worry about strengthening the RG spot.

Keep in mind that this was the 1st game as active since his injury. It was most likely an "only in emergency" situation. He did break a bone in his leg. Seems they're doing him right by bringing him back to game-shape slowly.

Whether Heitman is better at C than Baas, I don't think we know for sure. We do know that Baas has been playing VERY well this season and has most likely been our most consistent lineman thus far.

I too think Chilo has been a problem. Once Heitman is ready, I hope a combo of him and Baas force Chilo out of the starting lineup. Rachal seems like he's unsure of his own assignments half the time. I believe this, combined with his total lack of consistency, has hurt Anthony Davis a lot. When Snyder was in at RG, Davis played much better. After all, Snyder's played a lot at RT. I think Snyder, Baas, and Heitman, due to their level of experience at different positions, would shore up the right side.

Sorry for the length of this post!

Originally posted by fan49:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by dj43:
The reason a lot of people wanted Baas at center instead of Heitmann was because they thought Baas would get more "push" in short yardage situation. Well, that has not happened. In fact, statistically, running up the middle is the LEAST effective area for the 49ers to run. They are best on the right, next is the left, and LAST is up through the middle where Baas is supposed to be a beast.

I believe Heitmann should be at center because of his experience in calling blocking assignments, and because he won't be any less effective than Baas.

Move Baas to RG in place of Rachal if the team has truly given up on Rachal. I don't think so but I don't know.

However, another thing to remember, Baas is out of contract and the team has already as much as told him he will not be re-signed. Therefore, try Baas at RG, and if he succeeds better than Rachal, then try to re-sign him. If not, then Rachal is the RG.

I'm pretty sure Baas will remain our center for the foreseeable future. He has been the best member of the line this year. His one low point was his snap through the back of the end zone against the Saints. Heitmann needs to come back and play RG for us. Rachal needs to be sent packing. Staley needs to be moved back to RT. And Simms needs to be starting at LT with Davis backing him up.

Why would you put Heitmann at guard instead of center?

Why not move Baas to RG? He played there when he first came here.

Heitmann was better for us as a guard than as a center. Baas has been better as a center, where he was a stud in college, than he has as a guard. This stuff isn't hard.

I appreciate your opinion although I disagree with your conclusion that Baas is the best choice at center.

i guess being the nations best center when drafted means nothing. i believe the quote was "THe nations best center equelly good at guard"

It does mean nothing. If it was true I would imagine he might have secured a starting role at guard?

So, no. He is doing ok but when they join the NFL the slate is wiped clean.

Originally posted by bigtony2tone:
Keep in mind that this was the 1st game as active since his injury. It was most likely an "only in emergency" situation. He did break a bone in his leg. Seems they're doing him right by bringing him back to game-shape slowly.

Whether Heitman is better at C than Baas, I don't think we know for sure. We do know that Baas has been playing VERY well this season and has most likely been our most consistent lineman thus far.

I too think Chilo has been a problem. Once Heitman is ready, I hope a combo of him and Baas force Chilo out of the starting lineup. Rachal seems like he's unsure of his own assignments half the time. I believe this, combined with his total lack of consistency, has hurt Anthony Davis a lot. When Snyder was in at RG, Davis played much better. After all, Snyder's played a lot at RT. I think Snyder, Baas, and Heitman, due to their level of experience at different positions, would shore up the right side.

Sorry for the length of this post!

This. And don't apologise, it was a good post.

what if we move Baas to RG?

Staley Iupati Heitman Baas Davis

Originally posted by Frisco69ers:
what if we move Baas to RG?

Staley Iupati Baas Heitman Davis

Fixed

Originally posted by BrianGO:

Originally posted by dj43:
The reason a lot of people wanted Baas at center instead of Heitmann was because they thought Baas would get more "push" in short yardage situation. Well, that has not happened. In fact, statistically, running up the middle is the LEAST effective area for the 49ers to run. They are best on the right, next is the left, and LAST is up through the middle where Baas is supposed to be a beast.

I believe Heitmann should be at center because of his experience in calling blocking assignments, and because he won't be any less effective than Baas.

Move Baas to RG in place of Rachal if the team has truly given up on Rachal. I don't think so but I don't know.

However, another thing to remember, Baas is out of contract and the team has already as much as told him he will not be re-signed. Therefore, try Baas at RG, and if he succeeds better than Rachal, then try to re-sign him. If not, then Rachal is the RG.

Gore was getting stopped behind the line of scrimmage for losses last year at least 4 times as often (which is a huge underestimate, but I don't want to spend hours figuring the exact numbers).

When looking at runs of less than 10 yards, our running average up the middle is far better.

Heitmann can get to the second level better than Baas (maybe this is why Gore had so many home runs last year), but Baas certainly gets better push in the run game (which contributes to why our short yardage runs are far better).

It's probably a wash, but most importantly, you don't want to make changes to the line unless you have to. The line is playing better than it has in years, despite the fact that they are eternal scapegoats. There is no reason to move Baas; I am more comfortable with a line that gets small chunks of yards for Gore, then a line that gets him stuffed 20 times behind the line, with an occasional 50 yard run (which Gore had the other day BTW).

The "elephant in the room" is the fact that this offense has been playing better than it has in many years; its just that we have killed ourselves with unforced turnovers.

According to statistics on offensive line play at the NFL site, running up the middle is the LEAST effective area of the 49er offensive line. According to the numbers, running to the right has been the most effective area. Running left is second. Running up the middle is least effective.

I believe it was Barrows who noted that Smith has more confidence in Heitmann's blocking calls than Baas. That alone should suggest Baas move to RG and Heitmann to center. Observation also suggests that whatever the reason, the center of the line has OFTEN missed blocks, missed blitz pickups, etc. All of this strongly suggests that blocking assignments are either wrong, or the players themselves are not making the play.

Finally, Baas has been far less the bulldozer that everyone hoped to see at center. He has been getting knocked backward with some regularity this season.

Originally posted by fan49:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by dj43:

Originally posted by Kilgore_Trout:

Originally posted by dj43:
The reason a lot of people wanted Baas at center instead of Heitmann was because they thought Baas would get more "push" in short yardage situation. Well, that has not happened. In fact, statistically, running up the middle is the LEAST effective area for the 49ers to run. They are best on the right, next is the left, and LAST is up through the middle where Baas is supposed to be a beast.

I believe Heitmann should be at center because of his experience in calling blocking assignments, and because he won't be any less effective than Baas.

Move Baas to RG in place of Rachal if the team has truly given up on Rachal. I don't think so but I don't know.

However, another thing to remember, Baas is out of contract and the team has already as much as told him he will not be re-signed. Therefore, try Baas at RG, and if he succeeds better than Rachal, then try to re-sign him. If not, then Rachal is the RG.

I'm pretty sure Baas will remain our center for the foreseeable future. He has been the best member of the line this year. His one low point was his snap through the back of the end zone against the Saints. Heitmann needs to come back and play RG for us. Rachal needs to be sent packing. Staley needs to be moved back to RT. And Simms needs to be starting at LT with Davis backing him up.

Why would you put Heitmann at guard instead of center?

Why not move Baas to RG? He played there when he first came here.

Heitmann was better for us as a guard than as a center. Baas has been better as a center, where he was a stud in college, than he has as a guard. This stuff isn't hard.

I appreciate your opinion although I disagree with your conclusion that Baas is the best choice at center.

i guess being the nations best center when drafted means nothing. i believe the quote was "THe nations best center equelly good at guard"

If that was true, it was a very weak draft class for centers and guards. It took Baas three years to get off the bench.