Clayton Ranking NFL starting quarterbacks

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by solidg2000:

Originally posted by WildBill:

Originally posted by kem99:

Originally posted by Tru2RedNGold25:
Here's your poster boy:

21. Alex Smith, San Francisco 49ers

Analysis: It's hard to believe this is Smith's sixth season. The pressure is on him to get the 49ers to the playoffs. He has not lived up to his No. 1 billing in the draft, obviously, but the surrounding cast is good enough to make a playoff run. One of the faults I noticed when I saw him in the preseason is that he doesn't always hit receivers in stride.
Chance of being elite: 0 percent


It's very true elite QB's can hit a receiver in stride when they have to.

think why i still dont trust this guy even with a pro bowl cast we could end up not making the playoff's because of play

im not a Smith backer but i want the playoffs SO BAD that i really dont have no choice but back him.

Just imagine what kind of team we would have if we had A REAL NFL QB like lets say Drew Brees????..............

Just for fun...where do you think Brees was in QB ranking before he went to New Orleans? The Chargers had so much faith in him, they drafted another franchise QB because they thought they missed on Brees. The Dolphins chose to pass on him in favor of Culpepper, though Brees' shoulder injury had something to do with that.

All I am saying is it took Brees a few years to become "elite". Not saying Alex will necessarily follow that path but lets not pretend that Brees was "elite" from the beginning.

Bress was always a good passer with the Chargers, but they felt he wasn't prototypical and no one knew how he would comeback from that shoulder injury. He would have gotten more suitors if not for that injury. Things however have a way of working out for those.

No he wasn't
that's why they drafted Eli Manning which became Philip Rivers
Brees didnt start to play well until after Rivers was on the team

Actually; Brees ran hot and cold. He was on an off year(due to Line issues) and nearing the end of his contract(midway point actually) so their GM chose Manning(Rivers by trade) and then Brees had a solid year so they traded Brees to New Orleans and went with the Rookie. Brees has a Super Bowl and Tomlinson has moved on to the Jets and effectively leveled the playing field for the AFCWest. Rivers is no more likely to go to and win a Super Bowl than many people here believe Alex is.

I don't have the list but I think that Smith is a better QB than Rivers, due to Rivers sidearm delivery. When you put the ball at the same height as the Defensive Linemen they should be able to get a hand on it and that creates turnovers.

So where is Rivers listed? If he's in the top 15 Clayton is a moron who should stop eating paint chips.

Now I'm really interested to see Clayton's list. If for no other reason than laugh value.

~Ceadder

Seriously. You're putting Smith ahead of Rivers and accusing someone else of eating paint chips.

Philip Rivers has had 2 seasons of a 100 rating average. 2 time Pro Bowler, and finished 3rd in MVP voting last season.

Alex has 4 100 rating games, and 1 300 yard game. That's with 43 starts under his belt.

You bet your ass I do.

I gave a very good reason why as well. San Diego no longer has Tomlinson. They still have some solid Backs but I don't think they'll be all that now that LT is over in New York. Which doesn't take pressure off the QB position in SD. He's got to make his throws count more and Defenses know that he sidearms the ball.

But here I'll name some more to cement my position about Clayton and his paint chip fetish.

1 thru 3 you really can't argue with. In fact they're probably the easiest to rank and most fans would probably have them ranked the same. It's nothing Clayton couldn't have snagged from a fan poll.

1.Peyton
2. Brady
3. Brees

Now here is where he starts sliding on rails to showing how unintelligent he is.

Roethlessberger @ 4? Over Favre? Are we kidding? Big Ben is not a top 5 QB. No freakin way. Every Starter could go belly up get stuck in the ground and he STILL wouldn't crack the top 5. His completion percentage is one of the LOWEST in the league.

5-9 is pure BS.

5. Favre. Should be number 4.
6. Rodgers. Yay you made the post season with basically the same talent that Favre had before he "retired".
7. Rivers.
8.Romo
9. McNabb.

As I show no way Favre is worse than Roethlesberger, in fact I rank him higher cause he pulls Wins out his ass when it matters. Big Ben has NEVER done this. Not ever.

Rivers for his sidearm.
Romo is a choke artist.
And how the hell did those two rate ABOVE McNabb who if we signed him would have taken us to the Super Bowl by Claytons own deluded rantings on Murph and Mac? If McNabb is so damn good that he could do this BEFORE our draft, how the hell you rank that guy at 9 below two guys that haven't even gotten to the big dance?

And let's include #10 Carson Palmer. Palmer is a much better QB than Romo and Rivers. How does Clayton justify ranking him below them except by having McNabb ranked below them.

I would also point out that Cutler and Orton are also ranked WAY too high. Should be nearer to where Garrard is. Jason Cambell deserves 19 based on what? Hasselback is an injury away from being out of the league but should still be ranked higher than Eli because he IS a better QB.

Vince Young and Smith are in the same boat but there's no mention of this in Young's write up.

So how can I take anyone whose list has so many discrepancies seriously?

Especially someone who only uses stats when it suits his purpose. i.e. Matt Schaub.

I stand by my opinion the man eats big fat lead filled paint chips.

~Ceadder

Have you been hiding under a rock the past 2 years? LT is washed up. You honestly think that his 3.8 and 3.4 yards per carry carried Rivers? San Diego finished 31st in rushing last season, and 20th in 08. Do you watch football at all?

I don't think you do, because your list is so 2 years ago. Big Ben has 2 Super Bowl rings and last season did improve his completion to 66%. If you watched the man play you would have saw that he put 4,300 yards, 26-12 TD/Int and a 100 rating last season. He doesn't pull wins out of @ss? Not ever. I seem to recall a Super Bowl 2 years ago when he lead Pittsburgh on a game winning drive.

Rodgers is the one best QB's in football. Take off the homer glasses and watch him play. He's spectular.

Carson Palmer has fallen off the map. Last season his play mirrored Smith's play. He's not better than Romo or Rivers, and really shouldn't be in the top 12. The guy has 0 playoff wins too so don't give me no choking arguments either.

Eli Manning is a better QB than Hassleback right now. I don't think he's anything special, but he is a solid QB and as of right now has more team success than Hassleback and is much better statisically.

I'm not going to flip about QB's ranked from 15-21. They're all average QB's and nobody should care if Campbell is ranked a little higher than Smith. VY has a Pro Bowl and an 18-11 starting record. He just has more team success than Alex. Jason Campbell finished better than Alex in just about every statisical category last season with a worse team too (Alex has him on TD's per game). I'd give them a tie though. Either way it's not something to flip about it.

He hit D. Walker in stride on a slant last game against the Raiders. Don't know what Clayton's talking about . And not sure Clayton himself knows what he's talking about either.

Only ten pages, huh?

I think its a strange coincidence that Clayton has noticed the same thing I noticed. Either both of us are completely delusional and blinded by our irrational hate of Alex or this issue is blatantly obvious that somebody like myself would notice.

Originally posted by fister30:
Only ten pages, huh?

I think its a strange coincidence that Clayton has noticed the same thing I noticed. Either both of us are completely delusional and blinded by our irrational hate of Alex or this issue is blatantly obvious that somebody like myself would notice.

Or that neither of you has taken sufficient time in making a worthwhile analysis of the situation.

Originally posted by Shaj:

Originally posted by BubbaParisMVP:
I don't see the validity of a pre-season ranking. Since you can't draw any hard and fast conclusions from pre-season performances (unless a player has clearly passed his shelf life and tanked) a pre-season ranking should closely resemble the end of season rankings from the preceding year. After all, what new information is there to go on, right?

In short, there's no new useful data, so there's no meaningfulness to the ranking--assuming you actually find such rankings meaningful in the first place.

If he was ranked #10, I bet you and almost everyone else here would see a LOT of validity in this pre-season ranking.

The thing is, the difference between 10th best QB in the NFL and the 20th is not huge.

Originally posted by Shaj:

Originally posted by BubbaParisMVP:
I don't see the validity of a pre-season ranking. Since you can't draw any hard and fast conclusions from pre-season performances (unless a player has clearly passed his shelf life and tanked) a pre-season ranking should closely resemble the end of season rankings from the preceding year. After all, what new information is there to go on, right?

In short, there's no new useful data, so there's no meaningfulness to the ranking--assuming you actually find such rankings meaningful in the first place.

If he was ranked #10, I bet you and almost everyone else here would see a LOT of validity in this pre-season ranking.

i wouldnt that would be way too high

IMO he should be between 15-20 with maybe like 20% chance of being elite but cmon this list is bs

so many mistakes teh biggest one being shaub not only is he a top 5-7 qb he is knocked out all the way to 15? cmon

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by solidg2000:

Originally posted by WildBill:

Originally posted by kem99:

Originally posted by Tru2RedNGold25:
Here's your poster boy:

21. Alex Smith, San Francisco 49ers

Analysis: It's hard to believe this is Smith's sixth season. The pressure is on him to get the 49ers to the playoffs. He has not lived up to his No. 1 billing in the draft, obviously, but the surrounding cast is good enough to make a playoff run. One of the faults I noticed when I saw him in the preseason is that he doesn't always hit receivers in stride.
Chance of being elite: 0 percent


It's very true elite QB's can hit a receiver in stride when they have to.

think why i still dont trust this guy even with a pro bowl cast we could end up not making the playoff's because of play

im not a Smith backer but i want the playoffs SO BAD that i really dont have no choice but back him.

Just imagine what kind of team we would have if we had A REAL NFL QB like lets say Drew Brees????..............

Just for fun...where do you think Brees was in QB ranking before he went to New Orleans? The Chargers had so much faith in him, they drafted another franchise QB because they thought they missed on Brees. The Dolphins chose to pass on him in favor of Culpepper, though Brees' shoulder injury had something to do with that.

All I am saying is it took Brees a few years to become "elite". Not saying Alex will necessarily follow that path but lets not pretend that Brees was "elite" from the beginning.

Bress was always a good passer with the Chargers, but they felt he wasn't prototypical and no one knew how he would comeback from that shoulder injury. He would have gotten more suitors if not for that injury. Things however have a way of working out for those.

No he wasn't
that's why they drafted Eli Manning which became Philip Rivers
Brees didnt start to play well until after Rivers was on the team

Actually; Brees ran hot and cold. He was on an off year(due to Line issues) and nearing the end of his contract(midway point actually) so their GM chose Manning(Rivers by trade) and then Brees had a solid year so they traded Brees to New Orleans and went with the Rookie. Brees has a Super Bowl and Tomlinson has moved on to the Jets and effectively leveled the playing field for the AFCWest. Rivers is no more likely to go to and win a Super Bowl than many people here believe Alex is.

I don't have the list but I think that Smith is a better QB than Rivers, due to Rivers sidearm delivery. When you put the ball at the same height as the Defensive Linemen they should be able to get a hand on it and that creates turnovers.

So where is Rivers listed? If he's in the top 15 Clayton is a moron who should stop eating paint chips.

Now I'm really interested to see Clayton's list. If for no other reason than laugh value.

~Ceadder

Seriously. You're putting Smith ahead of Rivers and accusing someone else of eating paint chips.

Philip Rivers has had 2 seasons of a 100 rating average. 2 time Pro Bowler, and finished 3rd in MVP voting last season.

Alex has 4 100 rating games, and 1 300 yard game. That's with 43 starts under his belt.

You bet your ass I do.

I gave a very good reason why as well. San Diego no longer has Tomlinson. They still have some solid Backs but I don't think they'll be all that now that LT is over in New York. Which doesn't take pressure off the QB position in SD. He's got to make his throws count more and Defenses know that he sidearms the ball.

But here I'll name some more to cement my position about Clayton and his paint chip fetish.

1 thru 3 you really can't argue with. In fact they're probably the easiest to rank and most fans would probably have them ranked the same. It's nothing Clayton couldn't have snagged from a fan poll.

1.Peyton
2. Brady
3. Brees

Now here is where he starts sliding on rails to showing how unintelligent he is.

Roethlessberger @ 4? Over Favre? Are we kidding? Big Ben is not a top 5 QB. No freakin way. Every Starter could go belly up get stuck in the ground and he STILL wouldn't crack the top 5. His completion percentage is one of the LOWEST in the league.

5-9 is pure BS.

5. Favre. Should be number 4.
6. Rodgers. Yay you made the post season with basically the same talent that Favre had before he "retired".
7. Rivers.
8.Romo
9. McNabb.

As I show no way Favre is worse than Roethlesberger, in fact I rank him higher cause he pulls Wins out his ass when it matters. Big Ben has NEVER done this. Not ever.

Rivers for his sidearm.
Romo is a choke artist.
And how the hell did those two rate ABOVE McNabb who if we signed him would have taken us to the Super Bowl by Claytons own deluded rantings on Murph and Mac? If McNabb is so damn good that he could do this BEFORE our draft, how the hell you rank that guy at 9 below two guys that haven't even gotten to the big dance?

And let's include #10 Carson Palmer. Palmer is a much better QB than Romo and Rivers. How does Clayton justify ranking him below them except by having McNabb ranked below them.

I would also point out that Cutler and Orton are also ranked WAY too high. Should be nearer to where Garrard is. Jason Cambell deserves 19 based on what? Hasselback is an injury away from being out of the league but should still be ranked higher than Eli because he IS a better QB.

Vince Young and Smith are in the same boat but there's no mention of this in Young's write up.

So how can I take anyone whose list has so many discrepancies seriously?

Especially someone who only uses stats when it suits his purpose. i.e. Matt Schaub.

I stand by my opinion the man eats big fat lead filled paint chips.

~Ceadder

Have you been hiding under a rock the past 2 years? LT is washed up. You honestly think that his 3.8 and 3.4 yards per carry carried Rivers? San Diego finished 31st in rushing last season, and 20th in 08. Do you watch football at all?

I don't think you do, because your list is so 2 years ago. Big Ben has 2 Super Bowl rings and last season did improve his completion to 66%. If you watched the man play you would have saw that he put 4,300 yards, 26-12 TD/Int and a 100 rating last season. He doesn't pull wins out of @ss? Not ever. I seem to recall a Super Bowl 2 years ago when he lead Pittsburgh on a game winning drive.

Rodgers is the one best QB's in football. Take off the homer glasses and watch him play. He's spectular.

Carson Palmer has fallen off the map. Last season his play mirrored Smith's play. He's not better than Romo or Rivers, and really shouldn't be in the top 12. The guy has 0 playoff wins too so don't give me no choking arguments either.

Eli Manning is a better QB than Hassleback right now. I don't think he's anything special, but he is a solid QB and as of right now has more team success than Hassleback and is much better statisically.

I'm not going to flip about QB's ranked from 15-21. They're all average QB's and nobody should care if Campbell is ranked a little higher than Smith. VY has a Pro Bowl and an 18-11 starting record. He just has more team success than Alex. Jason Campbell finished better than Alex in just about every statisical category last season with a worse team too (Alex has him on TD's per game). I'd give them a tie though. Either way it's not something to flip about it.

"Your list is so two years ago..."

I haven't even put together a list. I'm just pointing out that Big Ben does not merit a #4 ranking based on a 66% completion rating. Ain't it funny how you claim "my list is so two years ago" and then you try to defend your opinion based on... wait for it...

The Steeler's final drive in their last Super Bowl. Which honestly the Cards coughed up a big ole worm ball Defensively. Nevermind that isn't pulling a game out your ass unless there's clock pressure. And there wasn't it was your typical 2 minute drill and Ben did his job. Yaaaaaaaaaaay

So please if you wish to defend the list fine, but no way you can say Ben is better on the field than Favre. I absofrigginlutely HATE Favruh, but if you rank Ben over him you've lost every last marble in your head. Ben is not top 5. Never has been and never will be based on his career stats. You couldn't be any more wrong than if you said Namath was top 10 All-Time.

~Ceadder

Originally posted by Gavintech:

The thing is, the difference between 10th best QB in the NFL and the 20th is not huge.

That's a really good point.

The crop of starting NFL quarterbacks are more of a rectangle curve than a bell curve. On average, you have 2-3 truly excellent QBs followed by a huge pack of competent but largely interchangeable QBs, followed by 2-3 hapless disaster areas.

Originally posted by oldman9er:

Originally posted by fastforward:

It's interesting that the arguments against Smith now get down to the not-hitting-in-stride. That's quite an improvement from last season!

THIS

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:
IMO he will be better this year than what we have seen. So called "experts" are going off of the past which is the only body of work they can judge. But he never had a good O Line in front of him until this year and he never ever had 2 years in the same system and with the same coordinator until now. So he will for sure be better IMO.

Ubran Meyer gave us an exact road map. He told us what to do. "Alex is NON FUNCTIONAL until he gets it. He has to understand everything before he is effective. And when he does he is a dynamic QB."

So what did we do? We gave him a new O. Coordinator and new system every single year.

IMO he may never be great but I also don't think he will be as bad as what people believe either. I believe he can be more than functional. He can even be good. He was last year at times. There is no way with 2 years in the same system and with a better O Line and Crabtree in his 2nd year he is worse. It's not possible.

... and THIS

This whole thread is nothing more than masturbatory material for the haters... have fun.

/Thread

Wow good job Mr. Clayton, Alex has at least 20 QB's in this League who are better than he is, and a back up or two. 21 isn't a horrible assessment good job John, indeed.

I cant wait until th end of this season so we can once and foreall can stop talking about alex. I am a supporter but getting truly sick and tired of this discussion. if he works out, doenst work out, i dont care, i just want it to be over already

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by solidg2000:

Originally posted by WildBill:

Originally posted by kem99:

Originally posted by Tru2RedNGold25:
Here's your poster boy:

21. Alex Smith, San Francisco 49ers

Analysis: It's hard to believe this is Smith's sixth season. The pressure is on him to get the 49ers to the playoffs. He has not lived up to his No. 1 billing in the draft, obviously, but the surrounding cast is good enough to make a playoff run. One of the faults I noticed when I saw him in the preseason is that he doesn't always hit receivers in stride.
Chance of being elite: 0 percent


It's very true elite QB's can hit a receiver in stride when they have to.

think why i still dont trust this guy even with a pro bowl cast we could end up not making the playoff's because of play

im not a Smith backer but i want the playoffs SO BAD that i really dont have no choice but back him.

Just imagine what kind of team we would have if we had A REAL NFL QB like lets say Drew Brees????..............

Just for fun...where do you think Brees was in QB ranking before he went to New Orleans? The Chargers had so much faith in him, they drafted another franchise QB because they thought they missed on Brees. The Dolphins chose to pass on him in favor of Culpepper, though Brees' shoulder injury had something to do with that.

All I am saying is it took Brees a few years to become "elite". Not saying Alex will necessarily follow that path but lets not pretend that Brees was "elite" from the beginning.

Bress was always a good passer with the Chargers, but they felt he wasn't prototypical and no one knew how he would comeback from that shoulder injury. He would have gotten more suitors if not for that injury. Things however have a way of working out for those.

No he wasn't
that's why they drafted Eli Manning which became Philip Rivers
Brees didnt start to play well until after Rivers was on the team

Actually; Brees ran hot and cold. He was on an off year(due to Line issues) and nearing the end of his contract(midway point actually) so their GM chose Manning(Rivers by trade) and then Brees had a solid year so they traded Brees to New Orleans and went with the Rookie. Brees has a Super Bowl and Tomlinson has moved on to the Jets and effectively leveled the playing field for the AFCWest. Rivers is no more likely to go to and win a Super Bowl than many people here believe Alex is.

I don't have the list but I think that Smith is a better QB than Rivers, due to Rivers sidearm delivery. When you put the ball at the same height as the Defensive Linemen they should be able to get a hand on it and that creates turnovers.

So where is Rivers listed? If he's in the top 15 Clayton is a moron who should stop eating paint chips.

Now I'm really interested to see Clayton's list. If for no other reason than laugh value.

~Ceadder

Seriously. You're putting Smith ahead of Rivers and accusing someone else of eating paint chips.

Philip Rivers has had 2 seasons of a 100 rating average. 2 time Pro Bowler, and finished 3rd in MVP voting last season.

Alex has 4 100 rating games, and 1 300 yard game. That's with 43 starts under his belt.

You bet your ass I do.

I gave a very good reason why as well. San Diego no longer has Tomlinson. They still have some solid Backs but I don't think they'll be all that now that LT is over in New York. Which doesn't take pressure off the QB position in SD. He's got to make his throws count more and Defenses know that he sidearms the ball.

But here I'll name some more to cement my position about Clayton and his paint chip fetish.

1 thru 3 you really can't argue with. In fact they're probably the easiest to rank and most fans would probably have them ranked the same. It's nothing Clayton couldn't have snagged from a fan poll.

1.Peyton
2. Brady
3. Brees

Now here is where he starts sliding on rails to showing how unintelligent he is.

Roethlessberger @ 4? Over Favre? Are we kidding? Big Ben is not a top 5 QB. No freakin way. Every Starter could go belly up get stuck in the ground and he STILL wouldn't crack the top 5. His completion percentage is one of the LOWEST in the league.

5-9 is pure BS.

5. Favre. Should be number 4.
6. Rodgers. Yay you made the post season with basically the same talent that Favre had before he "retired".
7. Rivers.
8.Romo
9. McNabb.

As I show no way Favre is worse than Roethlesberger, in fact I rank him higher cause he pulls Wins out his ass when it matters. Big Ben has NEVER done this. Not ever.

Rivers for his sidearm.
Romo is a choke artist.
And how the hell did those two rate ABOVE McNabb who if we signed him would have taken us to the Super Bowl by Claytons own deluded rantings on Murph and Mac? If McNabb is so damn good that he could do this BEFORE our draft, how the hell you rank that guy at 9 below two guys that haven't even gotten to the big dance?

And let's include #10 Carson Palmer. Palmer is a much better QB than Romo and Rivers. How does Clayton justify ranking him below them except by having McNabb ranked below them.

I would also point out that Cutler and Orton are also ranked WAY too high. Should be nearer to where Garrard is. Jason Cambell deserves 19 based on what? Hasselback is an injury away from being out of the league but should still be ranked higher than Eli because he IS a better QB.

Vince Young and Smith are in the same boat but there's no mention of this in Young's write up.

So how can I take anyone whose list has so many discrepancies seriously?

Especially someone who only uses stats when it suits his purpose. i.e. Matt Schaub.

I stand by my opinion the man eats big fat lead filled paint chips.

~Ceadder

Have you been hiding under a rock the past 2 years? LT is washed up. You honestly think that his 3.8 and 3.4 yards per carry carried Rivers? San Diego finished 31st in rushing last season, and 20th in 08. Do you watch football at all?

I don't think you do, because your list is so 2 years ago. Big Ben has 2 Super Bowl rings and last season did improve his completion to 66%. If you watched the man play you would have saw that he put 4,300 yards, 26-12 TD/Int and a 100 rating last season. He doesn't pull wins out of @ss? Not ever. I seem to recall a Super Bowl 2 years ago when he lead Pittsburgh on a game winning drive.

Rodgers is the one best QB's in football. Take off the homer glasses and watch him play. He's spectular.

Carson Palmer has fallen off the map. Last season his play mirrored Smith's play. He's not better than Romo or Rivers, and really shouldn't be in the top 12. The guy has 0 playoff wins too so don't give me no choking arguments either.

Eli Manning is a better QB than Hassleback right now. I don't think he's anything special, but he is a solid QB and as of right now has more team success than Hassleback and is much better statisically.

I'm not going to flip about QB's ranked from 15-21. They're all average QB's and nobody should care if Campbell is ranked a little higher than Smith. VY has a Pro Bowl and an 18-11 starting record. He just has more team success than Alex. Jason Campbell finished better than Alex in just about every statisical category last season with a worse team too (Alex has him on TD's per game). I'd give them a tie though. Either way it's not something to flip about it.

"Your list is so two years ago..."

I haven't even put together a list. I'm just pointing out that Big Ben does not merit a #4 ranking based on a 66% completion rating. Ain't it funny how you claim "my list is so two years ago" and then you try to defend your opinion based on... wait for it...

The Steeler's final drive in their last Super Bowl. Which honestly the Cards coughed up a big ole worm ball Defensively. Nevermind that isn't pulling a game out your ass unless there's clock pressure. And there wasn't it was your typical 2 minute drill and Ben did his job. Yaaaaaaaaaaay

So please if you wish to defend the list fine, but no way you can say Ben is better on the field than Favre. I absofrigginlutely HATE Favruh, but if you rank Ben over him you've lost every last marble in your head. Ben is not top 5. Never has been and never will be based on his career stats. You couldn't be any more wrong than if you said Namath was top 10 All-Time.

~Ceadder

66% completion percentage is good. That's the 5th best completion percentage last season, and better than Favre's completion percentage last season.

I bring up his Super Bowl comeback because it's only the biggest game of the year. I would of thought that you would at least paid attention to that game. Sure there's 18 others I could point too but I'm going with that one.

Let's compare 2 scenarios here.

Down by 4 2:42 left on the clock with the drive starting at the 22 yard line. Game winning TD at 35 seconds

Down by 3 3:10 left on the clock with drive starting at the 11 yard line. Game winning TD at 34 seconds

I'm guessing you're going to say that only the Niner one was restrained by the clock.

Historically you're right, but you're talking about 42 year old Brett Favre compared to a Big Ben in his prime. Favre had a great season last year, but it's not like he's been consisantly good over the past 5 years (70.9, 72.7, 95.7, 81, 107.2). He's not Jesus, and he's doesn't pull games out of @ss in January either. I challenge you to find someone with more game losing picks then him.

Originally posted by Daniel2778:
I cant wait until th end of this season so we can once and foreall can stop talking about alex. I am a supporter but getting truly sick and tired of this discussion. if he works out, doenst work out, i dont care, i just want it to be over already

For the 49ers, it'd be better if Smith works out great. If he fails, then the search for QB continues, which is rather painful for most teams.

KILGORE!!! Oakland-niner???????????? And whoever talks crap about why I think Smith sucks... Accuracy, Accuracy, Accuracy...... Enough said!!!!! McNabb would have been a great pick-up. Your boy Smith is going to have to have a miracle year. Let's see what happens. I just want a deep playoff run and a shot at a Superbowl. Is that so much to ask for since I pay a couple grrrrr a year for seats? Make good on my investment Smith.

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by tjd808185:

Originally posted by Ceadderman:

Originally posted by solidg2000:

Originally posted by WildBill:

Originally posted by kem99:

Originally posted by Tru2RedNGold25:
Here's your poster boy:

21. Alex Smith, San Francisco 49ers

Analysis: It's hard to believe this is Smith's sixth season. The pressure is on him to get the 49ers to the playoffs. He has not lived up to his No. 1 billing in the draft, obviously, but the surrounding cast is good enough to make a playoff run. One of the faults I noticed when I saw him in the preseason is that he doesn't always hit receivers in stride.
Chance of being elite: 0 percent


It's very true elite QB's can hit a receiver in stride when they have to.

think why i still dont trust this guy even with a pro bowl cast we could end up not making the playoff's because of play

im not a Smith backer but i want the playoffs SO BAD that i really dont have no choice but back him.

Just imagine what kind of team we would have if we had A REAL NFL QB like lets say Drew Brees????..............

Just for fun...where do you think Brees was in QB ranking before he went to New Orleans? The Chargers had so much faith in him, they drafted another franchise QB because they thought they missed on Brees. The Dolphins chose to pass on him in favor of Culpepper, though Brees' shoulder injury had something to do with that.

All I am saying is it took Brees a few years to become "elite". Not saying Alex will necessarily follow that path but lets not pretend that Brees was "elite" from the beginning.

Bress was always a good passer with the Chargers, but they felt he wasn't prototypical and no one knew how he would comeback from that shoulder injury. He would have gotten more suitors if not for that injury. Things however have a way of working out for those.

No he wasn't
that's why they drafted Eli Manning which became Philip Rivers
Brees didnt start to play well until after Rivers was on the team

Actually; Brees ran hot and cold. He was on an off year(due to Line issues) and nearing the end of his contract(midway point actually) so their GM chose Manning(Rivers by trade) and then Brees had a solid year so they traded Brees to New Orleans and went with the Rookie. Brees has a Super Bowl and Tomlinson has moved on to the Jets and effectively leveled the playing field for the AFCWest. Rivers is no more likely to go to and win a Super Bowl than many people here believe Alex is.

I don't have the list but I think that Smith is a better QB than Rivers, due to Rivers sidearm delivery. When you put the ball at the same height as the Defensive Linemen they should be able to get a hand on it and that creates turnovers.

So where is Rivers listed? If he's in the top 15 Clayton is a moron who should stop eating paint chips.

Now I'm really interested to see Clayton's list. If for no other reason than laugh value.

~Ceadder

Seriously. You're putting Smith ahead of Rivers and accusing someone else of eating paint chips.

Philip Rivers has had 2 seasons of a 100 rating average. 2 time Pro Bowler, and finished 3rd in MVP voting last season.

Alex has 4 100 rating games, and 1 300 yard game. That's with 43 starts under his belt.

You bet your ass I do.

I gave a very good reason why as well. San Diego no longer has Tomlinson. They still have some solid Backs but I don't think they'll be all that now that LT is over in New York. Which doesn't take pressure off the QB position in SD. He's got to make his throws count more and Defenses know that he sidearms the ball.

But here I'll name some more to cement my position about Clayton and his paint chip fetish.

1 thru 3 you really can't argue with. In fact they're probably the easiest to rank and most fans would probably have them ranked the same. It's nothing Clayton couldn't have snagged from a fan poll.

1.Peyton
2. Brady
3. Brees

Now here is where he starts sliding on rails to showing how unintelligent he is.

Roethlessberger @ 4? Over Favre? Are we kidding? Big Ben is not a top 5 QB. No freakin way. Every Starter could go belly up get stuck in the ground and he STILL wouldn't crack the top 5. His completion percentage is one of the LOWEST in the league.

5-9 is pure BS.

5. Favre. Should be number 4.
6. Rodgers. Yay you made the post season with basically the same talent that Favre had before he "retired".
7. Rivers.
8.Romo
9. McNabb.

As I show no way Favre is worse than Roethlesberger, in fact I rank him higher cause he pulls Wins out his ass when it matters. Big Ben has NEVER done this. Not ever.

Rivers for his sidearm.
Romo is a choke artist.
And how the hell did those two rate ABOVE McNabb who if we signed him would have taken us to the Super Bowl by Claytons own deluded rantings on Murph and Mac? If McNabb is so damn good that he could do this BEFORE our draft, how the hell you rank that guy at 9 below two guys that haven't even gotten to the big dance?

And let's include #10 Carson Palmer. Palmer is a much better QB than Romo and Rivers. How does Clayton justify ranking him below them except by having McNabb ranked below them.

I would also point out that Cutler and Orton are also ranked WAY too high. Should be nearer to where Garrard is. Jason Cambell deserves 19 based on what? Hasselback is an injury away from being out of the league but should still be ranked higher than Eli because he IS a better QB.

Vince Young and Smith are in the same boat but there's no mention of this in Young's write up.

So how can I take anyone whose list has so many discrepancies seriously?

Especially someone who only uses stats when it suits his purpose. i.e. Matt Schaub.

I stand by my opinion the man eats big fat lead filled paint chips.

~Ceadder

Have you been hiding under a rock the past 2 years? LT is washed up. You honestly think that his 3.8 and 3.4 yards per carry carried Rivers? San Diego finished 31st in rushing last season, and 20th in 08. Do you watch football at all?

I don't think you do, because your list is so 2 years ago. Big Ben has 2 Super Bowl rings and last season did improve his completion to 66%. If you watched the man play you would have saw that he put 4,300 yards, 26-12 TD/Int and a 100 rating last season. He doesn't pull wins out of @ss? Not ever. I seem to recall a Super Bowl 2 years ago when he lead Pittsburgh on a game winning drive.

Rodgers is the one best QB's in football. Take off the homer glasses and watch him play. He's spectular.

Carson Palmer has fallen off the map. Last season his play mirrored Smith's play. He's not better than Romo or Rivers, and really shouldn't be in the top 12. The guy has 0 playoff wins too so don't give me no choking arguments either.

Eli Manning is a better QB than Hassleback right now. I don't think he's anything special, but he is a solid QB and as of right now has more team success than Hassleback and is much better statisically.

I'm not going to flip about QB's ranked from 15-21. They're all average QB's and nobody should care if Campbell is ranked a little higher than Smith. VY has a Pro Bowl and an 18-11 starting record. He just has more team success than Alex. Jason Campbell finished better than Alex in just about every statisical category last season with a worse team too (Alex has him on TD's per game). I'd give them a tie though. Either way it's not something to flip about it.

"Your list is so two years ago..."

I haven't even put together a list. I'm just pointing out that Big Ben does not merit a #4 ranking based on a 66% completion rating. Ain't it funny how you claim "my list is so two years ago" and then you try to defend your opinion based on... wait for it...

The Steeler's final drive in their last Super Bowl. Which honestly the Cards coughed up a big ole worm ball Defensively. Nevermind that isn't pulling a game out your ass unless there's clock pressure. And there wasn't it was your typical 2 minute drill and Ben did his job. Yaaaaaaaaaaay

So please if you wish to defend the list fine, but no way you can say Ben is better on the field than Favre. I absofrigginlutely HATE Favruh, but if you rank Ben over him you've lost every last marble in your head. Ben is not top 5. Never has been and never will be based on his career stats. You couldn't be any more wrong than if you said Namath was top 10 All-Time.

~Ceadder

66% completion percentage is good. That's the 5th best completion percentage last season, and better than Favre's completion percentage last season.

I bring up his Super Bowl comeback because it's only the biggest game of the year. I would of thought that you would at least paid attention to that game. Sure there's 18 others I could point too but I'm going with that one.

Let's compare 2 scenarios here.

Down by 4 2:42 left on the clock with the drive starting at the 22 yard line. Game winning TD at 35 seconds

Down by 3 3:10 left on the clock with drive starting at the 11 yard line. Game winning TD at 34 seconds

I'm guessing you're going to say that only the Niner one was restrained by the clock.

Historically you're right, but you're talking about 42 year old Brett Favre compared to a Big Ben in his prime. Favre had a great season last year, but it's not like he's been consisantly good over the past 5 years (70.9, 72.7, 95.7, 81, 107.2). He's not Jesus, and he's doesn't pull games out of @ss in January either. I challenge you to find someone with more game losing picks then him.

Two words: Ball Placement.

This has been Smith's issue and he's been looking good in this category the last two games. Can't say the same for that first game but it's the first game so he gets a mulligan.

percent, schcerment! It's about Ball Placement.