People who are not sold on Singletary

I have said it before, and will continue to say it, if you think that Mike Singletary doesn't know the "x's and o's" you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground. It is utterly retarded to think that a 10 time all star and Hall of Fame player doesn't understand in game strategy.

Originally posted by Memphis9er:
I have said it before, and will continue to say it, if you think that Mike Singletary doesn't know the "x's and o's" you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground. It is utterly retarded to think that a 10 time all star and Hall of Fame player doesn't understand in game strategy.

Not sold. Maybe if they start winning playoff games I'll feel better about him as HC.

I want winners.

Originally posted by BETTERDAYZ9ERS:
This thread would not have been created if

-Dre Bly picks off Favre on 4th down of the Vikings game

-Favre gets hit before he can throw that lucky pass to Lewis at the end

-Al Everest does not call a double reverse in the beginning of the Seahawks game.

-Parys Haralson pushes Chris Johnson out of bounds on a 4th down TD run.

Game of inches bro. Those were 3 games that could have went our way. Could have gone 11-5 and you would be praising Singletary.

You can interpret this as just on the cusp of something great...or...sloppyness that did not occur back when the 49ers were the premier team in the league.

Originally posted by Memphis9er:
I have said it before, and will continue to say it, if you think that Mike Singletary doesn't know the "x's and o's" you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground. It is utterly retarded to think that a 10 time all star and Hall of Fame player doesn't understand in game strategy.

When people refer to X's and O's they aren't referring to knowing actual plays. They are referring to scheming an offense/defense and coming up with gameplans that will put the team in the best position to win.... and NO, Singletary has NOT displayed this in ANY way shape or form. When you lose as many close games as we did due to poor initial gameplans, that's poor coaching. So far he's been a great motivator and mentor, but absolutely terrible game manager and schemer.

Originally posted by Ninerman49:

Originally posted by jreff22:
DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB DUMB

please listen to this mans comments.. no one can speak here until the end of this upcoming season. Everyone on the zone thinks they are nostradamus and can predict everything.. lol im sorry but ur not that talented

Neither is Singletary as a game manager/planner

Originally posted by 49oz2superbowl:

Originally posted by Memphis9er:
I have said it before, and will continue to say it, if you think that Mike Singletary doesn't know the "x's and o's" you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground. It is utterly retarded to think that a 10 time all star and Hall of Fame player doesn't understand in game strategy.

When people refer to X's and O's they aren't referring to knowing actual plays. They are referring to scheming an offense/defense and coming up with gameplans that will put the team in the best position to win.... and NO, Singletary has NOT displayed this in ANY way shape or form. When you lose as many close games as we did due to poor initial gameplans, that's poor coaching. So far he's been a great motivator and mentor, but absolutely terrible game manager and schemer.

would you rather have nolans schemes with less motivation? or singletary and his players actually doing something... when it came down to it we were short handed with our offensive line play! the only time we really put running yards on the board was when gore broke it for big other then that he avg maybe 2-3 yards a carry! and the only reason why we opened up the play book in the second half was cause we were already down and had to pass to play catch up.

what i'm saying is what would you really expect from a head coach in his first year? i think sing did way better then any of us would have expected. that and our o.c. is bill cosby! we'll be great this year! i think you guys are beginning to point the finger way to early!

do you guys wanna get him fired before the season starts? sounds like it! you guys can't build a perfect team over a year... it takes time! just be happy with what we have! instead of constantly rebuilding!

Originally posted by Memphis9er:
I have said it before, and will continue to say it, if you think that Mike Singletary doesn't know the "x's and o's" you don't know your ass from a hole in the ground. It is utterly retarded to think that a 10 time all star and Hall of Fame player doesn't understand in game strategy.

When YOU assume that in saying he is not and x and o coach that I mean he does not know his xs and os then you need to learn how to read the english language.

I have played and coached football, Mike Singletarry has for gotten more football than I will ever know, his knowledge of xs and os is not in doubt, it is his coaching style that I speak of when I say he is not an x and o guy.

Sing like myself is a motivational coach, this implies that his belief in his players and their belief in themselves is his primary focus. You can tell he is more focused on this by his choice of offensive style, brutal direct no bones about it bare knuckled football, think Ditka, think Gibs, think smash mouth.
An x and o coach worries more about optimizing his chances through play selection and deception, think Wyche, think Levy, think finesse.

The greats can do both WELL think Lombardi, think Walsh, think Shula, if you put Sing in this category you know very little about football.

End of the day I am saying motivation is is best asset, and that xs and os are a weakness for Mike, this does not mean he can't win games, or championships, it just means that every so often we will get out thought, but rarely will be out fought!

GO NINERS!

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by GolittaCamper:

Originally posted by oldninerdude:

Originally posted by GolittaCamper:

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:
Not sold? I guess not but . . .

Erickson: 9-23
Nolan: 18-37
Singletary: 13-12

I'll give him credit for having a winning record to date. That said for me to be sold on Singletary this team needs to take the next step in 2010 . . . meaning a Division Title.

This,

I just love his ability to motivate, BUT I just hate his understanding of X and Os!

Not Sold, but tempted to buy in!

What, exactly, do we know about his understanding of X's and O's?

Just based on his playing career, and his reputation as an undersized but intense and cerebral HOF MLB, I'd wager that he knows far more than the average fan, far more than you (and me) about X's and O's.

Seems like this particular criticism is based more on ignorance than fact.

How many times did his Bears play against the Niners back then? So he prepared, as the QB of the Bears defense, to play against Montana and the original WCO at its best.

Doesn't it seem likely that he studied that offense and knew it inside and out? He probably knows as much about the WCO and all its X's and O's as anybody.

Did you not see the Falcons game? It was one of the worst plan events since George Armstrong Custer said " Leave the gatling guns behind, we need to get to the little big horn fast!" Sing is a great motivator but if you think he is any kind of high IQ football guru....Sorry to disappoint you.

He's a lot of Mike Ditka, and no Bill Walsh!

Plenty of coaches have won on inspiration alone, many have won on pure Xs and Os, but the very few who do both well are on a short list in Canton Ohio!


Lombardi, Walsh, Shula.... Singletarry? no not buying that!

Yes, I did suffer through the experience of watching the Atlanta game. What part of a knowledge of X's and O's translates into a cornerback being too slow to react to Roddy White and your FS taking a bad angle--leading to the touchdown that opened the floodgates on a very flat (after the Minnesota game and a week before the bye week) team? It wasn't the X's and O's, or the game plan, that lost that game. It was a failure to execute by the players--maybe Singletary's failure to properly motivate them--not X's and O's.

Face it, there's never gonna be another Bill Walsh. He was one of a kind and its unfair to any coach to compare them to Walsh.

Singletary's got his own strengths and weaknesses. Whether knowledge of X's and O's is one or the other, or somewhere in between, we really don't know.

Frankly, I'd be surprised if you could diagram the route tree, or explain all the blocking assignments of the TEs, or anything like that. Singletary, on the other hand, doubtlessly knows the playbook inside and out, and each player's assignment for every play. He may know the nuances and details for LB play better than he knows those things for the OL, but I'd wager he still knows all the player's assignments for every play--and isn't that what the "X's and O's" are really all about?

It's undoubtedly a second language for Singletary, one that he learned long ago and has been fluent in for along time. Your attempt to criticize him about it is like an American who doesn't speak French criticizing a Frenchman's accent--when he's never heard the Frenchman speak and wouldn't understand him if he did--just because he saw a French movie once, with subtitles.

Can you cite to one instance where Singletary's purported lack of knowledge of the X's and O's was revealed? Where he called for a draw when he meant to call for a dive play? When he thought it was going to be a sweep and it was a trap? Where he thought a double reverse was a bubble screen? Anything?

Allow me to paraphrase what you're saying: "That Singletary's a great motivator, but he doesn't really know football." Really?

NFL HOF MLB who played in ten pro bowls? Surprising, since, according to your position, he really didn't know what he was doing and doesn't understand the game.

Did they have other guys on the field with him during those pro bowls, pointing him in the right direction, telling him what to do? Guys that were really motivated to help him?

This particular criticism just doesn't seem very well founded, to me. Or else I am misunderstanding what you're trying to say. If so, I apologize, but I just don't see a valid basis in fact for your criticism, here.

You misunderstand, let me sum up, Mikes coaching style, like my comes from teaching basics and motivating his guys, his choice of offense is like mine, simple effective and brutal if executed well.

I understand my "Xs and Os" and I am sure Mike knows them better than I.

Your point about the corner that is to slow, makes my point well. A motivator, puts his trust and faith in his players, and they respond as best they can... even if they are to slow they keep chasing and never quit. A X and O coach finds a way to give help to his weaker players, by scheme, or even sitting and playing a back-up who matches up better.

Some coaches use motivation, some use X's and Os, it is not a good thing or a bad thing it is simply a thing.

The truly great coaches coaches who transcend the game do both well, I don't buy that Sing is a great coach, one who does it all. I don't put him in the same category as a Bill Walsh or even a Bill Parcels. That doesn't mean he can't bring in X and O type co-ordinators, to round out his style, it does not mean he can't learn to lean on match-up and deception, it doesn't mean he will never be a great coach it just means he isn't there yet. So do I buy into him, no not yet, I'm I kick-en the tires on his band wagon you bet!

Go NINERS!

Sing is a good coach, he gets the most out of his players. With that said, I do not know who actually chooses the plays, does Raye or does Sing override him at times?

I think the doubt that sing has cast, is that we all know that he wants to be able to run the ball at will, but sometime the 49ers were so stuborn about running that you didn't need to wonder gee what are they going to do. I understand that you want to let people you are going to run but at some point you have got to do a play action past to keep people on their toes. In the first half of the season they did it four straight series multiple games.

However, Sing did let the off. open up in the second half of the season. I think that shows he can adapt. He is still learning as a coach himself. Let's just hope they run but stay open minded.

His choice of Raye was probably the desire of getting someone who will not be bolting right away after a years time. He wanted a vet, and didnot want to take a chance on a young up and comer off coordinator. If he did and the off. soared there would be a good chance the guy would bolt cause if you make the anemic niners suddenly fly high, his value would go up.

In the end I think he should be given at least 3 full years. If Holmgren or Shanahan was available you would have to consider them, right now else is worthy? Certainly not pete carrol

Singletary's biggest flaw is his belief that the NFL has not changed since he was a player. He had to, on multiple occasions, change his strategy last season because of this. Whether it be his offensive schemes, etc.

Is he a good motivator ? Yes. But I dont think he has what it takes to be a great NFL coach. He has an 8-8 team from last year, and he's decided that the same team will achieve much more just based on the notion that they have an extra offseason to wokr together. Well, that philosophy worked back in the 80s and early 90s because every other team was doing the same thing. In today's NFL, when coaches like Shanahan can turn a once dead franchise into legitimate contenders by a few key acquisitions through free agency, this old school philosophy will not work.

For all the "fans" that have their marbles in Smith's basket, imagine how low you will feel if he doesnt pan out. Our entire season rests on his shoulder.....if he stinks it up, another season is shot and we go back to the drawing board. Thats not a sign of a championship caliber team folks. Thats the sign of a team just hanging on by a thread and hoping their success stems from other teams mistakes (in our case, hoping the rest of the teams in our division suck)....

Originally posted by ZRF80:
Singletary's biggest flaw is his belief that the NFL has not changed since he was a player. He had to, on multiple occasions, change his strategy last season because of this. Whether it be his offensive schemes, etc.

Is he a good motivator ? Yes. But I dont think he has what it takes to be a great NFL coach. He has an 8-8 team from last year, and he's decided that the same team will achieve much more just based on the notion that they have an extra offseason to wokr together. Well, that philosophy worked back in the 80s and early 90s because every other team was doing the same thing. In today's NFL, when coaches like Shanahan can turn a once dead franchise into legitimate contenders by a few key acquisitions through free agency, this old school philosophy will not work.

For all the "fans" that have their marbles in Smith's basket, imagine how low you will feel if he doesnt pan out. Our entire season rests on his shoulder.....if he stinks it up, another season is shot and we go back to the drawing board. Thats not a sign of a championship caliber team folks. Thats the sign of a team just hanging on by a thread and hoping their success stems from other teams mistakes (in our case, hoping the rest of the teams in our division suck)....

so based upon this and prolly your attitude on the team... we're not making the playoffs at all? am i wrong?

Originally posted by djfullshred:
Not sold. Maybe if they start winning playoff games I'll feel better about him as HC.

I want winners.

Is winning playoff games the new criteria? Cause it sure as hell wasn't when Nolan was here! Why would we even be considering canning Sing when he has done nothing but great things for this team.

I agree that he is not the brightest offensive-minded coach, but that is easy to solve. Bring in an offensive advisor or have Johnson step into the role more this year.

Originally posted by GOLDMOUTH22:

Originally posted by 9erfanAUS:

Originally posted by GolittaCamper:

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:
Not sold? I guess not but . . .

Erickson: 9-23
Nolan: 18-37
Singletary: 13-12

I'll give him credit for having a winning record to date. That said for me to be sold on Singletary this team needs to take the next step in 2010 . . . meaning a Division Title.

This,

I just love his ability to motivate, BUT I just hate his understanding of X and Os!

Not Sold, but tempted to buy in!

this is my view as well..

-9fA

so in your opinion what does he not know about x's and o's? especially being a hof in a defense that went up against bill walsh? he was the qb of the defensive side of the ball... studying way more x's and o's hen a qb on a single team... how about studying all x's and o's from all the teams!

He knows a lot about football strategy. I'm not debating that. But comparatively to the HCs around the league such as Payton and Belichick, I think of those guys as the more 'chalkboard' guys who usually come up with genius gameplans.

I don't 'hate' his understanding of x's and o's, but I don't think that he's on that upper echelon level.

For what it's worth, I was mostly agreeing with the last statement.

-9fA

Originally posted by GOLDMOUTH22:

Originally posted by ZRF80:
Singletary's biggest flaw is his belief that the NFL has not changed since he was a player. He had to, on multiple occasions, change his strategy last season because of this. Whether it be his offensive schemes, etc.

Is he a good motivator ? Yes. But I dont think he has what it takes to be a great NFL coach. He has an 8-8 team from last year, and he's decided that the same team will achieve much more just based on the notion that they have an extra offseason to wokr together. Well, that philosophy worked back in the 80s and early 90s because every other team was doing the same thing. In today's NFL, when coaches like Shanahan can turn a once dead franchise into legitimate contenders by a few key acquisitions through free agency, this old school philosophy will not work.

For all the "fans" that have their marbles in Smith's basket, imagine how low you will feel if he doesnt pan out. Our entire season rests on his shoulder.....if he stinks it up, another season is shot and we go back to the drawing board. Thats not a sign of a championship caliber team folks. Thats the sign of a team just hanging on by a thread and hoping their success stems from other teams mistakes (in our case, hoping the rest of the teams in our division suck)....

so based upon this and prolly your attitude on the team... we're not making the playoffs at all? am i wrong?

ZRF80 this guy who predicted us to go 1-15 this year and well in a bout inspiration, is predicting us to go 1-15 last year...

-9fA

[ Edited by 9erfanAUS on May 5, 2010 at 14:03:46 ]