Pattern or Coincidence?

Originally posted by BigDaddy:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by 49erRider:
I believe the "pattern" in question is the fact that all the coaches and FO personnel that were here before Singletary and Jed York took over are being fired. In other words, they're getting rid of everything about the old regime, much like they did when the Yorks took over and got rid of everything Walsh- and DeBartolo-related.

Hopefully it ends now because if this is truly a pattern, Manusky will be next to go.

It could be getting rid of the old regime. But I just think getting Holmgren or Shannahan would have been better. Oh well. Well just have to make due with this.

whats so great about Shanahan?

hes so overrated. yeah, when he was an OC with Steve Young and Jerry Rice, or a head coach with John Elway and Terrell Davis, he sure looked great. what happened when Elway and Davis retired? the Broncos got really mediocre really fast.

Shanahan is stubborn, and the way he handles his running game is awful. he wont make changes when what hes doing clearly isnt working. the Broncos wouldnt have just let him walk away if he was the coach you make him out to be.

Ah lets see... He won 2 Super Bowls! That's what's great. We currently have no GM and how many Super Bowls have the guys we have running the show won?

How many did he win after Elway and TD left? He might have been a great judge of offensive talent, but look at his body of work putting together a defense. He sure didn't make Griese look like a HOF, nor any of the QB's who came after Elway and Plummer don't count.

exactly, i remember reading that just because a coach has won a SB b4 it doesnt mean he will lead another team to another SB. off the top of my head i cant think of a head coach that has won a SB with more than 1 team...

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by 49erRider:
I believe the "pattern" in question is the fact that all the coaches and FO personnel that were here before Singletary and Jed York took over are being fired. In other words, they're getting rid of everything about the old regime, much like they did when the Yorks took over and got rid of everything Walsh- and DeBartolo-related.

Hopefully it ends now because if this is truly a pattern, Manusky will be next to go.

It could be getting rid of the old regime. But I just think getting Holmgren or Shannahan would have been better. Oh well. Well just have to make due with this.

whats so great about Shanahan?

hes so overrated. yeah, when he was an OC with Steve Young and Jerry Rice, or a head coach with John Elway and Terrell Davis, he sure looked great. what happened when Elway and Davis retired? the Broncos got really mediocre really fast.

Shanahan is stubborn, and the way he handles his running game is awful. he wont make changes when what hes doing clearly isnt working. the Broncos wouldnt have just let him walk away if he was the coach you make him out to be.

Ah lets see... He won 2 Super Bowls! That's what's great. We currently have no GM and how many Super Bowls have the guys we have running the show won?

2 super bowls with 2 HOFers.

come on. without Elway, Shanahan was nothing as a HC.

You really want to get into it, Holmgren was about the same with Favre. I was reading an article, about Mike Holmgren, pointing out his track record as a GM wasn't pretty at all. As a matter of fact he lost that title.

Originally posted by BigDaddy:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by 49erRider:
I believe the "pattern" in question is the fact that all the coaches and FO personnel that were here before Singletary and Jed York took over are being fired. In other words, they're getting rid of everything about the old regime, much like they did when the Yorks took over and got rid of everything Walsh- and DeBartolo-related.

Hopefully it ends now because if this is truly a pattern, Manusky will be next to go.

It could be getting rid of the old regime. But I just think getting Holmgren or Shannahan would have been better. Oh well. Well just have to make due with this.

whats so great about Shanahan?

hes so overrated. yeah, when he was an OC with Steve Young and Jerry Rice, or a head coach with John Elway and Terrell Davis, he sure looked great. what happened when Elway and Davis retired? the Broncos got really mediocre really fast.

Shanahan is stubborn, and the way he handles his running game is awful. he wont make changes when what hes doing clearly isnt working. the Broncos wouldnt have just let him walk away if he was the coach you make him out to be.

Ah lets see... He won 2 Super Bowls! That's what's great. We currently have no GM and how many Super Bowls have the guys we have running the show won?

How many did he win after Elway and TD left? He might have been a great judge of offensive talent, but look at his body of work putting together a defense. He sure didn't make Griese look like a HOF, nor any of the QB's who came after Elway and Plummer don't count.

Hmmm... So you are saying a great coach needs great players. Gee what a concept... You could say the same about Jimmy Johnson in Dallas and later in Miami with much less talent. What about George Siefert with the 49ers and later on with other organizations? What about Phil Jackson without Jordan and Pippen and Kobe and Shaq. Does he win all those championships without that talent level? Maybe none of them.

I will say this one last time for all. YOU NEED GREAT PLAYERS AND COACHING TO WIN! DUH.

[ Edited by SanDiego49er on Mar 24, 2010 at 00:57:13 ]

Originally posted by Sinsation:

Originally posted by BigDaddy:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by 49erRider:
I believe the "pattern" in question is the fact that all the coaches and FO personnel that were here before Singletary and Jed York took over are being fired. In other words, they're getting rid of everything about the old regime, much like they did when the Yorks took over and got rid of everything Walsh- and DeBartolo-related.

Hopefully it ends now because if this is truly a pattern, Manusky will be next to go.

It could be getting rid of the old regime. But I just think getting Holmgren or Shannahan would have been better. Oh well. Well just have to make due with this.

whats so great about Shanahan?

hes so overrated. yeah, when he was an OC with Steve Young and Jerry Rice, or a head coach with John Elway and Terrell Davis, he sure looked great. what happened when Elway and Davis retired? the Broncos got really mediocre really fast.

Shanahan is stubborn, and the way he handles his running game is awful. he wont make changes when what hes doing clearly isnt working. the Broncos wouldnt have just let him walk away if he was the coach you make him out to be.

Ah lets see... He won 2 Super Bowls! That's what's great. We currently have no GM and how many Super Bowls have the guys we have running the show won?

How many did he win after Elway and TD left? He might have been a great judge of offensive talent, but look at his body of work putting together a defense. He sure didn't make Griese look like a HOF, nor any of the QB's who came after Elway and Plummer don't count.

exactly, i remember reading that just because a coach has won a SB b4 it doesnt mean he will lead another team to another SB. off the top of my head i cant think of a head coach that has won a SB with more than 1 team...

I love Seifert and think he was a great coach. He even turned Carolina into a contender, but his winning a SB as HC was using plans and players put together by Walsh. You can include Switzer's winning with the team built by Jimmy. But I sure as hell don't want Switzer GMing my team.

Originally posted by Sinsation:

Originally posted by BigDaddy:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by 49erRider:
I believe the "pattern" in question is the fact that all the coaches and FO personnel that were here before Singletary and Jed York took over are being fired. In other words, they're getting rid of everything about the old regime, much like they did when the Yorks took over and got rid of everything Walsh- and DeBartolo-related.

Hopefully it ends now because if this is truly a pattern, Manusky will be next to go.

It could be getting rid of the old regime. But I just think getting Holmgren or Shannahan would have been better. Oh well. Well just have to make due with this.

whats so great about Shanahan?

hes so overrated. yeah, when he was an OC with Steve Young and Jerry Rice, or a head coach with John Elway and Terrell Davis, he sure looked great. what happened when Elway and Davis retired? the Broncos got really mediocre really fast.

Shanahan is stubborn, and the way he handles his running game is awful. he wont make changes when what hes doing clearly isnt working. the Broncos wouldnt have just let him walk away if he was the coach you make him out to be.

Ah lets see... He won 2 Super Bowls! That's what's great. We currently have no GM and how many Super Bowls have the guys we have running the show won?

How many did he win after Elway and TD left? He might have been a great judge of offensive talent, but look at his body of work putting together a defense. He sure didn't make Griese look like a HOF, nor any of the QB's who came after Elway and Plummer don't count.

exactly, i remember reading that just because a coach has won a SB b4 it doesnt mean he will lead another team to another SB. off the top of my head i cant think of a head coach that has won a SB with more than 1 team...

i dont beleive anyone has. Shula, Parcells, Vermeil, Reeves, and Holmgren have taken 2 different teams, but i dont think any won with both.

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by BigDaddy:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by 49erRider:
I believe the "pattern" in question is the fact that all the coaches and FO personnel that were here before Singletary and Jed York took over are being fired. In other words, they're getting rid of everything about the old regime, much like they did when the Yorks took over and got rid of everything Walsh- and DeBartolo-related.

Hopefully it ends now because if this is truly a pattern, Manusky will be next to go.

It could be getting rid of the old regime. But I just think getting Holmgren or Shannahan would have been better. Oh well. Well just have to make due with this.

whats so great about Shanahan?

hes so overrated. yeah, when he was an OC with Steve Young and Jerry Rice, or a head coach with John Elway and Terrell Davis, he sure looked great. what happened when Elway and Davis retired? the Broncos got really mediocre really fast.

Shanahan is stubborn, and the way he handles his running game is awful. he wont make changes when what hes doing clearly isnt working. the Broncos wouldnt have just let him walk away if he was the coach you make him out to be.

Ah lets see... He won 2 Super Bowls! That's what's great. We currently have no GM and how many Super Bowls have the guys we have running the show won?

How many did he win after Elway and TD left? He might have been a great judge of offensive talent, but look at his body of work putting together a defense. He sure didn't make Griese look like a HOF, nor any of the QB's who came after Elway and Plummer don't count.

Hmmm... So you are saying a great coach needs great players. Gee what a concept... You could say the same about Jimmy Johnson in Dallas and later in Miami with much less talent. What about George Siefert with the 49ers and later on with other organizations? What about Phil Jackson without Jordan and Pippen and Kobe and Shaq. Does he win all those championships without that talent level? Maybe none of them.

I will say this one last time for all. YOU NEED GREAT PLAYERS AND COACHING TO WIN! DUH.

I was responding to your suggestion that Holmgren or Shanahan was some magic elixer for our GM duties. You brought up their SB winning records as proof not I.

Originally posted by BigDaddy:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by BigDaddy:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by 49erRider:
I believe the "pattern" in question is the fact that all the coaches and FO personnel that were here before Singletary and Jed York took over are being fired. In other words, they're getting rid of everything about the old regime, much like they did when the Yorks took over and got rid of everything Walsh- and DeBartolo-related.

Hopefully it ends now because if this is truly a pattern, Manusky will be next to go.

It could be getting rid of the old regime. But I just think getting Holmgren or Shannahan would have been better. Oh well. Well just have to make due with this.

whats so great about Shanahan?

hes so overrated. yeah, when he was an OC with Steve Young and Jerry Rice, or a head coach with John Elway and Terrell Davis, he sure looked great. what happened when Elway and Davis retired? the Broncos got really mediocre really fast.

Shanahan is stubborn, and the way he handles his running game is awful. he wont make changes when what hes doing clearly isnt working. the Broncos wouldnt have just let him walk away if he was the coach you make him out to be.

Ah lets see... He won 2 Super Bowls! That's what's great. We currently have no GM and how many Super Bowls have the guys we have running the show won?

How many did he win after Elway and TD left? He might have been a great judge of offensive talent, but look at his body of work putting together a defense. He sure didn't make Griese look like a HOF, nor any of the QB's who came after Elway and Plummer don't count.

Hmmm... So you are saying a great coach needs great players. Gee what a concept... You could say the same about Jimmy Johnson in Dallas and later in Miami with much less talent. What about George Siefert with the 49ers and later on with other organizations? What about Phil Jackson without Jordan and Pippen and Kobe and Shaq. Does he win all those championships without that talent level? Maybe none of them.

I will say this one last time for all. YOU NEED GREAT PLAYERS AND COACHING TO WIN! DUH.

I was responding to your suggestion that Holmgren or Shanahan was some magic elixer for our GM duties. You brought up their SB winning records as proof not I.

He's a lot better than anything we currently have or have had for almost 10 years running. That's the bottom line.

Originally posted by BigDaddy:

Originally posted by Sinsation:

Originally posted by BigDaddy:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by 49erRider:
I believe the "pattern" in question is the fact that all the coaches and FO personnel that were here before Singletary and Jed York took over are being fired. In other words, they're getting rid of everything about the old regime, much like they did when the Yorks took over and got rid of everything Walsh- and DeBartolo-related.

Hopefully it ends now because if this is truly a pattern, Manusky will be next to go.

It could be getting rid of the old regime. But I just think getting Holmgren or Shannahan would have been better. Oh well. Well just have to make due with this.

whats so great about Shanahan?

hes so overrated. yeah, when he was an OC with Steve Young and Jerry Rice, or a head coach with John Elway and Terrell Davis, he sure looked great. what happened when Elway and Davis retired? the Broncos got really mediocre really fast.

Shanahan is stubborn, and the way he handles his running game is awful. he wont make changes when what hes doing clearly isnt working. the Broncos wouldnt have just let him walk away if he was the coach you make him out to be.

Ah lets see... He won 2 Super Bowls! That's what's great. We currently have no GM and how many Super Bowls have the guys we have running the show won?

How many did he win after Elway and TD left? He might have been a great judge of offensive talent, but look at his body of work putting together a defense. He sure didn't make Griese look like a HOF, nor any of the QB's who came after Elway and Plummer don't count.

exactly, i remember reading that just because a coach has won a SB b4 it doesnt mean he will lead another team to another SB. off the top of my head i cant think of a head coach that has won a SB with more than 1 team...

I love Seifert and think he was a great coach. He even turned Carolina into a contender, but his winning a SB as HC was using plans and players put together by Walsh. You can include Switzer's winning with the team built by Jimmy. But I sure as hell don't want Switzer GMing my team.

um, he didnt turn Carolina into anything. his final season as coach was 1-15 there. not like he was given anything to start though.

but as for the Niners, Walsh takes too much credit for Seiferts successes. i mean come on, Seifert had a better record as coach than Walsh did. and Seiferts first 4 seasons consisted of three 14-2 records. you will NEVER see that happen again. you can credit Walsh for the 1989 success, but as time moves on, Seifert had to keep the team rolling. if a great coach could set a team up for a decade, youd see alot more teams continuing great runs after a great coach left. which doesnt happen.

The only thing I get out of this is that Jed is taking out the trash and running this team in his image and vision in mind? Seeing how Singletary was his first hire if I'm not mistaken... everyone else he inherited.

And I'm just kinda stretching this pattern thing...


[ Edited by silkyjohnson on Mar 24, 2010 at 08:42:37 ]

Obviously a pattern.

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by 49erRider:
I believe the "pattern" in question is the fact that all the coaches and FO personnel that were here before Singletary and Jed York took over are being fired. In other words, they're getting rid of everything about the old regime, much like they did when the Yorks took over and got rid of everything Walsh- and DeBartolo-related.

Hopefully it ends now because if this is truly a pattern, Manusky will be next to go.

It could be getting rid of the old regime. But I just think getting Holmgren or Shannahan would have been better. Oh well. Well just have to make due with this.

whats so great about Shanahan?

hes so overrated. yeah, when he was an OC with Steve Young and Jerry Rice, or a head coach with John Elway and Terrell Davis, he sure looked great. what happened when Elway and Davis retired? the Broncos got really mediocre really fast.

Shanahan is stubborn, and the way he handles his running game is awful. he wont make changes when what hes doing clearly isnt working. the Broncos wouldnt have just let him walk away if he was the coach you make him out to be.

Ah lets see... He won 2 Super Bowls! That's what's great. We currently have no GM and how many Super Bowls have the guys we have running the show won?

Let's see, . . .

oh yeah, that Singletary guy, you know, the HEAD COACH,

he has a Super Bowl ring. If that's any criteria.

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by BigDaddy:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by BigDaddy:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by Niners99:

Originally posted by SanDiego49er:

Originally posted by 49erRider:
I believe the "pattern" in question is the fact that all the coaches and FO personnel that were here before Singletary and Jed York took over are being fired. In other words, they're getting rid of everything about the old regime, much like they did when the Yorks took over and got rid of everything Walsh- and DeBartolo-related.

Hopefully it ends now because if this is truly a pattern, Manusky will be next to go.

It could be getting rid of the old regime. But I just think getting Holmgren or Shannahan would have been better. Oh well. Well just have to make due with this.

whats so great about Shanahan?

hes so overrated. yeah, when he was an OC with Steve Young and Jerry Rice, or a head coach with John Elway and Terrell Davis, he sure looked great. what happened when Elway and Davis retired? the Broncos got really mediocre really fast.

Shanahan is stubborn, and the way he handles his running game is awful. he wont make changes when what hes doing clearly isnt working. the Broncos wouldnt have just let him walk away if he was the coach you make him out to be.

Ah lets see... He won 2 Super Bowls! That's what's great. We currently have no GM and how many Super Bowls have the guys we have running the show won?

How many did he win after Elway and TD left? He might have been a great judge of offensive talent, but look at his body of work putting together a defense. He sure didn't make Griese look like a HOF, nor any of the QB's who came after Elway and Plummer don't count.

Hmmm... So you are saying a great coach needs great players. Gee what a concept... You could say the same about Jimmy Johnson in Dallas and later in Miami with much less talent. What about George Siefert with the 49ers and later on with other organizations? What about Phil Jackson without Jordan and Pippen and Kobe and Shaq. Does he win all those championships without that talent level? Maybe none of them.

I will say this one last time for all. YOU NEED GREAT PLAYERS AND COACHING TO WIN! DUH.

I was responding to your suggestion that Holmgren or Shanahan was some magic elixer for our GM duties. You brought up their SB winning records as proof not I.

He's a lot better than anything we currently have or have had for almost 10 years running. That's the bottom line.

There is no sense in continuing to argue with these guys. It seems like the guys who continually make those arguments care more about sex appeal than experience and a winning record.

Who cares how they won as long as they win? I could give a rats ass if a coach never passed or ran more than 5 plays per game as long as he knew how to win!