The Purpose of "Building Through the Draft"...

Originally posted by Method:

Originally posted by Mister49:

Originally posted by Ronnie49Lott:

Originally posted by WillistheWall:

Originally posted by Method:
Trade our pick for Jared Gaither (even though you were in a thread saying not to?). WTF?

It would be a good move dude. The guy is a very good T who is huge and can play both spots and he's YOUNG. We aren't going to draft a RT better than that. 24 year old starter who can pass protect and be a road grader is pretty much everything you're asking for and more from a rookie mid 1st.

I know good teams DO build through the draft but then when they get to where we are now, they take a next leap by signing good players. Look at the 94 9ers, we couldn't get past the cowboys, we had drafted a bunch of our guys(Rice, Eric Davis, Watters, OLine guys, etc.), so then we used FA to bring in guys like Deion and Norton. Not only did it help us it also made our competition(the cows) weaker by taking one of their guys. Or look at the saints, they had an explosive offense, good coaching, but they needed help on D. So what do they do? They got out and pick up Sharper, they used FA to get their franchise QB 4 years earlier, they used FA to pick up Jabari Greer, they used trade for Shockey to give Brees another playmaker, and they used FA for Vilma. Multiple significant defensive players for them were FAs they picked up. Or the Ravens, they already had Ray Lewis, but they used FA to get 2 more guys who wound up helping them win the superbowl in Rod Woodson and Sterling Sharpe. Or the NY Giants when they won it with Plax, Pierce, Fred Robbins, etc.

I mean we already have guys we've built through the draft with. Willis, Davis, Crabtree, Staley, etc. If we got 2-3 more really good players, we could be a playoff team for sure. Then you get depth in the draft. Heck we could have a really dominant D if we went and picked up Sharper, then we drafted one of the corners in the 2nd or if we got Joe Haden. Our running game would be sick if we got Gaither and our QB would have a lot more time on some of these plays. It would help everyone on our team. And we would still have a pick in every flippin round to build through the draft with.

Well said. To take the next step most teams find players from sources other than the draft.

You make a lot of sense!!!

I know. What I meant was, ZRF is making this post about trying to make moves in FA not through the draft; in another post he said that he doesn't want to trade our #1 for Jared Gaither. I should have re-worded what I said.

I wasn't being sarcastic man,i was agreeing with you that dude was talkin out of both sides of his neck,u picked up on it and called him out...Well have a good one..

Originally posted by stevenking57:
In 81 before our first SB, we had some VERY good draft choices with Walsh; BUT that fall we added Hacksaw and Fred Dean. Those two player NOT taken in our Draft was huge for that years SB! A team has to get talent by any means possible. If we could get ONE key URFA this off season for one of our dire needs, it would free us up to address other needs.

That's just it. The consensus dire needs are starting OT, return man, safety, OG & pass rush help. Have any dire needs suffered for our lack of participation so far?

We know the OT market is all about RFA's so we'd need to give up picks . . . which is still an option. As far as an impact return men . . . again it looks like a vacant UFA market.

The DB's have been seeing a lot of movement with free agency and trades and I guess I'm a lttle surprised we're sitting that out. But it looks like this years draft is stacked with solid DB's that could impact early . . . in particular at safety.

Stephen Neal would have been nice at OG . . . I guess . . . Rex Hadnot? . . . Joey Porter? . . . IDK.

But McGM will have to add more free agents. By my count after adding Carr we have 23 open spots on the 80 man roster give or take. Depending on trades, 7 to 9 spots will be filled in the draft and figure 5 or 6 more will be filled with UDFA's.

That leaves 7-10 open roster slots that will need to be filled by veteran free agents. In 2007 & 2008 we filled many of those slots at the top of the depth charts with "big splash" FA's like Clements, Lewis, & Justin Smith. In 2009 we filled the middle and bottom of the depth charts with guys like Jones & Evans.

It's looking like 2010 will turn out like 2009 and it doesn't really bug me considering the market and who's been available.

Originally posted by redmanc07:

Originally posted by ZRF80:
For some odd reason, Ninerbrass (along with fans) are under the impression that you build, and therefore win, through the draft. What they fail to acknowledge is that the draft serves 2 purposes....


1) It gives you a foundation to work with. In essence, after the DErik and TDon era, we did well trying to shore up additional draft picks and adding young talent to the team. Since we had gutted the roster for salary cap purposes, we had no option but to start from square one. Therefore, the draft is the prime opportunity to build from the bottom up, and set a foundation on which to build upon.

2) It gives you young players that you can develop to replace older worn out players. Key example: Aaron Rodgers replacing Brett Favre in GB. The draft is a wonderful way of keeping your team "young" and "fresh". For one, you can rotate your new players with the old ones without losing a step. The team still stays competitive, and it allows the young players to get on field experience. Two, it allows the veteran players to mentor the young ones, and teach them techniques that may or may not be taught through training camps and coaching schemes.

It irks me when Niner fans use the "we'll build through the draft" excuse on a team that is on the brink of becoming competitive. For one, we've already set the foundation on which this team can excel. Probowl players fill key roster spots (RB, TE, CB, LB, etc.) The majority of these players are young, yet developed. They're ready to take it to the next step; all we lack are a few key roster additions to bump us over the edge.

A lot of ya talk about drafting olineman in the first round, etc. etc. As if those guys are going to come in and make us an instant top 10 o-line in 2010. Sorry folks not gonna happen. So why bother ? Why not go out and pick up the FA we need to get us over the top. You dont have to necessarily overpay. No one's asking for JPeppers. But there are options available, yet our front office wont bite.

Why not ?

Cause we build through the draft. Keep that up, and we'll be building for a very LONG time.

So you're saying Michael Oher didn't help the ravens immediately? So you're saying Ryan Clady didn't help the Broncos immediately? So you're saying Joe Thomas didn't make an impact on the Browns immediately? Because Im' saying our line is basically a RT away from taking us into the playoffs. And if its looking mighty good that we get a tackle in the draft why go get one in FA? Do you think Ozzie Newsome is just going to let Gaither go? If he does im going to guess there is a mighty good reason for it

KWAME HARRIS

Originally posted by SonocoNinerFan:

Originally posted by stevenking57:
In 81 before our first SB, we had some VERY good draft choices with Walsh; BUT that fall we added Hacksaw and Fred Dean. Those two player NOT taken in our Draft was huge for that years SB! A team has to get talent by any means possible. If we could get ONE key URFA this off season for one of our dire needs, it would free us up to address other needs.

That's just it. The consensus dire needs are starting OT, return man, safety, OG & pass rush help. Have any dire needs suffered for our lack of participation so far?

We know the OT market is all about RFA's so we'd need to give up picks . . . which is still an option. As far as an impact return men . . . again it looks like a vacant UFA market.

The DB's have been seeing a lot of movement with free agency and trades and I guess I'm a lttle surprised we're sitting that out. But it looks like this years draft is stacked with solid DB's that could impact early . . . in particular at safety.

Stephen Neal would have been nice at OG . . . I guess . . . Rex Hadnot? . . . Joey Porter? . . . IDK.

But McGM will have to add more free agents. By my count after adding Carr we have 23 open spots on the 80 man roster give or take. Depending on trades, 7 to 9 spots will be filled in the draft and figure 5 or 6 more will be filled with UDFA's.

That leaves 7-10 open roster slots that will need to be filled by veteran free agents. In 2007 & 2008 we filled many of those slots at the top of the depth charts with "big splash" FA's like Clements, Lewis, & Justin Smith. In 2009 we filled the middle and bottom of the depth charts with guys like Jones & Evans.

It's looking like 2010 will turn out like 2009 and it doesn't really bug me considering the market and who's been available.

I agree about not maybe being in the mix with the DB's. It was kinda disappointing just b/c of how cheap Rhodes and Cromartie were delt for. No way should we have considered paying Rolle that much money. I wouldn't mind them looking at Porter but that's pretty much about it. Like you said at the end it's about who is available.

And Gaither is not near being on a pro bowl level. Folks are falling for the hype right now, and I get the feeling the hype is coming from the Ravens. Sims played better than Gaither last year. Not saying Gaither is a bad player but he's still a project at this point. I wouldn't give up a 1st rounder for him. But if I were the Ravens I would keep selling him as if he were gold.

LOL...sorry man.

To me its all about the draft.

Free Agency has a place, no doubt, and if we were ONE player away and a great player at that position was available, then I would agree.

The fact is tho that we are NOT one player away and there aren't any players left in positions of need.

BUILD THROUGH THE DRAFT.

Nobody ever won a super bowl with a team of free agents. All great teams build through the draft and maybe supplement a player or two in FA, which is exactly what we have done. The key is having a legit QB, everything else is fluid. Look at all the guys Pittsburgh let's walk, they replace with a guy they drafted and groomed for a few years. NO got lucky that Brees came back from injury, but other than him there is never a good QB in FA. You get depth through FA, look at the Redskins.

I was okay with WillistheWall's comments re: getting a solid starting OL in trade, if not FA or draft...until i read Maicco's most recent article. RFAs are too costly for us, in that in addition to giving up a first, we also would have to grossly overpay. Makes this business that much tougher. Still, there are a bunch of teams out there willing to do just that...Chicago, for example.

Originally posted by stevenking57:
In 81 before our first SB, we had some VERY good draft choices with Walsh; BUT that fall we added Hacksaw and Fred Dean. Those two player NOT taken in our Draft was huge for that years SB! A team has to get talent by any means possible. If we could get ONE key URFA this off season for one of our dire needs, it would free us up to address other needs.

You are talking about two bigtime, one future HOF, impact players before the period of salary cap and RFA and URFA. Have you looked at the UFA class? This is by far, because of no new CBA, the weakest FA class, maybe ever. Those players did not exist in this FA. Getting a RFA, unless you are 100% sure you have an impact player who will take you far, is pretty stupid. You see some of the top 10 teams making trades because they have to. The uncapped year has put a lot of restrictions on what the top 10 teams can do in FA. Even the "big" name players who were available were not very alluring. There's are some quality backups available but no one who gets me excited.

Think about what you're doing when you give up a 1st or 2nd rounder. Think about the top 5 college players at every position and you have 70 players coming out. With 3 picks in the top 64 in one of the deepest drafts in a long long time, we might be passing up a future HOF player or 5 yr pro bowler for a quality backup.

Certain positions are not "impact" positions for rookies because of the learning curve. WR, S, DT, QB, C are not typically positions in which rookies can make an impact. But, T, G, LB, DE and CB are positions in which rookies can make an impact. Just because they're rookies doesn't mean our draft picks won't lift this team.

One word: VALUE

In 1994 you could still buy a team. Not today

Originally posted by ZRF80:
For some odd reason, Ninerbrass (along with fans) are under the impression that you build, and therefore win, through the draft. What they fail to acknowledge is that the draft serves 2 purposes....


1) It gives you a foundation to work with. In essence, after the DErik and TDon era, we did well trying to shore up additional draft picks and adding young talent to the team. Since we had gutted the roster for salary cap purposes, we had no option but to start from square one. Therefore, the draft is the prime opportunity to build from the bottom up, and set a foundation on which to build upon.

2) It gives you young players that you can develop to replace older worn out players. Key example: Aaron Rodgers replacing Brett Favre in GB. The draft is a wonderful way of keeping your team "young" and "fresh". For one, you can rotate your new players with the old ones without losing a step. The team still stays competitive, and it allows the young players to get on field experience. Two, it allows the veteran players to mentor the young ones, and teach them techniques that may or may not be taught through training camps and coaching schemes.

It irks me when Niner fans use the "we'll build through the draft" excuse on a team that is on the brink of becoming competitive. For one, we've already set the foundation on which this team can excel. Probowl players fill key roster spots (RB, TE, CB, LB, etc.) The majority of these players are young, yet developed. They're ready to take it to the next step; all we lack are a few key roster additions to bump us over the edge.

A lot of ya talk about drafting olineman in the first round, etc. etc. As if those guys are going to come in and make us an instant top 10 o-line in 2010. Sorry folks not gonna happen. So why bother ? Why not go out and pick up the FA we need to get us over the top. You dont have to necessarily overpay. No one's asking for JPeppers. But there are options available, yet our front office wont bite.

Why not ?

Cause we build through the draft. Keep that up, and we'll be building for a very LONG time.

I always thought that building through the draft was to pick someone who had one good season so that Dan Snyder could pay them 5 year "All Pro" wages to sign with the Deadskins.

In baseball I thought it was for the BoSox and Yankees to sign them.

What finally brought the Niner Dynasty down? the salary cap from over spending on free agency.Ain't nothin free about it!

Originally posted by ZRF80:
For some odd reason, Ninerbrass (along with fans) are under the impression that you build, and therefore win, through the draft. What they fail to acknowledge is that the draft serves 2 purposes....


1) It gives you a foundation to work with. In essence, after the DErik and TDon era, we did well trying to shore up additional draft picks and adding young talent to the team. Since we had gutted the roster for salary cap purposes, we had no option but to start from square one. Therefore, the draft is the prime opportunity to build from the bottom up, and set a foundation on which to build upon.

2) It gives you young players that you can develop to replace older worn out players. Key example: Aaron Rodgers replacing Brett Favre in GB. The draft is a wonderful way of keeping your team "young" and "fresh". For one, you can rotate your new players with the old ones without losing a step. The team still stays competitive, and it allows the young players to get on field experience. Two, it allows the veteran players to mentor the young ones, and teach them techniques that may or may not be taught through training camps and coaching schemes.

It irks me when Niner fans use the "we'll build through the draft" excuse on a team that is on the brink of becoming competitive. For one, we've already set the foundation on which this team can excel. Probowl players fill key roster spots (RB, TE, CB, LB, etc.) The majority of these players are young, yet developed. They're ready to take it to the next step; all we lack are a few key roster additions to bump us over the edge.

A lot of ya talk about drafting olineman in the first round, etc. etc. As if those guys are going to come in and make us an instant top 10 o-line in 2010. Sorry folks not gonna happen. So why bother ? Why not go out and pick up the FA we need to get us over the top. You dont have to necessarily overpay. No one's asking for JPeppers. But there are options available, yet our front office wont bite.

Why not ?

Cause we build through the draft. Keep that up, and we'll be building for a very LONG time.

You may not have noticed, but with the uncapped year and all, there are no f'n free agents this year. They are all restricted. What options are available? Grossly overpay Dunta Robinson? I agree with you in principle but this is not the year.

As far as building through the draft, two words: Pittsburgh Steelers.

Originally posted by redmanc07:

Originally posted by ZRF80:
For some odd reason, Ninerbrass (along with fans) are under the impression that you build, and therefore win, through the draft. What they fail to acknowledge is that the draft serves 2 purposes....


1) It gives you a foundation to work with. In essence, after the DErik and TDon era, we did well trying to shore up additional draft picks and adding young talent to the team. Since we had gutted the roster for salary cap purposes, we had no option but to start from square one. Therefore, the draft is the prime opportunity to build from the bottom up, and set a foundation on which to build upon.

2) It gives you young players that you can develop to replace older worn out players. Key example: Aaron Rodgers replacing Brett Favre in GB. The draft is a wonderful way of keeping your team "young" and "fresh". For one, you can rotate your new players with the old ones without losing a step. The team still stays competitive, and it allows the young players to get on field experience. Two, it allows the veteran players to mentor the young ones, and teach them techniques that may or may not be taught through training camps and coaching schemes.

It irks me when Niner fans use the "we'll build through the draft" excuse on a team that is on the brink of becoming competitive. For one, we've already set the foundation on which this team can excel. Probowl players fill key roster spots (RB, TE, CB, LB, etc.) The majority of these players are young, yet developed. They're ready to take it to the next step; all we lack are a few key roster additions to bump us over the edge.

A lot of ya talk about drafting olineman in the first round, etc. etc. As if those guys are going to come in and make us an instant top 10 o-line in 2010. Sorry folks not gonna happen. So why bother ? Why not go out and pick up the FA we need to get us over the top. You dont have to necessarily overpay. No one's asking for JPeppers. But there are options available, yet our front office wont bite.

Why not ?

Cause we build through the draft. Keep that up, and we'll be building for a very LONG time.

So you're saying Michael Oher didn't help the ravens immediately? So you're saying Ryan Clady didn't help the Broncos immediately? So you're saying Joe Thomas didn't make an impact on the Browns immediately? Because Im' saying our line is basically a RT away from taking us into the playoffs. And if its looking mighty good that we get a tackle in the draft why go get one in FA? Do you think Ozzie Newsome is just going to let Gaither go? If he does im going to guess there is a mighty good reason for it

Singing boldin and gaither are what's about to happen one last run with ray ray for a superbowl.